K04 Hybrid progress

[spider74]

This is a great thread, I’m heart set on doing the K04 conversion on my DTM. One thing is the K04 flange on the De-cat pipe. Where did you buy the flange? I asked RAI and they replied saying they would need to sell me a turbo before they could make the test pipe with the S3 flange on it? Did you buy the stock K03 pipe and then fabricate a custom flange yourself?

I think if I can overcome the flange hurdle and the diverter relocation the swap should be a simple enough job?

Any advice appreciated!

 

[solaris]

This is a great thread, I’m heart set on doing the K04 conversion on my DTM. One thing is the K04 flange on the De-cat pipe. Where did you buy the flange? I asked RAI and they replied saying they would need to sell me a turbo before they could make the test pipe with the S3 flange on it? Did you buy the stock K03 pipe and then fabricate a custom flange yourself?

I think if I can overcome the flange hurdle and the diverter relocation the swap should be a simple enough job?

Any advice appreciated!

[FONT=&quot]Yeah got the test pipe from RAI without a flange and asked them to send the k04 flange separately so once the turbo was bolted on I could offer it up before final fabrication.
So the main hurdles are the DV relocation (two option you can keep it recalculating or block it off)
Connecting the charge pipe to the side mounts, if you speak to bez he has an exhaust place that can fabricate a pipe for you. I used a large front mount intercooler so got away with using a 90 deg silicone elbow on the charge side mated to a custom t-pipe (for DV re-circ) and then connected to FMIC. You should be able to see this from the pics on post 29.
Let me know if you need any more advice for your project.[/FONT]

 

[IbizaAlex]

Great read. Im very impressed with the build.

 

[ben.w93]

Very interesting read, was thinking of putting a ko4 on mine and running the standard intercoolers. Mine has been mapped to around 240bhp, but still dosnt feel as quick as my old a3 1.8tq. It can keep with our 2.7t allroad which was mapped, but it can't touch our b6 s4 cab. It's much better on fuel than the allroad and s4. The s4 does 14mpg round town. The trouble I'm facing is sacrificing fuel economy for performance. My old a3 had an uprated fuel pump and injectors, but ate fuel. Does the ko4 do much to the fuel consumption?

 

[razza1]

Just upgrade to stage 2+....

 

[spider74]

Right, thanks to some PM help from Solaris, im on the way to getting mine done! So far i have managed to get the K04 second hand from another forum, S3 injectors (Part # B 06F 906 036 F), S3 DV flange (Part # 06f 145 751) and a load of pipe work and good quality clamps. Rather than start a new thread i'll just add to this and hopefully it can become a good source of information for others. The Car is a DTM edition Quattro same as Solaris but in Sprint Blue. At the moment its running an MRC stage 2 map with Full Milltek and Decat plus RS4 RARB. Currently it puts out 282bhp and 323lbsft I am on a tight budget so the FMIC will have to wait. I plan to use the standard intercoolers for now and see how it performs.

I'll post up progress and pics when i can

 

[razza1]

Hmmmm...looks like I'm going to get jealous once more.. .damn house extension..

 

[spider74]

So as i cant afford the FMIC upgrade i tried to assist the Stock Intercoolers with some more flow by adding in vents for through flow of air, this has been done before but i thought id add up the pics anyway, Very easy to do and Should lower the intake temps by about 10 deg.
First take off the liner

then Drill holes in measured spaces

Using galvanised bolts attach the wire mesh to the back

and refit

tonight i'll try and detail all the parts i am gathering!

 

[razza1]

Is that not going to throw loads of dirt into the bumper from the wheels through those holes?

 

[hades-]

i cant see that lowering the temp by 10 deg

 

[spider74]

Thanks For the Support guys! It seems a common mod on some other forums to cut and bond the vents from an S3 or B5 S4. My TT had them and it seemed a sensible way to go given i dont have the cash for better intecoolers for now. When it was last on the Dyno i was told my intake temps were 10deg less than the S-line SE mapped previously, Now accepted that could be car to car difference or the fact the DTM has no Fogs on it but hey its all experementation in this game isnt it? My Friends B5 RS4 has had bigger vents cut out like this even though its standard on them? He's running 570ps

I was worried a bit about corrosion but surprisingly little gets in there?

Anyway the K04 is the main thing! i just need a bit more time to get on with it!

 

[spider74]

Ok so its started! Tonight we got the Flange cut off the test pipe and the turbo trimmed and tapped plus some of the bits and bobs off the car ready to start.

The plumbing might be a little tricky but based on Solaris advice im hoping ive guessed right on the parts.

dont worry it was rounded off after this

 

[spider74]

how did you guys manage the cold side outlet from the turbo? is that what you mean with having to buy the S3 part and adapt it. part number 1KO 145 762 BM?

 

[hades-]

i relocated to the cold side was better for my set up
used the s3 dv flange and
eBay - The UK's Online Marketplace7
i had all my pipes custom made in stainless with outlets i needed

 

[spider74]

ok thanks Bez, think i'll have to fabricate spmething up to get it going for now and perhaps look at a better solution, The main difference is that im keeping the OEM intercoolers unlike solaris so i have a damn intercooler pipe from the top of the drivers side intercooler coming down almost where the turbo outlet is to the bottom and along to the other intercooler. Its making it difficult not to foul the fans etc. Ahhh well it wouldnt be fun if it was easy now would it?

 

[spider74]

Ok So its Fitted! Solaris did a great write up whic helped a HUGE amount so many thanks for that! The main thing i will try and describe is the difference in keeping the stock intercoolers means you have a pipe which stops you mirroring Solaris's solution on the T-Piece to the diverter.

First you have to trim the flange as per solaris did

Then if you lay the turbos side by side you get an idea of the differences

See the Cold side outlet is totally different and designed to go out the side rather than the bottom. This is a pain as it points the outlet right at your Fans at the front of the engine. There is room but its fiddly and means a bend is needed to correct. Also the oil and water lines are slightly different. These can be bent which I did but i think if you just bought the S3 ones they would be a bolt on. The breather to the top of the engine is different too (make sure this is included if you buy a used unit or buy new). Finally the outlet of the cold side is a strange machined connector designed to go into a specific S3 pipe

You can bolt a bigger pipe over the flange like Solaris did but then you need a reducer to the stock intercooler which also needs the offshoot to the DV relocate so its tight for space. As you can see above i took this off for now and made a new flange. But it has some weird machining before the flange which im assuming isnt for fun and must do something to help so im going to get it back on there when i can.

So the pipework to the intercooler looks like this now. (getting round the annoying pipe.

Another thing we did was replace the stupid "crimp" pipe which needed to be twisted to fit the water line. I was worried it might pop out as it was twisted 90 deg like this

Just cut this off and replace with proper pipe and hose clamps.

So once you have that done you need the DV relocate which solaris managed with the tap into the hose from the airbox to the top of the turbo.


Don't forget to feed you mates who are doing the mechanics and welding!

So now its in and the injectors fitted the car runs fine on the old Map, It starts and drives ok but obviously runs out of puff as the map cant cope with the extra air being flowed perhaps?

 

[spider74]

Forgot one thing, If you are taking the turbo off you only need to undo the top bolts and lift it out. the bottom ones are to hold in these flanges. We spent ages trying to get to these thinking it was anightmare design! Might save you some time.

 

[hades-]

i dont see how you had a problem with the oil water feeds i ran smic ok not the audi ones but pipe work the same
and for the discharge pipe why didnt you just get the a3 and slightly mod it perfect fit turbo side

 

[spider74]

Wasnt really a problem with the water and oil feeds they just needed bent a little. I was meaning more as a guide that if you accidentally bent it and kinked it or broke them youd be in trouble. As for the S3 turbo outlet youre right it is the answer but i was doing it on a holiday weekend and didnt have the pipe nor could i get it on the holiday weekend. I'll order it today and it should (as you say) make a perfect fit.

Could you take a pic of your solution from under the car the next time its on a ramp for us to have a peek at? might help others.

 

[hades-]

as your keeping the smic why dont you go cold side for relocation
i dont mean discharge pipe cold side as in pass ic to TB makes a lot better fit more room etc

 

[spider74]

I might re-do the DV to the cold side but for now i followed solaris lead and just took a t-piece from before the first intercooler right up to the inlet pipe using this

Self Sealing Hose Take Off Kit - 25mm ID Hose - Aluminium - Cambridge Motorsport Parts

looks like this in my car (yes i ran out of Hose clamps!)

thats the back of the headlight on the left with the (new uprated) DV on the S3 flange.

 

[solaris]

Looks like things are progressing well

 

[spider74]

Sorry for the lack of updates, Car has been Mapped at MRC today!

So it got a HPFP and new cam follower and Fuel and air filter (ITG), Made 333ps 476nm

Pretty good for the amount it cost? I would like a FMIC but i have invested in some S4 brake caliper carriers so i can upgrade the front brakes to 345mm S4 spec. I think i might need some brakes bofore the trip to "the Ring" in June!

I'm travelling with work at the moment but will post up full pics and detaisl as soon as i get back!

woo hoo!

 

[ANDYTQ]

Sounds great i wish i could afford to do mine.

 

[jonny87]

330bhp is good mate, after what we spoke about i think i would be tempted to fit a fmic and squeeze another 30bhp out of it, but as you say your ability to stop is important

What would you estimate the overall spend as being?

 

[andymc]

love the thread by you and solaris are them numbers at the fly wheel or wheels also has any one done this to a fwd if so any problems putting power down

 

[spider74]

Ok some pics from MRC

The car in their super cool Dyno cell

The power figures

In all id say i have spent about £2k? you need the following (estimates on price)

S3 Turbo £500
S3 injectors from ebay.de £180 plus say £20 for fitting kits, seals etc
HPFP £300
De-cat £100
Milltek £600
Some pipes and gaskets £100
A really good remap £500?
RARB £100


A FMIC would be great but they are about £800 and to be honest the car is hardly even worth £10k. So i think i'll see how it drives like this for a while and decide from there.

My goal all along was to have a reasonably fule efficient fast (and different) car. RS4's are out of my league, S3 3 door wont cut it, S3 sportbacks are still £20k and the B8 S4's are even more.

The DTM is a great project car for very little money really? and with a few good tweaks makes a nice drive. I'll report back on the drive when i get back from the US!

 

[hades-]

love the thread by you and solaris are them numbers at the fly wheel or wheels also has any one done this to a fwd if so any problems putting power down

i did it on the FWD put the power down pretty well

 

[Chets]

I'm looking at getting a Milltek cat back but can't seem to find one below £700.
Where can I get one for £600 spider?

 

[solaris]

Sorry for the lack of updates, Car has been Mapped at MRC today!

So it got a HPFP and new cam follower and Fuel and air filter (ITG), Made 333ps 476nm

Pretty good for the amount it cost? I would like a FMIC but i have invested in some S4 brake caliper carriers so i can upgrade the front brakes to 345mm S4 spec. I think i might need some brakes bofore the trip to "the Ring" in June!

I'm travelling with work at the moment but will post up full pics and detaisl as soon as i get back!

woo hoo!

The turbo is actually capable of producing more than 477nm of torque but MRC limit it to keep the bottom end safe.

 

[yavz]

I will hopefully be doing this conversion to my dtm soon so definately thank you to you guys for sharing.

I know its expected with the injectors and fuel pump but how significant has the drop in fuel economy been?

 

[spider74]

@chets, sorry mate, yeah I bought the milltek a while ago they are more than that, if your lucky you can get one second hand for about £450

@yavs, my economy went up with the decat and map, really depends how you drive it, it's not putting more fuel in all the time only when it's needed. After all the cars the same weight and it's still a 2.0tfsi so on partial throttle it should be the same. On my 60 mile a day commute (average 40mph) I can easily see 35mpg over a tank. That's measured not dis which shows 36mpg. Have some fun and that will plummett! But my tdi Quattro was hardly any better on fuel and the petrol is "worth every penny!"

 

[ANDYTQ]

Just bought ko4,down the slippery slope lol,i want to keep costs down as much as poss,thinking of keeping side mounts,ordering rai downpipe and cat plus ko4 flange and keeping stock exhaust for now,s3 injectors.Whats the options with regards to hpfp?,cheers guys great thread,ta Andy

 

[solaris]

Just bought ko4,down the slippery slope lol,i want to keep costs down as much as poss,thinking of keeping side mounts,ordering rai downpipe and cat plus ko4 flange and keeping stock exhaust for now,s3 injectors.Whats the options with regards to hpfp?,cheers guys great thread,ta Andy

Go for the Autotech hpfp, most reliable

 

[ANDYTQ]

Seen threads about o rings wearing out because of the step on the autotech one, any probs with yours?

 

[ANDYTQ]

My turbo has finally arrived ,now the money pit starts lol,solaris how did you pipe up,i know about turbo exhaust side,ie whats the major things to do and did you learn any easier routes whilest doing yours.cheers Andy

 

[solaris]

My turbo has finally arrived ,now the money pit starts lol,solaris how did you pipe up,i know about turbo exhaust side,ie whats the major things to do and did you learn any easier routes whilest doing yours.cheers Andy

If your using the std side mounts you need to fabricate a charge pipe thats going to fit. This is going to be trial and error once the turbo is mounted. You may want to speak to spider as this is exactly what he did.
Another factor is wheather you are recirculating the air or venting to air.

 

[ANDYTQ]

Definately recirc.Do the oil/water lines swap over as my ko4 has no pipes on it.

 

[solaris]

Definately recirc.Do the oil/water lines swap over as my ko4 has no pipes on it.

You need to slightly bend the existing oil and water lines to fit them. Just be carefull and take your time when doing so.

 

[spider74]

here is a pic of my machine at the Ring last weekend!

Drove 1800 miles to germany and back. Car felt great round the track. Glad I did the S4 Discs as your Brakes (and car) get a hammering round that thing.

I have no regrets about taking on the K04. Its now the car i wanted with plenty of Power, Torque and enough economy (average 30mpg over the entire high speed 1800 miles)