Awful dipped beam on my car. 2000 (Facelift lights) A4 TDi SE.

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impster

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Went to London and back this weekend and was horrified by the poor light output of my dipped beams on the motorway.

Headlights are fine - but dip beam is absolutelly awful not to mention dangerous. Coudlnt help but notice when cars were coming past how much brighter their dip beams were.

So, I got H7 bulbs in both dip and main beam. I'm happy with the main beam - any recommendations for H7 bulbs?

I'm not really interested in going HID route for a number of reasons.

What's the best H7 bulb for my dip beam people?

Thanks

Impster
 
Hmmm... I've gone HID - it's really simple to install.
 
I dont particularly like HID retrofits personally, unless of course its done properly with the correct parts, not some dodgy HID lamps in h7 holders.

I think before you condemn the stock setup, you need to make sure they're aligned correctly and that the bulbs are getting the full voltage.

http://www.modifieda4.com/web/tech/headlight-aiming.html

See there for the headlight alignment.

Then get a multimeter across the bulb terminals with the engine running and lights on, and see what its getting.
 
Checked alignment a few times in the past month - each time taking the beam higher or lower - although thanks for that particular guide - I haven't seen that one before. I'll check again using that one tonight.

The beam centre should therefore always point straight on and slightly lower than 'level' - is that correct? (I haven't really adjusted left/right adjustment)

How do I know if I have self levelling lights? I presume with H7 bulbs all-round they're not self levelling.

Thanks
 
they won't be unless you had HID from the factory or someone pnied up £300 in parts to retrofit the levelling kit.

I tried all sorts of bulbs to get my facelift lights to light up well enough. Osram, Phillips, 55W +50%, +85%, superbrights, blueish brights, 100W the lot. all pants IMO.
Lights were level, clean and scratch free. facelift lights are meant to have HIDs in them. they do not work at all well with normal bulbs.

one HID kit later and they are transformed! massive difference. had my MOT done a few weeks after, no problem at all, and my MOT guy is evil. picks up stuff I wouldn not expect anyone to care about (cracked numberplate!)
I did a write up on here, if you have facelifts housings the slim balasts work a charm under the headlight, no visible wires all over the place. very neat and very effective. don't wright them off until you see what they can look like.
 
if you have a levelling knob on the dash its not self levelling ;)

but the self levelling is independant of the actual alignment.

the lower corner of each \_ shape should be in the centre of the headlamp projector and down by the calculated declination using the formula on that website.

UK uses 1% though not 0.7% that he used.

Just follow his instructions using a wall and a marker pen or similar.
 
JCB: Just because it passed an MOT doesnt make the car any more legal.

The UK Construction and Use regulations make no provision for HID's at all. Meaning their use is illegal. The only reason cars are on the roads in the UK with HID's, is because the vehicles hold European Type Approval to use HID lighting, which overrules the UK regulations. Your car doesnt have the type approved parts fitted however, so its not exempted from the C&U regs.

Its also crap to say facelift headlights are designed only for HID's. The halogen units have different projectors designed for halogen bulbs and if they didnt meet the legal requirements they wouldnt be on the road...

The real HID units have a different projector, with the proper D2S fitting on it to take the correct, type approved bulb.

I've been in craigs S4, with its OE HID's and tbh, the difference isnt great. Yes its noticable that its a bit brighter, but its not like you can suddenly see a quarter mile up the road where you couldnt before, because the alignment means the beam cutoff is in exactly the same place.
 
passing an MOT without hassle is of more consequence to me than contravening obscure lighting laws.
I am waaay more likely to be stopped speeding or driving like a **** than being stopped for having Citroen Saxo Halfords chavtastic headlights

Christ I have wheels that stick out past my arches. light bulbs don't even come on the list of things I should be failing my MOT or getting stopped for. we all do things full in the knowledge of it being illegal. what is of more relevance is are we going to get away with it! the answer here is "yes" if you do it right.

the OEM HIDs may have a different fitting at the back but the projector lense is the same, infact the housing is identical, hence the cut out in the base.
whichever way you look at it projectors are designed to have a HID bulb. I have yet to see any other car with projector lenses that doesn't offer them as a half way house trim upgrade on cars that would normally run HID's.
Alignment, voltage, bulb choice and condition of the lense may impact it but the reason they are so crap on the facelift A4 compared to the pre facelift is the projector lense
i do't know what the OEM HID's are like but the difference between OEM Halogen in a facelift projector lense and a HID kit in the same lense is exactly like you can see further up the road.
Anything vaguely reflective lights up much more with HID lighting than with Halogen through the same projector lense
the beam cut off is in the same place but the halogens lack the light intensity of the HIDs.


OP asked about bulbs and had concerns about HIDs. I explained my point of view on all manner of bulbs I personally tested and compared to standard H7 55W Halogens and the fitting and passing an MOT with a standard HID kit.
If he still doesn't like the idea that's up to him...but don't tell me they don't work.
if it was no different I would have pulled them out and flogged them on eBay long since
 
There is no getting round the fact that they are gash as standard. Yes they are legal as standard but that does not mean they are good. With me and probably every other person it was not the fact they couldnt see far enough its the fact that the light was so dim compared to every other car on the road you end up driving in your own shaddow and in the rain at night or at dust they were verging on dangerous. Its no coincedince this keeps poping up time after time with these lights. If they are adjusted properly with HID's fitted you wont be bothering other drivers and if auto levelling was so good how come i pass so many feckers with one or both lights pointing in my eyes?
 
ha ha. its the ****** oncoming mercedes that keep frying my eyeballs!
 
Its shocking the ammount of nearly new cars going about with lights aiming way too high. I just love it when you get a rangerover/X5 sitting on your hoop with its lights aimed at your mirrors too.
 
Osram Nightbreakers have great light output for standard H7 bulbs. You can pick up a set on eBay for around £15ish. Give them a go.
 
Ok , checked it all out and it's all good and level as it should be.

Nightbreakers have been recommended to me as well.

Any opinions on 'Power Bulbs - Power Blue H7' - buy a pair, get a pair free (effectively a set for main beam and a set for dip beam for £24). Here's the link:
http://www.powerbulbs.com/product_detail.asp?prod=100

As I mentioned, HID conversion not an option for me.

Thanks
 
jcb: E30 BMW's have projectors for their dip beam, and the idea of a HID didnt even exist when they were new.

I can understand what your saying, i just feel people should be given the facts.

I've never had a problem with the projectors on ours, and they're not even running good bulbs, infact they're bulbs recovered from my original pre-facelift light units, which were in there from before we baught the car.

The fact an X5 or Range Rover appears to have its lights "pointing skywards" when they're behind you, is that the beam cutoff is set with the same declination as yours, however the light unit is mounted higher, so if they're sat up your bootlid your sat inside the beam. Would be no different if the car was on halogens, but because the beam intensity of HID is higher it exaggerates the effect.

Also self levelling doesnt mean they're aligned properly. All self levelling does is replace the dashboard "0-1-2-3" control with an automatic system which detects the pitch of the car. If the alignment is out the self levelling cant do anything about it.
 
aragorn said:
jcb: E30 BMW's have projectors for their dip beam, .
Click to expand...

ha ha, yes. and they are famously *****!! just google "E30 headlights" and look how many threads are on upgrades and ripping the old ones out.
having owned one I can tell you they are almost as crap as the A4 facelift only matched by the massive black spot on the road infront of the car! They went with ellipsoid that gave them their trademark "angel eyes" side lights in the 80's.
Anyway, moving on.

I tried some power blues and whilst they do look "whiter" when you look at the front of the car I put one in one side and left the old H7 halogen in the other side and they were really no clearer (or brighter).
I had Philips xtreme power +80% .....no brighter when I put one in next to the stock £5 55W halogen, so I stuck em on eBay!
I had Osram SIlverstar (allegedly 50% brighter, sold them to my cousin when I got the HIDs didn't try the nighbreakers but suspect if they are cheaper than £20 odd quid then they will be similar if not lower quality than the silverstar
 
i got some halfords +80% bulbs for my pre facelift. £20 for 2 (BOGOF) and they have made a massive difference.

That said however, I also washed the car for the 1st time for at least 6 months so the lenses would have been un-obscured for the 1st time in a while...
 
A lot of cars dont, just run all the current thru the stalk. Which is why fitting 100w bulbs is dodgy!

You should be within 0.1-0.2v of the battery voltage, any less would indicate something isnt upto scratch.
 
Ok - I'll check the voltage again then to be sure. If it isn't as it should be, what would be the likely cause? Any ideas?

(after my trip to London and back (at night) I want to make sure it's all hunky dory).

I've looked at a few forums and it seems dipped beam on B5 and B6 models isn't really up to scratch generally anyway.
 
Voltage at dipped lights with engine running is 13.14V. At battery it's 14.32V. So there's some loss of voltage, but with over 13V getting to the bulbs (rated 12v, 55w) they're getting ample.

Is there anything else I can check, or are they just crappy light units.

Osram Nightbreakers have improved the crispness of the 'cut off' and whiteness of the light. But still, the dips seem a bit naff.

Impster
 
What sort of condition are the front of the headlights? Over time they can get a bit 'cloudy' caused by loads of fine scratches.

I used Meguiars Plast-X on a light cut pad on one of my headlights (came from a high mileage fire damaged car) and managed to get it looking as good as new.
 
Fair point. I'll hopefully give the car a good wash tomorrow before the rugby and asses the lenses. They're not too bad, but then again, they probably could do with some polishing.

I've got some light (bodywork) swirl remover (Poorboys SS2 i think) - will that work you reckon with a mop? (It won't even begin to touch the swirls on the paintwork on the Audi...)
 
search 3M headlight on youtube. there is a how to on polishing plastic light covers
 
I'd say a 10% voltage drop on a lighting circuit isnt particularly good tbh.

Ye the bulbs may say "12v" on them, but they're designed to run at 14v.

Stolen from wikipedia
Light output is approximately proportional to V 3.4
This means that a 5% reduction in operating voltage will ... reduc[e] its light output by about 20%
Click to expand...

apply that to your bulbs:

13.1 ^ 3.4 = 6291
14.3 ^ 3.4 = 8475

which is a 25% difference in light output...

I'd be wanting to fix that to be getting the best from them. To find out where the loss is ocurring, try putting the probe first of all between the bulbs positive and the battery positive (this will show you the voltage drop over the feed wires) and then do the same again but this time between the bulbs negative and the battery negative.

If the drop is in the negative, you just need to beef up the earthing to the lamps, if its in the feed line, your going to have to introduce some relays or similar.
 
Thanks aragorn. Do you know of any 'weak points' in the system that I could specifically look for? I.e. the steering column switch/stalk?
 
not really, testing the voltages i mentioned above should give you a better idea.

If its not the earths, the next most likely culprit is the stalk itself i guess.
 
Argh dont get me started on those lights .... (damp candles). Since I have owned my Audi, I have been through all of the aftermarket bulbs, Phillips, Ring, Halfrauds, lucas 55w to 100w. They are all poooo!
I fitted an HID kit (in 2008) and its MUCH MUCH better. Ok so one of the ballasts went the other month, but it wasnt too much greif and the price has come down now to about £50 for a kit. so I have a spare ballast now. JCB nice job on fitting the balasts

The thing with the law.....I thought the law etc...well my experience:
I was driving in twilight... not good for these cars with standard bulbs... had the fogs on as well, got pulled by plod (looking for a reason to pull people before Xmas). He asked why I had them on and I made the comment that your mag light is brighter... the policeman replied "why dont you get one of those HID kits?" which I replied "are they not dodgey?" and the reply was "not as much as running with your fogs on, I do not see any reason why you cannot". This was a traffic copper and not just a beat car.
I can understand the dodgeyness of running an H4 set up but the fact the A4 has the lens means that you are not going to blind on coming traffic.
Self levelling, up thats me, with the beam switch :p
Dont knock them till you have tried them in all conditions!
 
Ok - just checked. Getting a 1v drop in the positive circuit - approx -0.98V. Earth shows +0.10V.

What can I check before resorting to relays - are there any switches or terminals to clean up? (Sorry don't really know my way around these Audis)

Impster
 
Rallyman said:
Argh dont get me started on those lights .... (damp candles). Since I have owned my Audi, I have been through all of the aftermarket bulbs, Phillips, Ring, Halfrauds, lucas 55w to 100w. They are all poooo! !
Click to expand...


finally someone who has my faith in "uprated" bulbs
 
Done some investigation with mine tonight.

Seems the relay approach isnt as simple as i first thaught, due to the bulb monitoring thing. Relay instead of bulb = BEEEEEEP!

However, i've got exactly 1v of drop on mine too, so i'm wondering if its actually caused by the bulb monitoring device...

Gonna have a further investigate and see what voltage is coming out of the stalk etc. Might mean rerouting the wiring and bypassing the bulb monitoring thing all together.
 
Some 'finer' details from this morning. May be worth invetsigating a bit more perhaps? The more I read on-line the more I tend to think that the light output is normal - it's just a bad designed lens maybe? Anyway, I may consider HID's just to make night driving safer. What do you reckon Aragorn?

Engine running, warmed up, normal temp.

Voltage at battery (lights off): 14.4V
Voltage at battery (lights on): 14.3V

Voltage at bulbs (dip bulbs):

Off-side bulb:
Voltage at bulb: 13.3V
Bulb Earth to Battery Positive: 14.1V
Bulb Positive to Battery Earth: 13.4V

Near-side bulb:
Voltage at bulb: 13.2V
Bulb Earth to Battery Positive: 14.1V
Bulb Positive to Battery Earth: 13.2V

How do your readings compare with those?

Impster
 
similar, cept my battery is only at 14v and the bulbs are down at 12.8-12.9v.

Its not the switch though, as the fuse is registering 13.9v and its after the switch.

My moneys on the stupid bulb monitoring device stealing volts!
 
I reckon you can faff about looking for losses etc for ages and maybe get them slightly better but they will still be *****. HID is the best way to go for these loghts if you ask me. A guy at work has a b6 with halogens and he says they are rubbish too.
 
a 55w H7 halogen puts out around 1500lm

a 35w Metal Halide, with Xenon gas (ie a HID burner) will produce around 3000lm

So yes, the HID is producing twice as much light. This cant be disputed.

some good halogens can produce over 2000lm, which is getting on towards HID performance, but when buying any fancy aftermarket bulbs it pays to actually check the lm output of the lamp.

an interesting article here:

http://www.clubtouareg.com/forums/f43/the-best-h7-bulbs-and-halogen-bulbs-in-general-31736.html

Shows that some upgraded halogens, usually blue coated "extrawhite" types, can actually produce less light than standard bulbs.

Personally, i'd love to fit HID's, but for me, the only way i'd be doing it is with the genuine parts, and they're expensive.
 
Also, some quotes from Wikipedia i've come across:

Lack of backward-compatibility

The arc light source in an HID headlamp is fundamentally different in size, shape, orientation, and luminosity distribution compared to the filament light source used in tungsten-halogen headlamps. For that reason, HID-specific optics are used to collect and distribute the light. HID burners cannot effectively or safely be installed in optics designed to take filament bulbs; doing so results in improperly-focused beam patterns and excessive glare, and is therefore illegal in almost all countries.[38]

Glare

Vehicles equipped with HID headlamps are required by ECE regulation 48 also to be equipped with headlamp lens cleaning systems and automatic beam levelling control. Both of these measures are intended to reduce the tendency for high-output headlamps to cause high levels of glare to other road users. In North America, ECE R48 does not apply and while lens cleaners and beam levellers are permitted, they are not required;[33] HID headlamps are markedly less prevalent in the US, where they have produced significant glare complaints.[34] Scientific study of headlamp glare has shown that for any given intensity level, the light from HID headlamps is 40% more glaring than the light from tungsten-halogen headlamps.[35]
 
Well I would rather be illegal and be able to see where I'm going anyway. My lights are not as bright to look at as most new cars lights are and as long as I keep them adjusted properly they are not going to give anybody grieff. If the police stop me and tell me to take them out then fair enough.
 
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