Anyone with S-Tronic miss a manual?

[SteveMcB]

Had one of them for 2 years. They don't do manual!

S Tronic was great but the 3.0Tdi Cab quattro is a bit of a cumbersome beast which suited S Tronic. Previously had a Coupe (same engine) with manual which I loved and never have had an issue with offset pedals, suppose I got used to it, others may not.

Ha, that makes the choice even easier. My days of ripping up the tarmac are behind me now anyway so this cumbersome (but good looking) beast will do me just fine. It's perfect for relaxed motoring, can shift if required and can tow 2100kgs as well, which is handy as I'll use it to tow the caravan my current a4 cab currently hauls along.

PS I hated the offset pedals, couldn't get comfy and never felt at one with the car, that odd shaped transmission tunnel is obviously designed with Audi's mass market, ie LHD, in mind.

 

[Joetidman]

Thanks guys for some good sharing of experiences, seems overall those that have moved to stron don't regret it so has helped alleviate any concerns! Wasn't meant to be an stron vs Manual thread as I appreciate both but, thanks for all the views all the same!

 

[StefRobinson]

I'd never go back to a manual gearbox. I am on my third non-manual Audi. My first was the DSG box in my A3 SB 8P. Then I had the multitronic box in my A4. Now I have the S-Tronic in my new A3 SB 8V. Out of the 3 different types of box, the S-Tronic is definitely the best and the most responsive gearbox I've had.

I don't actually mind changing gear manually. It's the clutch and what you have to do with your feet that I don't like. I'll never buy another manual.

 

[veeeight]

^ I'm glad you've pointed out the various boxes, reading some of the replies on here, some people have mistakenly lumped together the slush boxes and multi tronic boxes and auto boxes - under the banner S-Tronic.

 

[h5djr]

I'd never go back to a manual gearbox. I am on my third non-manual Audi. My first was the DSG box in my A3 SB 8P. Then I had the multitronic box in my A4. Now I have the S-Tronic in my new A3 SB 8V. Out of the 3 different types of box, the S-Tronic is definitely the best and the most responsive gearbox I've had.

I don't actually mind changing gear manually. It's the clutch and what you have to do with your feet that I don't like. I'll never buy another manual.

According to some magazine reports I read, when the new A4 comes out, Audi are going to drop the multi-tronic and only fit s-tronics.

 

[StefRobinson]

According to some magazine reports I read, when the new A4 comes out, Audi are going to drop the multi-tronic and only fit s-tronics.

I'd heard similar reports actually. I don't think the multitronic was generally seen as a great gearbox, and certainly not a patch on the S-Tronic. I think everything is all going S-Tronic with Audi these days.

My experience of it was it was fine when you were just coasting along in drive, but when setting off and switching between reverse and drive etc, it just didn't feel as responsive as the S-Tronic. It felt like it took the clutch a second or two to actually kick in when you press the accelerator.

 

[h5djr]

I'd heard similar reports actually. I don't think the multitronic was generally seen as a great gearbox, and certainly not a patch on the S-Tronic. I think everything is all going S-Tronic with Audi these days.

My experience of it was it was fine when you were just coasting along in drive, but when setting off and switching between reverse and drive etc, it just didn't feel as responsive as the S-Tronic. It felt like it took the clutch a second or two to actually kick in when you press the accelerator.

I have only driven a multi-tronic equipped A4 once before I had my first s-tronic back in 2004 and I hated it. It seemed that the engine revs did not match the road speed and it felt very odd.

 

[Daz Auto]

^ I'm glad you've pointed out the various boxes, reading some of the replies on here, some people have mistakenly lumped together the slush boxes and multi tronic boxes and auto boxes - under the banner S-Tronic.

I thought that DSG and S-tronic were the same technology? All I can find is that they might be programmed differently.

 

[veeeight]

Dave - Correct, thats how a CVT (or Pseudo CVT) box is designed to operate. The engine revs stay the same while the continuous (step less) gearing wheels change ratios.

In the very very early days of CVT, one could reverse as fast as one could go forward, e.g.: going backwards at 50mph ! (Volvo/DAF)

Daz - Yes, S-Tronic is DSG, but some posters have got this confused.

 

[h5djr]

Dave - Correct, thats how a CVT (or Pseudo CVT) box is designed to operate. The engine revs stay the same while the continuous (step less) gearing wheels change ratios.

In the very very early days of CVT, one could reverse as fast as one could go forward, e.g.: going backwards at 50mph ! (Volvo/DAF)

Daz - Yes, S-Tronic is DSG, but some posters have got this confused.

The original DSG was designed as a joint venture between Borg-Warner and Volkswagen for use in transverse mounted engines. Audi also used the same DSG for their transverse engined models and used the name s-tronic. They have also designed a version to work with their longitudinally mounted engines. The principals are the same with electronically controlled clutches connected to what is basically a normal manual type gearbox. It is one of these with will be used for the top of the range A5, A6, and A7 models and will be used in the new A4.

For anyone who wants to know more about the DSG/s-tronic and the various versions used by Audi this Wiki article is good:
Direct-Shift Gearbox - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[PilotAudi]

I have driven CVT on A 4 in 2002, hated it. Had Stronic on cab A 5 and a great box. Best recent Audi box of late was. 8 speed Tiptronic with paddles on A7BE . Still prefer manual on small cars.

 

[veeeight]

Tiptronic isn't a gearbox in its own right.

 

[Itguy]

That 8 speed box is the same one BMW are using in their M135i - I drove one and was really very impressed with it for a standard torque converter autobox. Gear changes very nearly as quick as a dsg with no preselect issues when going down multiple gears.

 

[PilotAudi]

Of all the autos I would rate the 8 speed Tiptronic as the best and didn't have the pre-select issues IT Guy refers to that S Tronic has.

The worst has to be Multi tronic, last drove an A7 FWD with it last year and whilst better than 2002 version I still hate it.

Love Autos on big cruisers but will stick with a stick on 'fun' car.

 

[Pulp84]

That 8 speed box is the same one BMW are using in their M135i - I drove one and was really very impressed with it for a standard torque converter autobox. Gear changes very nearly as quick as a dsg with no preselect issues when going down multiple gears.

Own a DSG / s-tronic and 8 speed ZF at the same time and you would have totally different opinion. Would say though after driving with it in a M 135i it appeared to have been programmed slightly different. You have to select the ZF box to upshift faster (DS mode) where as the DSG / s-Tronic upshifts quickly all the time as standard.

Main issue with the ZF is it can be jerky in certain situations and can be caught out when crusing and then for whatever reason needing to accelerate quickly.

 

[veeeight]

The ZF 8HP is an extremely clever bit of kit. It's non sequential, so in theory can skip gears, and can be optioned to be a hybrid with a electric motor in place of the torque converter, combining a start/stop starter.

That said, its changes aren't as fast as a DSG or PDK, but still pretty fast. It does however offer slightly better refinement in the change quality and smoothness in most cases. The only other box on the market approaching this level of sophistication and complexity is the Aisin box. Truly impressive when coupled with the sat nav to anticipate bends in the road etc.

Ard you're right. The drive can be ruined by a bad calibration.

 

[Itguy]

This thread has really reminded me I MUST get a cable and VCDS so I can re adapt my mk5 golf gti DSG, I'm sure it can be better than it currently is.

 

[h5djr]

Even the R8 now users s-tronic rather than it's original R-tronic

 

[Figarro]

How about those youtube, mag reviews ect, why this car isnt manual (usually they drive that dsg) .. so many of those testdrivers like manual more..

 

[hnm738]

Hi, this is just my opinion and experience. I have had audi tt 2010 then went to a4 B8 quattro both were S tronic, wife has the golf DSG. the Stronic/DSG is good at what it does but doesnt give you the same feeling as driving a manual. for the 3.5 years i enjoyed driving auto but my mind kept wishing the car was a manual.

I feel sometimes the Stronic couldnt do what you want it to (eg start in 2nd gear, or go from 5th to 2nd (you press the paddle shift 3 times and theres some delay for the rev to match, or you didnt press the paddle enough etc), some times the gear change you can hear make noises (sounds like clutch plates releasing and engaging). Was afraid of modding it too much because you hear stories that the gear box may not handle the power. And stories about ridiculous cost to repair.

I do about 13000 miles a year, and always in traffic, The DSG was good as a cruiser and relaxing. I have been driving manual again after 3.5 years with Stronic and for the mean time, I dont miss the auto.. i feel like im having more fun driving manual every day. But again, auto can be convenient at times.

 

[pat15312]

I'll not be getting another manual gearbox, I've been sold on DSG for years.

I specced DSG on my sister's Mk7 GTD without asking her. She was a bit apprehensive at first but within about a week of driving it she thanked me for it.

The last bastion for a manual gearboxes in my world is on our sales reps cars; I like the idea of having to make them do a bit more work whilst we save money off the price of the vehicle

 

[PembsA3]

Three weeks with my new SB S line TDI 184 quattro S tronic and I love it! I have poured scorn on autos for years and after a period with an E30 BMW auto I swore I'd never have another... But I am a complete convert to S tronic. It's brilliant! (And even better with Hold Assist i.e. no creeping).

 

[GreatBallsofFire]

Thanks guys for some good sharing of experiences, seems overall those that have moved to stron don't regret it so has helped alleviate any concerns! Wasn't meant to be an stron vs Manual thread as I appreciate both but, thanks for all the views all the same!

However, if you have to do a lot of street parking, the manual is king. DSG may be king on the racing track, but how often do you bring your cars there for a race? However, without a lot of parking to do and the climate we have here in the north, I would consider the DSG myself, although in the beginning I would likely feel like I sold myself out, losing some skills and doing what Audi wants me to do .

Top Gear seems to prefer manuals - that must surely be influential opinion.

 

[h5djr]

Three weeks with my new SB S line TDI 184 quattro S tronic and I love it! I have poured scorn on autos for years and after a period with an E30 BMW auto I swore I'd never have another... But I am a complete convert to S tronic. It's brilliant! (And even better with Hold Assist i.e. no creeping).

My new Sportback TDI-184 s-tronic quattro will be my fifth A3 with an s-tronic and I am fully expecting it to be the best. I loved the s-tronic from day one and would never ever buy another car without one. As 'PembsA3' says, I sure it will be even better with Hold Assist especially in relation to Start/Stop.

 

[msdmjb]

Good thoughts guys. My wife's Sportage still has a manual, but there isn't much subtle or fun about driving it I'm afraid, although overall the car is great. I'm sure the Stronic will be ace for 95% of the time, but I wonder if on that odd occasion I'll miss switching gears myself and having full control

That 5% would drive me nuts so I have gone for a manual.
On the test drive in the DSG for normal driving/commuting it was very impressive but a couple of times it came across I thought quite poor e.g. drop a gear & flatten the throttle to overtake, kickdown, bang limiter, back in to the gear I put it in with a really loud clonk along the way - I fully accept it might be me who needed to adjust to the DSG! My driving won't be commuting and for me whilst there are manuals I will always be using one. My attitude is the same for motorbikes which nowadays have a similar system.

But heh each to their own hence Audi give us the choice, nothing to do with anything other than preference.

 

[Twizzler]

We missed our manual cars about as much as we missed our old twin tub washing machine after we bought an automatic one.

 

[SilureMark]

I was toying with the idea of a manual, but a trip in one of the pool cars at work ( a manual diesel 3 series) and pretty soon I was missing the auto. When you think about what you’re doing in a manual, it is a bit laughable in this day and age. I used to hate auto boxes, but these days they’re so good you’d struggle to justify the manual, well when thinking with the head. You might still buy one with your heart and I do get that. There is a great deal of satisfaction from driving a good manual. I have PDK on my Cayman S – I tried a manual and as good as it was (probably as good as any manual gearbox could be), I still went for the auto box despite my desire to want the manual box. When I first drove the new S3, I tried the manual too and it wasn’t all that TBH. Then I tried the s tronic and it just felt so right for that car. Hence, I have ordered my S3 with s tronic as well. That’ll be my fourth VW/Audi double clutch box from the last 9 years. The image of auto’s only being for fat , lazy old men is long gone. When you think most performance cars these days can only be bought with a double clutch box, well, there’s your answer. They’re faster, more efficient and when you’re just going from A to B, more relaxing to drive. As for parking being easier in a manual – I’d disagree, utterly disagree. Tens times easier in an auto!! The only reason for buying a manual is if you can’t afford the auto joking ... but if you haven't tried an s tronic, I recommend you do before going with the stick again.

 

[GreatBallsofFire]

As for parking being easier in a manual – I’d disagree, utterly disagree. Tens times easier in an auto!!

You mean the auto actually is better - how can that be? I can't tell as I only driven manual (and will continue to do), but what from has been written here auto is not so good when it comes to delicate manoeuvring for tight parking.

 

[cuke2u]

Ten times note, whatever is being used as a benchmark. So much being written just to justify the additional expense and maintenance costs. It is after all just a matter of taste...

 

[CraigI]

You mean the auto actually is better - how can that be? I can't tell as I only driven manual (and will continue to do), but what from has been written here auto is not so good when it comes to delicate manoeuvring for tight parking.

I've never once had an issue parking an auto.
Don't understand where that comes from.

Auto is faster. Close thread.

 

[GreatBallsofFire]

I've never once had an issue parking an auto.
Don't understand where that comes from.

Auto is faster. Close thread.

Perhaps you don't live down-town in city? Anyway, I doubt that the auto is the holy grail- pretty sure there is pro and cons, unless if you are a fanatic. Good the choice still exists, we are all different. By the way, have you ever considered a electric robot dog too? Do not have to walk that dog time and time again, very convenient and comfortable (just kidding). Anyway, Friday I pick my car up, life is good

 

[royalsteve68]

I'm still getting used to my first auto... I definitely miss a manual when parking as the auto doesn't allow fine movements

 

[woollyjoe]

There are many advantages to Auto, namely it's safer as you can concentrate more on driving, less on gears. But therein lies the fun.

 

[royalsteve68]

I'm currently in an audi a5 tdi 177. It's OK but it's a cruiser and auto isn't an stronic... Not sure what box it is but it's slooow. It's not as so as the Mercedes email class 250cdi box though... That was unbelievably slow and the car was s**t too... Laughable at £45000

 

[Flibble]

I'm still getting used to my first auto... I definitely miss a manual when parking as the auto doesn't allow fine movements

Not sure why people say this, you can do very slow creeps just find in an auto - you just have to use the brake instead of the clutch.

 

[royalsteve68]

Not sure why people say this, you can do very slow creeps just find in an auto - you just have to use the brake instead of the clutch.

It doesn't do fine movements in auto

 

[arad85]

It doesn't do fine movements in auto

Not sure what you mean here. I have s-tronic and hill hold (or whatever it is called) and you can control when the auto brake comes on simply by the pressure you put on the footbrake. That is, you can have it move very, very slowly using creep and controlling it via the brake pedal.

 

[royalsteve68]

Not sure what you mean here. I have s-tronic and hill hold (or whatever it is called) and you can control when the auto brake comes on simply by the pressure you put on the footbrake. That is, you can have it move very, very slowly using creep and controlling it via the brake pedal.

but not as slow as a manual

 

[arad85]

but not as slow as a manual

Never noticed that TBH. Whether it is or isn't, I've not found it to be an issue....

 

[Andy1608]

I'm a manual fan all the way but that's just personal choice and understand everyone's points of view on theirs.