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2.0 TDI (BNM) engine sounding rough AFTER injector swap.

Discussion in 'A3/S3/Sportback (8P Chassis)' started by max69vk, Apr 17, 2012.

  1. max69vk
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    max69vk Active Member

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    [Jun 26, 2012]
    Car collected & looking at the service details, it confirms the turbo, sensors, & software were done.

    The car feels a little bit off the mark at the moment but I'm purely putting that down to everything still needing to settle in, & that anything is going to feel a little flat after driving a 3.0 V6 TDI for the last week. On a plus note no more siren sounds from the turbo which stops me looking for an approaching emergency services vehicle every few minutes, engine response is like an F1 car in comparison to before, & power output is very linear & very smooth, no hunting, no stalling, & no clouds smoke out the back!

    I'll give it a week or so to settle in & then I'll measure everything on VCDS to compare against previous logs, then maybe a trip to the RR again to see whats happening with the power output :)
    #81
  2. Gti Jazz Blue
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    Gti Jazz Blue Active Member VCDS Map User

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    [Jun 26, 2012]
    Fingers crossed that you are all sorted now.

    Looks very much like I'm going to need a new Solenoid block for my under-boost. Just waiting to borrow a known good one to try before out laying the £160 for a new one.

    Must have cost you a fair bit in extra diesel, glad I haven't got a DPF on mine. Might even put me off a newer A3 too.

    Paul
    #82
  3. max69vk
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    max69vk Active Member

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    [Jun 26, 2012]
    £160 for an N75? Have a look here... n75 | eBay
    #83
  4. Gti Jazz Blue
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    Gti Jazz Blue Active Member VCDS Map User

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    [Jun 26, 2012]
    If only, on the BKD it is all 3 valves in one unit called the Solenoid Block, p/n: 6Q0 906 625E £160 incl the VAT at a stealers.
    #84
  5. max69vk
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    max69vk Active Member

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    [Jun 26, 2012]
    #85
  6. monkeynut
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    monkeynut Member

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    [Jul 14, 2012]
    Hi max
    Just wondering if you have a successful conclusion to your woes? If you remember I started the 'kangarooing after injector recall' thread as have had problems since the injectors were done. I now have had the dpf light on twice but now have the emmisons light/engine management light and the car running in limp mode! It's going to have a diagnostic later today but guessing it will show the same faults as other folk have had with certain 'smensors' faulty. Not sure whether to just get the dpf deleted but if there is a fundamental fault with the injectors then I guess I better wait?? Any suggestions!? Hope your car is sorted now....:)
    #86
  7. max69vk
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    max69vk Active Member

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    [Jul 15, 2012]
    Well up until a week ago I would have said yes, however despite having had a second set of injectors, a complete top end, a new turbo, new DPF sensors & various software updates the car has developed a couple vibrations & the 'kangaroo' again under light throttle when cold, although not as severe as before. Tied into the fact MPG has plummeted to an average of 29mpg over a full tank (being driven like a saint) & it feels fairly gutless it's headed back to Audi asap :(
    #87
  8. Solz
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    Solz New Member

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    [Jul 21, 2012]
    Has anyone got their car sorted after having all these issues after the injectors recall.

    I have a vw golf 2.0 gt tdi 170, after giving my car in to vw for the recall, the car all of a sudden started juddering, which could be felt throughout the car and the car was smoking like hell also was misfiring. Turned out cylinder 4 has lost conpression, after finding this out i went to vw but they did not have any of it simply said nothing to do with the injectors or the recall. As i dont really know much about car i ended up giving a car to a local garage. After opening up the head turned out, i had two valves that were gone on cylinder 4, one valve had a whole in it. I forked out £1200 to have the valves replaced and have a overall head recon.

    The car has been off road since mid april, i got my car back after the head a week ago and now its back at the garage, the dpf light has come on 3 times in a week and there is burning smell coming into the car from the engine bay and also it is smoking. The garage opened the head up again and found no fault in their work carried out but when the took the injectors out, the mechanic said they think the 4th injector is faulty and as you cannot do a flow test on these injectors, the mechanic went to vw with the injectors and they go they cannot test the injectors unless their in the car and they have to carry a few tests for this.

    The car is booked in with vw for 1 aug, but after reading other peoples issues after getting the car back from the delears, im reluctant to give it to them just incase they mess something else up. Supposedly i give it to them
    i they find a fault with the injectors will they replace them free and also would that allow me to say that them
    injectors messed my car up in the first place.

    This recall has messed up alot of peoples car and making them
    fork out alot of money. Now why arent the delearships taking reaponsibility and does anyone no what i should do to solve this mess??
    #88
  9. Solz
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    Solz New Member

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    [Jul 21, 2012]
    Has anyone got their car sorted after having all these issues after the injectors recall.


    I have a vw golf 2.0 gt tdi 170, after giving my car in to vw for the recall, the car all of a sudden started juddering, which could be felt throughout the car and the car was smoking like hell also was misfiring. Turned out cylinder 4 has lost conpression, after finding this out i went to vw but they did not have any of it simply said nothing to do with the injectors or the recall. As i dont really know much about car i ended up giving a car to a local garage. After opening up the head turned out, i had two valves that were gone on cylinder 4, one valve had a whole in it. I forked out £1200 to have the valves replaced and have a overall head recon.


    The car has been off road since mid april, i got my car back after the head a week ago and now its back at the garage, the dpf light has come on 3 times in a week and there is burning smell coming into the car from the engine bay and also it is smoking. The garage opened the head up again and found no fault in their work carried out but when the took the injectors out, the mechanic said they think the 4th injector is faulty and as you cannot do a flow test on these injectors, the mechanic went to vw with the injectors and they go they cannot test the injectors unless their in the car and they have to carry a few tests for this.


    The car is booked in with vw for 1 aug, but after reading other peoples issues after getting the car back from the delears, im reluctant to give it to them just incase they mess something else up. Supposedly i give it to them
    i they find a fault with the injectors will they replace them free and also would that allow me to say that them
    injectors messed my car up in the first place.


    This recall has messed up alot of peoples car and making them
    fork out alot of money. Now why arent the delearships taking reaponsibility and does anyone no what i should do to solve this mess??
    #89
  10. monkeynut
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    monkeynut Member

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    [Jul 21, 2012]
    Agree wholeheartedly! Mine has gone back to the dealers again after 2x DPF light on followed by the eventual emissions warning light and car in limp mode. Fault code G450 so needed new dpf sensor. Fitted that then carried out a regen at dealers so there's another £160 spent. Not to count the first diagnostic of my 'kangarooing/juddering when cold' when they replaced a perished manifold seal, £108 that did nothing!! The car seems to run fine at the moment but I can't help feeling like its just a matter of time before it plays up again. Could it be that injectors are not seated properly causing poor fuel burn, resulting in too much soot overloading the dpf until it's unable to regenerate? Thought about Dpf removal but why should I when the car was absolutely fine before the recall work?
    #90
  11. Solz
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    Solz New Member

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    [Jul 21, 2012]
    That the same thing i keep saynm, car was fine before it went in. I wish i never gave it in for this recall.
    I reckon it is to do with the injectors not being seated properly, il find out 1 aug whether the injectors are faulty or not if they are not then ive got a car that ive just spent £1200 on and a cannot drive because the mot's finshed and it will not pass with the car smoking.
    #91
  12. monkeynut
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    monkeynut Member

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    [Jul 21, 2012]
    The dealer technician told me the injectors need to 'bed in' as such so I agree with your opinion that they are not seated properly. However, I think the kangarooing/jerking problem is to do with the dpf. This is because right now it runs perfectly, and the dpf has just been regenerated, so free of soot etc. When my car was in limp mode and unable to regenerate etc the jerking/hesitation was terrible. Although when warmed up it was less noticeable which is strange. I also wish I hadn't gone in for the recall too as the car had done 156,000 miles with the old injectors and ran fine, although I do get around 7mpg better now?! I still think it may block again in due course due to injectors not burning the fuel correctly but I won't know until I get some symptoms as I don't see any smoke and the car is running ok at present. SOOOO FRUSTRATING THOUGH!
    #92
  13. monkeynut
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    monkeynut Member

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    [Jul 21, 2012]
    Well well well, seems I am wrong. Unless the Dpf has clogged up from the 25 mile drive home it appears it must be the actual injectors not working correctly as the car has started again. It was parked from yesterday so I thought I'd give it a quick run in case the dealer had warmed it up a little before my arrival yesterday. Kangarooing/jerking is back and I now fear a rocky road is ahead. Like some of the other folk on here I could cut my losses and sell the car as it now has been cleared of fault lights and runs ok when warm. Thing is, I have more integrity than that and don't want to land somebody else with these problems. Besides, as the car has never acted this way until the injectors were changed it is clear that this is the cause when you look at everybody else with the same problem. Back to the dealer on Monday...not good
    #93
  14. monkeynut
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    monkeynut Member

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    [Jul 21, 2012]
    wow, can't believe the amount of VAG group PD170's with the SAME problems since having the recall work done! Shocking
    #94
  15. Solz
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    Solz New Member

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    [Jul 21, 2012]
    [FONT=Tahoma, Calibri, Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif]There is alot cars that have messed up after this recall but why arent the maindelears taking responsibility, i read up on another forum someone had a skoda vrs that was also recalled for injectors and sine having their car back its one problem after another.
    Im worried that if the maindelears find the injectors to be faulty and they replace the injectors i will be back to square one as right now my car drives fine, powers there only problem is its smoking now after having the head recon. So i dont no what am going to do as i dont want maindealers to touch my engine while replacing injectors as it will only mean one thing forking out another £1200 to have a head recon.

    I just want my car to be how it was, its been off the road for nearly 4 months and as maindealers are not taking responsibiliy, all the work is being carried out by a local garage therefore no courtesy car and the other car i have to drive gives 25 miles to £10. Killing me on fuel.[/FONT]
    #95
  16. Solz
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    Solz New Member

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    [Aug 15, 2012]
    Any updates? VW keep saying the injectors in my car fine even though they havent checked them, and as ive just had a head recon they keep insisting there is a crack in the cylinder head, yet the car drives absolutely fine power is there no hesitation only problem is its smoking. Which my local garage keeps telling VW its the injectors there over fuelling and have caused the DPF to become clogged. But they say will open the head and will charge you, i dont trust them so taking the car to a diesel specialist to diagnose the problem and give a written report which then am going to take the car back to VW.
    #96
  17. MaTriX_001
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    MaTriX_001 New Member

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    [Aug 28, 2012]
    I agree. Just wish I had never responded to the recall. One of the injectors on my Golf 170 was repaired last year prior to the recall - I have just received a cheque from Volkswagen for £740 for this. However am v fed up that I have a car I cant rely on to drive and following my most recent visit to the garage I am told that there is a oil leak around the manifold "which may cause issues with the DPF" and needs replacing...have already had sensor replaced. Like everyone else I never had problems before the recall (except the one injector that was repaired successfully). Have contacted What Car who seem quite interested and hoping they will take this up.
    #97
  18. Solz
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    Solz New Member

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    [Aug 29, 2012]
    Let us no how you get on with What Car. Ive had a full head recon after the recall and had a problem of car smoking due to it overfuelling. What shocks me is that when i had the head recon i had siemens injectors in the vehicle which were meant to have been replced for Bosch in the recall but i still had siemens, cut the story short VW had the car for a week and the car went in with smoking issues but they were admant their injectors were fine and the head was cracked so took the car of them and to a diesel specialist and whilst driving the car from
    VW to the specialist it wasnt smoking. The specialist found that the car had beeen over fueling and the oil contained diesel and so did the oil filter. Replaced these car
    runs fine it even passed MOT. So curious that all of a sudden the car is runing fine we checked the injectors and theyve been replaced with Bosch injectors by maindelears without telling us problem ive got now is that VW are not admitting they replaced my injectors and my DPF is on its was dpf light came twice in
    Three days even though a motorway journey was done
    #98
  19. max69vk
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    max69vk Active Member

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    [Aug 29, 2012]
    They dont replace the Siemens injecters with Bosch units, just updated Siemens units. Make sure they've updated the ecu software for the new injectors though as most dealers are totally unaware of this update (also affects the DPF sensors & regens).
    #99
  20. andrecc
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    andrecc Member

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    [Aug 29, 2012]
    I've got it booked in for end of month. What should I be aware of to question And defend myself how car is running superbly? Thanks
  21. Cheesey2
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    Cheesey2 New Member

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    [Aug 29, 2012]
    Have been reading all this with great interest and yes i think watchdog should be informed. My 08 170 tdi has just had the injectors replaced under the recall and not been right since ! I've put up with it for about 2 weeks being intermittant and am now fed up, will lock horns with Crewe Audi tommorrow and let you know the outcome
  22. Cossie_boy
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    Cossie_boy Member

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    [Aug 29, 2012]
    Bloody hell Max, and I thought I had problems, lol

    One thing after reading this from start I picked up on the software updates people mention, the specialist I was at today looking at mine said apparently the 2008 were all completley unique or something so the standard software update Audi did left them either not starting or possibly with symptoms mentioned above by you and others.

    I know mine had a problem stalling in 2011 so I found out so a camshaft sensor and ingition switch?! and software update was done, so made me think could this be related on mine, although i have just have an anoyying hesitation from 3k upwards on off on off style in 4/5/6th gears!

    How old are your cars and Max did all that get done under warranty with the turbo and head etc...?
  23. Cheesey2
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    Cheesey2 New Member

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    [Aug 30, 2012]
    Mine has had a software update after the injector change which i was charged £50 for......sounds like I was ripped off ! Currently car still runs rough for 2 seconds or so after start up, otherwise goes fine and runs fine......so far. Having read all the threads my view of Audi/VAG diesels has plummeted.......are there enough of us to go to what car or watchdog ?
  24. Cossie_boy
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    Cossie_boy Member

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    [Aug 30, 2012]
    Its a shame, but a pattern it seems

    I have always luved German stuff, a couple of E30's back in the day, then after my Cossie it was Golf GT TDi, Bora TDi, A3 1.8T Quattro, Golf Match TDi now my current A3 TDi 170 Quattro S-Line, but yes reading all the stories is not good!
  25. Solz
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    Solz New Member

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    [Aug 31, 2012]
    Ive had a full head recon and car was smoking so injectors have been replaced again, and now dpf issues dpf light comes on everyday... Does the dpf need replacing? Or is it a regenerating problem
  26. max69vk
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    max69vk Active Member

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    [Aug 31, 2012]
    My car is a 57 plate (nov 2007) - Every bit of work has been carried out under warranty by Audi despite me not being the original owner or having an extended warranty.

    Your best bet is to find someone with VCDS, or even better buy a cable from Nigel (NHN) on here & learm how to use the relevant features & compile all the info to build a case as to your issues then present it to AUDI UK. When presented with cold hard evidence they are very very helpful, & a recent tot up of everything that been done spent by Audi sorting my car now stands as around £8.5k!
  27. Cossie_boy
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    Cossie_boy Member

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    [Aug 31, 2012]
    Max, did you buy it from an Audi dealer though?

    Thats lucky as when I spoke to them I just got...the original owner should have sorted it!

    Hopefully all shall be sorted Monday!
  28. andrecc
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    andrecc Member

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    [Aug 31, 2012]
    Just got my car back from recall all fine will update if problems occur with a week or so

    Thanks
    dre
  29. Cheesey2
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    Cheesey2 New Member

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    [Sep 1, 2012]
  30. andrecc
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    andrecc Member

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    [Sep 1, 2012]
    What I got replaced at the recall was Piezo Unit Injector, also they didn't give me the paperwork since they said it has to go to Audi warranty and I'll receive it In a week or so.

    I got the recall done at Victoria Audi and the sales person told me they have done over 100 a3/a4 and none of them had a problem with the injector recalls. After I was explaining to him that a lot of people on forums where having problems after swapping the injectors.

    I was driving an 2012 a3 cabriolet for the day, and they gave my car a free wash and inspection. They seem pretty down to earth also spoke to a part member and he offered discountted service parts. When I book it in with Audi (parts are the cheap things it's the labour that's costs).

    Hope that helped.

    Dre,
  31. Cheesey2
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    Cheesey2 New Member

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    [Sep 2, 2012]
    Thanks Dre, I wonder if audi had the batches of replacement injectors checked before fitment, if siemans can produce one duff batch I'm sure they can produce some more........
  32. M88UES
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    M88UES Theres Never Enough Power

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    [Sep 2, 2012]
    someone on here should start a petition and get a list of names of whos cars have not been right since the replacement. i know mines bit juddery ever since especially at idle.
  33. Cossie_boy
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    Cossie_boy Member

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    [Sep 2, 2012]
    Exactly!
  34. Solz
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    Solz New Member

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    [Sep 2, 2012]
    Ive justhad my car back for a week and its started smoking again vw uk have been no use at all, i realii dnt no wat to do nomre ive had a head recon, got car back n it was smoking. Went to vw they had car for a week but dint take any blame but they replaced injectors forvthe second time without informing me. Took car to a specialist and seemed fine nw a weeek later its smoking again and dpf light comes on nearly everyday or within two days. Does anyone no wat the hell is wrong with the car ive had enough of going to my local garage snd vw for the past 5 months as the car is still messed up.
    And i totally agree everyone should right a petition and try and get some justice for problems and the stress weve had with our so called reliable cars.
  35. max69vk
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    max69vk Active Member

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    [Sep 3, 2012]
    The main issue with the recall (as mentioned previously) is not the parts that are the issue, its the idiots that are fitting them.

    Here's the problem for the dealer.... The parts are supplied & paid for by AUDI UK so there's no chance of making a profit from the parts, then the labour time & hourly rate is also dictated by AUDI UK (which certainly wont be what Joe Public gets charged). This leaves the dealer in a situation whereby they could actually stand to lose money (in their eyes) & so they will look for anyway to minimise or totally remove this problem...

    The only 2 options available for the dealer are to either get the apprentice on the job (working on a lower hourly rate than a master tech), or get the master tech to do the job as quickly as possible (usually by by rushing). Neither of these are a great option as invariably mistakes/errors will creep in & things get forgotten. Tie in this situation with the fact that VAG have revised several procedures/settings/measurements involved in doing the job as well as releasing more than one ECU & sensor updates that most aren't aware of, then it's a recipe for distaster.

    BTW, my car goes in tomorrow for the 10/11th time tomorrow to rectify a resonating vibration that started following the injector/head/cambelt replacement... Suspected damaged engine mount, we'll see what they find this time.
  36. M88UES
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    M88UES Theres Never Enough Power

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    [Sep 4, 2012]
    thats not right because mine were fitted by Audi twice! and still not right.
  37. max69vk
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    max69vk Active Member

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    [Sep 5, 2012]
    Car went back in this morning & typically it's decided to run almost 100% perfect (i.e no vibration) which coincidentally has improved since using super diesel rather than the normal diesel. Tied in with the fact that the vibration disappears when the engine is cold (increased fueling at startup) & also disappears when the car is doing a passive regen (also increased fueling) the issue appears to be fueling or combustion related.

    Chatting with the Master-tech who I've now got to know very well, he's said that AUDI UK are now starting to come round to the fact that there are some fairly universal issues since the injector recall - Apparently there have been so many reported issues that they've got to a point where they cant deny them. The other thing that suprised me is that the replacement injectors aren't new (as such), they are reconditioned & rebuilt units with the neccesary modifications made to them to stop the short circuiting that prompted the initial recall... QC appears to be an issue on a reasonable amount of these 'new' injectors that quite are replaced more than once.
  38. Solz
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    Solz New Member

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    [Sep 5, 2012]
    Update on my car the dpf has packed in the coil light has come on, max ive tried with VW UK theyve spoken to the retailer but the keep putting the blame onto my local garage who carried out the head work. They simply are saying the injectors are fine, but the bizzare thing is when the car was dropped off to VW it was smoking and had failed mot on emissions but when the car was taken out of VW to a diesel specialist who said car is not smoking but he regenerated the dpf and changed the oil and oil filter and car was running fine passed mot so when i got car a few local trips dpf came on and every teo days it kept coming on and also the cars started to smoke again and now thr coil light has come on.
    Any idea what it could be as i dnt think my local garage is really being straight up with me like VW so im stuck on what to do, and who to go to.
  39. Solz
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    Solz New Member

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    [Sep 6, 2012]
    Ive just had my DPF flushed, anyone know how to check if it has actually been done.
  40. max69vk
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    max69vk Active Member

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    [Sep 7, 2012]
    You need to get someone with a copy of VCDS to read scan the car which will allow you to see the soot measurement in the DPF unit. If you've got white smoke it can only be one of two things - Either a water leak thats allow water to be vapourised (which isn't actually smoke), or you're burning oil on the exhaust side of the engine.

    If you're head has been replaced there's a chance something isn't right & that it is leaking/dripping enough oil to burn in the exhaust, or your DPF & cat were full of oil & it's still burning off. If you're burning oil in the cylinder/fuel the smoke out the exhaust would be blue in colour rather than white & you would smell it a mile off.


    Things to check:

    Is the smoke white or actually blue?
    Are you sure that the dealer has flashed your ECU with the new software to go with the new injectors?
    Where is the oil level on the distick (overfills play havoc with the DPF due to extra oil vapour)?
    Are you losing any coolant water?
    Are you sure your DPF sensor isn't faulty (common fault)?

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