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  1. #1
    1animal1's Avatar
    The Clar!! it mouves!!!

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    Idiot prefacelift S3 driver in Sheffield

    Ok, now i love the quattro, especially in deep snow that we have had in Sheff today...... what annoys the crap outta me is reckless idiots that think its a license to drive like a nob....... your car has quattro...yes, brilliant, ace..... BUT it will stop (or not) like any other car, that means if its icey you run the risk of skidding into someone else

    amazing how many drivers cant drive in snow..... unbelievable infact.....utter recklessness and i hope you have a crash one day where you dont 'take out' another member of the general public - to learn your lesson the hard way
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  3. #2
    S3 Paul's Avatar
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    Would best suit "spotted" forum?
    Bit of a mardy rant to be fair,
    Snow catchs everybody out, Kids will be kids, always have and always will.
    My S3 rarely see's the snow to be honest. Always seems to be in the garage when there is white stuff about.
    The one time i have driven it in realy bad weather it was shocking, Always slipping, skidding... Im using my little rover 214 rover at the moment and it hasnt got stuck or scared the hell out of me at all.
    So the part time 4wd system doesnt get my vote of confidence ,
    Noggy Blue 2001 S3

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  4. #3
    Westy's Avatar
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    I find that because the haldex can change the amount of power to the rear that in the snow when it pumps power to the rear, the car behaves almost like rear wheel drive. It's fine when going nice and slow but it can catch you out if you apply a little throttle. I have been provoking it on purpose in empty carparks to get used to the behaviour and how to correct the slide.

    IMHO the haldex system is quite good but the ABS is absolutely shocking in this weather.
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  5. #4
    redrumakamurder's Avatar
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    IMHO the haldex system is quite good but the ABS is absolutely shocking in this weather.
    I totally agree there as i found out last night. going no faster than 5mph aprroaching traffic lights in 1st gear just locked up and skidding about 10yrds and bumping the car infront.
    leavin a tiny scratch in his bumper and now all of a sudden his car is making a funny noise and he wants my insurance details. :-(
    S3 2000 Black / weitec suspension kit /Milltek Cat Back /APR remap stage 2 / neuspeed P flo / full black leathers etc etc

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    this nearly happened to me coming out of the petrol station. locked up at crawling speed into the bloody road. lucky there were no other cars coming.
    2000 AMK S3, Revo'd, forge 007p, B8's, H&R's, tarox g88's, ferrodo ds2500's, and in the fastest colour



  7. #6
    1animal1's Avatar
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    not really worth posting anywhere but here cos i was aiming specifically for an S3 driver..............

    it is a rant but I would say it is absolutely valid as my safety is put into jeopody by an idiot that knows he can go fast when the elements are against him, whilst showing complete disregard in that he wont be able to stop..... snow simply catching you out is not an excuse that would stand up were a road death occur...'er sorry officer, i didnt see the heavy snow storm or the 4" thick layer on literally everything'...there is no excuse, if you cant adapt to conditions then you shouldnt be on the road, by all means gauge it and see what you can get away with, but driving like an idiot like this chap was, simply unjustifiable

    but thankyou for undermining me, i feel you have taught me a valuable lesson
    Last edited by 1animal1; 6th January 2010 at 13:19.
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  8. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1animal1 View Post
    not really worth posting anywhere but here cos i was aiming specifically for an S3 driver..............

    it is a rant but I would say it is absolutely valid as my safety is put into jeopody by an idiot that knows he can go fast when the elements are against him, whilst showing complete disregard in that he wont be able to stop..... snow simply catching you out is not an excuse that would stand up were a road death occur...'er sorry officer, i didnt see the heavy snow storm or the 4" thick layer on literally everything'...there is no excuse, if you cant adapt to conditions then you shouldnt be on the road, by all means gauge it and see what you can get away with, but driving like an idiot like this chap was, simply unjustifiable
    I absolutely agree. This weather I have seen more drivers who are totally unaware of how to adapt their driving to the condition,s than ever before. Some drivers mistakenly believe any type of 4 wheel drive vehicle is imune to skidding or any of the other hazzards this weather presents. My S3 is safely in the drive and I use the golf this weather...not because of how I drive but because I have seen how others drive.

  9. #8
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    Some people do think they are invincible beacuse 'I have a 4X4'! Boss told me about a Discovery 3 that was ploughing up the A339 on the outside lane whilst everyone else was pottling in the inside lane, next thing he saw was a bit of oppo lock, tail out and wham into the Amro, ouch!
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  10. #9
    A3Tom's Avatar
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    Blimey, it was only about a week ago that we were getting videos posted of people cocking about in the snow and getting pats on the back for it.
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    My opinion on this is "cocking" around and exploring your car is fine if you are in a deserted car park with no one or no other cars around that you could harm by loosing control, it is great fun sliding around in the S3. I think the point the OP is making is that this guy was putting other peoples lives in danger for which I believe there is absolutly no excuse.
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  12. #11
    A3Tom's Avatar
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    Much like one of the video's last week that was filmed on a road with other road users on it

    Carpark fun is fine, knobbing about on the road is just stupid. Plus you look like a prize lemon when you try and handbrake into a junction, hit the kerb and fold your nearside rear wheel under your car (as the guy in the max powered 206 I saw did earlier..ha ha).
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  13. #12
    S3 Paul's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by A3Tom View Post
    Blimey, it was only about a week ago that we were getting videos posted of people cocking about in the snow and getting pats on the back for it.
    Yeh... strange that isnt it?

    "1animal1"
    The fact people here were posting videos on here of themselves arsing about on public highways AND for that matter you post regulaly about races on "private roads" . Think any of that would be viewed any diffrently by the law to how this fool was driving?

    Just because this time you saw it from a third party point of view rather than blasting past some old dear while chasing whatever car it is your chasing this time isnt going to make it ten times worse than what you do.

    You actualy wished the person to have a crash.
    Noggy Blue 2001 S3

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  14. #13
    S3quatt's Avatar
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    I'm sure I'll cop some flack for this, But the S3 with proper winter grips on is amazing in the snow.

    Tested side by side, i left my mates 32 for dead on a fully white road, & stopping was even more surprising. at 20mph side by side he took 2 car lengths more to stop!

    Even through the bends I can sit happily at 40-50 where he has to drop to 20-30 & still sliding all over the place.
    It may sound mad, but with the right tyres the car feels so planted you can easily pull out & pass without any drama.
    I'm not saying it's invincible, & granted if you do hit ice there's nothing will save you, but you defo need to try them to believe it!
    I adopted the winter tread idea from working in Norway where it's the law that you have winter grips on from September through to March. Even in the current conditions, the people there just get on with it.
    Over here, all it takes is 2" of snow & the whole country grinds to a halt!
    ...... Waiting Paitently...

  15. #14
    1animal1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by S3 Paul View Post
    Yeh... strange that isnt it?

    "1animal1"
    The fact people here were posting videos on here of themselves arsing about on public highways AND for that matter you post regulaly about races on "private roads" . Think any of that would be viewed any diffrently by the law to how this fool was driving?

    Just because this time you saw it from a third party point of view rather than blasting past some old dear while chasing whatever car it is your chasing this time isnt going to make it ten times worse than what you do.

    You actualy wished the person to have a crash.
    Please Paul, you know me as Tim and not animal1 lets not get informal

    firstly how the hell can you compare my road races with this...there is absolutely no comparison what so ever as the thread is about going beyond vehicles limits in the wrong conditions...... i have just realised (you obviously still have not) that you really do enjoy being objectional, even if it is at the detriment of your own stature, you offer no reasonable response....instead opting for a far reached argument that only makes an ass of 'you' (just look at the people defending you, there are none!!, this should tell you something)

    Was i posting videos should be your first thought? second thought should be 'did i comment on the vids which i recall were mostly 'off road'...the answer is no to both... tell me how this all ties together

    ok...... yes 'road races' aren't as safe as driving normally, what i do is drive well within the limits of the vehicle given the conditions at the time...maybe why ive never had an accident?....this post was meant to highlight that this chap wasnt driving within the conditions in mind and therefore was asking for trouble..... yeah i wished he'd have a crash to teach him a lesson, your point is what?
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    S3 Paul's Avatar
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    You race on public roads... within the limits? dont make me laugh.
    Following the highway code ?
    Your view as to how safe this chap was driving isnt worth anything as you drive dangerously on public highways.
    Street racing carrys a straight ban if proven, For a reason.
    Im objective when somebody gets on a high horse like you did. I dare say he was driving stupidly.
    But if it was posted in here to aim it at the "chap" why just say pre facelift? what was reg? what colour? if you want to slate them... maybe they are a member be easier directly wouldnt it.

    Please tell me how what you regard as safe driving within the cars limits and this chap having an arse about are so diffrent?
    Within the cars limits? Can your car stop from probably more than twice the correct speed limit on a sixpence if somebody doesnt see you coming and pulls out/ across your path.

    My point be it a audisport supported one or not,
    Is if you drive like a tit and break the law dont cry in your coffee when somebodyelse does.
    Did he have the crash you sooo wished for?
    So maybe he hasnt had a crash either so... he is as safe as you??
    Noggy Blue 2001 S3

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    I agree with Paul here: if you're going to race on public roads then you have no right to complain about any other dangerous, selfish or stupid driving. Just because you think you're within the limits of the car, and the fact that you're yet to crash, means nothing more than you're cocky and lucky. Do you really expect us to believe you've never had a hairy moment during these "private road" encounters? How close to your limits do you get?

    I can't say I disagree with the original post though - driving as if it's not snowing is ridiculous, and 4wd won't help you steer or brake (avoid a crash, in other words) - and there have been planty of times I've wanted to just shout at people for being so stupid. Sometimes I wish the car in front would light up some unmarked blue 'n' twos and there'd be one less idiot driver, but it invariably doesn't happen.

    ps - pissing about in carparks is great fun in the snow!
    Last edited by MartayMcFly; 7th January 2010 at 00:07. Reason: a few typos
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  18. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by S3 Paul View Post
    You race on public roads... within the limits? dont make me laugh.
    Following the highway code ?
    Your view as to how safe this chap was driving isnt worth anything as you drive dangerously on public highways.
    Street racing carrys a straight ban if proven, For a reason.
    Im objective when somebody gets on a high horse like you did. I dare say he was driving stupidly.
    But if it was posted in here to aim it at the "chap" why just say pre facelift? what was reg? what colour? if you want to slate them... maybe they are a member be easier directly wouldnt it.

    Please tell me how what you regard as safe driving within the cars limits and this chap having an arse about are so diffrent?
    Within the cars limits? Can your car stop from probably more than twice the correct speed limit on a sixpence if somebody doesnt see you coming and pulls out/ across your path.

    My point be it a audisport supported one or not,
    Is if you drive like a tit and break the law dont cry in your coffee when somebodyelse does.
    Did he have the crash you sooo wished for?
    So maybe he hasnt had a crash either so... he is as safe as you??

  19. #18
    1animal1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by S3 Paul View Post
    You race on public roads... within the limits? dont make me laugh.
    Following the highway code ?
    Your view as to how safe this chap was driving isnt worth anything as you drive dangerously on public highways.
    Street racing carrys a straight ban if proven, For a reason.
    Im objective when somebody gets on a high horse like you did. I dare say he was driving stupidly.
    But if it was posted in here to aim it at the "chap" why just say pre facelift? what was reg? what colour? if you want to slate them... maybe they are a member be easier directly wouldnt it.

    Please tell me how what you regard as safe driving within the cars limits and this chap having an arse about are so diffrent?
    Within the cars limits? Can your car stop from probably more than twice the correct speed limit on a sixpence if somebody doesnt see you coming and pulls out/ across your path.

    My point be it a audisport supported one or not,
    Is if you drive like a tit and break the law dont cry in your coffee when somebodyelse does.
    Did he have the crash you sooo wished for?
    So maybe he hasnt had a crash either so... he is as safe as you??
    define dangerous Paul and then point out where i have described a dangerous supposed race ive had?..... thats the point your missing..... you can hang off a cliff with a shoe string yet still be safe even though the rule book which is the law assumes otherwise.... what your clinging to here is what the law states, what im emphasising is the stupidity of someone who drives well beyond this....do you stick to 70mph on an empty motorway? (infact dont answer that) but you follow my point.

    Do i know if this chap is a member.....no...hence why i havent gone striaght back to him, would i if he was a member?, absolutely..... why not state the colour etc, well how many pre facelift S3's would you know in sheffield...i thought powers of deduction etc but obviously this isn't specific enough for your pointless attempt at a grilling

    going back to the dangerous part.... there is a definition of how dangerous something is, in vehicles the only gauge you have is the law or yourself generally, rather than stereotyping everything that goes beyond the law you should open your mind a little - im not saying what i do is right, what i am saying is that there is a clear line between putting other road users in danger BLATANTLY and not

    and finally......having to stop your car on a sixpence if somebody pulls out? you would have to put yourself in that situation to have to attempt it, I for one have not had to do that, that is because not reviewing the road ahead would be potentially dangerous....do you not agree
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  20. #19
    S3 Paul's Avatar
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    I think your wearing blinkers..
    Are you or any of us able to work out how dangerous racing on a public road is?
    YOUR opinion of other road users not being at risk when you race past them is floored, You can see that surely?

    I see 2 or three S3's in sheffield,If i wanted to narrow down if it was a member on here or not i would say "dark grey S3 facelift reg number....., spotted racing past me balls out on the A57 last night" for an example ( this is an example not a spotting so calm downa bit)
    Noggy Blue 2001 S3

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    Might be opening a can of worms here, but can someone explain to me how anyone can race safely on public roads ?
    Last edited by robgosty; 7th January 2010 at 09:54. Reason: spelling

  22. #21
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    Meh, if people didn't want to put their hammer down occasionally then they wouldn't buy cars like the S3.... It's not got a K04 turbo on it to be tickled everywhere.

    A 1.6 with heated leather would be fine....
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  23. #22
    Welly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by robgosty View Post
    Might be opening a can of worms here, but can someone explain to me how anyone can race safely on public roads ?
    When it's 3 AM and no-one else is about!
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  24. #23
    A3Tom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by robgosty View Post
    Might be opening a can of worms here, but can someone explain to me how anyone can race safely on public roads ?
    Well if I'm being honest you cant.

    On a track its a controlled enviroment, dedicated to whats happening...a race. There are measures in place to reduce risk.

    On a road there are a lot of 'unknowns' of 'hazards' such as:

    Inconsistant road surface
    Contaminated road surface
    Dozey drivers
    Pedestrians
    Everyone else on the road

    You cant predict the above, its all down to luck. Being on a track seriously reduces those risks...plus when you attend most tracks there will be signs all over the shop saying 'Motorsport is dangerous'. The risks are reduced due ot the measures in place, on a road the risks are greater as the 'unknown' is always there and there's no consistancy to it. For example...tanking around the bend...and a dog runs out. Wont happen on a track but could happen on any road/street. When you run out of talent on a track you're most likely going to dent your ego and your own car...do it on a road and the stakes are much MUCH higher. Plus if there's any injury or god forbid a death then you might end up going down the steps for it when it all goes wrong.

    T
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    Driving like an idiot in snow or dry is stupid. Involving innocent road user in games that should be reserved for track meetings is selfish. I don't condone either so using the argument that a member should not complain because he races on the road does not stack up against my point.
    If i want to drive like I am in a race, I would attend a track day.
    If you kill someone you have to live with it and hopefully live with a long sentence in prison as well.
    Welly.. I bought my S3 for the overall package. It is a safe quick car with a comfortable interior. I buy powerful cars for the simple fact they eat up motorway speeds with no stress at low revs putting no stress on the engine whilst still having a turn of speed to get out of potential danger. The equipment level in the S3 is generally above a standard 1.6 as well.
    We may all like to think we are expert drivers and masters of the roads, but it is simply not true. You should always drive defensively if you want to arrive at the end of your journey

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    just to let you know where im at - im out

    I agree with animal on this one.

    Furthermore, as a frequenter of these forums I have seen several posts by S3Paul which have been arrogant and aggressive, almost in an attempt to provoke the other party into an argument. You are not a nice person.

    In any case, we are all born with sin, none of us are perfect, some less so than others. I think the point is there are some idiots who make choices which have not even registered as worth consideration in their excuse for a brain. Those idiots deserve what they normally get.

    Let us rejoice brothers, unite in the stand against inferior automotive machinary, salute the four rings!

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    Last edited by Kave; 7th January 2010 at 11:53.

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    A3Tom's Avatar
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    This is going slightly off topic now so lets not let this turn into a slagging match. We all know the rights and wrongs of driving etc so lets not get into a scrap about them.


    On topic....in short.... Tim thought this guy was driving like an idiot, fair enough. Now thats by Tims standards but I'd be happy to stick a fiver on the fact that the bloke was driving like an idiot to prompt such a reaction.

    Off topic....if Tim enjoys a bit of sport when out on the road then its up to him really, he's a big boy and knows the risks. After all we've all done it at some point or another.

    T
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  28. #27
    1animal1's Avatar
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    cheers Tom

    I think the main point and what will seal this debate is the fact that this chap was driving worse than i would have been had it have been a dry day..... you cant just catagorise dangerous driving as anything that is above what the law states.... it is often and most likely based upon opinion - although the difference between my driving and this chaps is night and day - THAT is the point that has been missed by creating some sort of moral argument based upon stereotyping

    Paul, you do tend to miss the point often and stray off onto a tangent, almost as though you are looking for that minute detail to pick someone up on.....
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    Quote Originally Posted by jesters3 View Post
    Some people do think they are invincible beacuse 'I have a 4X4'!
    Indeedy, like the knobsack in a Disco who ran into the back of, and wrote off, my girlfriends Renault Megane Coupe. It was the old shape and a (bit of a) clunker but she loved that car!

    Quote Originally Posted by ben_turbo1 View Post
    My opinion on this is "cocking" around and exploring your car is fine if you are in a deserted car park with no one or no other cars around that you could harm by loosing control.
    I believe more people should do this, it has taught me a lot; the limits of what you can expect of the car and how to attempt to control it should it do something unexpected. Naturally, after having her car wrote off, my girlfriend is a little wary of driving in the snow now (even though the accident wasn't her fault). So I showed her just how it IS possible to control the car if it gets out of shape.

    Of course, I'm not big headed enough to thing I would be able to get myself out of anything however I believe that "cocking around" on car parks, while fun, has better equipped me for the perils (and sometimes pleasure!) of driving in the snow. More people SHOULD do it, perhaps then we'd have less people ditching cars by the side of the road because their car did something they didn't expect and it unnerved them.

  30. #29
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    Please STOP the arguing

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    yes, i understand the irony....but no i don't understand why this is sided with me when my comments are aimed at someone who was far more dangerous in the snow than i have ever been on any public road in the DRY....you will notice that my posts have been more of a striaght line affair..... so yes, i feel within my rights to express annoyance around this chaps recklessness and i maintain my stance

    If you don't like it etc etc..... you have a right to express your feelings, although expect me to hold my line - this is just semantics - a pointless disagreement where you clearly cannot define between two variables
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    A heated debate is fine guys, personal insults are not.

    There is a time and a place to take risks and by Tims explanation the Preface guy chose the wrong time and place.

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    Im not taking sides but I see it from Tim's point of view.....Im sure almost everyone on this forum breaks the law at least once on a single journey in there cars, Its true...Who spends money on Exhausts and Remaps etc and still biddys around in it? They dont...Ive had loads of fun in the snow (What we got of it anyway ) in a big empty carpark and no harm done.

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    The point ive made over and over again is...
    When viewed from an outsiders eyes, The score on the cockometer will differ,
    He possibley thinks... it was under control, As do you tim when its you having a "play"
    I simply didnt understand the rant about it. If you was a trafic officer i would understand it but we (yes me included) drive outside the law from time to time so it confused me, IF he hit your car then yes,


    The view from... cant remember who saying we all buy S3's to give them some stick ...
    WRONG
    i for one bought it for its looks,trim and comfy/safe ride after a big crash.

    Personal insults have been aimed at me BUT think i can take incorrect views on the chin.

    Noggy Blue 2001 S3

    I ask questions because i change my mind so much. If i ask questions you have already covered... just leave it be?

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    Quote Originally Posted by S3 Paul View Post
    The view from... cant remember who saying we all buy S3's to give them some stick ...
    WRONG
    i for one bought it for its looks,trim and comfy/safe ride after a big crash.

    Personal insults have been aimed at me BUT think i can take incorrect views on the chin.

    Where did i say "S3" drivers?....Audi did sell more models then the Shed3....

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    Paul i think you was trying to start the argument tbh. Its blantently clear that you cannot drive safe in the snow, as you cannot brake, going 5mph and brake the abs comes on. In the dry you can break and handle and get the power down! so it is safer. thats whats so different about it. If someone on here says anything about another driver driving "dangerously" and that its against the law then thats perfectic.
    Its gone replaced with a mk2 golf gti 16v :D

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    well im big enough to apologise if you took my comments as insults Paul. They were meant to be guidelines based upon your response to this and other posts, guidelines that would allow you to reassess how you come across and not look objective in a forced way.

    outsiders eyes? whoever mentioned or wanted an outsiders opinion...... your losing me sorry.......

    again in summary there was no comparison in how i drive my car and how this chap was forcing his way through the traffic/snow...... i cant say this enough....the reason you cannot define the difference is because you cannot seperate anything beyond the law in terms of seriousness, THAT is your problem....whilst i appreciate some outsiders wouldnt agree, I would bet a limb that if they saw my driving at the side of this 'chump' then they would completely understand - unless they were becoming annoyingly objective with no actual aim, dont you agree?
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    Tim. dont try and hide new insults in a load of long winded tripe.

    I have more experience than most of street racing in my younger years.
    Its stupid and people get hurt.
    What i mean by an outsiders point of view is.....
    Ive tried to lay this one out more than once but you refuse to think about it.
    If i or you are out having a blast down a bypass and around a roundabout or 2 while showing a scooby/focus rs or the like that S3's arent as slow and lardy as many think And we flypast cars going about their daily drive home to gain that car length that will keep you/me smiling for the next day. Don't you think the old duffer or any other non car enthusiast would think... "what a pair of reckless fools, I hope when i get to the next roundabout those two are stuck in it"
    But to you and me thats just a bit of fun and we gave them plenty of room ( we didnt hit them after all)

    So on the same train of thought... he maywell of thought it was all under control. "safe fun" if you like.

    In response to insults aimed at me by a few,
    This is a public forum?
    Free speach and the right to air your views and opinions?
    I disagreed with tims first post. He said nobody had suported me and the view i had...well they have,
    I couldnt realy care less what people do in their "mighty S3" or how "Factory workers" and the like have some how lowered the image of the Luxury car we all own. But to say i stereotype people is unfair.
    Anything i have posted on this or any other site i would say the same in my local or in the office at work ,if i disagree i voice my opinions if i think i have a valid angle and point of view.

    Just remember its a view on the first post i wrote.
    If you wish to insult me or try for a cheap shot. PM me and keep things off the general forum
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    Dont want to get involved in your disagreement ....but it was in snow and all people whether car enthuaists or not would think its stupid, i dont think racings save. I think a fast drive home by yourself at night or on a clear road is as safe as you make it. In dry you can keep to your limits but in snow the limits are so little youve got to be a physco to even attempt it.
    Its gone replaced with a mk2 golf gti 16v :D

  40. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by S3 Paul View Post
    In response to insults aimed at me by a few,
    This is a public forum?
    Free speach and the right to air your views and opinions?
    I disagreed with tims first post. He said nobody had suported me and the view i had...well they have,
    Careful Paul, you'll find your post deleted if a certain mod should see it.

  41. #40
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    fully understand what your saying Paul, I have no issues looking back on myself and reviewing my own misendevours.

    Your scenario is great, emphasis possibly a little more than i would be prepared to go but i see your point as i have done all the way along....... you are not seeing my point in that my issue is with someone driving beyond the limts of a car, the road and the weather...... you wont see me flying full pelt at a roundabout in the wet let alone the snow..... hence my frustration @ somebody who will
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