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Put it this way Daz, if Team Prawn Racing ever goes global, you'd definitely be head hunted for the role as Chief of PR and advertising 
Prawn and BigAls A3 Track Car
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I love how you go to all the trouble of building a custom back plate and welding on connectors for the pipe work etc and then repair the holes in the old pipework with insulation tape 
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I love how you go to all the trouble of building a custom back plate and welding on connectors for the pipe work etc and then repair the holes in the old pipework with insulation tape
There is one key flaw in your statement Mark!
I repaired the old DUCTS with DUCT tape
To be honest, it's a saving of £25, I think it's well worth it
they shouldn't be exposed to much heat at that point, and the he's were only small where they'd previously touched the wheel. Loads of room now though so no more wheel rubbing 
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So, a little catch up on last weeks progress:
after lots of trimmng and careful lining up to ensure wheel clearence, I tacked on the first tube to attach the duct:
I then welded that up and checked fitment again:
Lower tube tacked into place:
And the other side:
My welding is far from pretty, but it's penetrated both materials fully, and it won't be seen, so I'm OK with it :lol:
2 backpates welded up, ready for porting:
I had run out of grinding stones for my dremel annoyingly, and everywhere was shut, so I ended up porting these out using a carbide burr on a drill then a file, took ****** ages!
3 coats of etch primer, followed by 3 coats of Rover gun metal paint I had lying around:
To ensure the plates wern't pulled around and bent too easily by the ducts, i wanted to spread the mounting load with penny washers, I had to trim these down due to how closely the plates run to the ABS rings:
Test fitted using tape to hold teh ducts on, the backplates needed a little tweaking after welding to ensure at least a 2mm gap away from the discs:
Full lock right:
Full lock left:
Loads of room and no nasty surprises there.
Onto the lower ducts:
I had JUST enough room to run these over the wishbones under the driveshaft:
and onto the backplate:
At this point my new bumper inlets hadn't arrived, so I refitted the wheels and checked wheel clearance one last time on the to ducts
Not the easiest pic to see, but there's a good 30mm+ between duct and wheel now, where previously it has rubbed
after lots of trimmng and careful lining up to ensure wheel clearence, I tacked on the first tube to attach the duct:
I then welded that up and checked fitment again:
Lower tube tacked into place:
And the other side:
My welding is far from pretty, but it's penetrated both materials fully, and it won't be seen, so I'm OK with it :lol:
2 backpates welded up, ready for porting:
I had run out of grinding stones for my dremel annoyingly, and everywhere was shut, so I ended up porting these out using a carbide burr on a drill then a file, took ****** ages!
3 coats of etch primer, followed by 3 coats of Rover gun metal paint I had lying around:
To ensure the plates wern't pulled around and bent too easily by the ducts, i wanted to spread the mounting load with penny washers, I had to trim these down due to how closely the plates run to the ABS rings:
Test fitted using tape to hold teh ducts on, the backplates needed a little tweaking after welding to ensure at least a 2mm gap away from the discs:
Full lock right:
Full lock left:
Loads of room and no nasty surprises there.
Onto the lower ducts:
I had JUST enough room to run these over the wishbones under the driveshaft:
and onto the backplate:
At this point my new bumper inlets hadn't arrived, so I refitted the wheels and checked wheel clearance one last time on the to ducts
Not the easiest pic to see, but there's a good 30mm+ between duct and wheel now, where previously it has rubbed
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Argh. Sorry Bill. No idea why that keeps happening!
I will continue.... hopefully no double post this time!
So, with all that done, it was getting close to 9pm. I decided to re-fit the splitter quickly to check there was room for the duct runs I'd planned to the front.
This is where disaster struck!
My splitter is attached to my subframe using existing captive nuts in the subframe. As I put one of the bolts in it didn't feel right after a few turns, so I decided to wind it out to run a tap through to clean the thread.
As I tried to wind it out, it got stiff, and the captive insert started to spin!
ARGH!!!!!
Usually not the biggest issue, but because the bolt was through the splitter, the splitter was blocking any access to fix the problem at all!
Nightmare:
The top silver line is the captive 'insert'
I couldn't get the welding torch in thereto weld the captive insert back to the subframe, so I ended up holding the welding torch about 4'' away, and very carefully letting the wire run under it's own weight 4'' into the joint.
I cranked the welder up to max, and blindly hoped that with enough power and wire fed in I could some how secure the captive insert to SOMETHING.
it doesn't look it from the pic, but that weld is a good 3'' in from the edge of the splitter. After 10 minutes of hoping and praying, I managed to build up enough weld spatter to weld the insert to the brace bar and washer below it:
Obviously more the washer, because when i finally got it out, the brace bar came away and the washer stayed!
Thank god for that.
With the splitter removed I was easily able to weld the captive insert back into the frame, a quick coat of etch primer, some satin black, and a run through with the M10 tap and Problem solved
I will continue.... hopefully no double post this time!
So, with all that done, it was getting close to 9pm. I decided to re-fit the splitter quickly to check there was room for the duct runs I'd planned to the front.
This is where disaster struck!
My splitter is attached to my subframe using existing captive nuts in the subframe. As I put one of the bolts in it didn't feel right after a few turns, so I decided to wind it out to run a tap through to clean the thread.
As I tried to wind it out, it got stiff, and the captive insert started to spin!
ARGH!!!!!
Usually not the biggest issue, but because the bolt was through the splitter, the splitter was blocking any access to fix the problem at all!
Nightmare:
The top silver line is the captive 'insert'
I couldn't get the welding torch in thereto weld the captive insert back to the subframe, so I ended up holding the welding torch about 4'' away, and very carefully letting the wire run under it's own weight 4'' into the joint.
I cranked the welder up to max, and blindly hoped that with enough power and wire fed in I could some how secure the captive insert to SOMETHING.
it doesn't look it from the pic, but that weld is a good 3'' in from the edge of the splitter. After 10 minutes of hoping and praying, I managed to build up enough weld spatter to weld the insert to the brace bar and washer below it:
Obviously more the washer, because when i finally got it out, the brace bar came away and the washer stayed!
Thank god for that.
With the splitter removed I was easily able to weld the captive insert back into the frame, a quick coat of etch primer, some satin black, and a run through with the M10 tap and Problem solved
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On to Sunday!
My inlet ducts finally turned up for the front bumper:
I lifted the splitter into place, and started marking up for the ducts:
The ducts needed some trimming, along with trimming of the bumper:
I decided to mount the ducts on the splitter this time. I didnât want to drill unnecessary holes in them, so decided Iâd glue them on using araldite.
To get the ducts sitting squarely, I cut up 4 wood screws:
And screwed them into the splitter at different heights:
These supported the plastic intakes at the right angle:
Then I glued them into place:
The ducts are fitted in such a way that the splitter can be dropped down to the ground before removing the ducts, to save trying to connect them in a fiddly tight space:
Rear ducts connected and secured to the wishbones:
Jubilees used on the spigots:
And the top ducts clipped up to replace the tape:
Itâs pretty tight in there, but both ducts now clear the wheels, driveshafts, and arb, through full lock in each direction and through the full range of suspension travel up and down:
The splitter was lifted up and secured for the final time, and I made a new airdam. This time in 3 parts so it can be easily replaced or removed in sections:
My inlet ducts finally turned up for the front bumper:
I lifted the splitter into place, and started marking up for the ducts:
The ducts needed some trimming, along with trimming of the bumper:
I decided to mount the ducts on the splitter this time. I didnât want to drill unnecessary holes in them, so decided Iâd glue them on using araldite.
To get the ducts sitting squarely, I cut up 4 wood screws:
And screwed them into the splitter at different heights:
These supported the plastic intakes at the right angle:
Then I glued them into place:
The ducts are fitted in such a way that the splitter can be dropped down to the ground before removing the ducts, to save trying to connect them in a fiddly tight space:
Rear ducts connected and secured to the wishbones:
Jubilees used on the spigots:
And the top ducts clipped up to replace the tape:
Itâs pretty tight in there, but both ducts now clear the wheels, driveshafts, and arb, through full lock in each direction and through the full range of suspension travel up and down:
The splitter was lifted up and secured for the final time, and I made a new airdam. This time in 3 parts so it can be easily replaced or removed in sections:
Last edited:
With all this brake cooling the only way you will be able to get brake temps lower will to be not drive the ****** thing!!
It looks awesome mate. Really does look cool.
Lets hope that it all the hard work pays off for bedford!!
It looks awesome mate. Really does look cool.
Lets hope that it all the hard work pays off for bedford!!
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And now the final update to the brake cooling saga, this one is just shiney pictures and a test report.
With the car back on the ground finally I took it to Homebase to have the local lads clean it:
They were all told to take EXTRA care around the splitter after damaging it last time. I'd usually wash it myself, but the que at the jetwash was huge!
Back home after a little spin:
Still amazed it gets onto my drive:
Test drive was very successful, no noises or rubbing, and all ducts and plates still intact and in position 20 mes later after a hard bedding in session.
I got the brakes VERY hot bedding them in, as you do, and after just 10 minutes cruising after that the calipers and discs were cool enough to touch, not a scientific test by any means, but different to the usu where you still can't get near them 30 minutes later!
All in all - very happy.
Roll on Bedford!
With the car back on the ground finally I took it to Homebase to have the local lads clean it:
They were all told to take EXTRA care around the splitter after damaging it last time. I'd usually wash it myself, but the que at the jetwash was huge!
Back home after a little spin:
Still amazed it gets onto my drive:
Test drive was very successful, no noises or rubbing, and all ducts and plates still intact and in position 20 mes later after a hard bedding in session.
I got the brakes VERY hot bedding them in, as you do, and after just 10 minutes cruising after that the calipers and discs were cool enough to touch, not a scientific test by any means, but different to the usu where you still can't get near them 30 minutes later!
All in all - very happy.
Roll on Bedford!
I love that good enough is not enough with your car and that everything can and usually is improved on no matter how good it is. Your saying its good and your happy but if you have another idea you would try it, and thats why the car is so good!
I cannot wait to see what its like at bedford. Im looking forward to going as a passanger in this as much as driving my own car!
roll on bedford!!!!
I cannot wait to see what its like at bedford. Im looking forward to going as a passanger in this as much as driving my own car!
roll on bedford!!!!
Can you afford it Daz.
Were are charging for pax laps now we have the new brakes.
It's not to make money.
It's for the special facial restraints to keep you eyeballs in their sockets.
Were are charging for pax laps now we have the new brakes.
It's not to make money.
It's for the special facial restraints to keep you eyeballs in their sockets.
EH you miserable bunch. I thought that remark was very funny and warranted more like than one like. 
dude the pads you have what is the temps rated from and to?
with all that cooling i would think on the short stuff the brakes would not get up to operating temp?
with all that cooling i would think on the short stuff the brakes would not get up to operating temp?
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I absolutely don't think this will ever be an issue on a full size track Miggles, all the recent cooling additions wern't done because I was bored
they were done because we push very hard, and the brakes run VERY hot, beyond their ideal temperature range.By adding cooling, you always have the option to partially block or remove part of it to increase temps to the desired range. Without it, you have no choice but to run too hot with no way of addressing the issue. For road use and short stuff like sprinting I can just block off the inlets with race tape (duct tape)
the F4R's are apparently 'fade resistant' to 1000 degrees!
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I absolutely don't think this will ever be an issue on a full size track Miggles, all the recent cooling additions wern't done because I was bored
By adding cooling, you always have the option to partially block or remove part of it to increase temps to the desired range. Without it, you have no choice but to run too hot with no way of addressing the issue. For road use and short stuff like sprinting I can just block off the inlets with race tape (duct tape)
the F4R's are apparently 'fade resistant' to 1000 degrees!
makes sense
but like for example my previous pads were rated from 300' to 900' and when we did the short hill climb i had to brake very early so was just asking
im using ebc blue now and its rated from 0' to 900' without fade, im def going to be doing the cooling for the future.
Nor can I, but facts are facts.
If you go shopping with Nicholas to Sainsbuggers, in the track car !!! it's maximum attack, minimum time.
If you go shopping with Nicholas to Sainsbuggers, in the track car !!! it's maximum attack, minimum time.
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It's cool dude, all input is always welcome
the F4R's are based around the old 1177 compound that I loved so much, but somehow improved to give MORE initial bite, and higher temperature resistance. I bedded them in the other night and initial impressions are very very good indeed. The pedal is incredibly sharp, but I can really modulate them incredibly well when stopping from high speeds.
At the Curby event a few weeks ago both Andy and Sam ended up moving the car in the pits a few times, and both commented on how insane the brakes felt even at parking speeds
They take a bit of getting used to!I'm really glad I went down the AP route though. After driving jardo's car at the weekend the LCR brakes are still very good, but the AP's are just on another level entirely.
Onwards and upwards as always
HA HA it has been known that the odd person wished the car was not so fast. Apart from all else, if you are not used to it IT'S the braking that is the big surprise.
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Don't worry Daz, Dad is on that exact same list too
''Don't you think you should slow down a bit now son?''
''NO''
Getting close now! car is all ready, cleaned and good to go and tucked away in the garage where the birds can't crap on it
Spare wheels and tools are all packed and ready to load up on Sunday afternoon, then we're off for some more of this!
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Cheers mate. it's certainly on the list at some point!
I'll add a slightly better write up later on, but to cut it short.
We went to Bedford.
Car was epic.
People were awesome too, Big Bad Dad, Frenchman, AndyP, Daz, we had a top day out!
Beat previous best lap by 2s which I was VERY happy with
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q3MrGRlf6ac
Will add more tomorrow
What a day!!! Was awesome!!! Nice to meet big Al and thanks for the passanger ride in the car. In that video it looks incredibly fast.but it does no justice to how fast, flat and how well it actually handles and stops! What a car!!!
Glad you had a good day at Bedford .... I now have a clunk free car as well changed those bolts and sorted it's strange that they cause it don't you think
Sam_
Down under
Looks quick! Rob said you had a play with the Evo and said it was neck and neck. I've been in his Evo and if yours is as quick as that it must be uber. I said Rob should fit a HTA3582
Rob should grow a pair and drive the ****ing thing.
My 59 year old Ford Popular has done more miles this year than his Evo has done since he got it!
My 59 year old Ford Popular has done more miles this year than his Evo has done since he got it!
Sam_
Down under
Coming from Mr 42mpg.... haha
I'm not surprised though. It's pretty thirsty. He drove me to AH Fabs and back when the welded the mounts on my IC wrong and I'm sure it used a whole tank. We did blow away a few cars on the motorway mind you
I'm not surprised though. It's pretty thirsty. He drove me to AH Fabs and back when the welded the mounts on my IC wrong and I'm sure it used a whole tank. We did blow away a few cars on the motorway mind you
Don't worry Daz, Dad is on that exact same list too
''Don't you think you should slow down a bit now son?''
''NO''
Getting close now! car is all ready, cleaned and good to go and tucked away in the garage where the birds can't crap on it
Spare wheels and tools are all packed and ready to load up on Sunday afternoon, then we're off for some more of this!
I'm getting used to the car now and can chuck it around a bit more. That last potie which is a very fast left hander at Bedford was the first high speed corner I had experienced for a few months. It takes some getting used to. My face says it all.
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Sure does! It used to lok crap
Looks quick! Rob said you had a play with the Evo and said it was neck and neck. I've been in his Evo and if yours is as quick as that it must be uber. I said Rob should fit a HTA3582
Yea, we had a little tear up on a private strip. The result wasn't what I was expecting AT ALL.
The evo is one of the most savage cars I've ever been in, properly mental. mine feels smooth and progressive, nothing like the evo at all.
Side by side, from 30-130 there was not even a single meter in it, despite the A3 wheelspinning through second. Both on track rubber too.
Pulled again from 50-120 - not more than half a length either way again, if anything, the A3 crept ahead by half a length as it picked up quicker. then a pull from 60 up hill slightly, and still, nothing in it what so ever.
Shocked, considering the evo has 440bhp, but very happy with it indeed
