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1.8T to S4 clutch upgrade questions

Discussion in 'A4/S4 forum(B5 Chassis)' started by B5QUAT, Dec 5, 2011.

  1. B5QUAT
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    B5QUAT Member

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    Hi,

    My clutch has started slipping (probably down to age and the 20psi going through it) so I feel it's time to upgrade to the B5 S4 clutch in readiness for the upcoming GT28 next year.

    Seen this flywheel kit which allows upgrade to the S4 clutch:

    Audi B5 A4 Quattro 1.8T > Drivetrain > Clutch > ES#12084 ECS RA4 Steel Flywheel Kit - ECS212321B5KT

    One I got this, would all that I need be the S4 clutch kit or are there other parts required?

    Where's the best place to get a B5 S4 clutch kit from that will be reliable? Any ideas?

    Thanks
    #1
  2. jamie226bhp
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    jamie226bhp Member

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    Gsf or euros I'd have thought
    #2
  3. Jason.s
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    Jason.s Active Member

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    Or just buy the complete kit from ECS if you`re going to get the flywheel from them?

    If you buy it seperate over here then the RS4 clutch is barely any different in cost so you might aswell go the whole hog and future proof it.
    #3
  4. tangerinedream
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    tangerinedream Member

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    work at euros clutch kit part no 641441570- 179+ vat retail but can get 25% on website at mo :)
    #4
  5. Bradderz_1988
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    Bradderz_1988 Dont replace it, Upgrade it !!

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    Or you could fit this mate 110756040178

    If just done the 1Z conversion with the ata/agk pressure plate and V8 friction disc all for £280 and I can honestly say its transformed the way the car puts the power down as the clutch was totally knackered and I hated the DM flywheel !!
    #5
  6. B5QUAT
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    B5QUAT Member

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    Cheers for the replies. Think I'll take Jason's advice and go RS4, make it futureproof.

    Cheers for the link Bradderz.
    #6
  7. B5QUAT
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    B5QUAT Member

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    What bits do you need for this conversion and what vehicles are they from? Sounds good value for money.
    #7
  8. Bradderz_1988
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    Bradderz_1988 Dont replace it, Upgrade it !!

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    You need the 1z flywheel fitted to some Audi 80 tdi and 2.0 and some early A4's an S2 clutch which is fitted with a SM flywheel or either the ata/agk pressure from a VW LT van and V8 friction disc.
    #8
  9. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator

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    As Bradderz says, you need:

    Audi "1Z" flywheel. Its fitted to most 1.8/1.9/2.0 4 cylinder Audi 80/100 models including the coupes. Expect to pay around £30 used, or £120ish new.

    then either

    complete 3B engined S2 clutch kit

    or

    Clutch pressure plate from a VW LT Van with an ATA or AGK engine
    240mm Friction plate from more or less any longitudinal Audi, i used a B6 S4 V8 one as it was on ebay cheap.
    release bearing (standard A4 one will work)


    I went with the second option, as i found the pressure plate and friction plate on ebay for around £110 all in.

    Then you need to have the flywheel redrilled to accept the larger pressure plate by a competent machine shop, and preferably balanced afterwards (i didnt have mine balanced though, and it seems fine) This cost me 90quid iirc.
    #9
  10. Bradderz_1988
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    Bradderz_1988 Dont replace it, Upgrade it !!

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    They still have the friction plate on eBay that i used at the mo but I think I have purchased there last ATA/AGK pressure plate they had in stock, I priced both of these from TPS to see how much they where and they where around £98 each (remanufactured) for them.
    #10
  11. tangerinedream
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    tangerinedream Member

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    im just about to replace my clutch but know ive seen this thred its got me thimking :) any one know the o.e number on the 1z flywheel
    as can get the s2 clutch for 120 brand new (sachs) if my flywheels gone im going to be up for this conersion.

    also i take it this would work for the 1.8t fwd models as well as the quattro?
    #11
  12. Arrkon
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    Arrkon Midlands regional Moderator

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    yup indeed it would.
    #12
  13. Jason.s
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    Jason.s Active Member

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    Yep as i have a FWD and have done it. OEM number is 026105269L (x for exchange)
    #13
  14. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator

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    tangerine, make sure the clutch you've found is from a 3B engined S2. Most S2's use a dual mass and "pot" style flywheel, only the 3B has the single mass flat unit.
    #14
  15. tangerinedream
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    tangerinedream Member

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    it should be mate done it at work ( eurous) listed for 2.2 20v turbo quatro (3b) sachs part number 3000 455 001
    #15
  16. tangerinedream
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    tangerinedream Member

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    how much is a new one jason because struggling to find any used?
    #16
  17. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator

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    That sachs part number isnt correct. Its for the older 016 gearbox and has a different friction disk with the thinner 24 spline input shaft rather than the thicker 23spline shaft your box has.

    The pressure plate in that kit is correct though.

    Sachs dont do a kit for the 3B S2, they only sell the pressure plate and friction plate as seperate components.

    Friction plate is 1862 625 001
    Pressure plate is 3082 919 001

    You can use that pressure plate with one of the V8 disks from ebay if you want though.
    #17
  18. Jason.s
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    Jason.s Active Member

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    Inc vat with the surcharge which you`ll have to pay its £155.15 unless your local VW/Audi dealer will give you discount for working at Euros.

    Is it not one you can cross refer over from the genuine part number to your system and find a non gen one?
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2011
    #18
  19. tangerinedream
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    tangerinedream Member

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    okay so if i got that

    sachs pressure plate (3082919001)
    flywheel from jason.s
    and v8 disk from ebay
    then use the standard release bearing?

    do you have ebay link to disk aragon

    cheers for all your help mate
    #19
  20. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator

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    #20
  21. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator

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    There are plenty Audi 80's breaking on ebay, surely you can find a flywheel from one of them!
    #21
  22. Bradderz_1988
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    Bradderz_1988 Dont replace it, Upgrade it !!

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    #22
  23. Soupie69uk
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    Soupie69uk Owner

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    Sorry to bump this but would an S4/RS4 clutch kit then work with the Audi 80 flywheel?

    Or do you have to use the below options?


    complete 3B engined S2 clutch kit
    or
    Clutch pressure plate from a VW LT Van with an ATA or AGK engine
    240mm Friction plate from more or less any longitudinal Audi, i used a B6 S4 V8 one as it was on ebay cheap.
    release bearing (standard A4 one will work)
    #23
  24. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator

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    S4 clutch wouldn't work, because the S4 flywheel isnt flat. It has a recessed area where the friction plate sits.

    the S2 clutch is designed for a flat flywheel, which matches the Audi 80 part.
    #24
  25. Bradderz_1988
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    Bradderz_1988 Dont replace it, Upgrade it !!

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    Hes selling a brand new ecs fly and rs4 clutch PM B5QUAT.
    #25
  26. Soupie69uk
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    Soupie69uk Owner

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    Yeah I saw that. My clutch is tip top and was thinking about buying it just to have incase it ever goes.

    Read a few mixed reviews over the past hour on the ECS kit also.
    #26
  27. Bradderz_1988
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    Bradderz_1988 Dont replace it, Upgrade it !!

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    Yeah ive heard mixed reviews about the ecs fly too !!

    im running the 80 fly with LT pressure plate and S4 friction plate.
    #27
  28. cpv
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    cpv New Member

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    Hi, although this thread hasn't been active for a while,

    I've seem to be running into a little bit of fuss with finding the proper setting with my clutch settings.
    My a4b6 is running the gt28 setting - so i'm a little over the 300bhp and 420 Nm threshold.

    Would the 80 SMF, v8 disk and LT plate fit and hold?

    base my car is '04 B6 190 hp (BEX) quattro 6 speed tranny.
    #28
  29. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator

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    Should do.

    The other option you might have is to use the AVF PD130 flywheel and clutch. But i believe if you do that, you'll need to fit an AVF starter motor too
    #29
  30. cpv
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    cpv New Member

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    do i have to redrill/rebalance the flywheel? -

    the oem parts for my b6 aren't compatible with the 5 speed quattro - as it seems from part codes.
    #30
  31. Bradderz_1988
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    Bradderz_1988 Dont replace it, Upgrade it !!

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    You will need to have it skimmed and redrilled to take the pressure plate, i didn't get mine balanced but its up to you if you want too.
    #31
  32. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator

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    the B6 AVF flywheel will bolt onto the earlier engines, as will its starter. There may be clearance issues in the bellhousing though, but knowing the way Audi like to make things compatible i suspect it would work just fine.

    One of mine was balanced and the other wasnt. No real noticable difference between them from what i can tell.

    edit: The AVF flywheel also needs a 5.5mm spacer between the engine block and gearbox.
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2014
    #32
  33. cpv
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    cpv New Member

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    My engine in BEX.
    Worked like a charm. Fitted right on after ballance and redrill.
    Swapped the friction material to kevlar(just in case...)
    Now holding at over 410 Nm.
    Great!
    Only disadvantage is that at under 1200 rpm i get a little chatter....but by 1800 it's gone
    #33
  34. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator

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    What did you use? The solid flywheel and S2 bits?

    Where did you get the S2 clutch parts? They're getting a bit hard to get hold of these days.
    #34
  35. Bradderz_1988
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    Bradderz_1988 Dont replace it, Upgrade it !!

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    Were did you get the kevlar friction from ?? Techniclutch ??

    Also second aragorn's question on source !!
    #35
  36. matt66604
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    matt66604 Member

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    has anyone used or does anyone rate the SMF conversion kits from valeo?
    #36
  37. Bradderz_1988
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    Bradderz_1988 Dont replace it, Upgrade it !!

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    Dont go there as there a generic kit and clutches cant seem to be had separately so if it goes expect to pay for another full kit and if your planning any performance mods i doubt it will take it, it can probably only just about handle a stock TQS !!
    #37
  38. cpv
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    cpv New Member

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    Got the 1z flywheel from the breakers..15 Euro.

    The plate and disk got them from a parts supplyer store.
    Was a little hard indeed and needed to go to 3 supplyers before i found one. He said that he can get the parts but non refoundable due to the fact they are not in stock ( had to w8 one day).
    Lucky for me i found this thread and there are codes posted for the parts.
    Friction disk seemed to be refurbished though (most of them are theese days) but labeled sachs. That s why i got kevlar. Kevlar went to a local ribs.ro ..around 70Euro.

    Plate and disk Parts came around 320 E.

    Ballance redrill and resurface 140 E.
    #38
  39. cpv
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    cpv New Member

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    As it seems the dream only lasted for about 3 months....3000km. some hard pulls (about 40-50) as in the beginning it was too violent and as started to slip the times improved. Got a 12.7s on 1/4 mile though.:)
    any idea were to go next?
    would the rs4 b7 disk fit?
    #39
  40. aragorn
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    aragorn "Stick a V8 in it!" Staff Member Moderator

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    paddle centre or an uprated cover plate is your next option... Probably the only option if your going to launch the car. These things start making the clutch rather unpleasant though.

    Or look for clutch upgrades for the 3B S2.
    #40

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