Volks AutosChris Nott
Results 1 to 31 of 31
  1. #1
    LeeT's Avatar
    2nd Gear

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Hampshire
    Posts
    427

    Most BHP on a B5 1.8T, want a new project

    Alright guys, i currently own a B6 1.8TQS which will be getting remapped on friday and a C5 A6 4.2 Quattro. Ive only recently bought the B6 and now have an urge for a turbo project. My plan is to buy a B5 aswell but... how much bhp can i expect to get out of a 1.8t b5. Do most opt to tune the quattro version? I have had some very quick cars in the past including maserati 3200gt, mk4 supra single turbo 700hp+, 380hp evo8, 370hp evo6, impreza wrx 320hp, 300zx 400hp, 200sx s13 300hp, B6 S4, C5 S6, etc etc.
    I built all of the above cars myself and just have an urge to tune a turbo car again after driving the b6 recently. I have heard of big bhp out of the 1.8t so what is the best engine/year to go for, for ease of remapping? Best turbo etc for say 400bhp? possibly a bit lower but i feel like a challenge. ORRRRR, do i just go for the S4 and go from there? I like the idea of the 1.8 T because of its cheap initial outlay if im being honest but would consider the s4.
    thanks ..lee

  2. # ADS
    ADS
    Join Date
    Always
    Location
    Global
    Posts
    Many
     
  3. #2
    TDIPOWARRR

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    618
    This thread might be helpfull to you, can't remember off top of my head but sure he got it running 420ish bhp with more to come.

    2008cc 20 Valve Turbo Stroker Build

  4. #3
    LeeT's Avatar
    2nd Gear

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Hampshire
    Posts
    427
    Quote Originally Posted by Jacktdi View Post
    This thread might be helpfull to you, can't remember off top of my head but sure he got it running 420ish bhp with more to come.

    2008cc 20 Valve Turbo Stroker Build
    thanks, will have a read

  5. #4
    2000 a4 1.8tqs-yellow

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    perth
    Posts
    1,197
    I would just get an s4 and stick on the k04 turbos from the rs4 with a few other things and a map to get something like 450bhp. It would cost a lot to get the 1.8t to that and wont be nearly as driveable for a road car.

  6. #5
    LeeT's Avatar
    2nd Gear

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Hampshire
    Posts
    427
    Quote Originally Posted by ian52 View Post
    I would just get an s4 and stick on the k04 turbos from the rs4 with a few other things and a map to get something like 450bhp. It would cost a lot to get the 1.8t to that and wont be nearly as driveable for a road car.
    thanks for the reply Ian, i was just looking at a budget outlay i suppose. Any pics of your car in yellow?

  7. #6
    IN 2 Deep's Avatar
    Hoonigan

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Lancashire, UK
    Posts
    379
    Quote Originally Posted by ian52 View Post
    I would just get an s4 and stick on the k04 turbos from the rs4 with a few other things and a map to get something like 450bhp. It would cost a lot to get the 1.8t to that and wont be nearly as driveable for a road car.
    I disagree on the driveability of a big turbo 1.8T on the road, mines as easy to drive as it was when stock, just a much sharper response from the go pedal. S4's are damned good if you can tolerate working on it, just a shame its engine out to do anything on the turbo's and quite a few other ancillaries. LeeT you should google some of the B5/B6 VR6 builds, these are making some serious numbers and you can run a mahoosive single turbo set up which you'll struggle to acheive using the 2.7TT, an R36 motor with a big single and the quattro driveline would be a mega road car, but no doubt will cost a packet though. Check this out for a taster

    Big Boost's B5 S4 VR6 (BAT style) :: motorgeek.com

    Oh and the max output I've seen from a 1.8T based build is 750 AWHP.
    Last edited by IN 2 Deep; 22nd May 2011 at 20:11.
    2000 Audi A4 B5 Quattro Sport - My build thread - Click
    2004 Volvo S60 D5 - Daily smoker & race car tow truck
    1993 Audi S2 ABY - Dead & buried
    1990 Audi Coupe 2.2E - Dead & buried

  8. #7
    LeeT's Avatar
    2nd Gear

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Hampshire
    Posts
    427
    Quote Originally Posted by IN 2 Deep View Post
    I disagree on the driveability of a big turbo 1.8T on the road, mines as easy to drive as it was when stock, just a much sharper response from the go pedal. S4's are damned good if you can tolerate working on it, just a shame its engine out to do anything on the turbo's and quite a few other ancillaries. LeeT you should google some of the B5/B6 VR6 builds, these are making some serious numbers and you can run a mahoosive single turbo set up which you'll struggle to acheive using the 2.7TT, an R36 motor with a big single and the quattro driveline would be a mega road car, but no doubt will cost a packet though. Check this out for a taster

    Big Boost's B5 S4 VR6 (BAT style) :: motorgeek.com

    Oh and the max output I've seen from a 1.8T based build is 750 AWHP.
    thanks for the reply. i have just read your whole build thread and i must say it is a bit of an inspiration. I'll check out the link you posted too. So is there any point in tuning a FWD or should the focus be on the quattro?

  9. #8
    IN 2 Deep's Avatar
    Hoonigan

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Lancashire, UK
    Posts
    379
    No worries, I'm glad you enjoyed reading about my build, the build thread i posted earlier for VRT build is in another league to mine although im quite sure the price tag will be as well. These 20 valvers are a very good motor and can make heaps of power. That said I really do think you would be wasting your time trying to put down any serious power through a FWD set up, the quattro is what you want for those neck snapping launches, wheel spin will just get annoying as i think i might still be spinning in fourth! Don't think the 4wd will get boring, mine 4 wheel drifts out of roundabouts with ease when the mood takes me. My 427hp was enough to absolutely annihilate a Range Rover Overfinch and crept away from a carrera 4 so aint slow.
    2000 Audi A4 B5 Quattro Sport - My build thread - Click
    2004 Volvo S60 D5 - Daily smoker & race car tow truck
    1993 Audi S2 ABY - Dead & buried
    1990 Audi Coupe 2.2E - Dead & buried

  10. #9
    2000 a4 1.8tqs-yellow

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    perth
    Posts
    1,197
    Quattro all the way. No point trying to put decent power through the front wheels when you have a 4x4 option. Pic of mine

  11. #10
    jcb
    6th Gear

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    uk
    Posts
    4,077
    like any mad turbo project your gearing is going to be the limiting factor.

    If I ever get mine built I am aiming for 400 tops but more like 3-350 daily.

    there are some mad GT35/40'd 1.8t's in the US running 5-600.
    even with quattro you are changing gears so quickly they are useless ratios in stock form.

    a diesel box or custom gearing is the way forward.

    I once drove an EVO 6 with mad power and it was undriveable as the first 3 gears were gone in a flash, 1st and 2nd were spin fests

  12. #11
    Neutral

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Melb, Aust
    Posts
    48
    Its not that cheep to build a high hp 1.8t. Rods, clutch, turbo, mani, tune, exhaust, intercooler etc.
    I'd go s4 too.
    96 A4 1.8TQ
    K03-073, 1 BAR CHIP, PORT N POLISH HEAD, SUPERTECH VALVES, JE PISTONS, SCAT RODS, FIDANZA FW, SOUTHBEND STG3, CUSTOM AIR BOX, 034 HIFLOW MANIFOLD, 034 PHENOLIC SPACER & FIBER GLASS INSULATED INLET MANIFOLD.
    'TO COME'
    2.5 IN EXHAUST, BILSTEIN H&R.

  13. #12
    jcb
    6th Gear

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    uk
    Posts
    4,077
    not a cheaper option IMO.
    not unless you have your own garage and like pulling engines every time you change a turbo, downpipe etc etc

    they are more expensive to buy to begin with, at least a couple of grand more, that buys you a lot of engine.
    its a simple maths thing 6 of every engine component and double the number of turbos to buy or four and one.

    main reason I went 1.8t
    Dont get me wrong I love the V6 noise and power delivery

  14. #13
    "Stick a V8 in it!"

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Glenrothes, Fife, Scotland
    Posts
    15,383
    Quote Originally Posted by bmarshall View Post
    Its not that cheep to build a high hp 1.8t. Rods, clutch, turbo, mani, tune, exhaust, intercooler etc.
    I'd go s4 too.
    While an S4 might not need rods until quite a bit more power, its still going to need a clutch, two turbos, tune, exhaust and intercooler if you want to take it much above 300hp.

    The cost of the second turbo and the fact you need to pull the engine to fit them, more or less equals the cost of fitting some rods to a 1.8t.

    So the 1.8T is certainly the cheaper option, and its also much more sensible an engine to work on, spare parts are cheaper and more readily available as the engines fitted to millions of cars.

    There does come a point where a big power 1.8T is going to start losing out on drivability ofcourse. I'd imagine a 600hp S4 will be a much nicer drive than a 600hp 1.8T for instance. Personally i suspect 400hp is about the limit i'd want to take one to.

    2000 A4 1.8T Sport Quattro Avant, Berry Pearl
    2000 A4 1.8T Sport Quattro Saloon, Black-ish
    1997 S4 - PPC £999 Challenge Track Car Build
    TD5 Land Rover Defender build


  15. #14
    IN 2 Deep's Avatar
    Hoonigan

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Lancashire, UK
    Posts
    379
    Quote Originally Posted by aragorn View Post
    Personally i suspect 400hp is about the limit i'd want to take one to.
    Can't quite understand whats brought you to that opinion Kev, based on what? I have to say I wouldn't think another 200 horsepower would all of a sudden make my car any harder to drive on the road, surely its all in the mapping. The OP clearly has experience of driving high HP boosted cars so im sure he aint gonna struggle with a 500-600HP 1.8T. The only thing that makes it hard to drive is the weight of the clutch pedal but dont think it makes it hard to drive as such.
    2000 Audi A4 B5 Quattro Sport - My build thread - Click
    2004 Volvo S60 D5 - Daily smoker & race car tow truck
    1993 Audi S2 ABY - Dead & buried
    1990 Audi Coupe 2.2E - Dead & buried

  16. #15
    Broken Byzan's Avatar
    Photographic Moderator

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Cardiff, United Kingdom
    Posts
    12,522

    My Social Networking

    Follow Broken Byzan On Twitter Add Broken Byzan on Facebook Add Broken Byzan on Google+ Visit Broken Byzan's Youtube Channel
    I can't wait to see in 2 deeps car at gti Inters, NOM, going down the strip?

  17. #16
    IN 2 Deep's Avatar
    Hoonigan

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Lancashire, UK
    Posts
    379
    lol. Im not intending to go down the strip in fear of breaking something! But there is still time for me to change my mind, i would like to see what i can do but can't be arsed trying to get it back to Lancashire if it breaks, what to do, what to do. Might be a good oppotunity to test out the anti lag/ launch control hmmmmmm.
    2000 Audi A4 B5 Quattro Sport - My build thread - Click
    2004 Volvo S60 D5 - Daily smoker & race car tow truck
    1993 Audi S2 ABY - Dead & buried
    1990 Audi Coupe 2.2E - Dead & buried

  18. #17
    "Stick a V8 in it!"

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Glenrothes, Fife, Scotland
    Posts
    15,383
    I just meant more that it stops becoming road friendly. A 600hp turbo on a 1.8 or 2.0 motor isnt going to spool up until your pushing on for 5k rpm, will typically have reduced compression ratio to handle the power and as such be a bit limp off boost, in general becomes a bit "all or nothing".

    I'm not suggesting it will be HARD to drive, just that it wont be as nice as a 600hp motor with 50% more capacity, such as a VR6 or 2.7TT motor.

    Maybe its not as bad as i envisage.

    2000 A4 1.8T Sport Quattro Avant, Berry Pearl
    2000 A4 1.8T Sport Quattro Saloon, Black-ish
    1997 S4 - PPC £999 Challenge Track Car Build
    TD5 Land Rover Defender build


  19. #18
    Broken Byzan's Avatar
    Photographic Moderator

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Cardiff, United Kingdom
    Posts
    12,522

    My Social Networking

    Follow Broken Byzan On Twitter Add Broken Byzan on Facebook Add Broken Byzan on Google+ Visit Broken Byzan's Youtube Channel
    Quote Originally Posted by IN 2 Deep View Post
    lol. Im not intending to go down the strip in fear of breaking something! But there is still time for me to change my mind, i would like to see what i can do but can't be arsed trying to get it back to Lancashire if it breaks, what to do, what to do. Might be a good oppotunity to test out the anti lag/ launch control hmmmmmm.
    BOOOO i was hoping for some HD video of it launching,LOL

    Will have to be placated with stills,lol

  20. #19
    IN 2 Deep's Avatar
    Hoonigan

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Lancashire, UK
    Posts
    379
    Quote Originally Posted by aragorn View Post
    I just meant more that it stops becoming road friendly. A 600hp turbo on a 1.8 or 2.0 motor isnt going to spool up until your pushing on for 5k rpm, will typically have reduced compression ratio to handle the power and as such be a bit limp off boost, in general becomes a bit "all or nothing".

    I'm not suggesting it will be HARD to drive, just that it wont be as nice as a 600hp motor with 50% more capacity, such as a VR6 or 2.7TT motor.

    Maybe its not as bad as i envisage.
    Well i guess in a way your right but any motor with a relatively large turbo will be a bit "all or nothing", its uncompareable to k03/04 turbos that instantly spool, but surely as turbo enthusiasts this goes without saying. And as you've said the larger the turbo the bigger the lag, its always a trade off when building small displacement high horsepower engines but I don't think it ever makes them hard to drive, maybe less fun. I personally wouldnt think anything larger than GT3076R would be much cop for the road, although im still waiting to see dyno plots of a new Borg Warner EFR turbos on a 1.8T. Spool of a GT2860 and airflow of a GT35 ive heard said, now that sounds very interesting.
    2000 Audi A4 B5 Quattro Sport - My build thread - Click
    2004 Volvo S60 D5 - Daily smoker & race car tow truck
    1993 Audi S2 ABY - Dead & buried
    1990 Audi Coupe 2.2E - Dead & buried

  21. #20
    2000 a4 1.8tqs-yellow

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    perth
    Posts
    1,197
    I have been in a 530 bhp s4 and its spooled to 1.6 bar probably only 1 or 2 hundred rpm later than my car reaches 1 bar on a k03. With a high power 1.8t you would be needing to work it hard to make it go but with the s4 you could drive it normally and have the power available much earlier. Just depends how much power you want and what you want to spend.

  22. #21
    jamie226bhp's Avatar
    2nd Gear

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    464
    Anti lag

  23. #22
    IN 2 Deep's Avatar
    Hoonigan

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Lancashire, UK
    Posts
    379
    nitrous!
    2000 Audi A4 B5 Quattro Sport - My build thread - Click
    2004 Volvo S60 D5 - Daily smoker & race car tow truck
    1993 Audi S2 ABY - Dead & buried
    1990 Audi Coupe 2.2E - Dead & buried

  24. #23
    IN 2 Deep's Avatar
    Hoonigan

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Lancashire, UK
    Posts
    379
    Quote Originally Posted by ian52 View Post
    I have been in a 530 bhp s4 and its spooled to 1.6 bar probably only 1 or 2 hundred rpm later than my car reaches 1 bar on a k03. With a high power 1.8t you would be needing to work it hard to make it go but with the s4 you could drive it normally and have the power available much earlier. Just depends how much power you want and what you want to spend.
    The problem is you can't make loads of power a k03/4 turbo on the 1.8T like you can with a pair on the 2.7TT. My car spools at about 3700-3800 at 2 bar of boost, you dont have to work it hard, once its spooled its off weather your ready or not lol. And as JCB said earlier it rips through the gears so damned fast its manic. But tuning cars is always a trade off, you can't really have it all. The S4 on paper looks like the way forward and it may be, im just not convinced.

    Oh and i found another 2.0 20V motor in the states that just made 1015WHP!!!!!

    VWVortex.com - Congrats to Ed@FFE Racing for making 1000+whp!!
    2000 Audi A4 B5 Quattro Sport - My build thread - Click
    2004 Volvo S60 D5 - Daily smoker & race car tow truck
    1993 Audi S2 ABY - Dead & buried
    1990 Audi Coupe 2.2E - Dead & buried

  25. #24
    jamie226bhp's Avatar
    2nd Gear

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    464
    Nitros is a good way of getting power until the boost comes in or there's been a few supercharger and turbo setups

  26. #25
    IN 2 Deep's Avatar
    Hoonigan

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Lancashire, UK
    Posts
    379
    Nitrous is the best way to eliminate turbo lag all together apparently, it makes masses of exhaust gases to spool the turbo, cools the inlet charge massively and raises the detonation limit, win win win lol. Plus the fact it obviously gives you more power, win.
    2000 Audi A4 B5 Quattro Sport - My build thread - Click
    2004 Volvo S60 D5 - Daily smoker & race car tow truck
    1993 Audi S2 ABY - Dead & buried
    1990 Audi Coupe 2.2E - Dead & buried

  27. #26
    2000 a4 1.8tqs-yellow

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    perth
    Posts
    1,197
    I just wish you could slap a k04 from an s3 on for a decent easy upgrade without spending too much. I think 300/350 bhp would be a nice ammount that should be reliable still.

  28. #27
    jamie226bhp's Avatar
    2nd Gear

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    464
    I'd be happy with 270 as no need to uprate the internals

  29. #28
    IN 2 Deep's Avatar
    Hoonigan

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Lancashire, UK
    Posts
    379
    But a decent set of rods really don't set you back much in the grand scheme of things, just a bit of work to get them in but not difficult really.
    2000 Audi A4 B5 Quattro Sport - My build thread - Click
    2004 Volvo S60 D5 - Daily smoker & race car tow truck
    1993 Audi S2 ABY - Dead & buried
    1990 Audi Coupe 2.2E - Dead & buried

  30. #29
    jamie226bhp's Avatar
    2nd Gear

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    464
    Wasn't the cost of the parts just that it's the wife's daily driver and cant afford to take it if the road for s full engine build as most engine builders are long and just the turbo etc can be done over a weekend and if it did come apart I'd end up going silly as last time I spent 15k doing a corsa

  31. #30
    Neutral

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Melb, Aust
    Posts
    48
    If your after k04 power look at a frankenturbo.
    96 A4 1.8TQ
    K03-073, 1 BAR CHIP, PORT N POLISH HEAD, SUPERTECH VALVES, JE PISTONS, SCAT RODS, FIDANZA FW, SOUTHBEND STG3, CUSTOM AIR BOX, 034 HIFLOW MANIFOLD, 034 PHENOLIC SPACER & FIBER GLASS INSULATED INLET MANIFOLD.
    'TO COME'
    2.5 IN EXHAUST, BILSTEIN H&R.

  32. #31
    jamie226bhp's Avatar
    2nd Gear

    Status
    Offline
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    464
    Think that will be My next one when the scroll gives up

 

 

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO

Garage Plus, Vendor Tools vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.

Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO