Does Anyone Like their S3?
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Mono.pur
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These threads will always descend to the same place ...........
After all, this is an Internet Forum
DID SOMEONE SAY MONO.PUR?
Joking, please lets not start this again
As it's a bank holiday today thought I'd take the S3 out for a long drive down to Bournemouth. Included lots of fast driving across the Salisbury Plain. Gave me some time to re-evaluate things considering I have been vocal about some of the S3's shortcomings.
So the enjoyable / good bits:-
1) You simply would not believe how quickly I covered ground across the Salisbury plain today. Point to point this car is mega. This I confirm was much fun
2) 36 mpg and I was not being gentle with the throttle.
3) Super relaxing. When I had to slow things down due to heavy traffic it was smooth and quiet. It is a nice place to be for a few hours.
4) The noise. I do love the noises this car makes. It made me smile quite a few times today.
The bits that take the edge off a perfect drive:-
1) Not sure if many people know it, but near Stonehenge on the road to Salisbury (A360) is a very long stretch that has a number of crests. At a *spirited* speed I had to back off as the crests bounced the car way too much. Mrs Pulp even made a comment - "should it do that?".
2) Variable steering - I still can't find a setting I like. 120 miles today tried all the settings. Hate Multi-storey car parks especially as to me the amount of steering input does not correlate with where the nose is going meaning nervously checking wing mirrors seeing where edges of wheels are against curbs etc.
3) Slow speed ride. Bournemouth's terrible roads really unsettled the ride comfort today. Not enjoyable.
I live locally to that road, and to be fair, those rises unsettle most cars. I used to hate that in my Jag, and don't find it a good road in my Q5 or my S3. I used to avoid it in my old Citroën BX16gti as it was 50/50 if you were going to get to Salisbury in one piece!
I've kerbed wheels in multistorey carparks in my last 3 cars - but not my S3 - I think the issue is with multistorey carparks not Audis steering. I hate the things and won't go near them anymore.
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0B1001001
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Just out of interest, what were you expecting when you ordered your S3 @veeeight ?
I'm not asking that in a please get annoyed with me way, just asking
The thing about it that's surprised me is the understeer, it's worse than my (very old and by now dead, I'm sure) Golf (also haldex and a much heavier engine too). Changing the tyres to Eagle F1's has helped but it's still not what I would've expected.
I do wish I'd spec'd mag ride but it wasn't until the rolling, sweeping (and a bit undulating) roads around Glencoe that I realised I had the optional go-go-gadget springs fitted to each corner! And not in a good way
Not something a normal test drive (or to be fair, normal driving) will uncover.However, saying all that, there's no other car right now I'd have instead and I love it. I'm not interested in modifying mine or anything like that and the RS3 is tempting but I'm also not a serial car changer, so I doubt that I will get one in the next 4 years... The thing to remember about this thread (and others) is we're being hyper-critical (well I am anyway!). The car is seriously nice inside and goes like stink!
This thread is brilliant!! only wish I had some popcorn!!
I have mentioned in previous threads I am not happy with steering and suspension and certainly not happy with "The Rattle" but those 3 aside I love my S3. I do look back as I walking away from it after every drive, I still clean it at least once a week and I still care enough for it to park 40 miles (little exaggeration) away from the door of the supermarket car park, in which upon reaching the front door realise I would have been better off leaving it at home... So surely that all points to LOVE?
She is going in for oil change this Friday so I have asked them to look at the rattle and at least document it but unless mine is quite different than others and turns out to be a goosed turbo then I am not holding out hope of a resolve.
I have mentioned in previous threads I am not happy with steering and suspension and certainly not happy with "The Rattle" but those 3 aside I love my S3. I do look back as I walking away from it after every drive, I still clean it at least once a week and I still care enough for it to park 40 miles (little exaggeration) away from the door of the supermarket car park, in which upon reaching the front door realise I would have been better off leaving it at home... So surely that all points to LOVE?
She is going in for oil change this Friday so I have asked them to look at the rattle and at least document it but unless mine is quite different than others and turns out to be a goosed turbo then I am not holding out hope of a resolve.
The thing about it that's surprised me is the understeer, it's worse than my (very old and by now dead, I'm sure) Golf (also haldex and a much heavier engine too). Changing the tyres to Eagle F1's has helped but it's still not what I would've expected.
I do wish I'd spec'd mag ride but it wasn't until the rolling, sweeping (and a bit undulating) roads around Glencoe that I realised I had the optional go-go-gadget springs fitted to each corner! And not in a good way
However, saying all that, there's no other car right now I'd have instead and I love it. I'm not interested in modifying mine or anything like that and the RS3 is tempting but I'm also not a serial car changer, so I doubt that I will get one in the next 4 years... The thing to remember about this thread (and others) is we're being hyper-critical (well I am anyway!). The car is seriously nice inside and goes like stink!
^ you mentioned the G word.
Another thread ruined
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The state of the roads in this country is appauling and getting worse so having the ability to adjust the suspension at the press of a button imo is a must,I only kept my RS3 for seven months because of harsh ride was not agreeing with my back ,my current S5 has adaptive suspension so when I want a spirited drive I just change the setting and it transforms the car ,having more adjustment available on an S/RS car is the answer to getting the car you want .
Kugaman1
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Just want to say.....
I was a subscriber to this forum a month before I collected my S3. During that month, I seriously doubted my purchase descision. I read on here, so many threads about the poor suspension, crashy ride, notchy manual gearbox, rattling wastegate rod, Poor quality paint, etc, etc....
Well, Im glad I didnt dwell on these threads. Ive had the car 2 weeks now And think its a cracking all rounder.
I find the ride quality, road holding and steering perfectly fine for the type of regular, day to day driving that I do. The gearbox is as good as any manual box Ive owned, the paint work finish is excellent considering modern water based paints and the car is quick, refined and very well built.
The only that I have experienced that has been raised on the forums is the waste gate rattle. However, this is a very small noise ŵhich is hardly a dealbreaker. Yes, I will be delighted if Audi bring out a fix, but if not, its no biggie to me.
In summary, for those of you who havent yet collected your new cars and have been reading this thread, please ignore the majority of comments until you get your car and can form your oŵn opinion! I find the car much, much better than many of the voices on here would have you believe!
I was a subscriber to this forum a month before I collected my S3. During that month, I seriously doubted my purchase descision. I read on here, so many threads about the poor suspension, crashy ride, notchy manual gearbox, rattling wastegate rod, Poor quality paint, etc, etc....
Well, Im glad I didnt dwell on these threads. Ive had the car 2 weeks now And think its a cracking all rounder.
I find the ride quality, road holding and steering perfectly fine for the type of regular, day to day driving that I do. The gearbox is as good as any manual box Ive owned, the paint work finish is excellent considering modern water based paints and the car is quick, refined and very well built.
The only that I have experienced that has been raised on the forums is the waste gate rattle. However, this is a very small noise ŵhich is hardly a dealbreaker. Yes, I will be delighted if Audi bring out a fix, but if not, its no biggie to me.
In summary, for those of you who havent yet collected your new cars and have been reading this thread, please ignore the majority of comments until you get your car and can form your oŵn opinion! I find the car much, much better than many of the voices on here would have you believe!
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I've had mine for 6 months now and....it's Ok. Good all-rounder, very fast in a straight line, looks nice (mainly the rear view) and the B&O is fantastic.
Lots of negative things said about under-steer etc. already, I'd add build quality, not as good as the Q5s I've had or the other Audis I've driven.
At the end of the day, would I buy another one? No (but to be honest the only car I have replaced like for like is the Q5).
Lots of negative things said about under-steer etc. already, I'd add build quality, not as good as the Q5s I've had or the other Audis I've driven.
At the end of the day, would I buy another one? No (but to be honest the only car I have replaced like for like is the Q5).
Yep agree - that road is a good test of any cars damping but the S3 really struggles. My 320d Sport (current F30 model) handles it much better as did my JCW MINI. I guess my point is for whatever reason the pogo stick effect is most noticeable on that road.
I just find the steering inputs are very awkward slow speeds. Mini roundabouts under 15 mph another good example - steering goes from heavy to light too quickly.
I agree muchly about the manual gear box and the paint. Own a Renault or a BMW and you would never curse VAG paint ever again. IMO only Mercedes paint comes close in terms of quality / hard wearing.
When I test drove the S3 I could only get a go in manual as there was no S-tronic around. I think you can tell a lot about a car by how well sorted the manual gearbox is. It's a lovely box with a nicely weighted clutch in the S3.
Happy belated Birthday to BH ...
Had my car 2,500 miles now and I'm really liking it and enjoy driving it. The way I drive I'd probably be equally happy with a 1.8T or 184 diesel engine but with quattro these were in S3 money so I went S3 and specced it up a bit. Love the tech and find the seats very comfy. I do sometimes feel a bit disconnected (last car was a mk3 Leon FR and always had hot hatches in the past) a good example being on an icy morning round a right hand bend the car behind me's headlamps disappeared to a small dot I felt like I was on rails but did think after that I had no idea how close I was to loosing it or what feedback I would have had. Power is a good hike up from the Leon so enjoying that and the engine noise. I've a 4 yr old lad so need the hatch and four door practicality. For me I'm happy with my choice.
Had my car 2,500 miles now and I'm really liking it and enjoy driving it. The way I drive I'd probably be equally happy with a 1.8T or 184 diesel engine but with quattro these were in S3 money so I went S3 and specced it up a bit. Love the tech and find the seats very comfy. I do sometimes feel a bit disconnected (last car was a mk3 Leon FR and always had hot hatches in the past) a good example being on an icy morning round a right hand bend the car behind me's headlamps disappeared to a small dot I felt like I was on rails but did think after that I had no idea how close I was to loosing it or what feedback I would have had. Power is a good hike up from the Leon so enjoying that and the engine noise. I've a 4 yr old lad so need the hatch and four door practicality. For me I'm happy with my choice.
Psyman79
Sarcasm is hard on a forum ;)
I've never had any issues with mag ride, i think its great.
I drove to work like a kn0b today and comfort mode seemed fine too to be honest.
I drove to work like a kn0b today and comfort mode seemed fine too to be honest.
Kugaman1
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.? Ive got normal suspension and dont have any handling issues?
The only thing I would say is that as the car is so refined, it isolates you from the road a bit......its very easy to be breaking the speed limit as you dont believe you are going so fast.
If I wanted a car for its handling, Id buy another Lotus.......I miss my little baby...
Exactly as in MY16 you cant get a 1.8 TFSI Quattro or the Diesel 184 Quattro with a manual gearbox and the S3 manual is actually cheaper than the TDI once you take in to account full leather seats and progressive steering and only £1K more compared to the 1.8TFSI. So running costs aside £1000 for an extra 120BHP is a no brainer.
Downside from a snobbery perspective is there might be a few more S3's on the roads that might detract a little from the "uniqueness" but then again look how many M cars are on the roads these days
Oh, the handling/suspension related issues are there alright (witness the numerous other threads and posts from many other owners) - it might be that you have't yet discovered them
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Psyman79
Sarcasm is hard on a forum ;)
Ok it is not comfortable as my wife's little SUV which is Audi Q3, but we like this little monster anyway.
Both we think that S3 Saloon is very good looking, fast and attractive car on the road. It's been just 2000 km. How much I can go faster on the public road I don't know but as much as I've gone fast so far, had no understeer issues.
Besides all those steering complaints, I'm happy with the it. Maybe it is just a subjective issue I don't know. At first I felt the steering was very soft but in time, I think I got used to it. Responses are getting better every time I drive. Maybe in dynamic mode, it could be more heavier than normal, but no big issue I suppose. Well, this is my opinion at least.
Our both cars have Haldex and I'm happy with it. I found it useful especially on snow and I feel more safe when cornering. So I think I can prefer understeer over oversteer.
Only thing that I disturbed; I think 19" wheels are not really city street's friendly and even with the magnetic ride, suspensions are too stiff. Our roads are not very smooth in Istanbul. Related to this, especially speed bumps make car's tail very errr bumpy. And at high speeds, I can feel the road's all of slopes. I can't really imagine what would happen, if I don't have magnetic ride.
God knows I'm dying to try LC or ESP Off modes but I've never try them yet by the way.
In conclusion, I'm happy with it. Do I buy it again? Yeah, I think I do in the same colour.
Both we think that S3 Saloon is very good looking, fast and attractive car on the road. It's been just 2000 km. How much I can go faster on the public road I don't know but as much as I've gone fast so far, had no understeer issues.
Besides all those steering complaints, I'm happy with the it. Maybe it is just a subjective issue I don't know. At first I felt the steering was very soft but in time, I think I got used to it. Responses are getting better every time I drive. Maybe in dynamic mode, it could be more heavier than normal, but no big issue I suppose. Well, this is my opinion at least.
Our both cars have Haldex and I'm happy with it. I found it useful especially on snow and I feel more safe when cornering. So I think I can prefer understeer over oversteer.
Only thing that I disturbed; I think 19" wheels are not really city street's friendly and even with the magnetic ride, suspensions are too stiff. Our roads are not very smooth in Istanbul. Related to this, especially speed bumps make car's tail very errr bumpy. And at high speeds, I can feel the road's all of slopes. I can't really imagine what would happen, if I don't have magnetic ride.
God knows I'm dying to try LC or ESP Off modes but I've never try them yet by the way.
In conclusion, I'm happy with it. Do I buy it again? Yeah, I think I do in the same colour.
Jon-SST
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I've done 1000 miles now in my S3 SB. I really LOVE it all. All except for that damm electric steering, yes I agree with V8 lol.
I find it too light and unpredictable (changes in resistence/response) with zero feedback. If I could spend £3k tomorrow to get better steering I would, as the rest of the car is awesome.
The quality of the interior is top notch. I love the mmi, everything seems to be in exactly the right place.
The suspension could be a bit firmer but then you might lose the excellent way I think it soaks up bad roads and potholes (compared to my previous BMW E46).
The ability to cover ground quickly and in supreme comfort in this car makes it perfect for my uses. I've had 4 sets of golf clubs and 5 people in too at times. Plus the dog sometimes, bikes etc. Great car.
Question for longer term owners : does the variable steering become more predictable eventually after time?
Question for tyre changers : do new tyres help with steering response ?
Great thread btw
I find it too light and unpredictable (changes in resistence/response) with zero feedback. If I could spend £3k tomorrow to get better steering I would, as the rest of the car is awesome.
The quality of the interior is top notch. I love the mmi, everything seems to be in exactly the right place.
The suspension could be a bit firmer but then you might lose the excellent way I think it soaks up bad roads and potholes (compared to my previous BMW E46).
The ability to cover ground quickly and in supreme comfort in this car makes it perfect for my uses. I've had 4 sets of golf clubs and 5 people in too at times. Plus the dog sometimes, bikes etc. Great car.
Question for longer term owners : does the variable steering become more predictable eventually after time?
Question for tyre changers : do new tyres help with steering response ?
Great thread btw
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I pretty much agree with that. I've covered 15K in mine now. Steering doesn't change with time. The car generally losens up a bit though.
I find you need to force it to stay in either comfort or dynamic depending on what you want. I use the individual settings on the Drive Select to set this up. Doesn't randomly tighten up then without you expecting it, it's either one or the other!
New tires always help a bit, but it is limited by its mechanics as mentioned before. Just about to stick a full new set of tyres on!
Jon-SST
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Thanks W Soul. What tyres are you going for ?
With the steering what I meant was did you as a driver get better using it with time ?
Also for some strange reason I think the steering in Eco mode is the most predictable.
With the steering what I meant was did you as a driver get better using it with time ?
Also for some strange reason I think the steering in Eco mode is the most predictable.
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Im going for the same set that came with the car. Was pretty impressed by them as an all-rounder really. So that's a set of 225/40/R18 92Y Continental SportContact 5's. About £100 a wheel, getting the wheel alignment done as well.
I got use to the steering after a while yeah. Just like the auto box can take a little getting use to in terms of getting it to behave exactly as you want it to! My steering is always set in comfort unless I'm going for a proper drive in the country or something
I got use to the steering after a while yeah. Just like the auto box can take a little getting use to in terms of getting it to behave exactly as you want it to! My steering is always set in comfort unless I'm going for a proper drive in the country or something
Why thank you @Rob2k68Happy belated Birthday to BH ...
Did make me laugh I must admit!
Bet you can't get them in the S3 version ...
All this talk about handling issues............
Beleive me the S3 can be hustled along at a very rapid pace. Its a great car for travelling a good distnace and doing it 'safely' and quickly.
For most people they might never get to the condition where you would notice an 'issue'. Even then I dont believe its a big deal. At very high speeds on an undualting or less than flat B road the car feels unsettled, a bit light and bouncy which may give cause for some concern. But I've found that the speeds and manner of driving you need to be travelling at on public roads to reach this situation would probably get you arrested. The answer is not to push the car that bit further and accept it's limitations. Which to some might be a bit annoying. There are obviously cars which have better on the limit manners but it certainly doesnt spoil my enjoyment and pleasure I get from mine and it woudnt cause me to go elswhere for a different model.
Beleive me the S3 can be hustled along at a very rapid pace. Its a great car for travelling a good distnace and doing it 'safely' and quickly.
For most people they might never get to the condition where you would notice an 'issue'. Even then I dont believe its a big deal. At very high speeds on an undualting or less than flat B road the car feels unsettled, a bit light and bouncy which may give cause for some concern. But I've found that the speeds and manner of driving you need to be travelling at on public roads to reach this situation would probably get you arrested. The answer is not to push the car that bit further and accept it's limitations. Which to some might be a bit annoying. There are obviously cars which have better on the limit manners but it certainly doesnt spoil my enjoyment and pleasure I get from mine and it woudnt cause me to go elswhere for a different model.
If you try to drive it like you stole it your travelling at up to or more than double the legal limit. So the speeds at which this issue shows up really are very high, totally illegal and the issue is probaly relatively insignificant unless you want to do track days.
I'm not sure that the fact another popular hot hatch could take a road at 130 instead of 128 in an S3 is of great importance. The differenc would undoubtably show round a circuit but never at leagal speeds in the UK.
I'm not sure that the fact another popular hot hatch could take a road at 130 instead of 128 in an S3 is of great importance. The differenc would undoubtably show round a circuit but never at leagal speeds in the UK.
Two points (for now)
The top speed of the car is advertised as 155mph, which in certain places, is legal. A car that can achieve this speed, but not cope at that speed, is not a good thing.
Other owners (including myself) have had the car pitch unpredictably, and upset the attitude of the car, at speeds well within the UK national speed limit. To say that you would not achieve this in the UK within the national speed limits is a falsehood.
The top speed of the car is advertised as 155mph, which in certain places, is legal. A car that can achieve this speed, but not cope at that speed, is not a good thing.
Other owners (including myself) have had the car pitch unpredictably, and upset the attitude of the car, at speeds well within the UK national speed limit. To say that you would not achieve this in the UK within the national speed limits is a falsehood.
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Veeeight I appreciate your opinion and rate your comments highly.
However I havent had any issues on slow speed corners, thats up to sixty miles an hour. The only time I find my S3 pitching is on an undulating winding road with direction changes. Trying to push down a a B road or fast A road with changes in loading from one side to another I can get it to pitch at will but the speed I'm travelling at is far quicker than I ought to be.
At some point every car reaches its limits, some earlier than others, the car is limited to 155 but surely we cant expect it to travel every where at that speed safely? I can assure you mine is rock stady on the limiter. Would I want to corner at that speed? No. Mine doesnt pitch as a result of high speeds, its direction changes and less than flat roads that causes it to reach its limits.
However I havent had any issues on slow speed corners, thats up to sixty miles an hour. The only time I find my S3 pitching is on an undulating winding road with direction changes. Trying to push down a a B road or fast A road with changes in loading from one side to another I can get it to pitch at will but the speed I'm travelling at is far quicker than I ought to be.
At some point every car reaches its limits, some earlier than others, the car is limited to 155 but surely we cant expect it to travel every where at that speed safely? I can assure you mine is rock stady on the limiter. Would I want to corner at that speed? No. Mine doesnt pitch as a result of high speeds, its direction changes and less than flat roads that causes it to reach its limits.
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And that's your experience, which is fair enough!
I, and many other owners (plenty of threads started by them) have found other combinations of roads, and speeds, which do not lend themselves to the set up of the S3.
The same roads, when driven on with my S3 8P, or other cars, do not upset the car(s) in the same manner as it does the 8V.
As for the high speed handling - this car is not as assured and planted when compared with other "lesser" cars on the same roads at the same speeds.Again, I'm not the only one to have discovered this.
But to take your example of fast direction changes - I do think that it's particularly galling that the S3 (a S car) should not be capable of quick direction changes, even worse, the 8P was better in this respect. I can categorically state this, having owned both, and driven both long term on the same roads under all conditions.
When one "upgrades" a car, with 10 years possible progress between platforms, one does not expect a loss of performance or less capability on the newer platform.
I, and many other owners (plenty of threads started by them) have found other combinations of roads, and speeds, which do not lend themselves to the set up of the S3.
The same roads, when driven on with my S3 8P, or other cars, do not upset the car(s) in the same manner as it does the 8V.
As for the high speed handling - this car is not as assured and planted when compared with other "lesser" cars on the same roads at the same speeds.Again, I'm not the only one to have discovered this.
But to take your example of fast direction changes - I do think that it's particularly galling that the S3 (a S car) should not be capable of quick direction changes, even worse, the 8P was better in this respect. I can categorically state this, having owned both, and driven both long term on the same roads under all conditions.
When one "upgrades" a car, with 10 years possible progress between platforms, one does not expect a loss of performance or less capability on the newer platform.
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Right, 1st thing, I'm not wearing rose tinted glasses.
So.....I've got a car that can brush off most cars on the road, has 300HP, 4WD on-demand, launch control & a 'flappy paddle' gearbox but it doesn't deserve an S badge?
Get a grip, an S isn't supposed to be a race car.
It's perfectly good enough to do the job. Some of us have pushed the S3 a fair bit and we've all seen the multitude of YouTube clips so we know it's not an unpredictable handful at speed in the right hands.
What? You've found a bit of road that unsettles it? It can happen, to any car. Never had it myself yet with the S3.
I love how I can cruise round town in comfort and also head out the road for a bit of serious fun, that is what S cars are about now, best of both worlds. Want a bit more? Buy an RS. More? R8. Not enough seats? Look at different brand then.
Some people just need to get the chip off their shoulder and move on. It really must be a bitch when you don't click with a car but don't try and drag us down to your level of dissatisfaction, thanks.
I'm more than happy with mine.
Jesus, long way down from this high horse
So.....I've got a car that can brush off most cars on the road, has 300HP, 4WD on-demand, launch control & a 'flappy paddle' gearbox but it doesn't deserve an S badge?
Get a grip, an S isn't supposed to be a race car.
It's perfectly good enough to do the job. Some of us have pushed the S3 a fair bit and we've all seen the multitude of YouTube clips so we know it's not an unpredictable handful at speed in the right hands.
What? You've found a bit of road that unsettles it? It can happen, to any car. Never had it myself yet with the S3.
I love how I can cruise round town in comfort and also head out the road for a bit of serious fun, that is what S cars are about now, best of both worlds. Want a bit more? Buy an RS. More? R8. Not enough seats? Look at different brand then.
Some people just need to get the chip off their shoulder and move on. It really must be a bitch when you don't click with a car but don't try and drag us down to your level of dissatisfaction, thanks.
I'm more than happy with mine.
Jesus, long way down from this high horse
What chip on what shoulder?
In whose book, would it be correct that a £30k S Audi, performs worse than a £20k Diesel Fiesta around corners?
In whose book, would it be correct that a £30k S Audi, performs worse than its 10 year old predecessor?
Who is trying to drag anyone down?
It's just an opinion (this forum is full of them ) as valid as any other on here, unless of course, you only want positives
If you're happy with your car, that's great, and that's what this thread is for.
But to deny the absence of any issue flies in the face of the numerous, other owners, on this forum, who have all expressed their view of their experiences of the suspension and steering issues
In whose book, would it be correct that a £30k S Audi, performs worse than a £20k Diesel Fiesta around corners?
In whose book, would it be correct that a £30k S Audi, performs worse than its 10 year old predecessor?
Who is trying to drag anyone down?
It's just an opinion (this forum is full of them
) as valid as any other on here, unless of course, you only want positives If you're happy with your car, that's great, and that's what this thread is for.
But to deny the absence of any issue flies in the face of the numerous, other owners, on this forum, who have all expressed their view of their experiences of the suspension and steering issues
I like this page, a lot of feedback!
I think (maybe) some of you misunderstand, veight is offering a detailed experience and comparison about the car's performance.
I can't directly compare having not pushed the car hard at all (rarely did this in the 8P either) but some people want, and should expect, to have a car that can be pushed without struggle at its limits.
If it does fall short of the 8P then I'm sure they will address this when making changes to the 8V in time.
I think (maybe) some of you misunderstand, veight is offering a detailed experience and comparison about the car's performance.
I can't directly compare having not pushed the car hard at all (rarely did this in the 8P either) but some people want, and should expect, to have a car that can be pushed without struggle at its limits.
If it does fall short of the 8P then I'm sure they will address this when making changes to the 8V in time.
