Which A4?

[golf]

Hi guys

I'm currently driving a MK4 Golf GTI and I've had enough of its niggly faults, such as plastic window clips breaking, excessive petrol drinking and various knocks/rattles to name a few.

I'm looking at getting an A4 1.8T, but I'm confused as to which one I should go for. I really want one that can be remapped to over 200 bhp so therefore must have a KO3s turbo. Which engine codes have the KO3s or even KO4? I know it wont be blisteringly quick with a rempa but I've driven a bog standard 150bhp and it felt sluggish.

Also which trim level is best? There's Sport, SE and standard, but what do Sport and SE offer over standard models? I know the Sport model has sport seats and wheel, but what about the SE?

I really hate the plasticky bumpers so is it better to get them resprayed or get the S-line kit for example?

Finally, what sort of mpg are people getting during town driving, motorway and a mixture of the two? I'm only 20, and I seem to be forking out at least £60 a week for petrol on my Golf at the moment.

Thanks for any help/advice people may have to offer, and sorry for the long post.

 

[Sinny71]

I know its not what you are looking for but you keep mentioning mpg and for that you'll never beat a TDi. Try driving a 1.9 (with remap if possible) or a 2.5 and see what you think. 1.9's put out about 160-170bhp after a remap but with boatloads of torque.
For info my 2004 A4 Sport has the GmbH (S-line) kit and the Sport sits about 20-25mm lower I think.??

 

[golf]

Thanks for the quick response Sinny. I have to say I'm not entirely convinced by diesels, I just don't like the sound. I've driven a friends Golf TDi with 130bhp and it was nippy enough and had lots of low down grunt, but I just prefer the refinement of a petrol engine, even though it'll nodoubt cost much more in the long run.

 

[Sinny71]

Hey, if we all wanted the same things in life the world would be a dull place. Sadly I know sod all about the petrol engines though...

Someone will surely be able to advise though

 

[gizze]

Are you paying cash or financing the car??

If you are financing the car try and find a later 190bhp s-line 1.8T, becuase of residuals it won't cost you much more if anything each month, and it can be remapped to 230bhp easily.

Regarding the mpg, expect between 22-28 mpg, ok you can reset it on a long trek ad see 30+ but by the end of the tank it will be down to mid twenties again.

 

[golf]

I'm going to be paying cash, as I'm only 20 my budget is around £7500. I just want an A4 with the best tuning potential. Is the 163bhp model better than the 150bhp for tuning?

Also, my Golf sounds like a hairdryer, I assume the same can be said of the A4. What does the standard twin exit exhaust sound like?

 

[Silverfox42badger]

If your insurance /budget allows it, why not look at a 98/99 2.7 S4 - 265Bhp standard, ability to tune to almost double this, and still return 25Mpg. A slightly different league to the 1.8T. I have owned both in my time, but appreciate that insurance for you will be a bit of a mare...!

Just a thought....

 

[pav-g]

I bought a 53 plate 1.8t 190 sport and its spot on in performance, its quick of the mark and fun to drive, playing through the gears the car is responsive and if you feed it rocket fuel (optimax) were talking a totally different kettle of fish. Fuel consumption is acceptable and I usually get 95 miles out of £15.00 (local driving). My brothers got a 2.4 cab and even though the power and drive is refined you dont get the buzz as you do with the turbo. Also bear in mind the 1.8t's come with sports suspension so drive will be rougher but its not too bad. Try getting one with the s-line kit already on that way you can just concentrate on a remap and bigger alloys.

pav-g

 

[Dan Gliballs]

Aye, S4 if you can chap

Better to buy one of these standard that holds their money, rather than start spending on/modding a 1.8T.

 

[Macduff]

excessive petrol drinking

You've got a 1.8T Golf and looking to go to a 1.8T A4. You're only going to see worse MPG as it's a heavier car.

Also which trim level is best? There's Sport, SE and standard, but what do Sport and SE offer over standard models? I know the Sport model has sport seats and wheel, but what about the SE?

Sport model also has lower sports suspension and larger/wider wheels. Sports seats were optional on the SE. SE I think got electric rear windows standard but I could be wrong. Pretty much everything else is an optional extra.

 

[golf]

Thanks for the responses everyone.

I did actually consider an S4 (B5) but this would seem a little unwise for a 20 year old, considering running costs and insurance would be sky high.

I prefer the A4, but if it cannot be remapped to around 200bhp then I'm more likely to go with an 02 plate A3 1.8t as I know these engines are good for tuning.

Is it worth getting a Milltek (or similar) back box for the A4, or are the standard pipes adequate?

 

[gizze]

Insurance on a remapped car is going to whack the price up past a standard S4 surely??

 

[golf]

Insurance on a remapped car is going to whack the price up past a standard S4 surely??

It shouldn't do, my current Golf is a group 14 - which is the same as the A3 1.8T - and the S4 is group 20 I think, which equates to uninsurable for someone aged 20 with only 3 years no claims. At the moment I'm paying a very reasonable £680 TPFT with Churchill.

It's looking more and more likely I will go with the A3, as no one seems to be able to give a definitive answer regarding turbo's on A4's.

 

[rodenal]

Dont sell your golf and buy an A3, there's no point. why dont u buy an anniversary GTI? look the dogs and have the 180 engine. Or a leon cupra, you'll get alot more for your money.

 

[gizze]

All the turbo engined petrol cars will give you around 25-30% gain.

 

[golf]

Dont sell your golf and buy an A3, there's no point. why dont u buy an anniversary GTI? look the dogs and have the 180 engine. Or a leon cupra, you'll get alot more for your money.

I have considered this option, but I would prefer to move away from the Golf scene, my town is being overrun with 1.4 Golf's with big rims and lurid stickers. The Anniversary is nothing more than a glorified GTI, really. It does look very nice but I've been a lifelong Audi fan ever since my dad owned a 1986 Audi 80, and I've got my heart set on an A3 or A4.

All the turbo engined petrol cars will give you around 25-30% gain.

What I'm really interested in is which of the petrol turbo engines come with a KO3s turbo as standard, as I understand the KO3s have larger injectors and can be remapped to around 210bhp easily (on the Golf anyway). I'm getting conflicting views about the tuning issue, ChippedUK have said that the A4 1.8T (150 & 163) can be easily remapped to 205bhp, but others claim that 190 bhp is more realistic. Who am I to believe?

 

[gizze]

The 163 one will map to 200bhp no problem at all and the 190 will map to 225bhp no problem, maybe even higher. Depends on who you use as to how far they push it.

The only one I don't know about is the 150bhp.

 

[golf]

Thanks for that Gizze, it really helped clear up things a little.

I think the 190ps version is slightly too expensive for my budget, so I will probably plump for the 163 or the 150 as some of these have the KO3s turbo and better intercoolers. Does anyone have the engine codes for the A4 B6 range?

Gizze you seem to be knowledgable regarding the A4 1.8T, so is it worth changing the exhaust sytem from the standard twin exit to a Milltek (or similar) sports system? How does the standard one sound?

 

[gizze]

Well worth the swap, I think the standard exhaust on my S4 is crap, I have just ordered a resonated cat back Milltek.

It's not terrible but the Milltek transforms the 1.8T and will make you smile everytime you tap the loud pedal.
they come up used a fair bit so keep an eye out for one when you get the car.

Don't all the 1.8T's come with K03's?

 

[gizze]

Some bedtime reading....


http://www.sun-diagnostics.com/intl/en/pdf/html/full_audi.html

http://www.sun-diagnostics.com/products/scanner/VAG-pdf/VAG5x-VW.pdf

 

[golf]

Don't all the 1.8T's come with K03's?

Do you mean KO3 or KO3s there?

Thanks for the links by the way, very useful. As for the exhaust issue, I think I will definitely get a Milltek as soon as cash flow allows.

 

[A4Andy]

A 190 A4 should do the trick. They run the K03s. Smooth cars, bags of torque with a remap as well.

One thing you should consider is getting the power down. You don't want the ESP light winking at you in third, and that will happen.

Get the Quattro drivetrain. It's worth the initial extra cost, extra insurance group, increased servicing price every 20K and the additional cost of tyres (replacing 4 at a time).

Ovbiously I'm bias, and indeed it is possible to put powerdown through 2 front wheels only, however there still isn't a drive system like Quattro out there; it's ******' awesome.

 

[golf]

A 190PS A4 seems to be a bit too pricey for my budget, and I thought these had the KO4 turbo? I'm so confused about which turbo's were fitted on which engine!

Quattro would be a bonus, as I know all too well about the wheelspinning in 2nd with FWD. I think my best bet would be to go for a 163bhp A4 Quattro Sport, as I want the nicer seats. Do the Sports come with full DIS?

 

[A4Andy]

Get a 1.8T Quattro Sport then. Anything after 2002 should be 163. That's still the K03 turbo if I remember correctly. Remapable to 190-200ish just on a generic map and no other mods.

Full DIS is an option I believe. Things like cruise control, coolbox and arm rest can all be retrofitted as an when cash allows.

Even with the basic DIS I get to know hoe much fuel is left in my tank. Bonus.

 

[A4Andy]

K04s are only on the bigger engines and the S3 and certain TT's I think, although I'm pretty sure that's not completely right.

 

[AndyMac]

You want to run a 1.8T at 210bhp and expect to get better than 20mpg?
I don't think so.

 

[golf]

You want to run a 1.8T at 210bhp and expect to get better than 20mpg?
I don't think so.

Would you care to elaborate Andy?

I'm not expecting great MPG of course, but when you say 20mpg where are you getting this figure from? Have you owned an A4 1.8T? I'm sure mpg is not hugely affected by a remap, so I'm not sure what you're basing this figure on.

At the moment my bog standard Golf is getting around 21 mpg average in town and 15 driven hard, on the motorway if I drive carefully I get around 30 if I'm lucky. This is not normal for a Golf, so I might as well upgrade to a larger more powerful car with these figures I'm getting.

 

[A4Andy]

With 98-99RON fuel and a remap you're MPG will not be significatly affected, if anything it will improve slightly.

A remap to 210 may be possible, however it would drive like crap (probably) and strain the turbo. 210 is doable with additional mods like FMIC, sports cat etc from a 163 power pack.

 

[golf]

Thanks A4Andy.

With the 150bhp Golf engines (AUM) after 2000 210 bhp is very easliy achievable with just a remap. I think I'll take the plunge as I've spoken to a tuning company and they said 210bhp will be realistic with a well run in A4 163bhp. I hope they're right.

 

[gizze]

I agree alot of the 163bhp cars were showing standard figures of nearer 180bhp anyway, so another 30bhp is easily achievable.

 

[bubstar]

You want to run a 1.8T at 210bhp and expect to get better than 20mpg?
I don't think so.

Oh I do Andrew.

I went for a nice brisk cross crountry drive yesterday evening. A and B roads. I was out for just under 2 hours and covered 80 odd miles. DIS was showing 28.7 in my 237BHP 1.8TQ............... In fact with the re-map and Milltek Cat' back I reckon the economy is BETTER than standard in like for like driving. On a motorway run I would expect to see 33-35mpg with speeds ranging from 70-85mph (+ 10% for FWD). Not exactly a 1.9TDi but still pretty good IMO.

FYI golf - The 190ps 1.8t engine code is BEX. It runs a K03 turbo, twin side mount intercoolers and larger injectors. With a good re-map and exhaust you'll be looking at 240bhp and still a nice flat(ish) torque curve with about a 230lbft peak.

All A4 1.8T's use the K03.

Only the 225ps engine (BAM and others) use a K04 but the 225 has a stronger bottom end (crank, block & rods) and runs a lower compression ratio of 9to1 (lower spec 1.8T's are 9.5to1).

Plenty of info' on the 1.8t about.

My only advice would be if you are going to tune the engine, go for Quattro. You will lose approx' 10% economy (3-4mpg) but the drive and grip you gain will more than make up for it.

BUB