RS4 Avant Outlaw II

[Siena]

Another RS4 Outlaw II, this time in Avant guise:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/2005-AUDI-A4-...39:1|66:2|65:12|240:1308&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14

 

[ALPINE]

it bores me that its all black!

 

[Caesium]

Could have got a decent sized set of stoppers on it, they look like fiesta brakes behind them alloys.

 

[jcb]

its a diesel ***!

 

[Siena]

Yes, diesel. A chipped 2,7 TDI will pull away from the RS4 4,2L V8 non-turbo, the 3,0 versions are even more impressive.

 

[ALPINE]

you gonna buy it siena... i take it your considdering it as you must of looked into chipping it! ??

 

[Siena]

Alas for that money, no. Thing is, I'm not into buying modified cars, prefer to build my own.

Besides, he want's over £21,000, a lot of money to spend.

 

[ALPINE]

yeh i bought 1 already modded car once and was bored. changed the wheels and that was it!!

 

[NHN]

Yes, diesel. A chipped 2,7 TDI will pull away from the RS4 4,2L V8 non-turbo, the 3,0 versions are even more impressive.

I'd agree with that tbh as the 4.2 v8's to me are a little boring, my s4 4.2 was a stunning car & drove beautifully but it didnt have the power you'd expect, 365bhp didnt really put it down on the road & it was all functioning right, its a heavy load man for sure which makes it slow, Wesley's new S3 with map ****** on an older RS6 517bhp earlier today 4 times, lol, so says alot huh, same engine isnt it Siena??

If is then the 4.2's do seem rather lacking huh fella???

 

[ChriS3]

Not a great conversion. Even the basics are wrong - he got the rear badge on in the wrong place...

I'd agree with that tbh as the 4.2 v8's to me are a little boring, my s4 4.2 was a stunning car & drove beautifully but it didnt have the power you'd expect

The S4 and RS4 are different beasts with very different engines, not really comparible. As for a soot chucker, sure it's quicker....

 

[Dan Yeates]

Am I the only one who thinks the advert is just a sly advert for the bodyshop, the car isn't really for sale, it's just some shameful advertising?

The photos with the bodyshop in the background, the awful Porsche thing, the fact he says he's going to get a Porsche Cayenne to give to them and the fact the advert says absolutely nothing about the car, in terms of interior, spec, MOt, tax etc...

 

[aragorn]

i cant really see how a chipped TDI making perhaps 250hp could even come close to pulling away from a 420hp 4.2L V8, numbers simply dont make any sense.

Perhaps over a very small band, in a fixed gear once rolling it might pull away a tiny amount due to its huge wodge of torque, but any proper "race" with the drivers actually driving the cars properly instead of just sinking the boot in 6th gear at 70 the car with 420hp WILL be faster, a LOT faster.

 

[Caesium]

you have answered your own question, how can you compare two cars with totally different power outputs? the diesel will have more torque so it will pull away quicker but the petrol has more horsepower so it will gain more speed.

If you had a 420bhp diesel up against a 420bhp petrol, then the diesel would leave the petrol for dust, because the 420bhp diesel would most likely have about 1000nm of torque.

As for the comment saying its a diesel why does it need bigger brakes, the diesel engine is heavy and the heavier something is the more difficult it is to stop due to inertial force. A 3.0tdi is still capable of 150mph.

 

[NHN]

depends on the map, lol, but the rs4 isnt turbo charged, its the same 4.2 v8 as my s4 had, wasnt that fast tbh & that was way above the tdi with a generic map interms of on paper, fact is the v8 is a huge lump & it seems to weigh the car down to much IMHO which inturn doesnt give it the power you'd expect

eg. wesley has the s3 8p, he's had it remapped so its running from 300-330bhp on a 2.0 T, his mates got a 517bhp rs6, he thrashed the rs6 on every run, much lighter car is what I see makes difference & on paper the HP difference is nearly 200 so power numbers dont neccessarily mean quicker car, number of other differences seem to be big factor aswell, I mean I had the s3 8L tuned to 265 & the s4 b6 on 365, s3 I think was quicker & I had a S3 & a TT pull away from my s4

 

[NHN]

A 3.0tdi is still capable of 150mph.

That engine is a superb lump IMHO & its what I was gonna buy & still would TBH, 4wd & loads of power & tuning possibilities, still get reasonable MPG aswell, if it was tuned properly then it would have some fun with the RS4 I believe.

 

[Caesium]

My mate has a 3.0tdi A6 and I have the 3.0d 5 Series, his is only just behind mine....

Still very very quick

 

[aragorn]

the V8 is alloy, the derv is cast iron for a start, so the derv will be heavier imo

people get blinded by the torque figures but it doesnt actually mean anything. Yes torque makes the car accellerate, but you need to apply that torque over time. The result of torque applied over time is power. (power is torque x rpm) If you make 1million torques at 1000rpm and 20 torques from 1500rpm to the redline it suddenly doesnt go very fast.

Even if both engines had 420hp, the diesel has a VERY narrow power band, and the petrol has a very wide power band. this means the diesel usually has longer gearing which further dilutes its huge torque advantage and because it only makes peak torque for a very short time its worse off again, the petrols torque curve will be a plateau probably starting around 2k and continuing for many thousand rpm's

Dont get me wrong modern dervs are capable cars. But regardless of the torque figure, even a 300hp derv isnt going to come close to a 420hp V8 in a proper race. Maybe on a motorway, with **** drivers, it might have an edge, but if you drove it properly, the derv would be gone.

 

[Siena]

Guys, relax.

I said a mapped 2,7 / 3,0 TDI would pull away from the naturally aspirated RS4 V8, I never said in what gear, neither did I say it was a drag race.

Despite the RS4's larger capacity, it has a high redline for a V8, and is peakier than the older V8 motors. I've had the pleasure of running one, and I've also had the pleasure of running a A6 2,7 TDI Avant auto.

This car was mapped, and despite the Avant weight and power-sapping auto, I was shocked at how much shove it had. I'm no stranger to fast petrol cars, but believe me, the current VAG V6 TDI's are ****** quick, even in stock form.

I can only imagine the 3,0 version will be quicker. Sure, the RS4 will be quicker off the line, but in terms of sheer midrange grunt, a mapped 2,7 / 3,0 TDI will have the edge.

I remember a tussle I had back in 2005, in an RS4 B7. A BMW loomed up in my rearview mirror, and I stupidly slowed to allow it to get within range. I assumed the 5 series was an M5, it caught up so quickly.

My foot was mashed into the floorboards, but this car went past me in a black cloud - it was a 535D, I could only watch as the gap gradually widened, till it was gone. Never saw it again after that!

 

[NHN]

thats what I'm also saying naturally aspirated doesnt really float my boat, my S4 was a nice car but to me 365bhp non turbo was nowhere near as impressive as the on paper power figures, lol, I would have thought they would of stuck a turbo or 2 in the RS4 tbh.

My S3 was quicker than my S4, lol, worrying huh.

 

[aragorn]

Something i notice with my brothers S4 is that because its so torquey you often dont downshift as far as you need to extract maximum power. By that i mean if your doing 45 in 5th and decide to overtake something, you can drop to 3rd and overtake effortlessly and quickly. However if you want maximum power the car really should be in 2nd.

If you get too used to driving it like that however, when you really DO want/need the full power available, you probably wont actually shift into 2nd as your so used to using 3rd and its performance is sub par, and you get passed by a car which is on paper a slower car.

I'd imagine the same thing would happen with any large engined powerful saloon though. It also feels so much smoother than a smaller hatch that you feel the power less, a few times i've heard craig say "hmm this doesnt feel fast" before looking at the speedo and saying "oh."

 

[docurley]

I know that Porsche GT replica on a Boxer

 

[NHN]

Yeah I can see your points & seems sense, admittedly the S4 was a lovely car & I would have kept if it wasnt for the mpg & having the S3 aswell, now both gone, but yeah you can easily lose track of your speed in that car, but still I used to downshift to get the grunt but lacked IMHO, but fair points made I have to agree for someone that doesnt know there car that well.

 

[ALPINE]

i like the purple van! lmao!

 

[dieselfitter251]

...you know you're all going to end up with diesels anyway

....228900 miles by the way. Expect 230k by mid november!

 

[NHN]

I'll be honest out of the petrol cars I've had & the derv I have now, its probably the best one I've had to date, I do miss 4wd tbh but thats about it, so yeah I might stick with derv, but depends on when I test drive the S3 sportback auto really, but if its economy I want then think it'll be derv or hybrid with maybe a petrol for weekend if I can afford it, lol, which with economy I doubt it

 

[dieselfitter251]

tdi quattro.... definately a different beastie. I had an 08 2.0tdi A4 avant S-line a wee bit back and it just wasn't the same as my old b5 tdi quattro (well it was clean and minus a ton of dug hair). Sure the '08 was smooth and had plenty of legs but compared to a quattro the way the power gets to the tarmac doesn't compare. Only downside is maybe tiny bit less mpg on quattros though I still manage 50mpg without to much trouble.

 

[jcb]

screw power of a N/A vs Diesel.
I wouldn;t spend money tarting a derv up because they sound pants (unless they are V12's doing 200mph down the Mulsanne straight)!

give me a petrol engined noise over a deisel any day turbo or not!

 

[dieselfitter251]

I agree, but...
You'll be listening to me as I pass you at the petrol station ;O)

Love those V8's though!