Chris NottEM Tuning
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  1. #1
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    Allroad 2002 2.5tdi Questions

    Hello

    I have just bourght an Allroad, for no other reason than I like the look of the car, having never driven one b4

    Drove it home 200 miles yesterday. The one thing I noticed and disapointed me was the very poor low rev performance. It is dead under 2200rpm!!!

    I have driven French diesels for 20+ years, and have gotten very used to the low rev torque they have.

    Is this normal on this car. Seems I need to drive it a bit like a petrol to wake it up.

    Otherwise the car is A1 in condition and loverly at cruise speed.

    What else do I need to know about this car? any tips and advice from others would be great to hear.

    BIggles

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  3. #2
    Jason's Avatar
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    Sorry Mate it's normal with the V6 tdi due to the large turbo that needs more than a few revs to get going.
    Normal driving and you will get used to it but it's a bloody nightmare with a trailer!!
    Some reckon a remap can sort it!

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    Hello Jason

    Ohhhgh! Fecky Woo

    I do a lot of towing. Towbar is 1st accessory!?

    The rev thing reminds me of my wife's Mini. Goes like stink if you work it, but that is not what a driving a diesel is about.

    I have to admit I am finding the 6 box difficult to master as well. @ the moment I never seem to be in the right gear unless it is above 4th

    I do hope I learn to "drive" it. Strange my wife drove it and was at home straight away.

    I am thinking about remapping, any suggestions would be welcome from anyone. Can I get it so I can get something below 2200?

    Lastly I have driven loads of cars in my time. Why does this not feel like 180bhp? I am confient that the car is 100%. The guy I bourght it from was almost cyring when I drove off. The history suggests it was probally his mistress.

    Biggles

  5. #4
    Jason's Avatar
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    Biggles

    Coool!
    They are not that bad with trailers,I have a large twin axle that I pull with ours and you dont even no it's there except when your reversing for example and it's full loaded, you have to give it some gas or it stalls, where as the old 100 straight 5 tdi would never stall!!

    The 6 speed box takes a bit of getting used to.
    Could be the Maf sensor!!

    When I first got our V6 tdi I thought the same that it's was flat and gutless over 3000rrrr's until I found out about cleaning the Maf sensor,which I did and subsequently nearly shat myself it was if 100 extra bhp had just appeared

    The all road is a fantastic piece of kit but unfourtunatly they are well exspensive second hand here!

    Make sure that the engine breather has been changed!!! Very Important!

    Enjoy
    Last edited by Jason; 11th November 2006 at 12:36.

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    Hello Jason

    What is a MAF sensor, where is it, and how do I know if it needs cleaning? IS it a DIY job?

    When you say engine breather do you mean the one that vents the crankcase?


    BTW looks like a great pad you have there.

    Biggles

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    Hi Biggles

    Cheers mate!12 years of graft!!

    The Mass Air Flow sensor tells the ecu how much air is going to the engine.
    Because of the EGR valve putting gases back into the inlet the MaF gets sooted up and can't read the correct air flow!!

    Its directly after the air filter on the black pipe going to the engine,has a wire going to it.It has 2 torx screws holding it in place for which you need a special screw driver, but you can get them out with a good pair of pliers/mole grips,once out clean it very carefully with cotton buds /pipe cleaners dipped in petrol.

    It works for me every time,but It did'nt make any differance on the wifes Beetle so I had to get a new one (70) but well worth it as the differance is MAD!!

    Crank case breather blocks up on the V6 Tdi putting the block under presure,lots of smoke and your oil seals will eventualy blow!!!


    Let us know how you get on.


    Good luck!!

    Jason

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    Hello Jason

    I will have a look at that. Cheers for the talk through.

    Do you have any experience with remapping or chipping the Allroad?

    Biggles

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    Hi Biggles

    Although our's was remapped by Audi by the last owner (cost him 800) from 150bhp to 180bhp and goes like stink,and has been trouble less, there is still no power below 1800/2000 rrrr's.

    You can get independant custom re-map to suite your own requirements, bottom end torq for example but your looking at 500 ish!!!!!

    Start with your Maf,Vag-com will also tell you if your Mafs knacked but easier to whip it out and clean!!!!!

    Jason

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    Morning Jason

    I was of the impression it was 180bhp already. Says so in my owners guide.

    I have been looking a remapping kits on e-bay. So far I am not convinced as to their claims. I am waiting for one purchaser to give me a review of his purchase.

    Biggles

  11. #10
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    Yours is 180bhp but my A6 was 150bhp when new being a 1998 model.

    Do a search on this forum for remapping.

    Any plug in kit you buy is not forced to sort your problem out i.e bottom end torq-Go have a luck in "tech torq" or "Diesel bit"

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    Hi Jason

    Been out playing today. Getting better @ the 6 box. It is diesel driving Jim, but not as we know it. LoL

    I know know why it does not seem like 180BHP. It weighs in a best part of 2 tons! according to the book.

    I am liking it a bit more, but still not sure if it is a keeper.

    Biggles

  13. #12
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    Hi Biggles

    I'm sure you will get used to it and your right about the 2 ton that needs shifting around!!!!
    Also make sure the turbo's wastegate is really free - they are prone to sticking and if they dont fully close it will be gutless at low revs. The engine ecu must have 100% control of the wastegate for the engine to perform properly

    Jason

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    change the MAF, they are noarmally dead under 1500 rpm but on full song at 2200rpm
    Formally a4 2.5 tdi (b5)
    Now Seat Ibiza tdi 130

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    jason, where is the crankcase breather?, considering i have half my engine in bits at the moment anyway i might well change it.
    Formally a4 2.5 tdi (b5)
    Now Seat Ibiza tdi 130

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    Ok Jason

    Just so I am clear. The Maf sensor is held in with 2 splined screws which have a dot in the middle?

    I also would like to know where the breather is so I can check it out.

    Still trying hard to drive it like a petrol. Can't get diesel stylie out of my blood :-(

    One other thing, and don't laugh, is this engine intercooled?

    Biggles.

  17. #16
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    [QUOTE=kris_tdi]jason, where is the crankcase breather?, considering i have half my engine in bits at the moment anyway i might well change it.[/QUOTE)

    Crank case breather filter is behind the oil filter

  18. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Biggles
    Ok Jason

    Just so I am clear. The Maf sensor is held in with 2 splined screws which have a dot in the middle?

    I also would like to know where the breather is so I can check it out.

    Still trying hard to drive it like a petrol. Can't get diesel stylie out of my blood :-(

    One other thing, and don't laugh, is this engine intercooled?

    Biggles.
    Hi Biggles

    Yep you have found the MAF! that's the baby with the funny screws!!

    Crank case breather is behind the oil filter,Oil filter is under your black cover at the front,black plastic jobby with large nut.

    Crank case breather is a bit of a ***** to get to,you usualy have to take the injector pipes off for access.

    Yes it's intercooled!

    Enjoy!

    Jason

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    hello biggles, I used to work in a tyre fitting bay and I noticed we got a lot of allroads in for new tyres, that had worn the edges off the tyres very quickly and left the rest one quarter warn.
    Basicly what was going on was the camber and tracking on them was being thrown out by varying degrees of offroading and not regularly re-adjusted, and so was munching tyres. Even if you never go offroad it doesnt mean the previous owner(if there was one) didnt. And so get your fourwheel alignment checked and adjusted as required on a regular basis, itll save you money on fuel and tyres in the long run.
    Alec

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    cheers jason, will have a look at mine 2moro.
    Formally a4 2.5 tdi (b5)
    Now Seat Ibiza tdi 130

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    Hi Jason

    I will look at it next week and report back.

    Thanks for the tyre tip audialec. I will keep an eye on it. I doubt the previous owner ever did. He LOVED it, I am sure he would have even avoided cobbled roads LOL

    Biggles

  22. #21
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    I have been posting about my 180hp TDi in various places, search for fjtwelve and you should find them. If yours is flat below 2200 you have a problem, mine is going away like stink by then, 1.75tonnes or no. Its slow below 1400 and the chip did improve things. Try all the standard checks before you chip ie air filter, split hoses, MAF, EGR, get a Vagcom check, 4 wheel alignment. All relatively cheap and could make the difference
    2001 A6 Avant 2.5TDi quattro Sport 180hp+TurboDynamics MD438 hybrid+Bosio Race683s+3" exhaust+Celtic Tuning remap - now with adamss24 replaced with runabout
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    2004 A4 Avant 1.9TDi quattro Sport 130hp + Superchip - sold & replaced by
    2005 Audi TT 1.8T
    1988 Yamaha FJ1200 120hp finally traded after 23 years for
    1986 Yamaha FJ100 (1300 barrels shhh!) with too many bits to mention
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  23. #22
    marmite's Avatar
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    I sold my Allroad and really miss it


    Mine was Auto so the delay was even worse on take off , but with a little driving style change it was ok,
    Brakes really need a upgrade though, sometimes I found stopping you just needed alot of hope!!

    Tyre wear, get the tracking done anyway, got nothing to loose at least you know it is ok

    I drove a remapped one for a while just to see if I liked it, at I loved it 209bhp it was and increased torque, but still a delay!
    No idea who did it though, never asked at the time.

    You got a really great car there, great off road too, I used mine a few times in France in snow, mud and it was great, no snow chains needed.

    Depending on the year of vehicle unplug the MAF and it will go to a back up value and see how it revs up then, if it changes then you got a MAF fault, doing this may bring the engine warning light on though, so will need a Vag-com reset!

    Enjoy
    Audi RS6 Daytona GreyLoving all 455.7BHP of her

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    Thanks for the continued posts in this thread. I am learning a lot.

    I noticed yesterday morning (did not have the radio on) and it was quite cold the valve in the turbo closing at exactly 2200rpm. It had a definite sound, but I can't describe it, it was a bit like a vacuum cleaner picking up a ping pong ball.

    As it warmed up after 5 minutes the sound went.

    I am definitely going to clean the Maf sensor. Will that require a system reset?

    OH and what is VAGCOM.

    Biggles

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    Hi

    OK have cleaned the Maf sensor. No difference I can see or feel :-( I also made sure the breather was clear, and the air filter was clear.

    I did run the engine without the Maf in the hole, but still connected. Result was barley able to struggle to 3000 rpm. The Sensor had been of b4, and not with the correct tool!

    Reading through this forum more, seems to be an inherent problem.

    If I go to my local Audi (not stealership) what can they do with a diagnostic test, and how much is likely to cost.

    Biggles

  26. #25
    Jason's Avatar
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    Dealer can tell you a lot of things (maybe too much) and it wont cost you the earth 20/30.

    Your supposed to try with the Maf disconected not out, dangling about,not kin suprised it would'nt rev!!

    Your Maf measures air flow to the engine and your ECU in return add's the correct amount of fuel-No air,No fuel!!!

    Let us know how you get on.

    Jason

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    Hi

    The reason I did it that way was because I read somewhere else on this forum that running with it disconnected might require a dealer reset.

    I take it that is bunk?

    Biggles

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    Hello

    OK disconnected the Maf today. Lots of warning lights.

    Results. Slightly better below 2200, but not that you would notice unless I knew there was something to look for. Over 2200, the same dismal performance as there is with it connected under 2200. Almost as if the turbo did not cut in.

    Reconnected it, all warning lights went out.

    Biggles

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    Smile

    R-E-S-U-L-T

    I did a bit more reading about cleaning a Maf sensor. It was in my mind that perhaps with all the comments on the subject that I may not have done the job properly.

    Here is what I did. I got a can of Servisol IPA. Gave the 3 small electronic components a dam good seeing to with the tube nozzle attached. Put the unit back in. Way Hey. I like my Allroad now.

    It now pulls well from about 1500rpm in first and second (this is where my main issue with it was). I always hit second gear with no power on demand unless I gunning it through. Nothing much different to report about 3rd this always seemed OK in town speed traffic and when gunning it, but the real difference is in 4th. It now pulls adequately from 1200rpm to 1500rpm, from then onwards brisk to 2200 then off it goes. I even noticed I was in 5th at town speeds. Not done that before.

    So thanks to everyone for the help in this thread.

    Biggles
    Last edited by Biggles; 25th November 2006 at 19:08.

  30. #29
    Jason's Avatar
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    Sorted eh!

    I do like a Happy ending.

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    Yep.. Decided I will keep it. Even committed to loading the CD player tonight. Until 2 night I could not see the point. For me that is a big commitment LOL
    Looks like a keeper now.

    Thanks Jason.

    BTW do you have any canals / rivers near you that do boat hire? I have a UK based narrowboat, and would like to explore France a bit before either buying one over there or bringing ours over. PM a reply.

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    Oh dear the problem is back.

    It was fine for a day of two, then went back to its old ways.

    I took it to the local Audi Specialists. The chap there took it for a run, disconnected and fiddled a bit, but could not find it. So it is now booked in for a diag on Friday.

    More worrying is the sound of the transmission. Having driven 4x4 before the noise and rumble on slow speed high lock. I just put this down to normal 4x4 wind up. The chap assured me it was not normal, but was not certain of the cause.

    Anyone got any info on the latter problem?

    Biggles

  33. #32
    Jason's Avatar
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    Biggles
    Dunt sound up to much your chap!

    If you sorted your problem by cleaning the MAF looks like that's your problem,clean it again,get into the orifices with pipe cleaners or buy another well worth 70 if it solves your problem,I got a new one for the wifes Beetle and the differance was mental (even she noticed) some swear by special electrical grease on the conection plug.

    As for your 4x4 I think sombody else also mentioned that the all-road was prone to tracking out which could cause your problem.

    Jason
    Last edited by Jason; 5th December 2006 at 07:04.

 

 

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