What are your thoughts on diesel vs petrol power delivery (test drive an S5 and RS5)

Im driving an A3 diseasel at the moment when my B8.5 S5 is at the dealers,i can't for the life of me understand why you are comparing it to an S5 or RS5 they are worlds apart in every aspect.:think:
 
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Im driving an A3 diseasel at the moment when my B8.5 S5 is at the dealers,i can't for the life of me understand why you are comparing it to an S5 or RS5 they are worlds apart in every aspect.:think:
Because I'm looking for a "performance" car that is also suitable for commuting. I am not saying that the A3 184Q is better than an S5 or RS5 in out and out speed, but it does have other benefits that push the balance back in it's favour (i.e. low running costs with relatively good performance yet delivers power very low in the rev range - which is where it needs to be IMHO).

Whilst I can totally understand an S5 or RS5 as something you can have fun in, whatever I end up with has to be very practical too. Driving 60ish miles a day on A/B roads, I need something that is powerful enough to have some fun in when I am able, I am also looking for something that either gives me goose pimples every time I drive it (so I can justify potentially 3 gallons of fuel A DAY which is over 2x what I currently spend) or is economical enough that I can afford to buy something else other than fuel for the car!

Fundamentally, I'm comparing them as I want something "better". I was expecting to come away from the test drive thinking "how can I live without driving an S5/RS5 on a daily basis". I didn't, but that isn't to say they are a bad car. I would love to have either as a fun car which I could use when I wasn't worried by fuel costs, but that isn't practical....

I'm rapidly coming to the conclusion that I either stick with what I have or look at the 3l quattro diesel. Or a Beamer (which seems to be the only other practical "performance diesel" alternative). I think I am coming to the conclusion petrol is out as the cost-per-goosebump (tm) is probably too high.
 
Look forward to your report on brake squeal !

There doesn't seem to be any universal love for any brand of aftermarket pads on this forum, whatever you mention someone has a horror story! Surely with some careful copper greasing it shouldn't be too bad. Thought the RS3 guys were running these with some success???? I know Revo used them on their S5 for a bit without any reported issues.!
 
arad, why have you removed the DTUK tuning box?

regards
 
Because I'm looking for a "performance" car that is also suitable for commuting. I am not saying that the A3 184Q is better than an S5 or RS5 in out and out speed, but it does have other benefits that push the balance back in it's favour (i.e. low running costs with relatively good performance yet delivers power very low in the rev range - which is where it needs to be IMHO).

Whilst I can totally understand an S5 or RS5 as something you can have fun in, whatever I end up with has to be very practical too. Driving 60ish miles a day on A/B roads, I need something that is powerful enough to have some fun in when I am able, I am also looking for something that either gives me goose pimples every time I drive it (so I can justify potentially 3 gallons of fuel A DAY which is over 2x what I currently spend) or is economical enough that I can afford to buy something else other than fuel for the car!

Fundamentally, I'm comparing them as I want something "better". I was expecting to come away from the test drive thinking "how can I live without driving an S5/RS5 on a daily basis". I didn't, but that isn't to say they are a bad car. I would love to have either as a fun car which I could use when I wasn't worried by fuel costs, but that isn't practical....

I'm rapidly coming to the conclusion that I either stick with what I have or look at the 3l quattro diesel. Or a Beamer (which seems to be the only other practical "performance diesel" alternative). I think I am coming to the conclusion petrol is out as the cost-per-goosebump (tm) is probably too high.

Fundamentally your paying for 300kgs more metal / refinement / toys / a bit of performance etc...., so please don't think the price will deliver all speed and thrills, it won't. You have to put your hand in your pocket again if you want absolute power!

If you can't stomach 25.9mpg as an average MPG then I wouldn't consider it. 24mpg was the lowest MPG I was prepared to accept on 10000 -12000 miles a year (circa £3k fuel a year with S-U/L).

I think the 335d/435d would be a reasonable match for the S5 without the sting at the pumps, and then the A5 3.0TDi Quattro a close second.
 
Your car is very new to be considering a change, won't you take a big hit on depreciation? That said you can buy an S5 for not much more for a new S3 at the moment if you bargain right so it's not all bad!
 
Fundamentally your paying for 300kgs more metal / refinement / toys / a bit of performance etc...., so please don't think the price will deliver all speed and thrills, it won't. You have to put your hand in your pocket again if you want absolute power!
Yup... I know.

If you can't stomach 25.9mpg as an average MPG then I wouldn't consider it. 24mpg was the lowest MPG I was prepared to accept on 10000 -12000 miles a year (circa £3k fuel a year with S-U/L).
I've done 4500 miles since March 1st.... and we have another car if we're out for the day so more like 12-15k/yr.

I think the 335d/435d would be a reasonable match for the S5 without the sting at the pumps, and then the A5 3.0TDi Quattro a close second.
The A5 3lQ is where I'm thinking... But it's a lot of money for slightly more performance.

What I really want is the ability to tune the heck out of the A3 rather than spend another £10-£15k for the correct spec A5 and then spend more again! £15k is a lot of diesel :)
 
Your car is very new to be considering a change, won't you take a big hit on depreciation? That said you can buy an S5 for not much more for a new S3 at the moment if you bargain right so it's not all bad!
Yes and yes.... Money in pocket and annoying itch wanting scratching....
 
Me no fit in the old 8P body.... (really, honestly... it was the reason I ended up with a new car rather than second hand 8P) - unless you mean a new one in which case maybe :)

The question was/is: "What are your thoughts on diesel vs petrol power delivery (test drive an S5 and RS5)" and NOT whether or not you fit into the old 8P body...
 
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There doesn't seem to be any universal love for any brand of aftermarket pads on this forum, whatever you mention someone has a horror story! Surely with some careful copper greasing it shouldn't be too bad. Thought the RS3 guys were running these with some success???? I know Revo used them on their S5 for a bit without any reported issues.!
Correct Warren !!!!

Been running the EBC redstuff on the RS3 now for 7 weeks+, NO Squeal whatsoever !!!! Better bite and best of all hardly any sodding dust !!!

A revelation. IMHO.
 
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You're not gonna get any "performance car that gives you goosebumps" and return the mpg of your diesel A3 .:no:
 
You're not gonna get any "performance car that gives you goosebumps" and return the mpg of your diesel A3 .:no:
No. My point was the only way I'll spring for a performance car is if it gives me goosebumps every time I drive it - due to fuel costs. Although I did get that feeling from the RS, the amount of time I'd actually get that feeling would be minimal as I felt the power delivery (and hence the post) wasn't particularly useful for day-to-day driving.... Although I only had limited time in the S5, the power delivery was far more consistent from low revs, but it still didn't inspire me to double my fuel costs...

The question in the original post fundamentally was - am I missing something on the way the power is delivered.
 
The question was/is: "What are your thoughts on diesel vs petrol power delivery (test drive an S5 and RS5)" and NOT whether or not you fit into the old 8P body...
Well... it wasn't clear from your original terse reply how "RS3" would apply to my original question...... so I answered your post with how I thought you had answered it :)
 
The downside of the s4/5 was the lottery fuel consumption for a while. Some early engines were getting 14mpg
 
I would say the 3.0tdi a5 feels totally different to the 184 ps engine
 
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I would say the 3.0tdi a5 feels totally different to the 184 ps engine

+1, the V6 is a peach and sounds remotely civilised for a diesel. I'd have one if my mileage increased.
 
How long after the new A4 will the new A5 appear?

Probably a few months or so. The S5 won't arrive for a few months after that, but I would guesstimate A4 towards the end of the year, then A5 a few months after that and first signs of S5 maybe mid next year.
 
Well... it wasn't clear from your original terse reply how "RS3" would apply to my original question...... so I answered your post with how I thought you had answered it :)

An RS3 was a good suggestion from 45bvtc ,it has plenty of power,thrilling to drive, will defininatley give you goose bumps and return good mpg.It fits the bill perfectly shame you don't fit in the car.:sob:
 
An RS3 was a good suggestion from 45bvtc ,it has plenty of power,thrilling to drive, will defininatley give you goose bumps and return good mpg.It fits the bill perfectly shame you don't fit in the car.:sob:
I might in the new one :)
 
Is this thread really about comparing the RS5 to DERV A3?! :ohmy:
 
I am really happy with my A4 3.0 TDI, remapped to 315bhp with 720Nm of torque it flies but also returns good economy for a 300 bhp quattro estate. Just got back from Manchester dropping the daughter off at the airport this morning. 75-85 mph on the motorway as not in any particular rush and after a 130 mile trip there and back the trip counter was showing 49 mpg.
The standard 3.0 is a bit flat, really needs a map to bring the best out of it.
With the map on mine it has similar performance to the new 3.0 BI-TDI.
The RS5 TDI prototype with two turbo's and an electric blower as well looks pretty good with a sub 4 second 0-60 it would be a match for most quick cars and probably only starts to lose out when you get to 3 figure speeds. After all their sucess at Le Mans with the diesels it's about time they brought out a proper RS model.

Audi RS5 V6 TDI-e prototype first drive Review | Autocar

karl.
 
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I am really happy with my A4 3.0 TDI, remapped to 315bhp with 720Nm of torque it flies but also returns good economy for a 300 bhp quattro estate. Just got back from Manchester dropping the daughter off at the airport this morning. 75-85 mph on the motorway as not in any particular rush and after a 130 mile trip there and back the trip counter was showing 49 mpg.
The standard 3.0 is a bit flat, really needs a map to bring the best out of it.
Excellent. That is really good news and sounds just what I am after - thanks. Where did you get the remap done?

Perhaps it's time to wait until the last of the current A5s are being sold - might get some good bargains that way :)
 
Look forward to your report on brake squeal !

ON MY CARS: REDSTUFF front and REAR on the RS3 and so GOOD.

Initial bite, low dust, etc., all so much better it hurts!

AND I've put a lot of effort into resolving brake issues on the RS3 with Audi UK and Audi GmbH

Done the same to the TT, REDSTUFF front and rear, ok, so the improvement is not as dramatic as on the RS3 but it's still oh so good.
 
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Well... it wasn't clear from your original terse reply how "RS3" would apply to my original question...... so I answered your post with how I thought you had answered it :)

Apologies arad85; I'm a 69-year old RS3 junkie - having been a Lotus Elan Sprint (and Plus 2 S130/5 and Europa Twin Cam) junkie for 37-years and more - and this RS3 is the only car I've since driven that I'd NEVER sell (and that after a HECTIC wet day recently with CRAZY German professionals at Silverstone with: RS4s, TTRS plus and R8V10 plus).

This 5-pot engine combined with 7-speed DSG is amazing... :thumbsup:
 
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Excellent. That is really good news and sounds just what I am after - thanks. Where did you get the remap done?
Remap was done by Rick at Unicorn Motor developments in Stockport, Have a look at my build thread if you are interested there is a link at the bottom of all my posts in the signtaure.

Karl.
 
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My old man had a new 63 plate a6 bitdi 3.0 Quattro for a bit and that felt ridiculously quick for what it was.......0-60 in 5.0 secs Iirc

He reckons it was as quick 60-100 as his e63 amg and that was epic! The only difference was the e63 would rattle your rib cage on tick over the diesel audi was synthetic noise in dynamic mode I believe .

But again I would buy an 8v s3 and tune it with full decat exhaust , large fmic, and a remap to within an inch of it's life and I bet you would be happy with power, leg room etc

Sean
 
But again I would buy an 8v s3 and tune it with full decat exhaust , large fmic, and a remap to within an inch of it's life and I bet you would be happy with power, leg room etc
I'm sure I would. It would be the fuel consumption that would be the issue :)

Current fave option is to wait until the A5s are just being replaced (which allows me not to have silly depreciation on the 184Q) then possibly a 3l A5 quattro with a remap. Although it will be interesting to see what engines the new A4 comes out with as you'd expect the A5 refresh to have those choices too...
 
I'm sure I would. It would be the fuel consumption that would be the issue :)

My stage 2+ S3 returned 27.9mpg over 3 years. The new one gives at least 3-4mpg more. That's very good return.
 
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It's only if you cane the **** off of it that it drops. 4 laps of the Nurburgring (quick, not flat out) delivered 17.9mpg.

Very little drop off of MPG with mods, one of the very rewarding ownership propositions. S3 has amazing potential when modded with shopping trolley running costs.
 
OK. Have you driven both? What were your impressions.

I have to say the A5 3l looks to be my only realistic upgrade.

I've not just driven both but owned both. :)

The 184ps is a nice engine but very 4pot diesel. The 3.0tdi is much smoother, faster and rich. My A6 even sounded very V like. The variants I had was a manual early A5 then a late a6 245

Now have an S3 but for diesels the 3.0 is truly brilliant. I would guess the 3.0bitdi would be great I'm guessing
 
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I've not just driven both but owned both. :)

The 184ps is a nice engine but very 4pot diesel. The 3.0tdi is much smoother, faster and rich. My A6 even sounded very V like. The variants I had was a manual early A5 then a late a6 245

Now have an S3 but for diesels the 3.0 is truly brilliant. I would guess the 3.0bitdi would be great I'm guessing

The 3.0 bitdi is great, very impressive...... You should go test drive one.

Sean