Religous Tolerance... discuss.

Caesium · Jan 8, 2010

I just watched Jimmy Carr telling jokes, and he called Jesus a fag, and the Pope the king of the paedos.
I thought that was hilarious even though it pokes fun at the majority religion in this country, because its a joke and not to be taken seriously.

Perhaps some should study the concept of a joke, especially those who decide that stoning to death a teacher who called a teddy the wrong name is a suitable punishment, when a punishment isn't necessary at all, let alone stoning.

Maybe some religions should grow up and be part of the 21st century if they want to be taken seriously.
If not, then they can live their lives in the 9th century, where they belong.

sidibear · Jan 8, 2010

Jimmy Carr is a **** though and will say anything to get a laugh or publicity.

jojo · Jan 8, 2010

This thread could potentially end up in tears....

But to answer your question, I'm not much of a religious man myself, but I think if you have paid to see Jimmy Carr, this is the type of stuff that's going to be spouted out his mouth, and I would probably laugh myself. But to read what he is saying in text, or to put it in the news lets say(which did happen), he was always going to be shot down, regardless if it was a joke or not.

Staz · Jan 8, 2010

Not wishing to fan the flames but...

Go to google and type in the following lines one after another to see what auto results you get:

christianity is
judaism is
hinduism is
mormonism is
scientology is
sikhism is
islam is

beanoir · Jan 9, 2010

Staz said:
Not wishing to fan the flames but...

Go to google and type in the following lines one after another to see what auto results you get:

christianity is
judaism is
hinduism is
mormonism is
scientology is
sikhism is
islam is

Thats very interesting, i'm sure there is a technical or logical reason behind why that happens, but i'm intrigued to know what it might be.

phoenixv6quattro · Jan 9, 2010

I would rather discuss 101 ways to get cancer.

voorhees · Jan 9, 2010

phoenixv6quattro said:
A true and recognised passport to commit murder. And thats every religion.

Bhuddism ?

Caesium · Jan 9, 2010

phoenixv6quattro said:
I would rather discuss 101 ways to get cancer. I despise it. A true and recognised passport to commit murder. And thats every religion.

did you have to google that conclusion?

Staz · Jan 9, 2010

beanoir said:
Thats very interesting, i'm sure there is a technical or logical reason behind why that happens, but i'm intrigued to know what it might be.

I would assume it's for the very same reasons that Chris started this thread.

beanoir · Jan 9, 2010

Well I do sympathise with his point, there does seem to be so much paranoia especially when it comes to speaking out about one certain religion, but it's ok to let people of that certain religion speak open and publicly against the country they live in.

Lets not discuss the march planned in Wooton Basset then....

1wheelonly · Jan 9, 2010

religion is not something im into what so ever, therefore obviously my view is each to there own but keep it to them selves and stop spouting and preaching it to everyone else.
im sick of this country bending over backwards for everyone elses beliefs and religions, havent we gone to far with accomadating for everyone else rather than what great britain once was and what we once stood for?
you cant and never will please everyone but i feel this country has gone to far and has lost sight of what should be and shouldnt be accepted as a nation !
what other countries put up with what we put up with ?????

phoenixv6quattro · Jan 9, 2010

A4Quattro said:
did you have to google that conclusion?

It's not a conclusion. It's an educated opinion. If it were a conclusion it would be a final analysis. As religious issues are an ongoing problem a final conclusion cannot be recognised. And ref google, stop trying to "shine me on" from my one of my previous post responses to you. Your making yourself appear the idiot. A4, have you read, and understood the Holy Bible, and the Qu'ran? If you havn't I suggest you do so as to fully understand the subject matter of the thread you have started.

phoenixv6quattro · Jan 9, 2010

voorhees said:
Bhuddism ?

Thats a valid point mate. Fair play!

Caesium · Jan 10, 2010

phoenixv6quattro said:
It's not a conclusion. It's an educated opinion. If it were a conclusion it would be a final analysis. As religious issues are an ongoing problem a final conclusion cannot be recognised. And ref google, stop trying to "shine me on" from my one of my previous post responses to you. Your making yourself appear the idiot. A4, have you read, and understood the Holy Bible, and the Qu'ran? If you havn't I suggest you do so as to fully understand the subject matter of the thread you have started.

Wouldn't you rather go and start a discussion thread about cancer? I thought from one of your earlier posts that you would not be involving yourself in this discussion.
Yet again I see you are lowering the tone down to inferred personal insults, must you do that to make yourself feel validated?

phoenixv6quattro · Jan 10, 2010

A4, If the personal insults(you coined them insults, not me)were not warranted, and not 101% deserved they would not happen. However, how can they actually be personal?? I don't know you and vice versa. I make these insults( as you call them, I call them observations) purely on the the basis of the posts you have made, and those only. Your not doing youself any favours, as a large percentage of what you have written is both un-researched and un-supported by any means of facts.....I.E. Guess work/make-believe.
Ref me not being available for discussion, that was stated at the end of my last post on a previous thread, once again you stand corrected......I would rather discuss cancer, but that dosn't mean I will not discuss it (neither did I say I wouldn't, on this particular thread), it just means I don't like it. But as all things, they usually turn out to be the most stimulating ones, as it removes one from ones comfort zone('s).
And......Ref your clumsy attempt at amateur psychology, I would take extra special care to not stumble upon another subject you know very little about. The answer to your question anyway is no. I have 8 medals, a mention in despatches and a degree in protective security to make me feel "validated" (and hell yeah they do!! Lol). Now, stop avoiding the question A4, have you read the Holy Bible and Qu'ran and fully understood them?

Caesium · Jan 10, 2010

Oh, silly me!
I thought implying someone was an idiot by way of their post was an insult, maybe its an endorsement. In which case, thanks very much.

No, I have not read either of the Holy books you mentioned, neither do I wish to.
I have never said in any of my posts that anything I have said is fact, its all my own opinion, which I am entitled to.

This thread has gone well off on a tangent, I originally wanted to discuss perceived tolerance within the boundaries of religion, reading the bible will not really help this discussion as all religion is open to individual interpretation.
A point in fact would be that I'm sure it does not say anywhere in the Qur'an that stoning a teacher to death for naming a teddy Mohammed or killing a Dutch cartoonist for drawing a picture of him, that is the interpretation of the individuals, albeit a skewed one.
People in this country are scared of expressing their feelings towards the actions of minority ethnic groups for fear of being called racist or whatever buzz-word is used today.

I'm glad you saw fit to mention your medals and academic qualifications to back up your statements, I guess you believe that adds some weight to them

phoenixv6quattro · Jan 10, 2010

Firstly, no problem, it was my pleasure. Ref my credentials..My dear boy, it adds all the weight they are ever going to need! I am qualified both mentally and practically! I am proud of my achievments, and of the services to my country and in turn myself! So why not mention them! It's funny that most of your posts appear to be written as facts and not your personal opinions. However, you have rectified this by very kindly pointing out that they were all actually your own concoctions, and not indeed anywhere close to facts. Little bit of advice. Before you step up to the plate, make sure you have live ammo, not blank rounds.....No it dosn't mention the attrocities of Christianity or Islam in either book of teachings. BECAUSE THEY WERE WRITTEN 1000's of years ago my old potatoe! Give yourself a pat on the back, at the same time stop being so shallow in your believed findings. If you want to understand religion, let alone start a discussion, have a bit of subject knowledge in the first place. You can do this by reading the aformentioned books. Oh, but you don't want to? Why? Because you don't like religion? THEN WHY START A DISCUSSION ON IT CHRIS? A contradiction is its own right. If you want to understand tolerances or lack of them, stop being so ignorant and read them. It will give you an understanding of where they come from. Basics. Don't try walking before you can crawl. Your trying to change a head gasket before you can change a wheel....(Don't take that literally, as I'm sure you know how...both the wheel and the HG).
So hows the A4 mate?

Staz · Jan 10, 2010

Are you saying I'm not allowed to discuss my feelings on religious intolerances because I haven't read either the Qu'ran or the Bible?

phoenixv6quattro · Jan 10, 2010

Staz. My old chap. That is, without a doubt, the most daft thing I have heard all week. So daft in fact, it doesn't deserve a serious response, let alone an answer. Have you had your cup of coffee this morning? Christ!

mitch78 · Jan 10, 2010

Nowhere in this thread has anyone claimed to be Christ, so what makes you think that asking on here whether he's had a cup of coffee will get a response? I doubt he even drinks the stuff?

Staz · Jan 10, 2010

Tea for me buddy, got a second one brewing.

phoenixv6quattro said:
Staz. My old chap. That is, without a doubt, the most daft thing I have heard all week. So daft in fact, it doesn't deserve a serious response, let alone an answer. Have you had your cup of coffee this morning? Christ!

So how about dignifying my post with either a proper answer or explaining why it's so daft, instead of trying your hardest to make everyone else look stupid while you make yourself look like a jumped up know-it-all ****.

My question appears perfectly reasonable when you consider this little quote:

phoenixv6quattro said:
If you want to understand religion, let alone start a discussion, have a bit of subject knowledge in the first place. You can do this by reading the aformentioned books. Oh, but you don't want to? Why? Because you don't like religion? THEN WHY START A DISCUSSION ON IT CHRIS?

Caesium · Jan 10, 2010

mitch78 said:
Nowhere in this thread has anyone claimed to be Christ, so what makes you think that asking on here whether he's had a cup of coffee will get a response? I doubt he even drinks the stuff?

I think Christ was rather partial to water, which he turned into vino.... lol

mitch78 · Jan 10, 2010

phoenixv6quattro said:
It's not a conclusion. It's an educated opinion. If it were a conclusion it would be a final analysis. As religious issues are an ongoing problem a final conclusion cannot be recognised. And ref google, stop trying to "shine me on" from my one of my previous post responses to you. Your making yourself appear the idiot. A4, have you read, and understood the Holy Bible, and the Qu'ran? If you havn't I suggest you do so as to fully understand the subject matter of the thread you have started.

You do seem to be missing the point of the thread (as I understand it).

Rather than discussing (and therefore having to understand) the fundamental beliefs of each and every religion, I think it was intended to be a discussion of the levels of tolerance or intolerance of other people's religious beliefs, whatever they happen to be. Anyone can have a very clear and relevant view on that subject, without knowing the details of any religion at all.

Caesium · Jan 10, 2010

phoenixv6quattro said:
Firstly, no problem, it was my pleasure. Ref my credentials..My dear boy, it adds all the weight they are ever going to need! I am qualified both mentally and practically! I am proud of my achievments, and of the services to my country and in turn myself! So why not mention them! It's funny that most of your posts appear to be written as facts and not your personal opinions. However, you have rectified this by very kindly pointing out that they were all actually your own concoctions, and not indeed anywhere close to facts.

A4Quattro said:
I have never said in any of my posts that anything I have said is fact, its all my own opinion, which I am entitled to.

phoenixv6quattro said:
Little bit of advice. Before you step up to the plate, make sure you have live ammo, not blank rounds.....No it dosn't mention the attrocities of Christianity or Islam in either book of teachings. BECAUSE THEY WERE WRITTEN 1000's of years ago my old potatoe! Give yourself a pat on the back, at the same time stop being so shallow in your believed findings.

Isn't religion all based upon beliefs?

phoenixv6quattro said:
If you want to understand religion, let alone start a discussion, have a bit of subject knowledge in the first place. You can do this by reading the aformentioned books. Oh, but you don't want to? Why? Because you don't like religion? THEN WHY START A DISCUSSION ON IT CHRIS? A contradiction is its own right. If you want to understand tolerances or lack of them, stop being so ignorant and read them. It will give you an understanding of where they come from.

I don't care much for the religion itself, If minorities want to live and become part of the west's culture then they need to adapt to become part of it, not try and change it to their benefit, for example trying to implement Sharia law in the UK, is that religious tolerance and acceptance of the host's country?
to me it sounds like a parasitic infection we need to dispatch.

phoenixv6quattro said:
Basics. Don't try walking before you can crawl. Your trying to change a head gasket before you can change a wheel....(Don't take that literally, as I'm sure you know how...both the wheel and the HG).

Yes I do know how to change a wheel or a head gasket, I wont mention my credentials to add weight to this statement, I feel the lack of them adds enough gravitas.

phoenixv6quattro said:
So hows the A4 mate

Stolen, so no idea.

johnnythepie · Jan 10, 2010

mitch78 said:
Nowhere in this thread has anyone claimed to be Christ, so what makes you think that asking on here whether he's had a cup of coffee will get a response? I doubt he even drinks the stuff?

Well i beg to differ.I must be Christ.At least a dozen times a day my wife says 'Jesus what the fu*k have you done now!'

jojo · Jan 10, 2010

fingermouse · Jan 11, 2010

Im a jedi knight .......................... Honest ...........................

Syncopix · Jan 11, 2010

I personally think religion is the cause of the majority of the issues in the world today. Yeah I'm sure I'm going to get flamed for it, but can anyone tell me what good religion has done for the world in the last 100 years?

Most wars that have ever happened will have religion tied up in them somewhere...

(flame suit on...)

10blazin · Jan 11, 2010

Syncopix said:
I personally think religion is the cause of the majority of the issues in the world today. Yeah I'm sure I'm going to get flamed for it, but can anyone tell me what good religion has done for the world in the last 100 years?

Most wars that have ever happened will have religion tied up in them somewhere...

(flame suit on...)

I think your wrong its money , greed and land that has been the cause of wars not religeon , thats just a good tool for brainwashing but the truth is if we didnt have religeon we wouldnt be here now there would of been a total breakdown long ago , its religeon that keeps most people from doing bad things , even non believers and athiest ,morals and values from there parents some where down the line stems from religeous rules and value's , they can deni it but its true .

speedfreek · Jan 11, 2010

I would never judge someone for their beliefs, no matter how strongly I disagree with them, but in my opinion making jokes about religion is fair game - same as any other subject. At the end of the day, Jimmy Carr is a sodding comedian that you KNOW tells risque jokes - so if you decide to take his jokes seriously and take offence then I suggest comedy isn't really for you. Or if you enjoy comedy but not jokes pointed at religion, then FIND ANOTHER COMEDIAN.

Welly · Jan 11, 2010

speedfreek said:
I would never judge someone for their beliefs, no matter how strongly I disagree with them, but in my opinion making jokes about religion is fair game - same as any other subject. At the end of the day, Jimmy Carr is a sodding comedian that you KNOW tells risque jokes - so if you decide to take his jokes seriously and take offence then I suggest comedy isn't really for you. Or if you enjoy comedy but not jokes pointed at religion, then FIND ANOTHER COMEDIAN.

Agreed, if the topic isn't funny to you, you have to accept that and make you judgment based on that. Either you stay, or you get up and leave. Or change channel.

I shouldn't worry anyway, it won't be too long before making any form of joke about any religion, in good spirits or not, will result in you being dragged off in a jam sandwich van and gets you banged up. Thats not just the case with religion either to be fair, many topics have now become so taboo that people won't even offer an opinion on them. This is annoying to me, because this is, as far as I'm concerned, free speech. It's what a large number of family dies in WW2 fighting to protect.

Sad, but free speech isn't what it once was in this country. I find myself watching what I say all the time these days, in case someone finds it offensive and complains.

Baa baa 'rainbow' sheep springs to mind.

speedfreek · Jan 11, 2010

Welly, it's the same with racism... jeebus cripes it boils my pee.

How is calling a blackboard a 'chalk' board less racist? It is f**king black!!!!! Calling it a different name just implies that it was racially offensive in the first place. Which of course, it is most definately not.

Welly · Jan 11, 2010

speedfreek said:
Welly, it's the same with racism... jeebus cripes it boils my pee.

How is calling a blackboard a 'chalk' board less racist? It is f**king black!!!!! Calling it a different name just implies that it was racially offensive in the first place. Which of course, it is most definately not.

Yep, racism is the other one. I heard a ridiculous story about how Snooker & Pool are racist games because the white ball hits the black ball around.

THEY ARE COLOURS! I don't hear people who have been out on holiday and have been in the sun for too long (and have consequently gone red) complaining that they are offended by Snooker as the white ball hits the red ball around. Utterly ludicrous.

That story mentioned before about the teacher with the Teddy named 'Jesus' getting fired boils my blood. I do a lot of work for a primary school, and knows how much the teachers love the kids. For that sort of thing to be allowed to happen is awful.

Imagine going to Egypt for example and telling them that we won't conform to their religious beliefs, as happens to us in this county. See how long it takes you to end up in jail then!

Anyway, this is simply my opinion at the end of the day. I just think it's a shame the the country has gone 'Political Correctness' mad.

Ads · Jan 11, 2010

Yep, it's very stupid having to refer to things which are black as something else. Some London councils told their employees to refer to black bin bags as refuse sacks! Pathetic.
There is nothing wrong with referring to a person who is of black origin as "black", so there shouldn't be anything wrong with calling a black object "black" either. "Black" is not a derogatory term.

One thing I don't always like is when a person is referred to as black (or any other race) in a general statement when there is no real need. For example...... I was walking up the street and this black bloke dropped his wallet so I told him and he was very grateful.
A guy at work does this. He always includes the person's colour EXCEPT when that person is white.
He never says anything negative but I always wonder why he feels the need to point out colour when the person is anything but white.
That doesn't make him racist though.

The example of snooker and pool... I've heard that one before too. But I'm not sure how true that is though. I've seen it many times in "Black" films and comedy sketches, outlining how stupid the idea is.

I think the problem is that everyone is now over-compensating or being forced to over-compensate for the racism or racial comments of those who made them when it was more common twenty odd years ago. (And believe me, as a non-white, back then it was pretty hard to get through a day without colour being used against me in some sort of negative way)
It's how things are.... something happens and then everyone gets told to, or feels that they should do the total opposite, often going too far the other way, just to make sure that they are not seen as being a racist/sexist/etc.
e.g.... In a conversation where there is mention of black/asian/etc.... many many many times you will hear (or at least I have heard) the statement "..I haven't got a problem with them cos I've got loads of black/asian/etc friends".
It's like people are feeling forced to prove they aren't prejudice in any way.

A time when I sometimes feel forced into being a certain way is because of this this explosion of paedos being everywhere. Now there are times when I find myself trying not to even glance at an under aged girl (school girl) on the bus just in case someone says/thinks something stupid. I don't always feel like that, but it has happened.

What I also find totally unfair and wrong is the way it is ok for people of any non-white race to say pretty much what they like about white people, especially on TV, in comedy, and in films.
Example.... the film White Chicks. Can you imagine if there was a film based on a couple of white guys "blacking-up" and calling it Black Chicks. All hell would break lose.
Chris Rock (as much as I like him) based much of his comedy on taking the mickey out of white people, and everybody loved him.. black and white. But take someone like Bernard Manning (as much as I hated him) and he was seen as a fat racist idiot.

All of these are sad situations, but sadly it's how things are for the foreseeable future.

Welly · Jan 11, 2010

Excellent post Aythreee. I agree in every aspect. It's nice to know that there are still sane people out there.

I worry what the world will be like for my daughter in 10 years time growing up as a teenager, and then in 20/30/40 years time.

EDIT: How long did that take you to write? You must be as busy as I am today.... :whistle2:

Ads · Jan 11, 2010

Welly said:
EDIT: How long did that take you to write? You must be as busy as I am today....

Oh yes, I'm REAL busy today!
Just not with the right things.. :laugh:

And it took twice as long to write it as it should've because my colleagues thought it was a good time to keep walking past my desk!
I actually felt annoyed with them for walking around the office doing their work and stopping me from typing on here!
Even as I type this there are two of 'em having a conversation behind me. GET LOST AND DO WHAT YOU ARE GETTING PAID FOR ELSEWHERE AND LET ME GET ON WITH MY SKIVING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Welly · Jan 11, 2010

aythreee said:
GET LOST AND DO WHAT YOU ARE GETTING PAID FOR ELSEWHERE AND LET ME GET ON WITH MY SKIVING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I've just had the WHOLE office look at me because of how much that made me laugh! Whoops. Ah well.

I'm supposed to be managing the network here... Still, having broadnband issues today so I consider this to be 'testing the broadband.'

aythreee said:
And it took twice as long to write it as it should've because my colleagues thought it was a good time to keep walking past my desk!

My normal problem is pressing the backspace button by accident which always causes the browser to go back a page, losing whatever I've written. Now that is annoying!!

Caesium · Jan 11, 2010

Welly said:
My normal problem is pressing the backspace button by accident which always causes the browser to go back a page, losing whatever I've written. Now that is annoying!!

Yup know that one.

Ads · Jan 11, 2010

Welly said:
My normal problem is pressing the backspace button by accident which always causes the browser to go back a page, losing whatever I've written. Now that is annoying!!

Haha... I know that one well mate, I know it well!

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