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Thread: S-tronic question...

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    S-tronic question...

    I am thinking of placing an order for a SB S-Line 184 Quattro and it will HAVE to be S-tronic as there is no manual option... Now, my Mother's MINI has an auto box and to shift up with the stick you pull back and push forward to change down. This seems entirely intuitive to me. However, my Dad's new Tiguan DSG does it the opposite way - i.e. back to change down and forward = up... I don't get that - it's wrong to me... The question is, how does the S-tronic do it? Can anyone out there with a 6-speed S-tronic 8v confirm? Many thanks. Ps it might be a deal breaker as I don't really want an auto, so no pressure guys!...

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    Audi's have paddles on the steering wheel, no stick moving to change gear...

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    If you really don't want an auto, would you be willing to give up the Quattro? Then you can have a manual.
    A3 SB S-Line TDi 184PS Quattro S-tronic. Shiraz Red, Tech Pack, Comfort Pack, B&O, Sunroof, LED lights, lots of other stuff.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cuke2u View Post
    Audi's have paddles on the steering wheel, no stick moving to change gear...
    I thought you can still pop the stick over to manual and use that. I test drove it but can't remember!
    A3 SB S-Line TDi 184PS Quattro S-tronic. Shiraz Red, Tech Pack, Comfort Pack, B&O, Sunroof, LED lights, lots of other stuff.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PembsA3 View Post
    Can anyone out there with a 6-speed S-tronic 8v confirm?
    Order a steering wheel with shift paddles and forget about the stick. It's cheap (compared to the cost of your car and s-tronic) and it's much easier than fiddling with the shifter. I never owned an automatic before getting an A3 with s-tronic, but now I'd never go back - it's beautiful.

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    The paddles work fine.

    The lever can be shifted manually but 1/ is a rather nasty squishy thing and 2/ is wired like most other road cars the wrong way around from a sequential shifter in a race car. It is intuitive to push forward to change down under hard braking which is why race cars have it set this way.

    BMWs are one of the few manufacturers to wire it around like sequential shifter in race car and the shifter feels a bit better but still not like a real mechanical sequential shifter. Bizarrely you can get better shifters for your home computer than fitted to these £30k+ cars but like I said the paddles work fine.

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    If you move the stick to the manual mode with S Tronic it is forwards for up and backwards for down just the same as VW DSG. Agree it is counter intuitive.
    8V S3; Sportback, S-Tronic, Monsoon Grey, Aluminium Roof Rails, Privacy Glass, Supersport Seats, Comfort Pack, Technology Pack High, Bang & Olufsen, Folding, Dimming Mirrors, Interior Light Pack, Extended Mono.Pur, Parking System Plus, Reversing Camera, Rear Side Airbags, Reversible Boot Mat, Tyre Pressure Monitor, Hold Assist

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    I really want Quattro. Well, NEED it actually where I live... I googled it and Audi do it the 'wrong' way i.e. forward/up and back/down... Typical... I like to use the stick - it's why I want to stay with manual. Call me old fashioned... Maybe have to do some brain re-training! Waiting on the dealer to get their 184 Quattro S-tronic on site for me to drive. We'll see if I can live with it then...

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    I'm sure you'll get used to it quickly enough
    Sport 2.0 TDI 150 Sportback in Scuba Blue, alcantara/leather, advanced key, audi sound system, comfort pack w/ ACC and park assist, deselect sports suspension, auto-dimming & folding door mirrors, electric lumbar support, heated seats, hold assist, non-smoking pack, side & lane assist, reversing camera, storage & luggage pack, tech pack with audi connect, tyre pressure warning, towbar, variable headlight range control, xenon light pack

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    I thought the s-tronic has flappy paddles as standard. Ah, just seen this on their website:
    The extra gear, along with a dry-clutch set-up, results in improved fuel
    economy and lower CO2 emissions. As with the 6-speed S tronic gearbox, this gear
    system can be operated in fully automatic mode, or using the gear lever or
    steering wheel gear-change controls for an even more engaging drive.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PembsA3 View Post
    I really want Quattro. Well, NEED it actually where I live... I googled it and Audi do it the 'wrong' way i.e. forward/up and back/down... Typical... I like to use the stick - it's why I want to stay with manual. Call me old fashioned... Maybe have to do some brain re-training! Waiting on the dealer to get their 184 Quattro S-tronic on site for me to drive. We'll see if I can live with it then...
    I thought I would use the stick like a sequential manual on my 8P but found the paddles to be immersive enough and didn't care that the stick shift wasn't great.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PembsA3 View Post
    I really want Quattro. Well, NEED it actually where I live... I googled it and Audi do it the 'wrong' way i.e. forward/up and back/down... Typical... I like to use the stick - it's why I want to stay with manual. Call me old fashioned... Maybe have to do some brain re-training! Waiting on the dealer to get their 184 Quattro S-tronic on site for me to drive. We'll see if I can live with it then...
    My brain re-trained so quickly that I haven't used the paddles or manual shift on my DSG Golf GTi in 3 years. The auto changes faster than I ever could anyway. I also have no intention of using the paddles on my upcoming A3. Auto all the way for me!
    A3 SB S-Line TDi 184PS Quattro S-tronic. Shiraz Red, Tech Pack, Comfort Pack, B&O, Sunroof, LED lights, lots of other stuff.

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    ...and I'm really cross with Audi for not offering a manual option on the quattros (unless you can stretch to an S3...)

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    Am I missing something? I don't see why pushing forwards to go forwards is counter intuitive?
    Ordered 16/8/13, Build Week 44, Delivery Nov/Dec 13. Panther Black / Silver Alcantara, 3dr S-Tronic. Black Styling Package, Black 3D Design Inlays, 18" x 7.5J ‘5-twin-spoke “Star”’ design anthracite, partly polished alloy wheels with 225/40 R18 tyres,
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    To convince myself I was such a driving enthusiast I wouldn't miss an S-tronic or similar I specced my current car as a manual. My next car will be an S-tronic or similar...

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    Quote Originally Posted by paullowther View Post
    Am I missing something? I don't see why pushing forwards to go forwards is counter intuitive?
    Have you ridden a motorbike or driven a race car with a sequential box? When hard on the brakes and you are being pushed forward it is counter intuitive to be pulling back on a lever or pushing up with your foot - you go with the movement - at least that is how my brain works

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    I think the intuitive/counterintuitive thing comes from driving old 4-speed cars in my youth - 1st to 2nd and 3rd to 4th (changing up) is pull back. Conversely, 4th to 3rd (down a gear) is push forward...

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    I think the pull back to change down is a bit of a safety feature as it takes a more determined effort to pull back. Banging down 5 gears while braking doesn't work anything like as well IMHO. It would be so simple to make it user defineable, after all it is just a switch.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PembsA3 View Post
    I think the intuitive/counterintuitive thing comes from driving old 4-speed cars in my youth - 1st to 2nd and 3rd to 4th (changing up) is pull back. Conversely, 4th to 3rd (down a gear) is push forward...
    I agree, the only times you ever push forward (without going through an horizontal gate) is to change down

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    Quote Originally Posted by baldrick View Post
    Have you ridden a motorbike or driven a race car with a sequential box? When hard on the brakes and you are being pushed forward it is counter intuitive to be pulling back on a lever or pushing up with your foot - you go with the movement - at least that is how my brain works
    Yes but it's not a motorbike or a race car that's pulling 2/3G under deceleration or acceleration. It's a road car and 99% of the time you're driving it normally. Besides, race cars nowadays have paddles, something I'm looking forward to really trying out when I get my car!
    Ordered 16/8/13, Build Week 44, Delivery Nov/Dec 13. Panther Black / Silver Alcantara, 3dr S-Tronic. Black Styling Package, Black 3D Design Inlays, 18" x 7.5J ‘5-twin-spoke “Star”’ design anthracite, partly polished alloy wheels with 225/40 R18 tyres,
    Technology Pack, Comfort Pack (cruise control & rear parking sensors), B&O Sound System , Interior Light Pack, Full LED Headlights Lights, Non-Smokers Pack, Privacy Glass, Extended Mono.Pur Finish

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    Quote Originally Posted by paullowther View Post
    Yes but it's not a motorbike or a race car that's pulling 2/3G under deceleration or acceleration. It's a road car and 99% of the time you're driving it normally. Besides, race cars nowadays have paddles, something I'm looking forward to really trying out when I get my car!
    Agreed but it just feels a bit odd to have a road car setup and motorbike/race car setup the opposite way around. Hardly as big a deal as Hyundais having the indicators on the right and wipers on the left though!
    paullowther likes this.

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    Indicators on the right?! God that would seriously p**s me off!
    Ordered 16/8/13, Build Week 44, Delivery Nov/Dec 13. Panther Black / Silver Alcantara, 3dr S-Tronic. Black Styling Package, Black 3D Design Inlays, 18" x 7.5J ‘5-twin-spoke “Star”’ design anthracite, partly polished alloy wheels with 225/40 R18 tyres,
    Technology Pack, Comfort Pack (cruise control & rear parking sensors), B&O Sound System , Interior Light Pack, Full LED Headlights Lights, Non-Smokers Pack, Privacy Glass, Extended Mono.Pur Finish

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    I also struggled with the sequential stick direction being the opposite way around to what I would expect - very counter intuitive.

    So, leave in Auto or much more importantly use the steering wheel paddles.
    Enjoying my 8V

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    Quote Originally Posted by paullowther View Post
    Indicators on the right?! God that would seriously p**s me off!
    Just having a Hyundai would seriously p*ss me off!
    JohnnyM100 and paullowther like this.
    A3 SB S-Line TDi 184PS Quattro S-tronic. Shiraz Red, Tech Pack, Comfort Pack, B&O, Sunroof, LED lights, lots of other stuff.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cuke2u View Post
    I thought the s-tronic has flappy paddles as standard. Ah, just seen this on their website:
    The extra gear, along with a dry-clutch set-up, results in improved fuel
    economy and lower CO2 emissions. As with the 6-speed S tronic gearbox, this gear
    system can be operated in fully automatic mode, or using the gear lever or
    steering wheel gear-change controls for an even more engaging drive.
    I think the 184PS uses the 6-speed wet-clutch, not the 7-speed dry-clutch.
    A3 SB S-Line TDi 184PS Quattro S-tronic. Shiraz Red, Tech Pack, Comfort Pack, B&O, Sunroof, LED lights, lots of other stuff.

  27. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by paullowther View Post
    Indicators on the right?! God that would seriously p**s me off!
    When I started driving, 40+ years ago, all UK cars had the indicators on the right. Because Japan etc still drives on the right the same as the UK their cars tend to have the indicators on the right as well. Some years ago the European car industry decided to standardise on the layout for a left-hand drive car and the UK decided to following the same standard and put the indicator stalk on the left and the wipers on the right. It did take me a while to get used to the new layout.
    Dave R (h5djr)
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    A3 8V 2.0 TDI-184 Sportback Sport s-tronic quattro - Silver + lots of options - my 9th A3

  28. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by snakehips View Post
    I think the 184PS uses the 6-speed wet-clutch, not the 7-speed dry-clutch.
    Yes the 184PS would use the 6-speed wet clutch as the engine would produce too much torque for the 7-speed dry clutch.

    The September 2013 price list has the 184PS version as 6-speed manual or 6-speed S-tronic quattro. There is no non-quattro S-tronic version listed.
    Last edited by h5djr; 1st October 2013 at 08:56.
    Dave R (h5djr)
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    A3 8V 2.0 TDI-184 Sportback Sport s-tronic quattro - Silver + lots of options - my 9th A3

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    Quote Originally Posted by h5djr View Post
    Because Japan etc still drives on the right the same as the UK
    I think you mean RHD, otherwise remind me to avoid you on the roads

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    Paddles are a must. I ordered them and never shift manually with the stick.

  31. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by baldrick View Post
    I think you mean RHD, otherwise remind me to avoid you on the roads
    ar.

    Yes you're right. I mean on the left with a RHD car. Slightly confused at the moment because I am on holiday in Germany at the moment, enjoying their on lovely roads, driving my RHD A3 and driving on the Right-hand side of the road.

    I also agree about the paddles. I never drive in Auto mode. Always in manual mode mostly using the paddles.
    Dave R (h5djr)
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    A3 8V 2.0 TDI-184 Sportback Sport s-tronic quattro - Silver + lots of options - my 9th A3

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    For those that drive in manual paddle mode, will the gearbox override you either changing up or down apart from when your at the redline or standstill?

    I have been an enthusiastic manual driver all my life, but for various reasons need to move to auto. Im trying to decide between a s tronic S3 audi or BMW m135i ZF gearbox. The gearbox will make my decision in terms of which one provides more manual control.

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    I've driven both of those options and they are both great boxes. In manual mode using the paddles the stronic box will auto up shift / downshift at the absolute limits (ie stall or rev limit). The BMW zf box will auto down change but don't know about up shift at the rev limit, didn't get that far on my test drive.

    Both boxes are fantastic though - the 8 speed zf is a torque converter regular auto but a really decent one, the stronic is a double clutch style box with no torque converter.

    My personal choice is the stronic as having 6 speeds seems enough for me when using paddles as with 8 speeds I can imagine you're always up/down the box. The 8th gear in the zf is an overdrive cruising gear with a ratio that is longer than 6th on the manual m135i.
    Build Week 1: Panther Black S3 SB S-Tronic, black nappa, anthracite alloys, comfort pack with adaptive cruise and parking plus, active lane assist, adaptive xenons with variable range control and auto high beam, technology package HIGH with connect, B&O, tyre pressure warning, fold/dim/dip/heat mirrors, reversible boot liner, extended mono pur interior, privacy glass, hill hold assist, LED interior light pack, electric lumber support.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Itguy View Post
    I've driven both of those options and they are both great boxes. In manual mode using the paddles the stronic box will auto up shift / downshift at the absolute limits (ie stall or rev limit). The BMW zf box will auto down change but don't know about up shift at the rev limit, didn't get that far on my test drive.

    Both boxes are fantastic though - the 8 speed zf is a torque converter regular auto but a really decent one, the stronic is a double clutch style box with no torque converter.

    My personal choice is the stronic as having 6 speeds seems enough for me when using paddles as with 8 speeds I can imagine you're always up/down the box. The 8th gear in the zf is an overdrive cruising gear with a ratio that is longer than 6th on the manual m135i.

    Thanks for the reply. The ZF in the m135i would not shift up at all in manual sports mode. It would bounce of the rev limiter as I accidentally found out, but as you say, it will shift down in full manual sports mode if you were in too high a gear for the revs/speed. Having said that if you floor the throttle it won't shift down to help you accelerate unless you really had dropped serious engine speed and were labouring the engine. I can live with this approach for track days as it makes sense.

    i was told that the S tronic would change down if you floored the throttle in manual mode - and may shift several gears lower automatically. Is this correct ?

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    Yes, but only if you hit the kick down button behind the accelerator, ergo the s3 still allows kick down override but it's use is up to your foot, iyswim.
    Build Week 1: Panther Black S3 SB S-Tronic, black nappa, anthracite alloys, comfort pack with adaptive cruise and parking plus, active lane assist, adaptive xenons with variable range control and auto high beam, technology package HIGH with connect, B&O, tyre pressure warning, fold/dim/dip/heat mirrors, reversible boot liner, extended mono pur interior, privacy glass, hill hold assist, LED interior light pack, electric lumber support.

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    One other thing to add is that there are plenty of companies that offer tweaking of the stronic/dsg software to remove features like the auto up shift and disable kick down etc - if you were that way inclined. Not sure what is available for the zf box.
    Build Week 1: Panther Black S3 SB S-Tronic, black nappa, anthracite alloys, comfort pack with adaptive cruise and parking plus, active lane assist, adaptive xenons with variable range control and auto high beam, technology package HIGH with connect, B&O, tyre pressure warning, fold/dim/dip/heat mirrors, reversible boot liner, extended mono pur interior, privacy glass, hill hold assist, LED interior light pack, electric lumber support.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Itguy View Post
    Yes, but only if you hit the kick down button behind the accelerator, ergo the s3 still allows kick down override but it's use is up to your foot, iyswim.
    Ah... Thanks for the info. I have a test drive in a few weeks so will make note of that. Is it easy to develop a sense of how far to push the accelerator before engaging kick down ? If so this sounds ideal.

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    Yes it's easy not to press it
    Build Week 1: Panther Black S3 SB S-Tronic, black nappa, anthracite alloys, comfort pack with adaptive cruise and parking plus, active lane assist, adaptive xenons with variable range control and auto high beam, technology package HIGH with connect, B&O, tyre pressure warning, fold/dim/dip/heat mirrors, reversible boot liner, extended mono pur interior, privacy glass, hill hold assist, LED interior light pack, electric lumber support.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Itguy View Post
    Yes, but only if you hit the kick down button behind the accelerator, ergo the s3 still allows kick down override but it's use is up to your foot, iyswim.
    I don't think you can turn off the kickdown without a gearbox remap as states above but 2 workarounds:

    1. Use paddle to upshift again.
    2. Juuust lift throttle pedal slightly (ie 95% power) for a fraction of a second then floor it again. Gearbox changes back up and doesn't kick-down a second time.

    Found #2 last night by accident.... It turned out to be a smoother option and allowed full throttle in top gear. (Note: full throttle not full speed so perfectly legal).

    John.
    Enjoying my 8V

 

 

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