New Car New Problems

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Jenno007

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Hi Guys,

On Tuesday I very excitedly purchased a BAM S3.

I'm loving the car, but now I am starting to discover little problems with it. This is no big deal and has not put me off the car at all, I love the challenge of trying to fix everything.

I scanned the car and got the following codes

17704 - Error in Mapped Cooling System (***The car needs a new thermostat and I plan on changing this on the weekend***)
17608 - Boost Pressure Control Valve (N249): Mechanical Malfunction
17524 - Oxygen (Lambda) Sensor Heating Bank 1 Sensor 1: Open Circuit
17511 - Oxygen (Lambda) Sensor Heating: Performance too low
00812 - Brake Pressure Release Solenoid

The car has a bit of a rough idle, and to be honest, isn't as quick as I thought it would be. I've cleared all these codes and I will wait a day and see what comes back.

The main issue I have is the quattro is locked on. Even with the fuse out and the handbrake up all 4 wheels spin (jacked the car up to confirm this). This makes slow maneuvers difficult with the car hopping all over the place.

I checked the oil level (was full)
the earth strap (removed the strap and confirmed it made a circuit)

Now I don't know what else to check.
When the car was jacked up I put it in first gear and all 4 wheels spun (with the handbrake switch on). I then tried to use my foot to stop one of the rear wheels and the car made a weird slow ticking/crunching noise. Of Course when I tried to record the noise it stopped doing it.

I have been searching through heaps of other threads and I've tried every suggestion I've seen. If someone else could throw me some ideas that would be great. Please don't think I'm asking here without searching, trust me I am searching. One thing to note is it looks like the car has been on the beach, there is a tiny bit of rust on the bottom and a fine sand. Could this have messed up some electronics that may have locked the haldex on?


**Other strange things that I would like to confirm if they are normal or not.

The lights on the dash are always on even if the parking lights/headlights are off.
The run after pump will come on even if the car is stone cold and I turn the ignition on and off (without starting the car). It will then run for a few minutes which seems strange to me because the car is obviously not warm..


Thanks guys!
 
If the haldex is still locked after pulling the fuse then its a mechanical issue... typically the plates sticking together... could also be the controller stuck in the 'on' position as its a valve controlled by a stepper motor... lack of oil changes contribute ot this assuming there is oil in it at all...

Lambda issue sounds like a faulty sensor...

Rough idle could be an air leak... check fuel trims (wait a bit seeing as you have reset the codes as this also resets the fuel trims)

Dash lights and needles are codable in VCDS... they can be set to all off, backlit but needles off, needles on but not backlight or all on... I have mine set all on from personal preference..

After run pump operation is normal

<tuffty/>
 
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<tuffty/> said:
If the haldex is still locked after pulling the fuse then its a mechanical issue... typically the plates sticking together... could also be the controller stuck in the 'on' position as its a valve controlled by a stepper motor... lack of oil changes contribute ot this assuming there is oil in it at all...

Lambda issue sounds like a faulty sensor...

Rough idle could be an air leak... check fuel trims (wait a bit seeing as you have reset the codes as this also resets the fuel trims)

Dash lights and needles are codable in VCDS... they can be set to all off, backlit but needles off, needles on but not backlight or all on... I have mine set all on from personal preference..

After run pump operation is normal

<tuffty/>
Click to expand...

Wow mate I'm going to have to start paying you for all this help.

I read on another post that a good indication of a boost leak is to view block 032 and if fuel trims are negative more than 5% there is a good chance that there is a leak. I'm guessing that you need to do this while the car is under load? Does this sound like the best method to you?

I took off the oil level check plug on the haldex (with a 6mm allen key) and stuck a bit of wire in and the oil level was quite high. I have ordered more oil, a filter and the tool to remove the filter.

Could you please link me to somewhere I can read more about this stepper motor, I don't fully understand how it works/don't know what to search to find out more. But it sounds like it's going to be an expensive fix. The car was recently serviced at a local audi dealership. I will call them up and see what they have to say.

I've just ordered the ross tech vcds cable ($400 later!) so I will have a go at coding things. I would prefer the dash lights not to be on when the car isn't running, but I do quite like them on when the car is on and the headlights are off.


edit: is there definitely nothing electrical, faulty switched that could be causing it to lock on even with the fuse removed?
 
Last edited:
You undid what plug exactly? as far as I am aware there is no 'level' plug... the only plug you use is the one at the bottom to drain and fill...

Read this for more haldex info...
http://www.volkspage.net/technik/ssp/ssp/SSP_206.pdf

If its still binding with the fuse pulled then its most likely an iffy controller or potentially the plates... here is some info thats worth a read
http://www.ttforum.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=202454

(btw... if you undid any of the three 'plugs' shown in the first pic of that thread then these aren't level plugs... )

<tuffty/>
 
<tuffty/> said:
You undid what plug exactly? as far as I am aware there is no 'level' plug... the only plug you use is the one at the bottom to drain and fill...

Read this for more haldex info...
http://www.volkspage.net/technik/ssp/ssp/SSP_206.pdf

If its still binding with the fuse pulled then its most likely an iffy controller or potentially the plates... here is some info thats worth a read
http://www.ttforum.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=202454

(btw... if you undid any of the three 'plugs' shown in the first pic of that thread then these aren't level plugs... )

<tuffty/>
Click to expand...

Thanks for that tuffty, I read that there was a level plug somewhere that you undid with an allen key, so I found a plug on the side that needed an allen key to undo and presumed that was it. I must be mistaken. I called the place that serviced it in June and they said that they recommended the haldex oil be changed at the previous service but the owner decided against it (as he was selling the car).

I'm going to try and drive it at little as possible until the service kit arrives and I will change the oil and filter. Hopefully that will fix it, I'm really doubting it will though.

The dealership advised me that there is a place near me that specialised in this kind of stuff so if I can't fix it at least there is somewhere I can take it.

I'm guessing my options are pretty limited if giving it a service doesn't fix it.

Is there anything else I could do (that wouldn't involve buying an expensive part as a process of elimination)?

btw Tuffty I'm pretty sure this is the bolt I undid and presumed that it was the level inspection plug

2011-04-04130746.jpg
 
Level check plug is this one

HaldexGen1OilCheckplug_zpsa15a4183.jpg


as explained here

haldexservicing_small_zps7c6fe96e.jpg

:)
 
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rupe said:
Level check plug is this one

as explained here

:)
Click to expand...

Thank you! Now looking at it from that angle that does look like the bolt I checked! On the weekend I'll jack the car up again and have another look. Thanks for that. Given the symptoms I'm faced with, do you have any ideas as to what it could be?
 
<tuffty/> said:
Lambda issue sounds like a faulty sensor...
<tuffty/>
Click to expand...

Did some searching around, just want to double check. Is this the pre cat sensor or the post cat sensor. I imagined it would have been the post cat but after searching around it seems like it's the pre cat sensor (which seems very hard to get to, I had to take off the sway bar to even reach it).
 
audi upgrades
Jenno007 said:
Did some searching around, just want to double check. Is this the pre cat sensor or the post cat sensor. I imagined it would have been the post cat but after searching around it seems like it's the pre cat sensor (which seems very hard to get to, I had to take off the sway bar to even reach it).
Click to expand...

Bank 1 sensor 1 is pre-cat... wideband lambda in your case... only buy a bosch one

<tuffty/>
 
<tuffty/> said:
Bank 1 sensor 1 is pre-cat... wideband lambda in your case... only buy a bosch one

<tuffty/>
Click to expand...
The local store only stocks a Bosch one, a casual $200 later. Cheers. Any advice getting to it? Would you take the metal intercooler pipe out for a bit more room?
 
Yeah... remove that and the strut brace arguably... 22mm 'something' to get it off but I suspect it will be pretty tight... plenty of penetrating fluid and if you can do it without setting fire to stuff heat...

<tuffty/>
 
<tuffty/> said:
Yeah... remove that and the strut brace arguably... 22mm 'something' to get it off but I suspect it will be pretty tight... plenty of penetrating fluid and if you can do it without setting fire to stuff heat...

<tuffty/>
Click to expand...
Penetrating fluid? Setting fire to stuff? You've got me worried. The car is sitting at my storage unit so it will be stone cold. Or have I missed the humour?

Also I had to take a section of intercooler pipe off to get to the coolant drain tap and a fair bit of oil came out (it seemed like there was a little pool at the bottom of the passenger side smic). My mechanic mate though it was just from the pcv, and it's not blowing smoke at all which is a positive sign. But it still got me worried :/
 
Last edited:
:) the oil from smic is normal mine had that as well when i cleaned them. It is from the pcv. The pipe that conects the smics has probably some of it as well.
 
rupe said:
as explained here

haldexservicing_small_zps7c6fe96e.jpg

:)
Click to expand...

It says in this that the new oil cartridge is 0.25L, but the one I bought was 0.275L. Is the actual capacity of oil required for the unit 0.25L and the extra in the cannister intended for any losses of oil in re-filling the Haldex unit. I only ask cos I lost some when refilling mine earlier today.
 
The capacity's more @420ml as it says in the text, but when you drain the oil you don't actually lose all of it so the tube of 275ml is enough to refill what drains out, I think them quoting a 250ml tube is an error.
 
Jeriho said:
:) the oil from smic is normal mine had that as well when i cleaned them. It is from the pcv. The pipe that conects the smics has probably some of it as well.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the reply, from my understanding of how the PCV works I didn't think there would be so much oil. I got a faceful of it, literally haha. I would say there was about 150ml that drained out which seemed a lot to me :\. Given that the pipe from the passanger SMIC to the throttle body is quite steep, I think it struggled to make its way to the throttle body and just sat there..

rupe said:
The capacity's more @420ml as it says in the text, but when you drain the oil you don't actually lose all of it so the tube of 275ml is enough to refill what drains out, I think them quoting a 250ml tube is an error.
Click to expand...
I'm servicing my haldex today as the parts arrived, I'm interested to see how much will come out. If my servicing the haldex doesn't stop it from always being on, is there anything else I can test as a process of elimination. How would I check the pump is still working for example, any way with VCDS? (my authentic cable arrived yesterday!)
 
You can run the pump and operate the controller if you goto 22- AWD and then select output tests, it's very hard to hear the controller operate as the pump will be running, I find it easier to hear from inside the car, but might take a few cycles of the test for you to hear it.
 
rupe said:
You can run the pump and operate the controller if you goto 22- AWD and then select output tests, it's very hard to hear the controller operate as the pump will be running, I find it easier to hear from inside the car, but might take a few cycles of the test for you to hear it.
Click to expand...

Awesome thanks for that. I just changed the oil and filter and ****** me, the oil that came out was brand new. The woman at the service centre was obviously mistaken and they did change the oil at the last service... So I think I will have to take it somewhere to get it fixed. I will try run the pump and see if it's working through vcds first though, thanks for that
 
another question. I had the front of the car ramped up for a few days, I then ramped the rear up and started the car and it was blowing a little bit of white smoke. Could this be because I had the front of the car higher for a few days, or is there potentially something else wrong. It was just a tiny bit of smoke (almost thought it was condensation). Also there was no oil on the throttle body so I don't think it was burning oil from the PVC.
 
In desperate need for help...
So I purchased this
vphRWlE


the embedding doesn't seem to be working - http://imgur.com/vphRWlE < image link

which is a bosch Oxygen Sensor Pre-Catalytic Converter/Manifold, and I replaced the old sensor with that (the one under the sway bar behind the engine facing upwards) and the car was running VERY rich. Could smell fuel straight away and it wasn't firing properly, sounded like it was almost flooding itself.

I now have even MORE error codes.

17863/P1455 - Exhaust Gas Temp Sensor 1 (G235): Implausible Signal
17524/P1116/004374 - Oxygen (Lambda) Sensor Heating Bank 1 Sensor 1: Open Circuit
17704/P1296/004758 - Error in Mapped Cooling System <-- Got this after the car was only running for about 20 seconds so I'm thinking it must be the CTS and not the thermostat so I've ordered a new one
17511/P1103/004355 - Oxygen (Lambda) Sensor Heating; B1 S1: Performance too Low
18010/P1602/005634 - Power Supply B+ Terminal 30: Voltage too Low <-- I took the battery out to check the earth points underneath. I must not have connected the terminals correctly? Everything electrical seems to be fine though.

Just wondering, are error codes 17863, 17524, 17511 all relating to the same sensor? They are all saying Sensor 1, but it's called the EGT in one error code and Oxygen (Lambda) in the other. If they are different sensors I may have replaced the EGT sensor with a Lambda sensor which would explain the problems I'm getting, but as far as I'm aware they are the same sensor?
[
Would appreciate any help! Thanks
 
Not the same sensor... the ECU has the concept of multiple sensor and bank combos for engine where there are more than one of each... for example the v6 S4 Bi-Turbo has two sets of lambdas and EGT probes... Sensor 1 Bank 1 and Sensor 1 Bank 2 for each of the two down pipes

Could be wiring, could also be a clutch of crap sensors... sadly I have seen the EGT probe one before and its not gonna end well... replacement sensor may be required and they aren't cheap...

You said you checked the earths under the battery? I would try to eliminate wiring as a issue before buying sensors of course...

Considering the fault codes you have... EGT sensor faults normally result in overfuelling... overfuelling could kill the lambda if left unchecked for a prolonged period of time... could be the EGT fault lead to the Lambda fault...

<tuffty/>
 
<tuffty/> said:
Not the same sensor... the ECU has the concept of multiple sensor and bank combos for engine where there are more than one of each... for example the v6 S4 Bi-Turbo has two sets of lambdas and EGT probes... Sensor 1 Bank 1 and Sensor 1 Bank 2 for each of the two down pipes

Could be wiring, could also be a clutch of **** sensors... sadly I have seen the EGT probe one before and its not gonna end well... replacement sensor may be required and they aren't cheap...

You said you checked the earths under the battery? I would try to eliminate wiring as a issue before buying sensors of course...

Considering the fault codes you have... EGT sensor faults normally result in overfuelling... overfuelling could kill the lambda if left unchecked for a prolonged period of time... could be the EGT fault lead to the Lambda fault...

<tuffty/>
Click to expand...

Not the same sensor? Well what I think i have done then is installed the Lambda sensor where the EGT sensor goes.

Where abouts is the Lambda sensor bank 1 sensor 1?

I installed the new Lambda sensor behind the engine (stand in front of the car and look behind the engine and the sensor is pointing upwards). From what you've said I'm guessing that is actually the EGT sensor?

I'm hoping if I put the EGT sensor back in and then install the lambda sensor in the correct spot it will resolve both problems.

Does it sounds like I have installed it in the incorrect spot?
 
Oh dear.....

The EGT sensor consists of a black box thats fitted under the inlet manifold and has a braided cable that goes round to the back of the engine with a probe that fits into the hotside of the turbo..

EGT sensor looks like this..
DSCF2800.jpg


Lambda probe fits in the downpipe..
DSCN5889-vi.jpg


One would have to be incredibly silly to mix the two up :)

<tuffty/>
 
<tuffty/> said:
Oh dear.....

The EGT sensor consists of a black box thats fitted under the inlet manifold and has a braided cable that goes round to the back of the engine with a probe that fits into the hotside of the turbo..

EGT sensor looks like this..
DSCF2800.jpg


Lambda probe fits in the downpipe..
DSCN5889-vi.jpg


One would have to be incredibly silly to mix the two up :)

<tuffty/>
Click to expand...


Okay, I definitely replaced the correct sensor. I don't understand though, I never had any EGT sensor issues until I replaced the Lambda sensor...


Just to confirm, is Bank 1 Sensor 1 (Lambda sensor)

A) Under the red circle, facing upwards (hidden from this picture by the intercooler piping)
059lzLG


B) Here
A26-0142.jpg



I replaced the sensor from image A. If it is infact the sensor from picture B (not sure if there is actually a sensor there for the BAM engine as I haven't checked on my car), what is the sensor from image A.

Really confused and getting a little frustrated with this car already :(
 
Thats Sensor 2 bank 1... post cat lambda...

Sensor 1 bank 1 is pre cat sensor and located in the top of the down pipe just as it comes out the turbo

<tuffty/>
 
<tuffty/> said:
Thats Sensor 2 bank 1... post cat lambda...

Sensor 1 bank 1 is pre cat sensor and located in the top of the down pipe just as it comes out the turbo

<tuffty/>
Click to expand...
Are you referring to the first picture I posted or the second?

The sensor I replaced was definitely before the cat. I was getting to it from the engine bay.
 
<tuffty/> said:
Can't see the first picture

<tuffty/>
Click to expand...
http://imgur.com/059lzLG

Under the red circle (obviously not on the intercooler pipe). The sensor I replaced was under the red circle facing upwards and was a right pain in the *** to change.

I just don't understand how me installing a new sensor there (lambda) has given me an egt fault..
 
Hypothetically it shouldn't have but its plausible you may have knocked the probe and damaged the probes wiring somehow...

<tuffty/>
 
<tuffty/> said:
Hypothetically it shouldn't have but its plausible you may have knocked the probe and damaged the probes wiring somehow...

<tuffty/>
Click to expand...
I haven't even seen the egt sensor you posted above, so I don't know how I could have knocked it :/

What I'll do is when I get time I'll take a picture of what I replaced and hopefully someone can confirm if that is bank 1 sensor 1 oxygen sensor. I'm volunteering away in the country this weekend so I won't have time till Sunday to get some pictures.

Thanks for your help so far
 
Jenno007 said:
I haven't even seen the egt sensor you posted above, so I don't know how I could have knocked it :/

What I'll do is when I get time I'll take a picture of what I replaced and hopefully someone can confirm if that is bank 1 sensor 1 oxygen sensor. I'm volunteering away in the country this weekend so I won't have time till Sunday to get some pictures.

Thanks for your help so far
Click to expand...

Yes, the sensor in the first picture is sensor 1 bank 1 lambda

<tuffty/>
 
<tuffty/> said:
Yes, the sensor in the first picture is sensor 1 bank 1 lambda

<tuffty/>
Click to expand...

I've discovered what part of the problem was.
When I first purchased the car it ha a slightly rough idle (which I believed was a vac leak). When fitting the sensor I must have knocked the brake servo line behind the head shield because on inspecting it, it was split on both ends. I replaced it with some silicone hose and now the car is running fine and that slight rough idle has disappeared. I have purchased silicone hoses for all boost and vac lines excluding intercooler hoses, N249 and PCV as I will be installing a catch can soon and bypassing the N249.

However, with the new lambda sensor, I am still getting the 17524 and 18010 fault codes.

I am going to try trace the cables back to where they come from but I am really lost as to why I am getting the fault code still.

With regards to the 18010 I am not too worried as it doesn't seem to affect anything.
 
<tuffty/> said:
If you have replaced the lambda sensor and still getting 17524 fault code then its a wiring issue... there is a fuse for sensors too... not sure which one it is off hand but I'd check that... I'd also check the wiring around that area... it could be related to the 18010 code as this only comes up when the power is interrupted to the ECU

http://wiki.ross-tech.com/wiki/index.php/18010/P1602/005634

http://wiki.ross-tech.com/wiki/index.php/17524/P1116/004374

<tuffty/>
Click to expand...

urgh I was worried it might be a wiring issue. The engine bay is so tight... I've checked every single fuse and they are all fine. Guess I will have to go hunting for a broken wire, thanks.
 
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