Plunge Taken - S3 SB Ordered

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DickiePhitt

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Having deliberated long and hard over the merits of the VW Golf 'R' verses the S3 and trawled through this excellent forum I've gritted my teeth and ordered the S3.

The BMW M135i was on the list too but whilst I was prepared to overlook the looks, the age of the design and maybe even the lack of a spare wheel it was the aftermarket look of the sunroof that was the last straw, oddly enough.

I even went to the bother of creating a detailed spreadsheet of the S3 and the 'R' and for a time reckoned the Golf was significantly better equipped but then reading beyond the brochures found that most things were on the Audi, just not mentioned.

The local dealer was given ample chance to 'sharpen his pencil' on price but came nowhere near the quotes I got on CarWow so I've gone with a dealer less than 50 miles away who actually wants to sell a car.

One thing I would urge any potential buyer to do is to go on the Audi on line configurator tool. Its really useful for getting the mix of options right and getting a written record. The 8 digit code you get when saving the configuration can be quoted to your dealer to ensure that you are both quickly and easily looking at the car you want.

After deliberating long and hard about Manual verses DSG I decided to give the farts a miss and stick with being in control of the shifts - I've managed without auto for over 40 years of driving and this is supposed to be a car the missus will drive and she's never driven an auto. That, combined with ditching the electric (but no memory so what's the point?) seats freed up loadsa money (psychologically) to go for a few options forum members seemed to appreciate on their cars.

So the final spec is:-

Sepang Blue
Black Alcantara/Leather with Lunar Silver headlining - would have loved the silver seats but can't see them staying clean.
Advanced Key - only because we have it on the other car so seems sensible to have same system on both.
B&O - went the whole hog rather than the Audi System in the end.
Driver Assistance and Tech Pack - with the the bonus of speed limit display option hopefuly (see below).
Electric Lumber
Extended Mono.pur
Interior Light pack
Panoramic Roof
Gangster Glass
Reversing Camera - for the missus, I use mirrors! Again got it in the other car so consistant
Through Load

The Speed Limit no cost 'option' is looking to be a pain as there is no specific mention of it in the configurator. As its termed an option I assume its optional but nowhere can it be actively selected. You get it as a no-cost option with the Driver Assist (provides lane change camera which I assume picks up the signs too) and the Tech pack (Software and upgraded display to provide the visuals) but seemingly there is nowhere to say whether you want the option, or not, having ordered both the necessary packs. The dealer is going to clarify and I've stressed I want the option and won't take the car without it.

Anyway got a long wait until October.....in the meantime anyone interested in buying a TTS roadster before then?
 
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Nice car. I had what sounds like a similar experience with my local dealer. They weren't remotely interested in matching the quote I got from OrangeWheels. I think they have a relatively small allocation of S3s, and they know they can sell them all at close to RRP, hence why they can't be bothered with people like us.

Good choice on the manual, at the risk of opening up the age old manual vs s-tronic debate, I think it's the right choice. I have an old 8P diesel with an early DSG box, and I despise it. I think the early ones were significantly worse but you have to submit a written plan of intent to the gearbox to pull away at a junction, then it will consider your application and potentially pull away (at some stage), normally so late that someone is hurtling towards you, horn blaring, wondering why you're sitting there motionless. Even on the move, you end up driving the gearbox not the car. I was seduced by the fact that it was really a manual, just without a clutch, but the fact is it's an automatic and so chooses the gears for you and routinely gets it wrong. Now I'm on a rant, sorry. I'm very sure the newer s-tronic boxes are much better before I get batted down.

Have you spec'd Connect with your tech pack? I think it makes sense and you can't retro fit. Also, LED Headlights look very cool...

When I ordered my car (also a SB) at the beginning of June with Listers Coventry, they told me to expect a September delivery, but after the order was placed they changed that to the end of October. So you might find your delivery date goes backwards a bit, however looking at other delivery threads, it seems very much luck of the draw.
 
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NickyF said:
Have you spec'd Connect with your tech pack? I think it makes sense and you can't retro fit. Also, LED Headlights look very cool....
Click to expand...

I had to stop somewhere with the options so didn't go for Connect or LEDs!
 
Great spec and Sepang is a great colour, the red callipers do set it off though?
 
I thought long and hard about going for Connect. Since I'm not of a twitterbook persuasion I'd only lose out on the extra destination input options, which I can live without. Special destinations (speed cameras?) and map updates can be done without Connect anyway.

Yes the red callipers are cool but I'll manage to do them cheaper than Audi!
 
It's worth it just for the Google earth imagery and street view, etc. The google search does work very well indeed, not sure how much I'll use the facebook and twitter though. Improved traffic sources is also a bonus, connect gives you quite a lot.
 
I thought long and hard about going for Connect. Since I'm not of a twitterbook persuasion I'd only lose out on the extra destination input options, which I can live without. Special destinations (speed cameras?) and map updates can be done without Connect anyway.

Yes the red callipers are cool but I'll manage to do them cheaper than Audi! Now you mention it I recall the TTS has uprated/larger brakes compared with standard TT so its strange the S3 doesn't have the same. Maybe technology has moved on..
 
+1 for Connect... also cool to be able to look up a destination on Google Maps and send it right to the Car's Sat Nav ;)
 
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I'll give it a bit more thought, as I like the Google Maps-type features.
I'm reading through the Connect threads now but even jumping to the latest posts the discussion is still going on about which data plan / SIMs not working after a while, etc.
What concerns me is that (as I understand it) you're now limited to using the inbuilt dedicated SIM, rather than tethering to and using the data plan on your phone.
As I plan to use the car a lot in France over the years this could be a limitation. However, data roaming charges are set to plummet so maybe it won't such a problem in future.
 
DickiePhitt said:
I'll give it a bit more thought, as I like the Google Maps-type features.
I'm reading through the Connect threads now but even jumping to the latest posts the discussion is still going on about which data plan / SIMs not working after a while, etc.
What concerns me is that (as I understand it) you're now limited to using the inbuilt dedicated SIM, rather than tethering to and using the data plan on your phone.
As I plan to use the car a lot in France over the years this could be a limitation. However, data roaming charges are set to plummet so maybe it won't such a problem in future.
Click to expand...

Prob would be best to just grab a data sim while in France and swap it over.
 
NickyF said:
Even on the move, you end up driving the gearbox not the car.
Click to expand...

^ I love this phrase, it's very apt. I spent 2-3 months learning how to drive the gearbox.

And now I'm only just learning how to get it to perform how I want it, rather than driving around the limitations.
Don't get me wrong, I'm a big fan, and for 98% of the time, it's perfect for my needs. Just 2% of the time I end up shouting at it! and yes, the latest calibration of the DQ250 is much improved and its implementation in the S3 is very very good.
 
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The Challinor said:
Prob would be best to just grab a data sim while in France and swap it over.
Click to expand...
Agree that on the surface that looks like the simplest route but I have bad experiences. I planned to use these as away of disposing of my French land line last year. Mobicarte seemed to be the best value and easiest but, even in a phone, it was a challenge to use, seemed to get debited for stuff I'd not used and that was without the limited life issues of the credit and the number.

No, the Hassle:Benefit ratio of a French SIM is too high for my liking!
 
NickyF said:
Good choice on the manual, at the risk of opening up the age old manual vs s-tronic debate, I think it's the right choice. I have an old 8P diesel with an early DSG box, and I despise it. I think the early ones were significantly worse but you have to submit a written plan of intent to the gearbox to pull away at a junction, then it will consider your application and potentially pull away (at some stage), normally so late that someone is hurtling towards you, horn blaring, wondering why you're sitting there motionless. Even on the move, you end up driving the gearbox not the car. I was seduced by the fact that it was really a manual, just without a clutch, but the fact is it's an automatic and so chooses the gears for you and routinely gets it wrong. Now I'm on a rant, sorry. I'm very sure the newer s-tronic boxes are much better before I get batted down.
Click to expand...

Have you driven an 8v S3 with a double clutch box? I had the first ever production car with DSG, that was the first iteration of the R32. I had one from new, one of the first sold in the UK in fact. That wasn't great and did exhibit some traits similar to what you say above, but time has moved on. The double clutch boxes I have had in more recent audis and porsches are excellent; no problems with moving off quickly (without launch), no hesitation and getting gears wrong? You've lost me there completely. I'd never go back to a manual now the auto boxes are so good. Each to their own of course, but current double clutch boxes are damn good! Try one, you'll be surprised.
 
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I test drove an S3 S-Tronic and it did feel better away from junctions but overall it felt a similar experience. The car is for my wife and she's never forgiven me for the DSG in her 8P so I was always going to buy a manual so I wasn't really testing it out. My comment regarding the wrong gears is again experience with the 8P DSG. On inclines it holds onto high gears too long, which means you had to give it a decent boot of throttle to make it change down or you sit their chugging along at 1200 RPM with almost no torque. The Sport setting is close to useless and doesn't change up until high RPM even if you are at 1/4 throttle. You end up changing gears using the throttle, so if you want to change down you give it a boot, then lift off. But this means you can't drive the whole rev range of torque at decent throttle as the gearbox will change down, then there's the changing up when your lifting off coming into a corner, and kicking down half way through exit. These things are true of all autos i've driven and nothing to do with dsg/s-tronic. I guess I just don't like the lack of control. As you said, each to their own.
 
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My 8V is my first S-tronic, and so far I am enjoying it ... I'm not trying to be argumentative, but I'm not sure how anyone can complain of a lack of control :blush:

The situation described above, when the car shifts up earlier than I guess you would in a manual, and puts you at revs where the car is labouring a bit and either has no torque, or you give it a bootful (and it shifts down maybe too many gears) and you have lift off, is easily remedied by flicking the left hand paddle (as I have been doing while my engine is running in, as I don't want it to labour).

In a manual, I'd dip the clutch, shift down a gear, and release the clutch again.

With either transmission, I have full control, I get it to the gear I want to be in, only the S-tronic will be quicker (curl a finger) and less effort.

I agree, sport/dynamic isn't for me, I don't want to sit up around 4.5 - 5K when I've no need to with 1/4 throttle applied. So in situations I want to have a bit of fun, I'll just use the paddles and drive in M mode.
 
Firstly, sorry DickiePhitt for my utterly predictable thread hijack... but it's done now so may as well carry on... :)

TheFiftheElement - You're not being argumentative, you make great points. I'm glad you mentioned the labouring point. I do end up using the paddles, but then the gearbox is in manual mode and I don't want it in manual mode, so I click the gear lever back and forth from M to D and it's back in auto. Hardly the end of the world, but it shows up that the gearbox is not changing gears as it should given the driving situation, and it irritates me. When I bought the car I was convinced that I would only ever use it in manual mode using the paddles, so it would effectively be a manual. This just didn't work out, I always drive it in auto D and only use the paddles when the gearbox is being a pain. I can't explain why, as I like manuals and so I should use the paddles, maybe it's down to the fact that even in M mode, the gearbox still decides it's cleverer than me and changes when it deems revs are too low or high. Even now after 6 years of ownership I still occasionally try to give manual mode a go and I end up giving up, it just seems pointless when it will change itself in auto mode. It may be down to my car being a diesel, and maybe with a revvy petrol the gearbox makes more sense, not sure.

I am really not trying to put a downer on anyone's car and hope everyone who has chosen s-tronic loves it, but I wouldn't touch another with a barge pole. I suspect that might just be me, as I'm old, tired, and a bit strange.

veeeight - Exactly!
 
NickyF, I do the same, flick a paddle and then I'm back into Auto with a pull of gear lever.

I think the gearbox does a great job, but it'll never be perfect unless it can read the road ahead. I flick it into manual as I feel it's starting to labour, I can see the road ahead and know the hill continues, so want a lower gear. However all the engine/gearbox can do is use the parameters it's given to try and suss out the correct gear. It may be that we've reached the top of an incline and a change up is not appropriate. Only I can tell that because I can make judgements of what gear I want to be in, using the view of the road/traffic ahead and what style of driving I want (aggressive, passive, slow-smooth, on/off) ..

What might frustrate me (and bear in mind I'm running my car in) is I love being able to feel a turbo engine dig deep from low revs and wind it's way out to the red line. If the S-tronic box (in manual) shifts down too easily with a reasonable application of throttle, then I understand that this will be frustrating.

What sold me on the box, was it's behaviour around town when pottering, and also at maximum attack where I could flick up and down the gears at will without taking my hands off the wheel or unsettling the car (with my hashed last minute changes in a proper manual). Oh, that and the whoomph when it bangs up a gear.

I sold an X5 3.0SD within 3 months and the gearbox drove me nuts, so I'd say I'm a manual fan at heart.

In manual mode I'd like the S-tronic to up shift for me, downshift if I'm about to stall but that's it. Are you saying that it will (and does) over ride occasionally in manual if it's thinks it knows better? (I'm guessing that usually means drops down to accelerate more quickly when you've mashed the throttle to the carpet?)
 
Manual mode will only change gear if you are getting close to red line, or the revs drop too low (although not that low), at least on my old DSG. It will hold the gear selected even at lowish revs and full throttle, so you can do what you mentioned about winding the engine right through its rev range.

I think you've pretty much hit the nail on the head, it's a great gearbox, but it'll never be perfect as it can't read the road conditions so will always make gear selection mistakes. A manual can be perfect, assuming the driver is perfect, like me :whistle2:
 
No problem, NickyF, about the 'hijacking'.

The two options I had deliberated about on and off were the DSG and the Connect upgrade and we've had plenty of discussion on these topics on this thread. So far I'm happy I've made the correct choice with the manual because, like you, my driving is perfect :blow: and Connect SIM complications I can do without.
 
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NickyF said:
I am really not trying to put a downer on anyone's car and hope everyone who has chosen s-tronic loves it, but I wouldn't touch another with a barge pole. I suspect that might just be me, as I'm old, tired, and a bit strange.
Click to expand...

Nope not just you I'm afraid. I have s-tronic and for a variety reasons wish I'd stuck with a manual. For those who have it and love it then fantastic, it's each to their own at the end of the day. What I would say is if you've never seriously considered it then perhaps you don't need it. Stick with a manual and use the saving to further spec the car if need be - although the spec looks pretty damn fine to me. I honestly don't think you'll regret going down the manual route.
 
SilureMark said:
Have you driven an 8v S3 with a double clutch box? I had the first ever production car with DSG, that was the first iteration of the R32. I had one from new, one of the first sold in the UK in fact. That wasn't great and did exhibit some traits similar to what you say above, but time has moved on. The double clutch boxes I have had in more recent audis and porsches are excellent; no problems with moving off quickly (without launch), no hesitation and getting gears wrong? You've lost me there completely. I'd never go back to a manual now the auto boxes are so good. Each to their own of course, but current double clutch boxes are damn good! Try one, you'll be surprised.
Click to expand...

Agree with you there, although I don't get mine until November I've had a days worth in S-Tronic's ( all S and RS cars ) and never really thought twice or noticed delays in pulling out or wrong gears at all.
 
NickyF said:
I test drove an S3 S-Tronic and it did feel better away from junctions but overall it felt a similar experience. The car is for my wife and she's never forgiven me for the DSG in her 8P so I was always going to buy a manual so I wasn't really testing it out. My comment regarding the wrong gears is again experience with the 8P DSG. On inclines it holds onto high gears too long, which means you had to give it a decent boot of throttle to make it change down or you sit their chugging along at 1200 RPM with almost no torque. The Sport setting is close to useless and doesn't change up until high RPM even if you are at 1/4 throttle. You end up changing gears using the throttle, so if you want to change down you give it a boot, then lift off. But this means you can't drive the whole rev range of torque at decent throttle as the gearbox will change down, then there's the changing up when your lifting off coming into a corner, and kicking down half way through exit. These things are true of all autos i've driven and nothing to do with dsg/s-tronic. I guess I just don't like the lack of control. As you said, each to their own.
Click to expand...

S-Tronic ain't a auto though
 
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TheFiftheElement said:
What might frustrate me (and bear in mind I'm running my car in) is I love being able to feel a turbo engine dig deep from low revs and wind it's way out to the red line. If the S-tronic box (in manual) shifts down too easily with a reasonable application of throttle, then I understand that this will be frustrating.
Click to expand...

Good point and hopefully it does not work out that way, I love turbo cars in the way they preform and sound. To be fair enough you've not gone through many gears at all and then your doing stupid speeds
 
NickyF said:
When I ordered my car (also a SB) at the beginning of June with Listers Coventry, they told me to expect a September delivery, but after the order was placed they changed that to the end of October. So you might find your delivery date goes backwards a bit, however looking at other delivery threads, it seems very much luck of the draw.
Click to expand...
I'm also going with a Carwow quote from Listers. How have you found them so far? They are a little slow to respond in my experience (they should have rang me to confirm my specification and didn't) and it's pretty much the exact opposite of the hard sell.

I ordered mine last week and have been quoted a November delivery. I'm expecting that to slip however.
 
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cilurnum said:
Where is connect £300 on the online configurator? All I can see are various technology packs for over £1000.
Click to expand...

Tech Pack without Connect is £1495. With it, it's £1795, so £300 extra for Connect.

It's not available nor listed as a separate option.
 
Vertigo1 said:
Tech Pack without Connect is £1495. With it, it's £1795, so £300 extra for Connect.

It's not available nor listed as a separate option.
Click to expand...
Ahhh, yes I can see it now. Under special packages. It looks tempting, but a little too much for my taste.

Is there no chance of this being a retrofit?
 
Thought so. Ahhh, well. Alas, I can't see myself using it enough to justify it but if people do a lot of driving and navigation in places they don't know I can see it being worth it.
 
cilurnum said:
I'm also going with a Carwow quote from Listers. How have you found them so far? They are a little slow to respond in my experience (they should have rang me to confirm my specification and didn't) and it's pretty much the exact opposite of the hard sell.

I ordered mine last week and have been quoted a November delivery. I'm expecting that to slip however.
Click to expand...

So far so good - I went through Orange Wheels, but they only provide an intro from what I can make out - money for old rope. As you say, no hard sell from Listers, they don't need to as the deal is already done and they are the fleet arm so are more used to working with businesses which I guess is a good thing. The comms are on the light side. I get an email every few weeks, that is a copy/paste from the last one. But I don't need an email, unless something changes, so I'm happy. After I pick the car up it's very unlikely I'll have anything to do with them again as I live in St Albans. I'll be off to Watford Audi for servicing who wouldn't offer me a single penny off the car, were very aloof and didn't seem interested in my business.
 
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