Esme's 450bhp A3 8L track car project.

Esme's

Esme's

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Hello,

Here at Esme Engineering we are looking to build a 450 BHP Track Car for Client Days out!

Everyones help and advice along the way will be much appreciated.

We have an 8L Audi A3 Quattro currently running 221BHP at the wheels, Everyones advice on the most efficient way to hit our target will be well received.


Thanks

Connor @Esme's

Here are some pictures from when the car was purchased.
We will upload updated photos to show our progress.
Image
Image
Image
Image
 
The inside will be stripped out soon, with the seats available if anyone wishes to make an offer.
 
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rods, turbo, manifold, intake, fuel pump, intercooling, downpipe, exhaust, intake, larger maf, injectors.........
OR built engine with forged pistons, rebore, stroker?
skys the limit

budget?
 
This sounds interesting, I look forward to seeing how it turns out.

May I ask the reason for the chosen 450bhp target? It’s quite a lot of power, and a fair bit more than is really needed to make a decent quick car.

That said, I imagine 450bhp would be fairly enjoyable :laugh:
 
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Prawn said:
This sounds interesting, I look forward to seeing how it turns out.

May I ask the reason for the chosen 450bhp target? It’s quite a lot of power, and a fair bit more than is really needed to make a decent quick car.

That said, I imagine 450bhp would be fairly enjoyable :laugh:
Click to expand...
because quattro/lardy bus?
:p
 
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That'll do it :racer:

I'm still waiting for the day that something VAG and 4wd comes past me on a track day, maybe this could be the first :tongueclosed:
 
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<tuffty/> said:
Please use the classifieds to advertise sales

<tuffty/>
Click to expand...

Sorry about that tuffty.

badger5 said:
rods, turbo, manifold, intake, fuel pump, intercooling, downpipe, exhaust, intake, larger maf, injectors.........
OR built engine with forged pistons, rebore, stroker?
skys the limit

budget?
Click to expand...

Been having a look around and looking at the gt2871r turbo and supporting mods what's your opinion on that turbo/setup you think I will get the power I'm looking for?


Prawn said:
This sounds interesting, I look forward to seeing how it turns out.

May I ask the reason for the chosen 450bhp target? It’s quite a lot of power, and a fair bit more than is really needed to make a decent quick car.

That said, I imagine 450bhp would be fairly enjoyable :laugh:
Click to expand...

As badger5 said the reason for 450bhp target is due to keeping it 4x4.
Hopefully when it's all done up and running will have to see what it does on the track against the 2wd vags.
 
superkarl said:
That's a shame, someone has spent a lot of money on that car, it's lovely.
Click to expand...

Someone has spent some money on it in the past but hopefully when we are done with it, it will be a lot nicer and a hell of a lot quicker, which means it will be having a lot more money being spent on it.
Looking forward to the outcome!
 
Handling more important than engine power

Spend all the big $ on chassis (eg FIA roll cage & chassis strengthening), suspension, diffs/drivetrain & braking; then chuck in 300-400hp from a fast spooling low boost threshold turbo

Use an Skoda/Prodrive Octavia EVO as reference as to what to do if cash no problem ;)
 
snowy said:
Handling more important than engine power

Spend all the big $ on chassis (eg FIA roll cage & chassis strengthening), suspension, diffs/drivetrain & braking; then chuck in 300-400hp from a fast spooling low boost threshold turbo

Use an Skoda/Prodrive Octavia EVO as reference as to what to do if cash no problem ;)
Click to expand...

Thanks Snowy, we will be getting roll cage welded in, with bigger brake set up etc all part of the plan. Concentrating on getting stripped out and rid off all parts were not using then starting the build as soon as work slows down.
 
GT2871 won't get you anywhere close... HTA 3071 is a better bet

<tuffty/>
 
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300mm Green Performance Air a filter ordered!

Also looking to install air ducts through to brakes and Boost Guage all piped up and working!

New FMIC coming in next few weeks looking at 3" 600x300x100mm with 2.5" Pipework throughout.
 
<tuffty/> said:
GT2871 won't get you anywhere close... HTA 3071 is a better bet

<tuffty/>
Click to expand...

Where would you recommend for purchasing turbos? Are there any sellers
Inked to the forum?

Thanks in advance
 
Esme's said:
Sorry about that tuffty.



Been having a look around and looking at the gt2871r turbo and supporting mods what's your opinion on that turbo/setup you think I will get the power I'm looking for?




As badger5 said the reason for 450bhp target is due to keeping it 4x4.
Hopefully when it's all done up and running will have to see what it does on the track against the 2wd vags.
Click to expand...

450bhp, GT3071/0.63, tubular collected manifold, external wastegate, engine with cams and you will achieve your target,.,,, Alternatively GT3076 a suitable candidate
 
Turbo wise speak to Owen developments about an HTA30 ( .. incredible turbo, seriously fast spoolng and 430-450bhp..
<tuffty/> said:
GT2871 won't get you anywhere close... HTA 3071 is a better bet

<tuffty/>
Click to expand...
 
HTA money.... Decent unit, spool/power etc

not convinced they're worth the extra mula.... Other billet wheeled options out there without the HTA tax

GT3076 in the TT we help support.. Class A leading car in Combe Saloons
 
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beachbuggy said:
Turbo wise speak to Owen developments about an HTA30 ( .. incredible turbo, seriously fast spoolng and 430-450bhp..
Click to expand...

badger5 said:
HTA money.... Decent unit, spool/power etc

not convinced they're worth the extra mula.... Other billet wheeled options out there without the HTA tax

GT3076 in the TT we help support.. Class A leading car in Combe Saloons
Click to expand...

Thanks for the feedback, what sort of money am I looking for these set ups? Is there a deal to be had for all my engine mods when I've decided what I want? Or is everyone charging all items at individual costs?

I will research these turbos further.... Thanks!
 
badger5 said:
HTA money.... Decent unit, spool/power etc

not convinced they're worth the extra mula.... Other billet wheeled options out there without the HTA tax

GT3076 in the TT we help support.. Class A leading car in Combe Saloons
Click to expand...


I don't recommend the 3076 for our S3 because of the small engine, it will charge too late. Not good for a track car.

GT(X)3071 ar63 will be a perfect turbo for a 450HP setup.

With a 2871 you can reach 400/420 but not more.
 
tonio94 said:
I don't recommend the 3076 for our S3 because of the small engine, it will charge too late. Not good for a track car.

GT(X)3071 ar63 will be a perfect turbo for a 450HP setup.

With a 2871 you can reach 400/420 but not more.
Click to expand...

Considering the track car in question running the GT3076 is a class leader in Castle Combe Saloons winning outright last year then I beg to differ... no GT2871 has done 400hp on any car I have ever seen... that figure is hugely subject to dyno lottery

GTX turbos are not very good either... laggy and don't make the power everyone suggests they do...

For a big turbo track car its worth considering going stroker

<tuffty/>
 
Sorry I meant 2876, not 71.

Stroker changes everything, so he can go for a bigger turbo of course.

On a standard 1.8, I don't like how the car performs with a 3076, too much lag and the slot of use is very small. This can be fine for a street car but not for a track car, it's just my opinion.
 
I'm going to be looking at more acceleration/speed bottom end and up to 120mph after that can suffer as don't see getting a load of top end power that I can't get out on the track worth while.

Working on my list of mods will get it together over the weekend and see what sort of prices were looking at! Keep the ideas coming all much appreciated..
 
Forged rods
New shells, bearings, hone, head gasket, arp mains and head bolts
Tubular Vband Manifold
GT3076
Custom down pipe, recirc wastegate
3” exhaust
Modified turbo outlet
Supersize diverter valve
Custom Turbo inlet
Custom Tune
New stock fuel pump (and as track car consider a surge tank), DA31 inline pump
72 lb EV14 Injectors
Vibratechnic engine mounts
AST/KW Coilovers
Adjustable rear tie arms
Adjustable top mounts
You’ll want wish bones, hubs and steering rack from a ko4 car for better steering geometry
HPA Haldex controller for predictable haldex
Full Cage
lots more to add to the list aswell
Planning on all that work may aswell go to 2 liter, needing forged 83mm pistons, boring and a TFSI crank shaft
Bills camshafts work well

Adds up pretty quick.....
 
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tonio94 said:
I don't recommend the 3076 for our S3 because of the small engine, it will charge too late. Not good for a track car.

GT(X)3071 ar63 will be a perfect turbo for a 450HP setup.

With a 2871 you can reach 400/420 but not more.
Click to expand...

Sorry but you are just wrong..
GTX are laggy crap.. Avoid.
Throttle pick up is excellent on this GT3076... The op has said track use and 450bhp target..
Listen to the video linked below to see how quickly its spooling out of the chicanes for example. Its a nice setup.
 
Last edited:
tonio94 said:
Sorry I meant 2876, not 71.

Stroker changes everything, so he can go for a bigger turbo of course.

On a standard 1.8, I don't like how the car performs with a 3076, too much lag and the slot of use is very small. This can be fine for a street car but not for a track car, it's just my opinion.
Click to expand...
boll ocks.
This user has Said Track Car....
He's said 450bhp

What actual experience do you have with these on track?
 
Last edited:
Esme's said:
I'm going to be looking at more acceleration/speed bottom end and up to 120mph after that can suffer as don't see getting a load of top end power that I can't get out on the track worth while.

Working on my list of mods will get it together over the weekend and see what sort of prices were looking at! Keep the ideas coming all much appreciated..
Click to expand...
watch the video I linked to.
I think your 120mph virtual limit is wildly off the mark... unless you plan on only taking to go kart tracks or curborough etc.. eg Very Short ..
145mph up Avon Rise for example. Even my old Jetta 16v on 200bhp would do 120mph up there.
 
badger5 said:
not aggressive.. fact

why bother commenting seamons..
Click to expand...
It may well be fact, but you are coming across as aggressive and short tempered; although you have edited your post since I replied though, so doesn't look quite so bad now.

There's more than one way to skin a cat.

...Brockbank.
 
antwan64og said:
Forged rods
New shells, bearings, hone, head gasket, arp mains and head bolts
Tubular Vband Manifold
GT3076
Custom down pipe, recirc wastegate
3” exhaust
Modified turbo outlet
Supersize diverter valve
Custom Turbo inlet
Custom Tune
New stock fuel pump (and as track car consider a surge tank), DA31 inline pump
72 lb EV14 Injectors
Vibratechnic engine mounts
AST/KW Coilovers
Adjustable rear tie arms
Adjustable top mounts
You’ll want wish bones, hubs and steering rack from a ko4 car for better steering geometry
HPA Haldex controller for predictable haldex
Full Cage
lots more to add to the list aswell
Planning on all that work may aswell go to 2 liter, needing forged 83mm pistons, boring and a TFSI crank shaft
Bills camshafts work well

Adds up pretty quick.....
Click to expand...

Your not wrong, We will be taking our time to get it right as we will be using the car for Client Days out so need it reliable.... Bit of luck as well!!

As for the budget we will be getting funded by Esmes so hopefully wont take too long and will be utilising certain members to help with the build!
 
I think you should do a build thread if you can, similar to others on here. Be a good comparison and help others to decide what they need to do to achieve there goals in performance, regular updates and dyno printouts would be really good.
 
I think this project could be good if it's done sensibly.

it's worth stating right now, at the start, that to build and develop a track car with 450bhp, that will reliably lap all day at a respectable pace, you're looking at an absolute MINIMUM 20k outlay to get it going as an estimate.

If that figure isn't too daunting, then by all means carry on, and I look forward to seeing it :)
 
badger5 said:
boll ocks.
This user has Said Track Car....
He's said 450bhp

What actual experience do you have with these on track?
Click to expand...

Why so rude ? I was just giving my opinion...

My S3 is a track car (410BHP), and I am a member of a 20vt group. Aside from my car, I saw a lot of different setups on our engine.

The only difference is, we don't have a lot of strockers, it's not a common thing here.

About the video you have posted, I would like to know the complete setup, it seems so efficient.
 
tonio94 said:
Why so rude ? I was just giving my opinion...

My S3 is a track car (410BHP), and I am a member of a 20vt group. Aside from my car, I saw a lot of different setups on our engine.

The only difference is, we don't have a lot of strockers, it's not a common thing here.

About the video you have posted, I would like to know the complete setup, it seems so efficient.
Click to expand...
you see the video.
its GT3076.. the one you say is no good for track use.
It is indeed very efficient

std crank, 1900cc, GT3076, catcams, largeport, badger5/nortech tubular exhaust manifold, tial 44mm wastegate............ Emerald ecu, mapped by me

>450bhp

I have built a lot of setups and mapped more so which is why I say your opinion is wrong.
Not rude. Blunt yes.
 
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