Ea888 Question

m2srt

m2srt

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Hi,

I'm new to this site and waiting patiently for my 2015 S3. Does anyone know if there are any differences between the S3's EA888 and that of the Golf R's? Does VW now have access to Audi's 'Valve Lift' technology?
 
m2srt said:
Hi,

I'm new to this site and waiting patiently for my 2015 S3. Does anyone know if there are any differences between the S3's EA888 and that of the Golf R's? Does VW now have access to Audi's 'Valve Lift' technology?
Click to expand...

Same engine as the S1 aswell
 
All the same engine (although the S3 version has strengthened parts over the S1/Golf GTI version).

What is the valve lift technology your referring to? Not heard of this before.
 
Pulp84 said:
All the same engine (although the S3 version has strengthened parts over the S1/Golf GTI version).

What is the valve lift technology your referring to? Not heard of this before.
Click to expand...

In earlier incarnations of the EA888, Audi was using a fully implemented 'Valve Lift' system. VW were using a simplified version of this.
 
m2srt said:
In earlier incarnations of the EA888, Audi was using a fully implemented 'Valve Lift' system. VW were using a simplified version of this.
Click to expand...

Also on earlier versions they where using a KO4 turbo now they use a IHI turbo.

Lots of tuners are quoting figures they could achieve with the KO4 and not the new IHI which is annoying!
 
I've read many, many articles on the EA888 280 / 300 P.S engine and it appears to be identical in application across VAG.

The whole point of the EA888 engine was it could be used across all markets / platforms / brands with very few modifications - I think internally it's called the EA888 "global" engine for that reason.

Think the question is does the EA888 have this lift technology rather than does the R have it too.

Suspect Veeeight will know.....
 
Last edited:
Here is the best info I have found on the EA888: Tech Analysis: Next Generation 2.0 TFSI for New Audi S3 - Fourtitude.com

The article highlights the following new features:
  1. Modified aluminium pistons and higher strength conrods with new bearings help more effectively transfer power to the crankshaft.
  2. New cast iron crankcase boasts stiffening at the main bearing seats and cover.
  3. New cylinder head design is made from a new, high-strength aluminum-silicon alloy with improved thermal stability and decreased weight.
  4. Exhaust valves have a hollow design and are filled with cooling sodium.
  5. Maximum pressure for the new turbo is 1.2 bar with a theoretical throughput of 1,000 kg or 850,000 liters of air per hour.
  6. High-performance air-to-air intercooler that helps reduce the turbos operating temperatures significantly.
  7. New electronically controlled waste gate can operate much more quickly and reduces the pumping necessary because of decreased charge pressure and exhaust back pressure.
  8. Addition of indirect injection to supplement the FSI direction injection system when operating under partial load. By utilizing this feature, this lowers consumption andparticulate emissions, balancing the direct injection system that is utilized more efficiently at startup and under higher loads.
  9. The intake camshaft is also adjustable through 60 degrees of crank angle and the exhaust camshaft adjustable through 30 degrees.
  10. Valvelift system varies valve lift in two stages on the exhaust side. Drumble flaps help direct the in-flowing air into a very specific pattern.
  11. Engine operates at a compression of 9.3:1 – quite high for a turbocharged engine.
 
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audi upgrades
boltor said:
Here is the best info I have found on the EA888: Tech Analysis: Next Generation 2.0 TFSI for New Audi S3 - Fourtitude.com

The article highlights the following new features:
  1. Modified aluminium pistons and higher strength conrods with new bearings help more effectively transfer power to the crankshaft.
  2. New cast iron crankcase boasts stiffening at the main bearing seats and cover.
  3. New cylinder head design is made from a new, high-strength aluminum-silicon alloy with improved thermal stability and decreased weight.
  4. Exhaust valves have a hollow design and are filled with cooling sodium.
  5. Maximum pressure for the new turbo is 1.2 bar with a theoretical throughput of 1,000 kg or 850,000 liters of air per hour.
  6. High-performance air-to-air intercooler that helps reduce the turbos operating temperatures significantly.
  7. New electronically controlled waste gate can operate much more quickly and reduces the pumping necessary because of decreased charge pressure and exhaust back pressure.
  8. Addition of indirect injection to supplement the FSI direction injection system when operating under partial load. By utilizing this feature, this lowers consumption andparticulate emissions, balancing the direct injection system that is utilized more efficiently at startup and under higher loads.
  9. The intake camshaft is also adjustable through 60 degrees of crank angle and the exhaust camshaft adjustable through 30 degrees.
  10. Valvelift system varies valve lift in two stages on the exhaust side. Drumble flaps help direct the in-flowing air into a very specific pattern.
  11. Engine operates at a compression of 9.3:1 – quite high for a turbocharged engine.
Click to expand...

That makes for interesting reading for a novice like myself :) thank you
 
boltor said:
Here is the best info I have found on the EA888: Tech Analysis: Next Generation 2.0 TFSI for New Audi S3 - Fourtitude.com

The article highlights the following new features:
  1. Modified aluminium pistons and higher strength conrods with new bearings help more effectively transfer power to the crankshaft.
  2. New cast iron crankcase boasts stiffening at the main bearing seats and cover.
  3. New cylinder head design is made from a new, high-strength aluminum-silicon alloy with improved thermal stability and decreased weight.
  4. Exhaust valves have a hollow design and are filled with cooling sodium.
  5. Maximum pressure for the new turbo is 1.2 bar with a theoretical throughput of 1,000 kg or 850,000 liters of air per hour.
  6. High-performance air-to-air intercooler that helps reduce the turbos operating temperatures significantly.
  7. New electronically controlled waste gate can operate much more quickly and reduces the pumping necessary because of decreased charge pressure and exhaust back pressure.
  8. Addition of indirect injection to supplement the FSI direction injection system when operating under partial load. By utilizing this feature, this lowers consumption andparticulate emissions, balancing the direct injection system that is utilized more efficiently at startup and under higher loads.
  9. The intake camshaft is also adjustable through 60 degrees of crank angle and the exhaust camshaft adjustable through 30 degrees.
  10. Valvelift system varies valve lift in two stages on the exhaust side. Drumble flaps help direct the in-flowing air into a very specific pattern.
  11. Engine operates at a compression of 9.3:1 – quite high for a turbocharged engine.
Click to expand...

So basically the Audi version is awesome
 
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P40ULW said:
@veeeight could you kindly cast any light on this?
Click to expand...
Which bit would you like insight on?

Both Golf R and S3 engines have the identical dual camshaft valve lift technology (same heads) the major difference between them is the ECU hardware, and calibration. All other major power plant components are shared :)
 
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veeeight said:
Which bit would you like insight on?

Both Golf R and S3 engines have the identical dual camshaft valve lift technology (same heads) the major difference between them is the ECU hardware, and calibration. All other major power plant components are shared :)
Click to expand...

You answered it in your answer :) thank you sir!
 
For me, the biggest plus(es) of this engine over the previous generation of FSI engines, are the additional indirect injectors, upstream of the inlet valves. It was a major decider for me to change the 8P for an 8V.

At a stroke, the issue of carbon buildup that plagued those engines have been alleviated. You only need to read @S3Alex 's build thread to see his horror photos :)



Edit:

For our NAS readers, your cars in the US will not be getting the additional indirect injectors, so keep those regular de-coking sessions at the dealers booked in :/
 
Last edited:
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Told you he would know.....;)

Thanks veeeight!
 
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veeeight said:
For me, the biggest plus(es) of this engine over the previous generation of FSI engines, are the additional indirect injectors, upstream of the inlet valves. It was a major decider for me to change the 8P for an 8V.

At a stroke, the issue of carbon buildup that plagued those engines have been alleviated. You only need to read @S3Alex 's build thread to see his horror photos :)
Click to expand...

That's true,and RS4 V8 owners as well,suffer this problem.

I've found two ways to deal with this,the first being a vent-to-atmosphere breather system,and the second funnily enough being a second set of indirect injectors ,via a new manifold.



Now neither are cheap solutions,but for the engine on my car,they not only solve the coking,but the latter also opens up the potential for a good deal more power.
 
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P40ULW said:
Also on earlier versions they where using a KO4 turbo now they use a IHI turbo.

Lots of tuners are quoting figures they could achieve with the KO4 and not the new IHI which is annoying!
Click to expand...

The best that could be expected on the K04 is around 380bhp,and perhaps a bit more,with the timing pushed on WMI.

The problem with the new engine is firstly the dud batch of IHI turbos,and then dealing with the ECU encryption,neither of which are issues on the older engine,plus there are now a TON of parts for the older engine,from bolts to turbos and rods.

All of this will come for the new engine,but will take time,and I think the integrated exhaust manifold and turbo will be a sticking point at some stage as well.
 
S3Alex said:
and I think the integrated exhaust manifold and turbo will be a sticking point at some stage as well.
Click to expand...


That, and the extremely thin walled block (3mm) will be limitations.

But at least for now we know that 420PS has been achieved in a concept. Reliability unknown :)
 
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veeeight said:
That, and the extremely thin walled block (3mm) will be limitations.

But at least for now we know that 420PS has been achieved in a concept. Reliability unknown :)
Click to expand...

Another good point.....I don't know how thick the block on mine is,but power on that model doesn't seem to be a problem,with a number of people getting over 700bhp.
 
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veeeight said:
For me, the biggest plus(es) of this engine over the previous generation of FSI engines, are the additional indirect injectors, upstream of the inlet valves. It was a major decider for me to change the 8P for an 8V.

At a stroke, the issue of carbon buildup that plagued those engines have been alleviated. You only need to read @S3Alex 's build thread to see his horror photos :)



Edit:

For our NAS readers, your cars in the US will not be getting the additional indirect injectors, so keep those regular de-coking sessions at the dealers booked in :/
Click to expand...

Same reason for me also
 
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The Challinor said:
So basically the Audi version is awesome
Click to expand...

The Mk7 Golf R, 8V S3 and newest Leon Cupra R have the same engine. The only difference that has been seen at this point is that the ECUs (between the Golf R and S3 at least) are significantly different for some reason.

This has caught tuning companies out who purchased a Golf R, hoping to write tunes for the Golf R, S3 and Cupra R. This is the reason why APR's have recently had to backtrack on the release date for their S3 tune as all development work has been done for a Golf R.
 
pat15312 said:
Not correct. The S1 used the old EA113 engine from the last generation S3/Golf Ed30/Golf R/Leon Cupra
Click to expand...

Why then on any review i can find on the internet does it say that the new s1 uses the 3rd generation of Audi's EA888

I personally think your referring to the A1 Quattro that did use the older EA113 but I'm open to being proven otherwise.
 
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Reviewers notoriously get this sort of stuff wrong... I remember a review when Vicki Butler Henderson quoted the RS3 as being a 2.0 twin turbo...

If you can find a picture of the engine bay of an S1 then you'll know from that, although typing that into Google returns images of the old S1 Quattro as you might expect.
 
pat15312 said:
Reviewers notoriously get this sort of stuff wrong... I remember a review when Vicki Butler Henderson quoted the RS3 as being a 2.0 twin turbo...

If you can find a picture of the engine bay of an S1 then you'll know from that, although typing that into Google returns images of the old S1 Quattro as you might expect.
Click to expand...

I have an S1 what do you need a pic of?

6c045912f581015e86f1c93d975d6360.jpg
d16a096d1383ff88139582234ee06680.jpg
 
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Ok so not an EA113 engine then! Guess it was just the A1 Quattro that used that engine, my mistake.
 
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pat15312 said:
Ok so not an EA113 engine then! Guess it was just the A1 Quattro that used that engine, my mistake.
Click to expand...

Sir i take my hat off to you for admitting a mistake, glad to see there are more people in this world that will admit mistakes and its not just me :)
 
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Wow, there is some great knowledge on this forum. I know that Chris Harris felt that the Golf R had slightly more 'top end' than the S3. I didn't notice this during my test drives but the Golf that I drove didn't have it's radio fitted so it was in it's default drive setting. Once one of the major tuners release a switchable remap (like Bluefin or Revo) then I may look at going to 350hp-360hp. With it's comfort and subtle styling I really think that would make the S3 a A45 beater.
 
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m2srt said:
Once one of the major tuners release a switchable remap (like Bluefin or Revo) then I may look at going to 350hp-360hp. With it's comfort and subtle styling I really think that would make the S3 a A45 beater.
Click to expand...

True but it looks as if it's not been as easy as it was for the previous ECU and model.

That's why there are a number of tuning boxes right now and few real alternatives.

Likewise all of the parts for serious power are 8L and 8P.
You're basically where we were a few yrs back
 
S3Alex said:
True but it looks as if it's not been as easy as it was for the previous ECU and model.

That's why there are a number of tuning boxes right now and few real alternatives.

Likewise all of the parts for serious power are 8L and 8P.
You're basically where we were a few yrs back
Click to expand...

Still going through the development stages. I wish they would hurry up with a decent exhaust for the S1 :)
 
P40ULW said:
Still going through the development stages. I wish they would hurry up with a decent exhaust for the S1 :)
Click to expand...

You would think an exhaust would be easy enough wouldn't you.

I think aftermarket companies tend to hold back until they see what the market wants perhaps or what their competitors are up to.
 
S3Alex said:
You would think an exhaust would be easy enough wouldn't you.

I think aftermarket companies tend to hold back until they see what the market wants perhaps or what their competitors are up to.
Click to expand...

I think your spot on with your 'competitors' comment!
 
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Some things are best left untold...LOL.

There's a lot of funny stuff goes on between the various companies,and I suppose all to be expected in a commercial environment,but not all is what you might wish to find.
 
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P40ULW said:
I have an S1 what do you need a pic of?

6c045912f581015e86f1c93d975d6360.jpg
d16a096d1383ff88139582234ee06680.jpg
Click to expand...

In hunting around the forum then I bumped into this thread.

My 58 plate A3 (MY09) is a TSI (EA888) engine. I had that confirmed today when Niki Gower of R-Tech went to tune said car and I'd mistakingly booked it in as a TFSI. Yet the engine has a TFSI engine cover. So sometimes its the content of the book not the cover that reveals the detail!
 
Can R-tech remap EA888's just out of interest? I thought they only did older VW stuff.
 
chrise said:
Can R-tech remap EA888's just out of interest? I thought they only did older VW stuff.
Click to expand...

I did think it would be a wasted journey. As you say their knowledge and time is all about TFSI and the older 1.8T keeping them more than busy. But they didn't let me go home empty handed & put a map on it using (I understand) a more generic/ less in-house/ custom map they tweaked to help reduce some clutch slip they encountered. Sorry for thread hi-jack.
 
The S1 has the same EA888 engine found in the S3. The limited edition A1 Quattro from a few years ago had the old EA113 engine.
 
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