Thread: new boy here - need some advice :)

i'm looking to buy the newest shape A4 within the next few weeks so i thought i'd join up, get some advice and maybe get a few things sorted

i'm after a diesel A4, with good mpg but plenty of power, would people suggest the 2.0ltr pd170 or the 3.0ltr V6?

also, can the S4 lights be back fitted to the A4? the LED ones, and the seats too?

i may sound like a complete newboy here, but why are there so many versions? sometimes the S Line has the lipped bumper (where it raises in the middle) and some dont

like so - with the 'raised lip'
2008 Audi A4 2.0 TDI S Line 4dr Diesel Saloon

like so - without
2008 Audi A4 2.0 TDi 170 S Line 4dr Diesel Saloon

both TDi S Lines?

If you want good economy, get a BMW.

My A4 2.0 TDI (143) is shockingly bad on the fuel, average about 40mpg, 36 mpg on a long run a couple weeks ago. I suspect the 170 will be even worse, and the V6 worse still.

There is a new range coming out in March though, that are meant to be more economical with a 177BHP TDI. Who knows what the real world figures will be, but it is meant to be better. My current A4 is going in and I'm getting one of the new ones for this reason.

As for power, the 3.0 V6 is obviously better than the 2.0 so you wont be disappointed there. But then again, the BMW 335d, in the real world, is as economical as my 143, but with about 280 BHP is faster and more economical than the Audi V6 TDI. After all this hating on the Audi, why am I get another? Because I put the order in before I found out BMW are apparently releasing the 3 series with 4wd this year or next. My next motor will be the 4wd BMW after this next quattro though, thats for sure.

As for the lights. Get an S-line and they will come as standard. And you will get seats that are good enough also.

my 2009 a4 b8 170 averages 32 mpg combined.if you want fuel economy, good chassis engine and handling, dont buy an audi.For comfort, build quality, style and piure aesthetics and quattro, buy an audi.End of!!

Originally Posted by stis

i'm after a diesel A4, with good mpg but plenty of power

Two things that don't really go hand in hand! Which one is more important?

I've just come from a E90 BMW 320d Edition M Sport Touring to an Audi A4 Dynamik Edition TDi 170 Quattro.

Things I've noticed:

Costs £75 to fill the Audi and £85 to fill the BMW
My normal drive to work BMW reported 52MPG Audi reported 42MPG
Sit lower in the BMW
The steering in the BMW has more feedback
Power wise the BMW feels faster but then I've got quattro so you expect there to be less.
Stereo is a lot better in the Audi

My Audi's only done 248 miles so far, so I can't comment too much on the power, I've not really gunned it like I've done in the BM, I want to ease the engine, but the Audi is a lot smoother ride.

My A3 (8P) 170 Tdi does 47mpg on my 90 mile round trip commute to work and back, I took our B8 A4 1.8T the other day and it showed 42mpg on the same trip. Looks like the new models coming out will have addressed this as economy is not great on current models, particularly diesels it seems when compared with other manufacturers.

Agreed. The current B8 engines are pretty poor on the fuel economy issue. In fact, terrible.

The new ones look okay though. I'm sure I read somewhere that Audi think that their V6 TDI is the most efficient in its class? If so, that really would be an amazing feat compared to what they are currently like.

From their website, they are comparing the new 1.8T petrol, and 2.0 TDI 177 Diesel. Figures look good on paper, but time will tell in the real world:

Audi A4 Avant - Engines - Audi.co.uk

Basically though, unless you are going to be buying the brand new motor that's released in March, if its economy you want, don't go Audi. Even my mates brand new C-class is better than my current A4. Will keep the forum informed on my findings of the new 177 BHP diesel though when I get it. Should be end of march, and I generally do a few miles, so wont be long to figure out tank - to - tank, with real consumption values.

Can’t really offer a comparison as I’ve only had petrol BMW’s.
However previously I’ve had a B8 2.0Tdi (143), a B7 2.0Tdi (170) quattro ……and a B6 S4.
The B7 only use to get 33 mpg, B8 was better (albeit non-quattro) 43 mpg.
The 3.0Tdi I have now is only getting 34 mpg average after 7k miles but the car is fookin amazing for a diesel!

You can forget the in car display – I used road trip app to calculate mpg!

in short, everyones telling me to ditch the Audi idea and get a BMW 320d or 325d?

Originally Posted by stis

in short, everyones telling me to ditch the Audi idea and get a BMW 320d or 325d?

The first thing you need to decide is whether you want a Beemer (which I hear are great, but not my cup of tea) or an Audi. Then you can decide on what's important i.e. mpg or something that's not a beemer!!

I have never owned a Bmw but always loved the look of them. When i was looking for a car the past few weeks my short list was the Bmw 520d Touring and the A4 2.0tdi avant B8.. had a look at a few of each and i ended up going with the audi, My decision was easy for me as the fuel economy of the audi is still respectable albeit not on par with the Bmw but the Audi felt more special to drive. So i guess what im trying to say is what is more important? Fuel economy or the car your sat in?

Originally Posted by stis

i may sound like a complete newboy here, but why are there so many versions? sometimes the S Line has the lipped bumper (where it raises in the middle) and some dont

like so - with the 'raised lip'
2008 Audi A4 2.0 TDI S Line 4dr Diesel Saloon

like so - without
2008 Audi A4 2.0 TDi 170 S Line 4dr Diesel Saloon

both TDi S Lines?

Just had a look on both links and the reason is that one seems to be a B8 version, the latest and the other is a B7 which is no longer produced by audi and even the B8 has currently undergone a facelift so the new 2012 models look even more different.

As for your original qestion, the S line and Black editions both feature the same bodykit styling but the black edition trim level has the bang & olufson sound system with the chrome strip surrounds of the the S line on the foglights, grill and side windows are replaced with a black trim and the interior receives piano black inlays.

You also get those bright Xenon headlights on the S line and Black editions as standard in conjunction with sports seats in the front and of course, the S line badges around the car.

As far as i am aware, you also get the option of two 19" rim styles on the pure black editions including the titanium rotors (don't suit all colours IMO and look dirty quickly) or the 5 segment (which suit all colours but i'm biased as we have those :P).

On the other trim levels, you receive equipment changes but to be honest, your best bet is to look on the audi website for the A4 brochures if your buying new or to get an idea of the sort of equipment that comes as standard on each trim level. Other things you may need to spec that don't come as standard on any trim level such as full leather.

On your last point of the Audi or BMW, it all boils down to which car you would prefer for your needs. The audi seems to have better spec as standard and the options from what you choose seem to be cheaper in places. You also get a better boot space on the saloons.

The BMW seems to be classed more of a drivers car with better power, MPG and handling but minus the above. So it really comes down to which things you prefer having if your buying new OR whether you find a great spec car in your budget from either manufacturer, IF you aren't bothered about running costs on either which should be close to each other for the most part.

Originally Posted by Dazza0685

I have never owned a Bmw but always loved the look of them. When i was looking for a car the past few weeks my short list was the Bmw 520d Touring and the A4 2.0tdi avant B8.. had a look at a few of each and i ended up going with the audi, My decision was easy for me as the fuel economy of the audi is still respectable albeit not on par with the Bmw but the Audi felt more special to drive. So i guess what im trying to say is what is more important? Fuel economy or the car your sat in?

For me the car, but that's not to poo poo the importance of decent mpg now a days. I don't do the miles to need to worry too much about it.

Originally Posted by longp2

The first thing you need to decide is whether you want a Beemer (which I hear are great, but not my cup of tea) or an Audi. Then you can decide on what's important i.e. mpg or something that's not a beemer!!

i've never really been a fan of BMWs but recently i've seen a few and really liked them, however i like Audis more - i've only just turned 22 and owning BMW when you're younger always has that sort of "look at me i've got loads of money and drive a BMW" image about it. Not that it should, but maybe i've just been hanging about in the ghetto too much...

Originally Posted by NARMAK

Just had a look on both links and the reason is that one seems to be a B8 version, the latest and the other is a B7 which is no longer produced by audi and even the B8 has currently undergone a facelift so the new 2012 models look even more different.

As for your original qestion, the S line and Black editions both feature the same bodykit styling but the black edition trim level has the bang & olufson sound system with the chrome strip surrounds of the the S line on the foglights, grill and side windows are replaced with a black trim and the interior receives piano black inlays.

You also get those bright Xenon headlights on the S line and Black editions as standard in conjunction with sports seats in the front and of course, the S line badges around the car.

As far as i am aware, you also get the option of two 19" rim styles on the pure black editions including the titanium rotors (don't suit all colours IMO and look dirty quickly) or the 5 segment (which suit all colours but i'm biased as we have those :P).

On the other trim levels, you receive equipment changes but to be honest, your best bet is to look on the audi website for the A4 brochures if your buying new or to get an idea of the sort of equipment that comes as standard on each trim level. Other things you may need to spec that don't come as standard on any trim level such as full leather.

On your last point of the Audi or BMW, it all boils down to which car you would prefer for your needs. The audi seems to have better spec as standard and the options from what you choose seem to be cheaper in places. You also get a better boot space on the saloons.

The BMW seems to be classed more of a drivers car with better power, MPG and handling but minus the above. So it really comes down to which things you prefer having if your buying new OR whether you find a great spec car in your budget from either manufacturer, IF you aren't bothered about running costs on either which should be close to each other for the most part.

thanks for the infomation mate, so is it B8 i'm looking for? what year did those start production? i wont be buying a new one, my budget is around 12/13k so it definitely wont be new, i'm looking at 08/58 plate models with around 60k on the clock - would it be worth waiting for the new shape to come out? will this see a dramatic price decrease in the shape i'm looking for? again, thanks for your help

Originally Posted by stis

i've never really been a fan of BMWs but recently i've seen a few and really liked them, however i like Audis more - i've only just turned 22 and owning BMW when you're younger always has that sort of "look at me i've got loads of money and drive a BMW" image about it. Not that it should, but maybe i've just been hanging about in the ghetto too much...





thanks for the infomation mate, so is it B8 i'm looking for? what year did those start production? i wont be buying a new one, my budget is around 12/13k so it definitely wont be new, i'm looking at 08/58 plate models with around 60k on the clock - would it be worth waiting for the new shape to come out? will this see a dramatic price decrease in the shape i'm looking for? again, thanks for your help

I think your best best is to go to a site like autotrader and use the search options to set age at four years and your max price or even pistonheads and view in the A4 section of the classifieds.

You should definitely find something close to your budget but i would highly reccomend you look out for the S line versions and any other extra equipment you can spot as you'll be much happier with the bodykit on it compared to the other lower trims that don't have it.

I would say that its best to make a list of those you like and even those slightly out of budget, go to view them and look for any and all faults you can find that weren't listed as they're your bargaining chips when haggling a lower price. It might be good for you to take a friend along that maybe knows cars mechanically to give it a once over but generally, you can tell when a cars been looked after or not.

As for the the new shape, it can only help to lower the pricing of the current versions but i'm sure that the facelift versions are due in march to coincide with the 12 plate release and that may be the time to buy. You'll probably get more for your money and probably have a little more to spend.

Add a private plate and to be honest, any S line in good condition, you'll be hard pressed to tell when it was made so you'll be rolling in a car thats just like new. Don't be afraid to explore the BMW option but where i live, the 3 series and the C class mercs were done to death and i've only seen a handful of pure Black Editions which really helps our own to stand out. Your own are might be lacking in BMWs though and personally, i want to buy a 320D M Sport but insurance is crap where i live so i have to suffice with a polo as my own daily drive and envy the family car thats a Black Edition lol.

Hope that helped and good luck in your search.

Originally Posted by NARMAK

I think your best best is to go to a site like autotrader and use the search options to set age at four years and your max price or even pistonheads and view in the A4 section of the classifieds.

You should definitely find something close to your budget but i would highly reccomend you look out for the S line versions and any other extra equipment you can spot as you'll be much happier with the bodykit on it compared to the other lower trims that don't have it.

I would say that its best to make a list of those you like and even those slightly out of budget, go to view them and look for any and all faults you can find that weren't listed as they're your bargaining chips when haggling a lower price. It might be good for you to take a friend along that maybe knows cars mechanically to give it a once over but generally, you can tell when a cars been looked after or not.

As for the the new shape, it can only help to lower the pricing of the current versions but i'm sure that the facelift versions are due in march to coincide with the 12 plate release and that may be the time to buy. You'll probably get more for your money and probably have a little more to spend.

Add a private plate and to be honest, any S line in good condition, you'll be hard pressed to tell when it was made so you'll be rolling in a car thats just like new. Don't be afraid to explore the BMW option but where i live, the 3 series and the C class mercs were done to death and i've only seen a handful of pure Black Editions which really helps our own to stand out. Your own are might be lacking in BMWs though and personally, i want to buy a 320D M Sport but insurance is crap where i live so i have to suffice with a polo as my own daily drive and envy the family car thats a Black Edition lol.

Hope that helped and good luck in your search.

Thats exactly what i've been doing so far, i've seen a few that have come up that i really like the look off

are there any particular extras that i should look out for? a few are listed with the BOSE sound upgrade and satnav (which obviously would be a bonus) but is there anything else that i'll enjoy? and also add value to the car when it comes to sell it on?

Originally Posted by stis

Thats exactly what i've been doing so far, i've seen a few that have come up that i really like the look off

are there any particular extras that i should look out for? a few are listed with the BOSE sound upgrade and satnav (which obviously would be a bonus) but is there anything else that i'll enjoy? and also add value to the car when it comes to sell it on?

I'm not sure how good the BOSE system is and from my past experience in home entertainment forums, BOSE was commonly referrered to as the following acronym: B.O.S.E = Better Off Somewhere Else, due to the fact they became too reliant on marketing their brand rather than actually making better products like the competition lol

But if it was the only sound system upgrade offered at the time, which it might well have been till the Bang & Olufson, it would probably be something nice to have, as well as the satnav but i'm still in the camp that thinks it may be better to have a stand alone satnav as an individual as if things still are the same, the factory fitted versions are still moronic but, once again, any option like that should help with value on resale.

In my eyes, leather seats are perhaps a well desired option and a car with those seats in good condition would be nice and generally Audis are great for holding onto their value BUT the main thing is, when a new A4 (The B9?) is announced in the next few years, it might not help as much having those options as all models will see a general reduction in price across the B8 range if my guess is right on what usually happens.

Best thing to do, is buy the car for the best value at the time and make the least 'loss' at the time of sale as you almost always sell for less than you payed during normal ownership.

I'm sure others can chime in with which other extras were available at the 08-58 versions release and are still desirable as to be honest, i just recently did all my own research when we placed our own Black Edition order late last year.

Originally Posted by NARMAK

I'm not sure how good the BOSE system is and from my past experience in home entertainment forums, BOSE was commonly referrered to as the following acronym: B.O.S.E = Better Off Somewhere Else, due to the fact they became too reliant on marketing their brand rather than actually making better products like the competition lol

But if it was the only sound system upgrade offered at the time, which it might well have been till the Bang & Olufson, it would probably be something nice to have, as well as the satnav but i'm still in the camp that thinks it may be better to have a stand alone satnav as an individual as if things still are the same, the factory fitted versions are still moronic but, once again, any option like that should help with value on resale.

In my eyes, leather seats are perhaps a well desired option and a car with those seats in good condition would be nice and generally Audis are great for holding onto their value BUT the main thing is, when a new A4 (The B9?) is announced in the next few years, it might not help as much having those options as all models will see a general reduction in price across the B8 range if my guess is right on what usually happens.

Best thing to do, is buy the car for the best value at the time and make the least 'loss' at the time of sale as you almost always sell for less than you payed during normal ownership.

I'm sure others can chime in with which other extras were available at the 08-58 versions release and are still desirable as to be honest, i just recently did all my own research when we placed our own Black Edition order late last year.

well cheers for all your help man, i'll be sure to let you know how i get on

A 58 plate onwards is the age you need to look for to get a B8 chassis. I bought mine in January on a 58 reg (2009 car). Mine is a 2.0TFSi 211hp petrol though. So far the 2000 miles ive covered I have returned 37mpg. I paid 12.8k for mine with 59k on the clock so your budget is good if your after one. Diesels will demand a higher price as there more sought after. Full service history is a must too.

Originally Posted by A4B8Sline

A 58 plate onwards is the age you need to look for to get a B8 chassis. I bought mine in January on a 58 reg (2009 car). Mine is a 2.0TFSi 211hp petrol though. So far the 2000 miles ive covered I have returned 37mpg. I paid 12.8k for mine with 59k on the clock so your budget is good if your after one. Diesels will demand a higher price as there more sought after. Full service history is a must too.

what?! you get 37mpg out of a 2.0TFSi engine? is that the same one thats in the S3? my car at the moment is the 20vt engine, the 180bhp model though, and i get around 23mpg going to work and back, i can get 28/30 if i go on a long drive... 12.8k is a bargain too... the whole point of getting a diesel was to get better mpg haha

on a side note, i drove a few A4s on friday after work, they're beautiful cars but they're very big... i dont know if i should go for an A3 instead as they just feel a bit too big for me and i also thought the 2.0ltr diesel 143 was very underpowered, i much prefered the 170 model, but they're more expensive to buy

Originally Posted by stis

what?! you get 37mpg out of a 2.0TFSi engine? is that the same one thats in the S3? my car at the moment is the 20vt engine, the 180bhp model though, and i get around 23mpg going to work and back, i can get 28/30 if i go on a long drive... 12.8k is a bargain too... the whole point of getting a diesel was to get better mpg haha

on a side note, i drove a few A4s on friday after work, they're beautiful cars but they're very big... i dont know if i should go for an A3 instead as they just feel a bit too big for me and i also thought the 2.0ltr diesel 143 was very underpowered, i much prefered the 170 model, but they're more expensive to buy

Yeah honestly on my comute which is 30miles on mainly dual carriageway and b roads thats what I get. Book says it should return 41.5.

Around town though it does sit close to 30mpg if not the high 20's. I think the engine is slightly different to the s3 as the one in mine has valve lift and im sure the s3 doesn't. The A4 is quite a big car but mine is quite well spec'd and i have parking sensors which makes parking easy. I came from an astra vxr into my audi and even mine at 211hp feels slugish to me but its got lots of torque for a petrol which makes it a great motorway cruiser. Adaptive cruise control is great too. I had an old vw passat with the 1.8 20vT 150hp a few years ago and that never went above 30mpg tbh.

Get it mapped and it wont feel so sluggish.

Our A4, albeit with the 1.8T 160 bhp engine, does late 30's/early 40's on the wifes round trip of 30 miles of A/B roads. That's just steady away in normal traffic. Round town you will drop especially with alot of stop start but you have to think the price of the car is less to start with.

I had a 335d BMW with 340bhp and it was getting not that much better than my current s4
33mpg vs about 28mpg and the BMW cost more to fill the tank as it was a diesel.