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  1. #1
    nky_84's Avatar
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    Microsoft certified training??

    Seems to be quite a few people in IT on here so im after a bit of IT advice?

    I graduated last year with a 2:1 in computer science, problem is everyone in Edinburgh is after people with experience of which i have none.

    I found a place, www.itfuturesonline.com that is offering to sponsor the right kind of people through the training. They pay 1.5k an i pay 2k +vat.

    6months training + 12 week experience either 10am-1pm or 6pm-9pm daily

    The training includes a MCSA 2003, MCDBA plus placement

    starting sal after training 26k, second year 35k, 3rd year hopefull big bucks.

    anyone done one or heard anything about it?

    cheers

    Nick

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  3. #2
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    hmmmmm when you mention starting sals etc. Is that guarentee'd ? Not heard of many MCSAs on 35K in there second year of work.

  4. #3
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    If what they say is true, then it sounds OK to me.

    35k for MCSA with 1 years experience is good money if you're out of the City or a science park. Obviously an MCDBA could get a fair bit more in the right place, but highly paid DBA posts need a lot of experience, and even then its not guaranteed.


  5. #4
    nky_84's Avatar
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    its not garentee'd but they are depserate for people with the .net qualifications etc. They dont make money out of training you, so its in their interestes to hire you, to then make money out of you.

    I would prefer a science park etc, but i wouldnt mind busing it into the centre Edinburgh for good money.

    Just need to take a step back from the sales pitch and have a good think about it.

  6. #5
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    So the company actually employees you at the end of it ? Thats first for a trainging company. Try and get a copy of the T&Cs and have a look at the small print.

    Sorry to put a downer on it, but I've seen quite a lot of these companies promising x and not delivering. A few lads in my TA unit wanted to change careers and went down this route... and got conned.

    To be honest, no business in there right mind would guarentee a job at the end of training.... what happens with the trainee can technically pass the course but is an absolut idiot in terms of work effic etc ?

    EDIT ;-

    Looking at the website, I'd say that they were a recruitment agency with a small training arm.

  7. #6
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    i have the 7mcp's to make up the MSCE course, would like to go to the cisco CCNA course now.

    Im not quite on that salary either !

  8. #7
    nky_84's Avatar
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    feel free to put a downer on it, as long as its constructive

  9. #8
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    I think those kind of places are a bit dodgy. Especially that one, hardly any results on google (appart from themselves spamming a load of job boards) and no reviews that I can find.

    If you want to get certified then I would advise studying on your own to get the qualifications, its alot cheaper but will require alot of will power.

    There are loads of people with MDBA certs that are no-where near as good as other people with a couple of years experience, as there is so much more you can learn with experience.

    Sorry I don't have a quick fix, and I know that 'getting experience' isn't as easy as just doing it!

    There was a lad who joined our company to work on support 3 years ago straight out a a degree, moved into looking after the servers here, and has just left to work for cisco on about 30k, he was on peanuts working here, but he had learnt alot.

  10. #9
    nky_84's Avatar
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    Thats a good point about the google hits. How do you go about doing the qualifications your self and how much does it cost? The getting experience bit is starting to be a pain in the arse!

  11. #10
    batwad's Avatar
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    2.5k is quite a lot to shell out. If you persevere you can self-train and get the qualifications for considerably less. My main concern would be experience though. Okay you've been trained up but you'll have very little commercial experience which the 30k+ bunch will be expecting.

    Microsoft are always publishing studies saying how much more certified folks earn than others, but how much of that is actually down to the certification? Some of my friends, who are very successful IT contractors, have never taken a certification exam in their life (and I'm talking about 10 years+ in IT). Agencies and employers will look at experience before qualifications, simple as that.

    What I'm getting at is that the certification itself isn't worth as much as some might make out (i.e.: not 2.5k of your own money). The only good thing I can see in this offer is the 12 weeks' experience they offer you, but that only looks to be part-time. You've got to weigh up how much experience you'd get out of this scheme as opposed to getting a lower-paid full-time job and grinding it out. Personally, I think you're better off doing the latter.

    Have you looked at graduate programmes? That's how I got into the industry.

    P.S.: regarding your comment about .NET qualifications, MCSA isn't a developer credential, it's a sysadmin/infrastructure one and won't help you get a .NET job (unless you're phenomenonally good at blagging).
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  12. #11
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    batwad beat me to a better explanation, so I'll second his comments

  13. #12
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    I work in IT and I've had a few friends go for these companys which offer discounted training and promotions like they will find you a job placement when you finish etc. All of them have turned out dodgy. I'd stay clear.

    If you're on a budget you know you dont have to go on a course. Start with the MCPs - buy the book and study then take the exam. There are lots of videos you can "obtain" on bit torrent as well which offer classroom style studying.

    I've been lucky as my company took me on with just college IT quals then trained me with the MS ones (and others :D)


    Also jobsite.co.uk is your friend. Make a good looking CV and post it on there so recruiters can search and browse it. This is all I ever do when looking for jobs and get phoned loads about interviews etc. once your CV is on there you dont have to lift a finger - they will find you Just my experience anyway but its worked and I didnt have any experience when I started apart from personal.
    Last edited by Rich; 11th June 2007 at 15:45.

  14. #13
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    Don't pay 2.5k for it! Buy the study guides, the testking exam sheets and then take the exams. Just takes a bit of discipline - and having recently gratuated you should be still in the way of studying

    As for the salaries, I very much doubt someone with only 2 years Microsoft experience will be on 35k in central scotland. I suppose its all down to the right place and right time etc but I think you'd be lucky to achieve that.

    Its all about trying to make yourself different from the other folk applying for the jobs, and I'm afraid everyone and their auntie has some Microsoft certifications. The DBA stuff would be good to have. Don't you fancy going the Cisco route and doing some networking or security? It's good to do something specialised and concentrate on that.

    You might need to accept a smaller salaried job just to get the experience but it can pay off for you. Just don't settle in and get stuck in the same place for 10 years going nowhere - I've seen that all to many times!! The only way to get on in IT is to move on IMO.

    I don't mean to 'piss on yer chips' - just experience of IT in central Scotland.....
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  15. #14
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    I agree with Audiboy - self certification is the way forward. I am currently studying CCVP, which is a nightmare without the previous certs (CCNA and CCNP) but I don't have the time to do them, although I have most of the required books etc for them....

    To be perfectly honest though, the current trend is that a qualification like an MCSE or MCSA or even a CCNA will get you an interview, from that point it's up to you.

    I know a few CCIE's who have recently been looking around, and because of a flooded market they are better staying where they are. Gone are the days when CCIE meant 75k+, more like 50k these days.
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