Jardo's 'Journey to quattro' - My Story...

[Prawn]

.... and hey presto, i've ruined another A3.

Bit harsh superK,

Despite J-rod being the worlds most prized mong, and the initial butchering and subsequent rectification of said almight fail, the end result appears to be really reasonably OK.

That, and it'll be miles quicker than your S3 at the moment

 

[16Klappe]

.... and hey presto, i've ruined another A3.

good luck with the 250hp ko3s

When I come back with a 250bhp K03s will you stop being such a misery? Do you not know how achievable 250bhp is on a K03s now? One made 261bhp on bills rollers at the weekend, EXACTLY the same setup as mine but with meth. No more questions or doubts, even Bill has to accept it as it happened on his rollers lol

How can you say it is ruined, and anyway this is only the beginning

 

[Westy]

Please stop living off everyone else's glory Jardo! All I hear is Prawn's car did this, or Mylo's car did this........

Make some glory of your own

Also we need to rearrange that brands hatch showdown that got cancelled in January

 

[Reesy]

When I come back with a 250bhp K03s will you stop being such a misery? Do you not know how achievable 250bhp is on a K03s now? One made 261bhp on bills rollers at the weekend, EXACTLY the same setup as mine but with meth. No more questions or doubts, even Bill has to accept it as it happened on his rollers lol

How can you say it is ruined, and anyway this is only the beginning

Out of interest how old is the turbo? Westy's car makes 15bhp more then mine and all he has is meth and a newer turbo. The age and condition of the turbo obviously makes a big difference.

Also could this not just be a one off? A freakishly good turbo/engine? No one else gets power near that, and their must be a reason?

 

[16Klappe]

Please stop living off everyone else's glory Jardo! All I hear is Prawn's car did this, or Mylo's car did this........

Make some glory of your own

Also we need to rearrange that brands hatch showdown that got cancelled in January

That's exactly what I am doing Westiclez, I will get my 250bhp K03s. I am a bit gutted it wasn't my car that Niki did all the R&D on, but now we all know exactly what you nedd for 250bhp I just need to replicate it. What I have wanted for the last to two years is no different to your 300bhp K04, seeing the pride and joy you got from that motivates me more to reach my own goals

Yes we do need to rebook! Llandow? Combe?

 

[Westy]

Westy's car makes 15bhp more

And a fair bit more torque

The condition of the blower is definitely the reason most cars are never identicle comparing stage 1 maps even of the same brand.

 

[Westy]

That's exactly what I am doing Westiclez, I will get my 250bhp K03s. I am a bit gutted it wasn't my car that Niki did all the R&D on, but now we all know exactly what you nedd for 250bhp I just need to replicate it. What I have wanted for the last to two years is no different to your 300bhp K04, seeing the pride and joy you got from that motivates me more to reach my own goals

Yes we do need to rebook! Llandow? Combe?

Go for it mate. I just wanted to hit a figure that people said wasn't possible as I like proving people wrong. My next mission will be to get an S3 lighter then ever before

If we do a track day I'd prefer if it was a bit more central. I've moved further North since we tried to book Brands. Brands is still fine though and we could probably drum up a bit of interest for other ASN members.

 

[16Klappe]

Mylo's turbo is totally stock, and as far as I'm aware is the vehicles original. He'll come along and give the answers soon I'm sure.

It's an incredible feat, and goes to show what happens when you refuse to accept boundaries. Niki and Mylo have blown up the rule book within the last year, with a handful of 300bhp K04's and a 260bhp K03s. If you wind back two years 270bhp was the accepted ceiling for an S3, with the odd rarity making 275/280 and 230 was the accepted limit for a K03 with the odd car making 235 if it was lucky. You guys are all happy to accept 300bhp from a K04, so why can't K03's have moved on at the same rate?

If you look at the graphs the turbo is not being ruined, it's 22psi peak and holds 21psi past 5K. "Impossible" apparently.

The reason things have moved on isn't anything to do with the turbo's, not a thing has changed with them. But tuners have got smarter, manipulating the stock ECU in ways to make power without having massive boost. Compared to what it is today mapping was **** two years ago, dirty power made with massive unnecessary boost because it was the only way it was possible. Look at Prawns car, it just made 307bhp on a base map...Two years ago that was fully mapped up awesome sauce K04 hybrid territory.

My old car is the ultimate example of this pikey tuning, it made monumental boost and some how coped with it. Everybody said it was a ticking time bomb, and that's how it felt to drive. If you look at Mylo and Prawns logs it just looks like a stock car with the figures doubled. Soooo smooth.

Niki had 250bhp out of a K03s Mk4 almost 2 years ago, nobody believed it then and you guys all took the **** out of me when I said it could be done. I can't undo the last two years worth of you guys thinking I'm a rambling nut job who thinks a K03s is the best thing in the world, but I can at least achieve my goal so I can personally put some closure on something I've thought for a very long time

I'm excited, Mylo and I chat literally all the time with new ideas and all that jazz. He's a nice bloke and he'll help me get to my target.

Anywho, I don't want negativity or any gayness. Positive thought and help to get to my 250bhp target [/B

Wesitcles, probably Brands is the best bet then. April next year again?

 

[Westy]

Mate I just want to hear YOU say I've done this and that, not Prawn or Mylo. You never heard me saying so and so has done this with a K04. I just went for it and now I have the most powerful and fastest (I know of) stock K04 8L S3 out there.

Oh and BTW Mylo's turbo isnt the original turbo. In the B5 RR thread it says it was a seat replacement unit fitted 60k miles ago.

 

[16Klappe]

I'm going to do it, and I'm going to tell everybody I've done it

 

[Prawn]

Please stop living off everyone else's glory Jardo! All I hear is Prawn's car did this, or Mylo's car did this........

Make some glory of your own

 

[aragorn]

I dont personally believe this is a ECU/software feat, not alone anyway.

Theres a lot of hardware knowledge that simply didnt exist before.

Previously the turbo simply wouldnt hold the boost, theers nothing in the ECU you can do to make a turbo hold more boost.

The learning is in understanding that the stock actuator isnt upto the job, using meth to keep things cool and various other components like the relentless manifold to improve flow. Once those hardware mods are inplace, THEN its the job of the tuner to get the best from them, and clearly nicks good at what he does.

 

[16Klappe]

I dont personally believe this is a ECU/software feat, not alone anyway.

Theres a lot of hardware knowledge that simply didnt exist before.

Previously the turbo simply wouldnt hold the boost, theers nothing in the ECU you can do to make a turbo hold more boost.

The learning is in understanding that the stock actuator isnt upto the job, using meth to keep things cool and various other components like the relentless manifold to improve flow. Once those hardware mods are inplace, THEN its the job of the tuner to get the best from them, and clearly nicks good at what he does.

No, it's pretty much all in the tuning.

Regardless of what was and what is now, 21PSI has always been peak boost for a GOOD K03s. Mylo's car makes 21PSI peak and holds it to 5000RPM, the stock actuator is more than capable of maintaining 21psi.

The advancement has been in working out how to stop the actuator from opening, and how to tell the actuator to hold 21PSI.

I don't THINK Mylo's car even has a Forge actuator. It may well do, but I think his is stock. Or if it does have a Forge I think he might have got it and then said there was no improvement.

There is no better manifold for a K03s than a stock ported manifold, that hasn't changed in years either.

The advancements in the K04 can be attributed to hardware and bolt on mods, I 100% agree with that. But for a K03s it is ALL down to meth, and the ability to map the car to suit. The mapping being the hardest part. Which is why Reesy's car makes 15bhp less than Westy's for the same spec IMO; because his tuner doesn't know how to control the map in the way Niki and Bill do.

Niki and Bill have worked very closely on lots of things recently, pooling their knowledge to create better maps for everybody. What a pair of winners!

 

[Prawn]

No, it's pretty much all in the tuning.

Regardless of what was and what is now, 21PSI has always been peak boost for a GOOD K03s. Mylo's car makes 21PSI peak and holds it to 5000RPM, the stock actuator is more than capable of maintaining 21psi.

The advancement has been in working out how to stop the actuator from opening, and how to tell the actuator to hold 21PSI.

I don't THINK Mylo's car even has a Forge actuator. It may well do, but I think his is stock. Or if it does have a Forge I think he might have got it and then said there was no improvement.

I think you're getting ahead of yourself a bit here mate....

It's a very well developed spec, and carefully put together, the actuator is a brand new unit, cranked up a LOT to give 10psi, the stock actuator at 65000 miles wasn't up to the job at all.

Whilst it's a fantastic result, I wouldn't go assuming you can copy the exact spec with a combination of used high mileage parts and expect to see the same results. Good results maybe, but not the same, it just doesnt work like that.

 

[16Klappe]

Yeah I see that, but I'm right in saying a stock actuator is up to the job. I don't think anything has changed hardware wise for a K03s within the last two years?

 

[Jason.s]

Love how Jardo goes off on one and then Prawn begs him back and tells him to rethink what he's saying lol. Everytime!

 

[16Klappe]

Love how Jardo goes off on one and then Prawn begs him back and tells him to rethink what he's saying lol. Everytime!

Hardly, I was right in the first place. Prawn was just adding a bit of clarity to what I said.

 

[colicabcadam]

not another high powered under steering front wheel driven car lol

good on you though if you can get that much oomph out of a k03, at what rpm does it spool ?

 

[<tuffty/>]

not another high powered under steering front wheel driven car lol

good on you though if you can get that much oomph out of a k03, at what rpm does it spool ?

Graphs in post #328 (http://www.audi-sport.net/vb/a3-s3-forum-8l-chassis/130554-jardos-new-toy-9.html#post1719291)

<tuffty/>

 

[16Klappe]

Peak power table tops on Mylo's at 3250 to 5K, so hoping for a fairly standard power band just with higher power and torque figures.

 

[colicabcadam]

3,000 rpm, thought it would spool much quicker than that ?? i know that's peak torque, but i cannot tell from the graph when it spools ?

 

[smurfworth]

Looked so much nicer before you got hold of it.

 

[Prawn]

Peak power table tops on Mylo's at 3250 to 5K, so hoping for a fairly standard power band just with higher power and torque figures.

That's the torque line kiddo, read the other one for power, peaks just after 5k :thumbsup:

 

[<tuffty/>]

Its plausible its been tuned to spool a little later as its a fwd car... better to tune peaky turbos or larger turbos this way on fwd as its more progressive without lighting up the wheels too much all the time

<tuffty/>

 

[16Klappe]

3,000 rpm, thought it would spool much quicker than that ?? i know that's peak torque, but i cannot tell from the graph when it spools ?

Bottom right is the boost shown against the RPM. It makes it's peak boost figure in the same place a stage 1 does.

Looked so much nicer before you got hold of it.

LOL, thanks. Means a lot! Interestingly when you put your A3 up for sale I resisted the urge to comment about it's price. Have you had any luck selling it? I think I've seen it about in Plymouth a few times.

 

[colicabcadam]

are you going to try and keep this one then ?

 

[smurfworth]

Just personal opinion dude, put the facelift bumper back on and hide those aweful intercooler pipes and you'd be onto a winner. And yea, it sold pretty quickly too.

 

[mylo]

Its plausible its been tuned to spool a little later as its a fwd car... better to tune peaky turbos or larger turbos this way on fwd as its more progressive without lighting up the wheels too much all the time

<tuffty/>

spot on Paul.

Remember its my 1/4 mile toy as well as a daily driver.

 

[16Klappe]

Just personal opinion dude, put the facelift bumper back on and hide those aweful intercooler pipes and you'd be onto a winner. And yea, it sold pretty quickly too.

Nahh, I hate facelift cars. Much prefer the pre facelift bumper. I like the squareness of the grill and the thinner surround, it matches the way the B4 A4 and the B4 80 looks. Which is in my mind the way an Audi should look I like the pipes showing, in fact I like pretty much everything about the front end.

I'll be putting a pre-facelift steering wheel in it once I get an airbag holder for the one I have. I even considered swapping the dash. THAT's how much I like pre-facelifts.

It did look smart the times I saw it, glad it sold quickly.

I don't think Lou will let me sell this one, so it'll have to stay. We've had her for almost 4 years now, she's part of our family.

 

[smurfworth]

Your mad ha, the 8P is how the Audi should look

It was a very very smart looking car, shame I found it so unreliable with some many intermittent faults that I lost interest and started hating it.

 

[16Klappe]

Your mad ha, the 8P is how the Audi should look

It was a very very smart looking car, shame I found it so unreliable with some many intermittent faults that I lost interest and started hating it.

This makes me sad I've sold some truly epic cars due to getting fed up with little issues, or not fixing things which were easy. I hope you don't regret it

I am not a fan of the 8P, I'd much rather a Mk5 GTI. A friend of mine has an absolute stunner.

I am taking him up to Niki's on Thursday to get it man mapped, really excited!

 

[smurfworth]

This makes me sad I've sold some truly epic cars due to getting fed up with little issues, or not fixing things which were easy. I hope you don't regret it

I am not a fan of the 8P, I'd much rather a Mk5 GTI. A friend of mine has an absolute stunner.

Regret? Nah not yet, cold leather seats in the winter.. Never again. I wouldn't say the a3 is a truly epic car though.
That gti is nice but it's just not as classy as the Audi's are. Still, always wanted an 8P S3 so moved to an 8P tdi, yeah I know it's devil fuel, to save the money and saving over 100 quid a month on fuel alone without having to put every penny into it to keep it going is the way forward for the minute. There's one thing I miss about the 8L and that's the noise, that's it ha.

 

[superkarl]

jardo im sorry for my horrible comment, i was just referring to my plea to you in the pub where i said please dont ruin it. because its an epic car, and the pic of yours and pieres together is A3 porn at its dirtiest, and classiest.

painting the bumper in your shed is a bit pikey tho, im all for pikey, just not that far! lol. get it sprayed properly, you can tell from pics so id hate to imagine it in the flesh.

to be at peak boost/torque at 3k is pretty epic, if only it held a bit more up top.

 

[16Klappe]

jardo im sorry for my horrible comment, i was just referring to my plea to you in the pub where i said please dont ruin it. because its an epic car, and the pic of yours and pieres together is A3 porn at its dirtiest, and classiest.

painting the bumper in your shed is a bit pikey tho, im all for pikey, just not that far! lol. get it sprayed properly, you can tell from pics so id hate to imagine it in the flesh.

to be at peak boost/torque at 3k is pretty epic, if only it held a bit more up top.

Externally this is as hardcore as it'll get, nothing else will be visable. I don't want it to be lairy like the old one I know you mean well SK, you just tell it how it is

In the flesh it looks spot on, the paint work on the bumper is actually really good!

If just looks a bit crappy there because it had my filthy dirty hands all over it. I'm going to give the car an epic clean in the morning so I'll post some proper pictures in the morning.

x

 

[badger5]

No, it's pretty much all in the tuning.

Regardless of what was and what is now, 21PSI has always been peak boost for a GOOD K03s. Mylo's car makes 21PSI peak and holds it to 5000RPM, the stock actuator is more than capable of maintaining 21psi.

Niki and Bill have worked very closely on lots of things recently, pooling their knowledge to create better maps for everybody. What a pair of winners!

the std 5psi k03s actuator is'nt capable..... the k04-001 one as fitted to mylo's seems to however... 12psi (ish)
still a stunning result.. and a pile of meth going in there also... and clearly a healthy relatively fresh turbo. Like westicles new k04 did to him, it was night and day different just for being new.

 

[Prawn]

it's also possibly worth noting that the ko3S came with two different actuators.

150bhp versions on the AUM had a 65N actuator, where 180bhp versions on the AUQ and similar had an 85N actuator.

Whether this is a factor in how much the stock actuator can hold I don't know, but it could be relavant

 

[badger5]

not seen any difference in actuator pressure runs on any stock k03... always 5psi region... often less (tired) rarely more unless cranked a bit..

 

[Prawn]

I don't mean the crack point Bill, but the spring strength in terms of resisting cracking open under high boost?

I know borg warner list the 65N for 150bhp turbos and 85N for 180bhp turbos, just wondered what the practical effects of this might be.

 

[aragorn]

maybe they've upped it a bit more on the k04-001 turbo too?

 

[16Klappe]

Rain stopped play on cleaning

I went out and washed the car and did the wheels, started waxing and the heavens opened

Got my COV sticker on though, so I'm ready to take missions from HQ.