New to VAG COM - Problems with ABS test

[campervan]

In an attempt to solve an ABS problem (http://www.audi-sport.net/vb/showthr...595#post709595) I've bought VAG COM but am having a few difficulties

Tried to do an output test on the ABS but am getting a few problems:
- either "no response from controller" or
- says tests complete but nothing appears to have happened or
- nothing seems to happen at all !

Am I missing something ?

Also - I cant access any groups in Basic Settings, I get "group not available message" on any group.

Hoping someone can help

Thanks

('99 Audi A4 Avant 2.4)

[bearthebruce]

Tell us a little about your VAG-COM setup. Post an autoscan of the car. Help us to know what you are doing and how you are trying to do it.

[campervan]

Thanks
Will post details shortly

[campervan]

I've postes the Auto Scan Results below. Seem to have problems communicating with some of the modules.

The full story can be found here: http://www.audi-sport.net/vb/showthr...595#post709595. But as I needed some specific VAG COM help I created this thread.

In summary:

I got the orange abs lights and the flashing brake fault light up (complete with 3 beeps when starting the car).

My handheld code reader indicated an ECU fault.

Had my unit tested and it was 'unrepairable' so replaced it with a used unit. This cleared the red warning light/beep.

The orange ABS light would come on after a few minutes driving - before it did the ABS seemed to operate when the brakes were applied even a low speeds.

I re-scanned and got a rear ABS sensor fault.

I removed and cleaned the sensor (it was covered in metal particles - like a magnet and iron filings).

This cleared all the fault code and the orange light but the ABS seems to operate everytime the brakes are applied even at low speeds.

Both rear sensors have been replaced and the rings on the rear hubs checked by a local garage.

Some suggestions were that it was a sticking valve in the hydraulic part of the ABS controller or that it needed bleeding (the disks, pads, and cylinders have been replaced on both rear sides)

I bought VAG COM and have tried to perform the output tests and to follow the ABS bleeding procedure but cant seem to get them to work (see first post)

I'm at the limit of my knowledge so would appreciate any help

Thanks in anticipation.


FAULT CODES:

VAG-COM Version: Release 409.1-S

Control Module Part Number: 8E0 614 111 AB
Component and/or Version: ABS 5.3 FRONT D00
Software Coding: 0273004281
Work Shop Code: BB 24548
2 Faults Found:
00290 - ABS Wheel Speed Sensor: Rear Left (G46)
35-10 - - - Intermittent
00287 - ABS Wheel Speed Sensor: Rear Right (G44)
35-10 - - - Intermittent


AUTO SCAN:

VAG-COM Version: Release 409.1-S


Chassis Type: 8D - Audi A4 B5
Scan: 01,02,03,08,15,17,25,35,45,55,56

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 01: Engine
Controller: 4B0 907 552 C
Component: 2.4L V6/5V MOTR HS D03
Coding: 04001
Shop #: WSC 06325
1 Fault Found:
17978 - Engine Start Blocked by Immobilizer
P1570 - 35-10 - - - Intermittent
Readiness: N/A

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 03: ABS Brakes
Controller: 8E0 614 111 AB
Component: ABS 5.3 FRONT D00
Coding: 0273004281
Shop #: BB 24548
2 Faults Found:
00290 - ABS Wheel Speed Sensor: Rear Left (G46)
35-10 - - - Intermittent
00287 - ABS Wheel Speed Sensor: Rear Right (G44)
35-10 - - - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 08: Auto HVAC
Controller: 8L0 820 043 D
Component: A4 KLIMAVOLL
Coding: 04161
Shop #: WSC 06325
Note: Excessive Comm Errors

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Skipping Address 15-Airbags

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 17: Instruments
Controller: 8D0 919 930 JX
Component: B5-KOMBIINSTR. VDO D10
Coding: 01462
Shop #: WSC 00815
IMMO-IDENTNR: AUZ7Z0X1107189
No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 25: Immobilizer
Controller: Bit teA dre ss
Component: e 17 eingeben
No Faults Found
or DTCs not supported by controller
or a communication error ocurred

[bearthebruce]

I don't agree with the person that said that your problem would be solved by bleeding the ABS. Seems to me that the speed sensors are the problem. Either they are wrong sensors or there is a wiring problem after they were changed.

http://wiki.ross-tech.com/index.php/00290

[campervan]

Thanks for the view.

The sensors were the correct part numbers and from different suppliers so my first thought was it is unlikely that there was a common failure. Likewise with the wiring. However, is there any way of testing either the sensors or the wiring or is the only 'test' to buy another two sensors ?

Would this explain the in-ability to connect to the controller or the apparant lack of access to the groups ?

Thanks again

[NHN]

Well tbh if they are new sensors & you have checked the wiring & the controller is intermittantly responding & abs isnt working correctly then it leads to the abs controller cause there's not much else it can be, the controller should respond everytime, but we dont know what cable you have & I assume you're using shareware version, have you tested this on an actual vcds proper genuine cable & newer version aswell to take this out of the loop which then helps even further to diagnose the issues at hand, strange the sensors though give errors even with new & from different suppliers.

[campervan]

Yeah - the intermittant fault on two new sensors does seem odd. I'd wondered about a controller fault or a wiring fault as they would be common to both sensors.

I'm using a full version of VAG COM - release 409-1 having successfully used the shareware version to read the error codes.

[Westy]

Campervan where did you buy the speed sensors from? I had the ABS light on and diagnosed the problem as being my rear right wheel speed sensor. I replaced it with a sensor from Euro Car Parts as it was £30 cheaper than the same part from Audi!

3 months down the line and I started getting a clicking noise at the front of the car which was where the ABS pump was trying to engage at speeds under 5mph. I had this diagnosed and it turned out to be the right rear wheel speed sensor! I got uner the car and unplugged the sensor at the block conecter and the problem went away. I bought a genuine Audi part and so far so good.

If you dont have genuine parts I would purchase proper Audi ones even though they are £65 each they may well sort you out.

[campervan]

Sounds like a similar problem. The sensors were not Audi parts - paid about £35 each for them.

I'll disconnect the sensors at the connector and see what happens. Will this bring up any other error messages ?

Thanks for the thought though - its give me something simple to try.

[NHN]

Ahhhh light on matter, not audi, I thought you sourced audi parts from other suppliers, this could be your issue then mate, but strange doesnt connect to module aswell at times, but you dont know what the abs sensors are doing to the system aswell, can cause strange happenings if sensors arent working properly.

[Westy]

I'll disconnect the sensors at the connector and see what happens. Will this bring up any other error messages ?

It'll bring on the ABS light and possibly the ESP (if you have ESP?) light on the dash and report the sensor as being faulty in VAGCOM. But if you unplug them and your ABS stops engaging at low speeds then you'll probably be ok if you fit audi sensors

[NHN]

Urm this is true, will give more errors but the abs system might just stop full stop anyway mate given the errors so this possibly wouldnt prove much, but I would get audi sensors anyway cause the system is fairly important to the welfare of you & the car, come on cough up, sometimes we have to bite the bullet on these things, but also check the bay for new oem sensors, eg. parking sensors are also £65-£80 each, I got brand new set of 4 for £40 delivered, they work perfectly & were exactly brand new & genuine

[campervan]

So I'm thinking I'll

1) get the ABS ECU tested
2) look at some OEM sensors

I'll post the findings

Thanks agains

[campervan]

The plot thickens...

I've just had the ABS ECU tested and am told there are no faults.

So why cant I communicate fully with it and why do I still have a problem ?

Help !

Thanks

[NHN]

Fella have you got oem sensors as yet cause tbh I wouldnt even consider anyone else's, if the sensors are naff anyway its not unheard of to cause issues with the main control module for that particular system if the other components are not upto scratch or working properly, I would get oem sensors anyway & retest.

It might not fix the issue but you need them anyway & also takes this out of the equation.

[campervan]

Thanks - think youre right.
I'll try that and post the results.

Any ideas where the cheapest source of OEM stuff is ? I'll have a Google-around

[campervan]

Update.

ECU has been tested as OK.

When I disconect either rear sensor the ABS coming on a low speed problem seems to go away.

Still cant communicate with the ECU fully using VAG-COM.

[campervan]

Right - finally got the sensors changed for genuine Audi parts but still the same problem.

Cant communicate usign VAG COM apart from reading error codes and that tells me there is an intermittent fault on both rear sensors i.e. the new, replaced ones !

Had the sensor targets re-checked and they seem fine.

I've run out of ideas know - was going to try to bleed the pump but the relevant blocks are unavailable.

Cant run the output test as I cant communicate with the controller.

Really appreciate any suggestions

Thanks

[bearthebruce]

Seems part of your problem is that you are using the shareware version of VAG-COM and features you need are not supported in the shareware. Am I correct that you are trying to make this repair with the shareware version? If you want to make use of the measuring blocks and so on, you will need a full license.

Also, since I am guessing that you are using an aftermarket wire that you picked up cheap, this too can be causing the difficulties with communications. I'm not trying to sell you anything - just know that the cheap stuff out there does not have the electronics found in the real genuine Ross-Tech products. Communications errors can and will exist with these cheap wires. We hear it everyday as people try to get us to support our product running on those wires.

[campervan]

Bruce,

Thanks. Its a registered copy of VAG COM following success with the shareware version.

However, as you guessed, its a cheaper interface lead.

Trouble is even if I purchased the real things I'm still lost for a way forward

[bearthebruce]

Then why not post up and ask someone to assist you? Find someone nearby who has a genuine product running the latest version of the software to see if you could then resolve the issue. Outside of that, I don't see how else to help.

[campervan]

Thanks for the suggestion.

I've actually had a lot of local help. This has included approx 16 hours at two Audi dealers with their Audi diagnostic software and 'expertise' (unable to diagnose problem and then concluded they couldnt support cars as old as mine !) I've also had a lot of help from my local mechanic with his Snap On diagnostics and he has been unable to resolve the issue. We have checked and double checked all the mechanical components. I also swapped components with other owners audis and have been unable to repeat the problem. Other locals have donated ECUs etc from scrapped audis and this hasnt helped.

I can see how my post was unclear and appologies for this - I was wondering if I was doing something wrong with the software and still seeking a strategy for fault resolution rather than "it might be....".

So whilst I could search for a local VAG COM - I still dont have any idea of a structured way forward. So I could have all the tools in the world but dont know what I'm looking for or what to do next.

[rt05492]

It's now 6 months since anyone posted anything here so here goes nothing.

I have an S reg A4 2.5 TDI quattro automatic. A few months back the centre brake warning light (and three cheeps) came on under heavy braking and then went out. Over the weeks similar intermittent occurences become more frequent. Eventually it happens as soon as you start the car and the ABS warning light also comes - both lights now on all the time.

Obviously i'm hoping for some advive on potential fixes but I have an observation on your threads. This is that I am looking at the ABS section in an Audi Workshop CD and see that there are 2 relays on the module in the engine bay and there also seems to be another module under the rear seat. Your threads make no mention of possible faults or checking of these item ?

Are they relevant/irrelevany/onl fitted on some models ?

My local Audi indepandant got a brake switch light fault code from mine and changed it with no change. He now cannot get the VAG COM to talk to the ABS and is now stumped.

[bearthebruce]

From this side of the pond, I don't understand "S Reg" terminology so I can't guess the year of the car. But let me try: '00 to '02? The ABS modules in those model years are known to give up the ghost and to stop talking on the diagnostic channel. As a result, you cannot find out what is wrong with the module. The module is usually toast.

Is that your problem? Can't say. Sure seems like the same symptoms. You could try unplugging the fuse for the module to power it completely down and then see if when you reconnect the power if it restores function. Sometimes, gremlins get in there and confuse the world - like PCs that lock up for no apparent reason.

[rt05492]

S registration is 1998 in the UK. It's a B5 saloon.

Yes, pull the plug and a re-start usually helps determine something. Where is the the ABS fuse on a B5 ?

[bearthebruce]

Yes, pull the plug and a re-start usually helps determine something. Where is the the ABS fuse on a B5 ?

Sorry - am on the road and have no access to wiring diagrams. Can't tell you which fuse or where it is located.

[bhainart]

Sounds like your ABS Electronic Control Module is shot. I have just had the same problem with my 99 2.8i Quattro. The giveaway is that your Audi chap now can't talk to the ABS Module. It cost me about £250 just for the part with OEM Audi part coming in at between £350-400 if I remember correct (I went faint at the time LOL).

On picking the car up after being told all the work was completed drove less than 2 miles home and the the damn ABS light comes on in the dash again. There was also a rythmnic knocking on depressing the brake pedal at low speeds which turned out to be the ABS kicking in for some reason (see paragraph below). When the ABS kicked (the clicking) the Abs light on the dash went out. Needless to say I was a bit upset after the wedge I had just paid out and rang the proprietor up straight away to ask what the crack was !!!

I took the car straight back to the garage and he hooked it up to his workshop diagnostics and it said there was a fault with ABS sensor on rear os wheel and get this, it said that the wheel was turning at a different speed than the other wheels ?????

My Audi specialist bent over backwards to sort the problem and must have spent more than a day trying to sort the problem with no further charges to me and also threw in the use of a courtesy car and fuel for it too.

When he dropped the car off again (fixed) 5 days later he said that the re manufacturer of the ABS module had told him about some codes to put in to clear the problem. The Audi specialist said to me he had never come across this scenario before with ABS on Audi/VW in general.

Hope this was helpful to you and to some of the other similar stories in this thread.

[NHN]

He put some codes in to fix the abs wheel sensor, thats new on me, unless he replaced the abs controller, then it wouldnt of needed any coding unless it required calibration of some kind & never heard of an abs controller manufacturer advising directly what coding needs to be done, also new on me, but hey anythings possible I guess, sensor removal & clean/change would of been the step I would of taken which should be plugnplay, but since its fixed then cant complain, curiously did he change the controller?