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'00 2.5tdi clouds of white smoke!!!

Discussion in 'Diesel forum' started by 0v0, Dec 22, 2005.

  1. madvw
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    madvw Active Member

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    [Mar 15, 2006]
    definitely go for the new part - second hand turbo's are a waste of everybodies time, patience and cash.

    as for the replacement, it'll be the getting the old one off that'll take the most time. How long/many miles has the old turbo done? these things can weld bolts on...

    patience, wd40, and lots and lots of tea may be needed - or it may just come straight off.
    #41
  2. tubtub
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    tubtub Member

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    [Mar 15, 2006]
    If you order from Turbo Technics, make sure you get them to write in blood that they have one in stock. They /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/swear.gif my local independent specialist about for weeks, even saying they were unpacking the one I'd ordered when it hadn't even been sent from Garrett.

    Buying used is a waste of money - you won't know if what you're getting is good, bad or scrap
    #42
  3. imported_dive007
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    imported_dive007 Guest

    [Mar 18, 2006]
    hi there had the some problem
    after a run try removeing the oil filler cap any high pressure here you will
    require new air breather
    just behind deisel pump . some pipe have to be remove to access this low down garage will take £120 fitted
    #43
  4. 0v0
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    0v0 New Member

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    [Mar 31, 2006]
    Update....

    New turbo fitted 380+vat + 190 labour ....

    Picked the car up yesterday was told it would smoke for a while as it burnt the oil out of the system. I presume the exhaust and cat??

    So last night as it was dark I went for an hour and half 100mile+ drive down the A3. There appeared little or no smoke as I drove at 80mph but thought it must be doing the job. As I came off at my junction bloody thing errupted in smoke till I got to my house...

    I thought I'd leave it running in the drive as it was smoking and therefor buring off this oil - which it did - but after 2/3 mins it stopped. Fantasic I thought - Its cured!!!

    This morning after a short 5 min run in traffic back to its old embarrassing tricks GRRRRR.....

    Though it doesn't seem as bad as before...

    Spoke to grease monkey who says it could take quite a while to burn off???

    Is this right?

    Why does it not smoke till after 5 mins? Cat heating up?

    Why no smoke at 60-80mph???

    Why would it stop smoking after ideling for 3/4 mins??

    Why have I still got so many f***ing questions :-(

    It is nice to drive again when not smoking especially compared to the heap of /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/swear.gif I've been borrowing...

    Nick - still /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/swear.gif off

    tubtub - I sympathise sounds like your problem aint too dissimilar(sp)
    #44
  5. madvw
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    madvw Active Member

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    [Mar 31, 2006]
    sounds weird man.

    I think you could be right though with your CAT idea. It sounds like when your driving, unburnt fuel/oil is getting into the CAT, then when you idle or drive at low speed, the CAT then heats up and starts burning off the excess, then once burnt, it stops.. untill you drive again.

    Thats all I can think of.

    But why would unburnt fuel be making it out of the engine?

    If it is unburnt fuel in the CAT, then that can be very dangerous - my mate burnt out a very very expensive supercar at work due to an injector permanently firing and filling the CAT's with petrol. The CATS got so hot on the track, that they caught fire.. along with the rest of the car. I didn't whether to laugh or cry when he told me.

    come to think of it, what were the VAG com error(s) that were logged?
    #45
  6. tubtub
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    tubtub Member

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    [Mar 31, 2006]
    Weird doesn't begin to describe it. My experience is pretty much the same though with a 4 cylinder TDI.

    I'm not convinced it's fuel; wouldn't that burn with black smoke? What I'm seeing is blue in the mirror when idling in traffic.

    When it's stationary and idling, after a couple of seconds it really pumps out blue/grey smoke.

    I've also noticed that a cold start produces a real puff of blue smoke but then no more until the engine reaches normal operating temperature.

    Mine shows no VAG com error codes whatsoever.

    Currently it's with Audi Taunton; I've lost faith in my local guy to diagnose anything after he suggested turbo, rings and ECU and wanted me to pay to have all replaced - I stopped at the turbo, that was £600 + VAT + labour....

    I'm off to Germany on Tuesday until the end of next week so won't be posting any updates until I return - hopefully by then there will be some good news.
    #46
  7. Joni_s
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    Joni_s Member

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    [Apr 21, 2006]
    Read this forum a while a go and can't remember if you guys have tried this but it is a very cheap test to have carried out and may help you to identify the problem.

    I had similar symptoms on my tdi V6 recently. I had a pressure test of the crancase which was showing very high pressure. It turned out the breather was not allowing normal flow rates and therefore pressure was building up in the crancase, consequently oil was being forced into teh combustion chambers and burnt.

    Ami right in thinking that you can start your cars from cold, rev them and see no smoke problems from the exhaust? This was hte situation with my car. It takes a bit of time for the crankcase compression to build up and force the oil into the chambers.

    Very cheap check to do . Let me know if you decided to do it and the results.
    #47
  8. Gnasher
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    Gnasher Gansher

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    [Nov 19, 2006]
    Recently acuired my A6 and am having smoking problems from the exhaust this usually happens only when the car is almost up to temp and running at normal temp whitish smoke with a oily burning smell do you think this is an EGR issue too? I have taken the plastic V6 guard off and have discovered sooty deposits around the EGR area.

    Help anybody

    Previous owner apparently used to run on a mix of cooking oil have had fuel lines, filters and tank all cleaned out. reading the forum suggests to me EGR has anyone got any photos of the V6 block with pointers showing what stuff is or any ideas where i can obtain a suitable manuel for this car as there is no haynes avalible.
    #48
  9. Joni_s
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    Joni_s Member

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    [Nov 20, 2006]
    If it nots EGR then i'd say it could be your crankcase breather which is a common fault. My car had it. On start up there is no smoke but leave irt running or drive it for a while adn the crancase pressure builds up and forces oil into the combustion chambers hence smoke.
    Heres a pic of it. there is a better view of it on this website but i cant find it at the mo.
    http://www.vagcat.com/epc/cat/au/A4Q/1998/219/49/2643459/

    This may also help you?:
    http://www.vagcat.com/epc/cat/au/A4Q/1998/219/49/2644351/

    Hope this helps. Think you can clean out hte breather but i just got a new part - bit of a b*gger to change but not too bad.
    #49
  10. fjtwelve
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    fjtwelve Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    [Nov 21, 2006]
    Theres a small sooty mark near my EGR. I hesitate to say its normal as my EGR did fail not long after i bought it and the black mark may have been a symptom. The independent Audi mech that fixed it said he'd seen it before and it was not a cause for concern.
    When my EGR failed i got black smoke i have never had white smoke, car has now done 147000 miles.
    #50
  11. Jason
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    Jason Member

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    [Nov 21, 2006]
    My EGR got stuck open a few years ago now,silly amounts of white smoke,smelt like an old boiler & flat as a fart!!!

    Cleaned (Realy cleaned it so that you are a 100% sure it's closed) and that sorted it!!

    Dont think you have any reason for concern that it's been run on Veg oil!!
    #51
  12. Gnasher
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    Gnasher Gansher

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    [Dec 4, 2006]
    Changed the breather filter got one from Audi for £47inc vat. Was a bit of a git to get out: Injector pipes off and turbo oil feed. Some nibble fingers were required but i was just happy to get it all out and back together again with only 5 chunks of skin missing from my hands. Very usefull tool to have also is one of those magnetic sticks to retrive dropped tools and screws.
    Oh breather has done the job no more clouds and no more annoyed cyclists.
    #52
  13. Jason
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    Jason Member

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    [Dec 4, 2006]
    GREAT!!
    Glad to hear it, and if you have got it in time you should save your self blown oil seals!!!!!
    #53
  14. Richie
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    Richie New Member

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    [Jan 13, 2007]
    Hi all,

    My 2.5TDi began pouring oily smoke out of the exhaust a while ago and I was (wrongly) advised it was the turbo so went through all the expense and hassle of finding a turbo as cheap as possible and getting it changed - it made no difference.

    I then found this forum and there was lots of good advice. I got my local independent VW/Audi garage to change the breather unit and hey presto all is well. £50 for the part (as opposed to £500 for a turbo!). Seems to be a common fault on this engine as it ages.

    If only I had come here first.

    Thanks for the advice - I thought I'd add to this thread to share my experience as it may help others.
    #54
  15. cobrascim
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    cobrascim Member

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    [Feb 20, 2007]
    Which crankcase breather have you guys had replaced?
    I am quoted by audi the ones from the heads down to the crankcase are about £52. The one that is close to the oil filter is only £17. Both plus vat.
    I have white smoke so will be cleaning out the EGR valve and will do this breather at the same time. I take it by breather we are just talking about a pipe? Audi dont keep them but can get them in but if I pull one off I should get hose the same size etc.
    John.
    #55
  16. cobrascim
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    cobrascim Member

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    [Feb 24, 2007]
    I'ts OK have now clarified the part as called the Oil Mist Seperator. It goes into the base of the oil filter housing/casting.
    Now on order from Audi at £40.97 + vat. :yes:
    #56
  17. cobrascim
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    cobrascim Member

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    [Mar 3, 2007]
    Replaced the oil mist seperator and the smoke has now gone. Phew!
    I had cleaned the EGR valve in situ by taking the forward pipe off it and using carb cleaner but this hadn't helped. I did this while awaiting the part. Anyway sorted.
    Thanks.
    John.
    #57
  18. dive007
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    dive007 New Member

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    [Mar 9, 2007]
    take a look at adds on audi-sport
    #58
  19. tom fenton
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    tom fenton New Member

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    [Jun 27, 2007]
    I've just read through this thread and am now grinning my head off :)

    Reason being my A4 2.5 TDI Quattro Avant has been leaking oil for a while now, but recently has started emitting clouds of smoke when it has warmed up.

    Obviously not knowing about the breather problems I was expecting the worst e.g turbo failure or possibly piston rings/valve seals, and had an investigate into it today.
    Found that with the engine running removing the oil cap was like opening a bottle of pop that someone had been shaking, a LOT of pressure. Thinking the worst I was having nasty thoughts about engine rebuilds and new turbos, however I am now going to phone the VAG dealer and order one of the breathers, FINGERS CROSSED GUYS!!

    Thanks for the resource, very useful, I will be doing some more reading.
    #59
  20. tom fenton
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    tom fenton New Member

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    [Jun 28, 2007]
    Well the "oil mist seperator" has been fitted by me this morning (not too bad actually, remove all 6 injector pipes, unbolt EGR valve from bracket to move it across slightly, I then found I just needed to lever the pipe from the turbo to the EGR valve slightly to get the breather filter past it.
    Mine was well made up with *****, and looked like it had been in there since 1998. New one fitted, injector pipes refitted, pipes bled, fired it up and all seems to be fine, left it running for 1/2 hour outside, fine, took it 5 miles to work, all still fine.
    So fingers are crossed but seems to be OK!

    Thanks again guys!
    #60
  21. iantype-r
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    iantype-r Member

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    [Aug 20, 2007]
    Hello guys, I think my problem is the same as yours, the oil mist seperator is blocked, Ive been to audi today and they cannot find the part, they have never heard of it, has anyone got the part number.
    Has anyone got any pics of this part so i can find it on my car, I have got this link, is it number 40 the oil breather,
    http://www.vagcat.com/epc/cat/au/A4Q/1998/219/49/2643459/#39

    cheers ian
    #61
  22. cobrascim
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    cobrascim Member

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    [Sep 21, 2007]
    White smoke again! 6 months since I changed the mist seperator. Anyone else had this problem re-occur?
    I did an oil change to see if that would help straight away but it didn't.
    I am using the proper oil.
    Iain - I will try and find my receipt and get you the part number.
    John.:blownose:
    #62
  23. iantype-r
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    iantype-r Member

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    [Sep 21, 2007]
    Hello john, I took my car to a garage to get sorted, they changed the mist seperator, cost me £170 :sadlike: but its ok now, not got a clue to why yours is smoking again, how many miles have you done since you had it fitted,

    cheers ian
    #63
  24. cobrascim
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    cobrascim Member

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    [Sep 22, 2007]
    Hi Ian,
    Glad yours is now fixed.
    I have a sneaky suspicion that the reason it has started is that my mate did the change for me (normally I would have done this myself but didn't have time). Oil change at the same time but he then finished the oil fill up with some other turbo diesel oil that he had as my proper stuff had only refilled to half way. I was not amused and worried about this causing some kind of problem. This may be the reason I dont know. We have only done a few thousand since then but it would seem this may be the reason.
    John.
    #64
  25. cobrascim
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    cobrascim Member

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    [Oct 29, 2007]
    Thought I would put up an update.
    As stated previously the white smoke is back. I had dismissed the oil mist seperator as it was done approx. 6 months ago. As it worsened I disconnected the EGR control valve and this worked for a little while. Then the smoke started agian. This was only when stopped in traffic. Then it started smoking while going.
    I had the classic pressure release when I took off the oil filler cap. So after more reading of this site discovered one guy who replaced his oil mist seperator 3 times in 8 month intervals. So I thought as an experiment I took cap off and using rubber hoses clamped in a breather cap to stop the pressure building up in the rockers ie the oil galleries. This worked an absolute treat and points me back to the oil mist seperator/crank case breather AGAIN!!!
    I have ordered the later one which does not have the fibre gauze on it I believe from reading another post see
    http://www.vwaudiforum.co.uk/forum/archive/index.php/t-2341.html

    This fits the AFB engine but is for the later engine and no reported problems as it is all plastic.
    With the engine oil galleries being under pressure I reckon the oil feed to the turbo bearing was getting under extreme pressure and forcing oil into the exhaust hence the smoke. I was on the verge of getting a new turbo before I decided to revisit the original proble. I would not have expected this to happen but maybe once the first one has gone the cr@p build up in the engine may cause new ones to gunge up very quickly.
    Anyway get my new one on wed. Will post after that. 'Til then will run with my "breather cap".
    John.
    #65
  26. golisago
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    golisago Member

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    [Dec 3, 2007]
    CAN I ASK YOU A FEW QUESTIONS OVO 1st/ off does your car white smoke first thing in the morning on first start up , 2nd/ does the temp gauge seem low = 75c or so when your driving in traffic then the min't you stop the temp gauge still reads low and the white smoke is still there.

    3rd/ Is the only time the temp gauge gets up to 90c is when you are driving on the motorway/dual-carrageway.

    I would say that if you punch the car and you get good boost and there is no BLACK SMOKE that the turbo is A/OK.
    #66
  27. Jason
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    Jason Member

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    [Dec 5, 2007]
    Having not been on this forum in a long time I just can't believe that these problems are still going on!!!

    You are probably getting the smoke because your EGR valve is full of **** and sticking open,needs stripping,cleaning & disconecting!!!

    Failing that Audi replaced at a later date the whole oil filter housing to solve block pressure problems.

    Good luck

    Jason
    #67
  28. golisago
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    golisago Member

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    [Dec 5, 2007]
    Ditto!!!
    #68
  29. cobrascim
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    cobrascim Member

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    [Dec 24, 2007]
    Haven't been on here myself for a time. But I have run with the EGR disconnected and this did work for a short period of time and then problem returned. I have not yet put the new oil mist seperator in although I plan to do this over the xmas holidays. I will also do the EGR valve as you have stated. I am still running the mod with the breather cap to stop pressure in the block and it is still working a treat. This is with the EGR valve reconnetced electrically. IMO EGR does not cause block pressure and this is definately my problem.
    Will post how I get on over the holidays.

    Golisago - answers- 1st doesn't everyones at start up? Just got the standard cold start white stuff nothing like what I was getting after it heated up. 2nd and 3rd there is no drastic changes in the temperature gauge as you describe. I know where your coming from but it is not an overfuelling problem.
    Turbo seems to be fine with the breather in place. There is no doubt in my mind that the oil is being forced through the turbo bearing into the exhaust and this is due to the oil galleries being put under pressure. Remove the pressure and this problem goes away.
    John.
    #69
  30. Turkster
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    Turkster Bro.Paul 2.5TDI Quattro Sport

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    [Dec 29, 2007]
    Oh bugger, Im now coming on in here and iv got my size 9's on,

    My well loved 2.5 loves to struggle to 3k rev's then boot out a load of black smoke and take off like a rocket,

    Iv changed the

    EGR Valve for a new one, £74 or there abouts
    The Turbo has been changed
    Breather filter just under the injectors £43 or so
    Air Flow Meter £80 or so

    And still playing up.

    [​IMG]

    When i get it over the 3k rev range it seems to run ok, bit smoky still but i expect a bit when pushing ot hard on the open road,

    So what have i done? Iv just disconected the egr valve and let the system de-presurise and it runs very well,

    [​IMG]

    I dont know what oil is in it as iv not changed it yet, i am very interested to read about a "oil mist seperator" not sure where it is but its worth a punt along with an oil / filter change, What oil would you guys recomend, money not an issue,


    Im sure to report back,
    #70
  31. Turkster
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    Turkster Bro.Paul 2.5TDI Quattro Sport

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    [Dec 29, 2007]
    Oil Mist Seperator
    Part Number 059-103-464-B
    £37.93 (Maybe + Vat)
    #71
  32. Jason
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    Jason Member

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    [Dec 29, 2007]
    Oil mist seperator is the engine breather filter just behind the oil filter!

    This is what blocks and creates a build up of block pressure which in turn makes car smoke and with time blow all it's oil seals!!!

    But you say you have already changed it?
    #72
  33. Turkster
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    Turkster Bro.Paul 2.5TDI Quattro Sport

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    [Dec 29, 2007]
    Changed the yellow marked bits,
    [​IMG]

    The old breather filter was not blocked when i took it out, but as i had go a new one i fitted it, old one went in the bin.
    #73
  34. Jason
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    Jason Member

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    [Dec 29, 2007]
    What about diesel,air filter??

    Have you checked vacuem pipes on bulk head to turbo ect???

    Sounds a bit like it could be the maf sensor to me, are you sure new ones good, is it conected properly? Some people swear by a special electrical grease for the maf conector.Have you tried disconecting it?

    The v6 tdi suffers from a bad ecu program too that can make it run like a bag of sh*te.I used to disconect my battery at least once every 2 weeks or when it started running badly for about 10 mins which automaticaly resets by default the ecu to factory settings.
    #74
  35. Turkster
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    Turkster Bro.Paul 2.5TDI Quattro Sport

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    [Dec 29, 2007]
    Diesel and Air filter are both new, Turbo pips have been on and off more times than my under pants,

    MAF = Air flow meter ? yes thats a brand new part,
    This car has been chipped, Will unplugging the cars battery reset that back to the factory settings too ?
    #75
  36. Turkster
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    Turkster Bro.Paul 2.5TDI Quattro Sport

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    [Dec 29, 2007]
    also water temp senser has been changed and this is still reading
    [​IMG]
    #76
  37. Jason
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    Jason Member

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    [Dec 29, 2007]
    No I would'nt have thought so, mine had been chipped (180bhp) and bhp was never effected only for the better.
    #77
  38. Turkster
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    Turkster Bro.Paul 2.5TDI Quattro Sport

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    [Dec 29, 2007]
    #78
  39. Jason
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    Jason Member

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    [Dec 30, 2007]
    :think: :think: :think: :think: :think:

    How many miles has the old girl done?

    Is that smoke at tickover? does it stink of diesel?

    Does it do it from cold or only when warm?

    Only other things that I can think of are that the timings out for some reason, jumped a tooth on the cam belt or there is a heat sensor that over fuels and advances the timing on cold start, if this is faulty it might be telling ecu that engines never up to temp?
    #79
  40. kite
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    kite Member VCDS Map User

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    [Dec 30, 2007]
    Looks like the thermostats not working
    #80

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