vcds timing check

[fitzdog88]

hi guys is there any way i can check if my timing is out via vcds if so could you link me to a guide tried the search engine already
s3 amk 2000

 

[Westy]

I assume you mean ignition timing? If my memory hasn't completely packed in I think block 020 in VCDS will give you the data you need. There might be a guide on www.Ross-tech.com but I can't remember. Have a little look.

 

[fitzdog88]

i mean engine timing sorry i was just wondering if it was possable just got vag com and my cars running like a bag of ****e

 

[Westy]

Any errors if you do a scan?

 

[fitzdog88]

yep 17956 n75 open circuit
17938 camshaft timing adjustment short to ground intermittent
17697 short to ground n249 done the delete and pluged back in

 

[fitzdog88]

checked all wiring and multimeter on all three terminals all got 5v with ignition on just wana check timing before i buy new sensors

 

[Westy]

If you had a timing issue you'd get a more specific timing error. All 3 of your errors sound like wiring issues

 

[fitzdog88]

i know but iv traced them all down the cable tidys no marks or scrapes even been under battery 2 check earths

 

[<tuffty/>]

As mentioned in the other thread mate... still say its wiring issues... not really sure where to start though but have heard of this sorta thing before being due to unrelated wiring issues such as the MAF...

No real easy way to start going about it tbh... not a problem I have seen before so not sure where I would start myself... trace the wires back to as far as they go would be the first thing to do... it might be something else shorting to earth and you are seeing a knock on from this... chances are the fault isn't even the sensors its showing...

VCDS won't help with timing in this case as the timing is handled in the map and is what it is... the map will have varios maps to use depending on the state of things... its not like old skool distributors and the like...

This might help
VWVortex.com - What is Wrong: 17938 - Camshaft Timing Adjustment: Short to Ground

Also... unplug the VVT unit, clear the codes and see what happens... do the same for each one in turn (leaving the others plug in etc) to try and isolate if its one sensor bringing the rest down...

<tuffty/>

 

[fitzdog88]

im gonna get my vcds out now and give it a try ill let you know my results
thanks again tho mate
matt

 

[fitzdog88]

just unpluged them 1 by 1 and got these codes
with n249 unpluged i got
17956-n75-open circuit
17938-camshaft timing adjuster-short to ground
17695-n249-open circuit

with n75 unpluged i got
17956-n75-open circuit
17939-camshaft timing adjuster -open circuit
17695-n249-open circuit

with the vvt unpluged i got
17956-n75-open circuit
17939-camshaft timing adjuster-open circuit
17697-n249-short to ground

and after with them all pluged in
17956-n75-open circuit
17938-camshaft timing adjuster -short to ground
17697-n249 - short to ground
what do you make from them guys

 

[<tuffty/>]

Well.. that suggests wiring to me... as the faults changed... common faults appear to be the N75/N249 and unplugging the N75 swaps the VVT from short to ground to open circuit... I'd start with tracing the N75 wiring as thats open circuit all the time... I suspect they share an earth as thats typically how vag wiring is... you may have to unpick the loom by removing the tape... you can loom it back up after...

Open circuit means the ECU can't see its connected... as they are then it suggests a wire is broken... as more than one item is open circuit and they tend to share an earth I would suspect somewhere in the loom where the earths are joined (typically twisted together) you may find the problem...

<tuffty/>

 

[fitzdog88]

thanks mate im gonna take the battery and casing out along with the air filter and get rite in there ill keep you updated
matt

 

[fitzdog88]

you the man tuffty one off the earths under the battery tray had come out of the o ring clamp
car drives like new now mate thanks to you and all the other members that replyed to my threads
you guys really helped me out
matt

 

[Westy]

Glad you got it sorted. Poor earthing on these cars is getting quite common due to their age.

 

[fitzdog88]

thanks mate after i cleared them and went for a good spin the dreded gas temp sensor 1 came i could smell it was running rich my exaust is blowing a bit so im gona try there first then the sensor wiring is there any thing i can check with vagcom or a fuse before i buy because as we all knw this fooker is 170 quid matt

 

[<tuffty/>]

thanks mate after i cleared them and went for a good spin the dreded gas temp sensor 1 came i could smell it was running rich my exaust is blowing a bit so im gona try there first then the sensor wiring is there any thing i can check with vagcom or a fuse before i buy because as we all knw this fooker is 170 quid matt

Whats the exact code and description from VCDS? (you can go to the ross tech wiki too for more info)

Seeing as you have been experiencing wiring issues it could be related to that again but yeah, EGT sensor is not a cheap item sadly...

<tuffty/>

 

[fitzdog88]

I'm at work at the moment mate ill post the exact code 2nite thanks
Matt

 

[fitzdog88]

just got home now mate the full code is
exhaust gas temperature sensor 1(g235) open or short to plus
p1453-35-00

dashboard computer is saying 12 mpg
i read somewhere that this sensor has a fuse that you can check is this true if so does anybody have any idea were it is located
thanks matt

 

[<tuffty/>]

Sounds like wiring issues again mate... the reason you are using fuel is because the ECU relies on the EGT probe for feedback as part of its engine protection strategies... if the ECU can't see it (as would be the case with the fault you are seeing) then it will overfuel for protection...

I would advise getting it sorted sooner rather than later... you will end up with bore wash and will lead to damaged rings and worse..

Considering the other issues you have had I would still be looking at wiring issues mate..

<tuffty/>

 

[fitzdog88]

thanks tuffty you ever herd about that fuse pal

 

[<tuffty/>]

thanks tuffty you ever herd about that fuse pal

Not on the EGT sensor no...

The probe fits into the turbo hotside and the sensor electronics are underneath the inlet manifold... remove the trim panel in front of the inlet manifold and the EGT sensor plug will be there....

<tuffty/>

 

[fitzdog88]

is it between my 3rd and 4th inlets going from left to right because im sure i seen a wet patch there last week

 

[<tuffty/>]

is it between my 3rd and 4th inlets going from left to right because im sure i seen a wet patch there last week

More between 1st/2nd

<tuffty/>

 

[fitzdog88]

Just been and checked the plug for the sensor all ok I cleared the code took my car for a drive then checked and it had come back again
Anyways is there any way I can check if the sensors ****ed with vagcom (still learning how to use it ) or do I just buy a new one guys

 

[<tuffty/>]

You will need to check the wiring back to the ECU...

AMK ecu doc can be found here...
https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B_V9-6xfgGlINmVjOTA1Y2UtOTRjMS00YTdjLTljM2ItNTM3NTg3NzEwMjgx/edit

EGT Sensor wiring (G235) goes to the 121 pin plug pin 61...

Check the other wiring too but unplug the sensor first

<tuffty/>

 

[fitzdog88]

I will do mate but I carnt get the link 2 work tuffty

 

[<tuffty/>]

****... hummm... prob need a goggle account then to see the file...

<tuffty/>

 

[fitzdog88]

Thanks mate ill get in it 2moro

 

[fitzdog88]

Just a update
Thanks to the wiring diagram tuffty checked them from the sensor down the loom and to the ecu all were ok so I thought I'd take the sensor off and check the probe when I got round the back of the engine I managed to unscrew this with my fingers any ways the probe was covered in soot and ****e cleaned it up with a bit of wet and dry and bobbed it back in went for a good 20 mile drive just incase and the code hasn't come back so touch wood this has fixed it o and don't think iv ever been so happy to see my mpg back in the 20s lol

 

[fitzdog88]

It's back grrr knew it was to good to be true