Help! Front tyre torn.........again

[nanafagis]

So another tyre has torn on the inside wall. This is the 10th one now in 18months and it's becoming pathetic. £1700 on tyres alone, some that have only done 2k miles!!! I attirbuted it to camber but that's checked and 100% correct.

Whatever s causing it is like a sudden impact because there is absolutely no sign of uneven wear one day, then the next day it's split.

I have also noticed that the tyres seem to go after going down one particular road that has lots of bumps and twisties and speed bumps. 3 tyres have gone now after doing this trip so this suggests there is something along that road that the car doesn't like.

I think it's something to do with hitting a bump or dip whilst turning.

This link shows the bit that I think is catching. It's part of the Steering End Link.

http://media.photobucket.com/image/a4 suspension/darrbar/Car stuff/CIMG1354.jpg

There's only about 1cm clearance between the tyre and part of the steering end link. I'm wondering if turning, and hitting a bump would cause this to happen. Anybody had similar issues? Might put some 10mm spacers on the front to see if it sorts anything.

 

[scott b]

is it only that front corner?

has it always had this fault or since its had 19's

 

[blackpool1974]

Question, what pressure are you putting in the tyres ??

I have 235/35/19 and had the same problem, only 1 set of fronts though. I was told it was because I was running them at 34 psi, this was off an ex F1 tyre mechanic. (whopee doo) he said should be running them at 38 psi. Problem with that is you have no rim protection and the ride is very harsh

That is my 2p worth

 

[nanafagis]

Cheers for the quick replies. I've tried all kinds of pressures to be honest. As high as 40 and as low as 30 - it's always had 19's on since I've owned the car. I get tears to the insides on both fronts. Not just one side. I'll try these on 38 and see how they go. Also the eagle F1's seem ok but the vredestein sessansas seem to have the problem. Maybe they're too soft on the sidewalls.

To be fair this tyre and the one that went last month were both pretty well worn this time - they had a good 15-18k on them.

It's this sudden tear that worries me. Fine one day then gone the next

 

[scott b]

have you had the tracking checked, if its the inner edge of the tread then the tracking could have to much tow out on it, possible bent suspension parts altering the camber to much?

 

[nanafagis]

have you had the tracking checked, if its the inner edge of the tread then the tracking could have to much tow out on it, possible bent suspension parts altering the camber to much?

Yea I had cambrr and toe in/out checked to no avail. Had a 4wd specialist look at it too last October I think it's just a heavy car on rubber band profiles and the amount of miles I do doesn't help.

Problem is there isn't any wear at all on the inner edge, just a split. As though it's had a quick, sharp stab mid-rotation. The wear on the tyres is perfect up until the last 5mm of the inside edge where it looks like it's been knifed for about 6 inches

 

[scott b]

is the car lowered?

 

[nanafagis]

nah, but it's on sport suspension which is 20mm lower.

Just thinking, and been doing some googling cos when I got a new tyre this morning the bloke changing my tyre said "it's just what happens with heavy cars on 19's with low profiles. they all go the same way" Reading around I can only really find bigger heavier cars (Audi's mercs, m3's etc...) on 19"s with this problem. Even then I can only find one or two people having problems with torn inside tyres and nobody seems to have a reason other than the weight of the car makes the tyre distort so there may be some truth in what he said, but probably not as common as he said! Maybe i've just got to put up with it.

These federal tyres i've got on aren't half bad by the way. Some of the reviews I read about them are utter utter cack! But I was skint at the time I put the first set on. After say 5k miles They seem to do the job in rain or sun and only cost £100. So far no splits on any of these so hopefully they're a bit harder wearing than the £170-180 vredesteins. They're definitely far better than the likes of toyo proxes and the dreaded nankangs. My only gripe with them is they don't have a lip protecting the rim so the tyre looks like it hasn't been put on properly, and alloys are easier to kerb. 3 out of my 4 are now federal and once the last F1 is gone I intend on replacing it with another federal.

 

[ageorgiou1984]

Have you checked to make sure that the tyre load index is correct. I had a bulge on one of my tyres and found out that the tyre load index of my tyres was to low for the car. I have since replaced all the tyres with the correct load index and have had no issues.

 

[niftyandy]

Wow, thats uncanny...I've just had the EXACT same issue with mine this weekend - got a 3.0 quattro. My drivers side inside shoulder was torn through to the metal carcass in two gashes each about 8 inches long, ane one of them popped. Luckily I heard if deflating whilst parked! Passenger side inside shoulder also just worn down to nothing but not as far as the carcass. Having both replaced now and getting my front suspension camber/castor/toe-in angles checked. Got 24000 miles out of them though! I had mine at 37.5psi then lowered to 36 to get a bit more foint end grip in damp conditions, perhaps that was a mistake. 40 is too much for me as you feel every ripple of the road...I'll try 38 with the new tyres! Rears are still great with 24k gone, got another 8k I reckon! Must be the heavy high cornering performance of a heavy, grippy car.

 

[nanafagis]

ageorgiou1984 I have absolutely no idea what rating the 2.5tdi needs to be honest! Can anybody tell me? I've looked in my engine bay and my axle loads are 1185 front and 1095 rear. do half each axle load or something?

the tyres currently on are rated 91W XL (Federal) and 91Y extra load (Eagle F1) which, according to the load index give me 615kg per corner..... is that correct?

niftyandy - I put 37psi in mine today and already the car pulls out of junctions a lot smoother, steering is a lot lighter too, but the ride isn't too hard at all. when I had 40psi in it was way too hard. Every tyre place I go to tells me 30psi-32psi, but it doesn't half make hard work of the steering - which can't be good for the tyre wear for a start. Or MPG! 24k miles is pretty impressive for fronts! my rears seem to last ages too.

Are both of you running 19's on your A4's? Quattro's? What engines? (just trying to gauge weight and tyre profiles etc...)
_______
ETA - sorry, just noticed andy's driving a 3.0 quattro

 

[subaru swift]

swap from front to rear & see if it happens again, as one wheel might not be right !.

 

[nanafagis]

Thing is it happens on both fronts and I do swap front to back each time i put new tyres on anyways. I was thinking about regularly rotating front and back to get even wear but figured that by doing so i would end up with 4 half ruined tyres, rather than just the 2 fully knackered front ones.

I'll give it some mileage on 37psi and see how we go. Early signs are promising as it doesn't "Feel" like it's chewing tyres like it does on lower psi

 

[blackpool1974]

Was going to say I have Marshall 235/35/19 and they have reinforced sidewalls, done 28k motorway driving and they are down to about 3mm, I thought they were budget tyres, but I am more than happy with them

I was given the option of 18's or 19's when I bought the car, wish I had gone for 18's the ride is too harsh with the nightmare roads we have at the moment, and with the lack of rim protection kerbs are like magnets !!

 

[niftyandy]

Hi nanafagis

I have a 3.0 quattro sport cabriolet so its a heavy beast anyway....great handler though as the centre of gravity is so much lower than the saloon.
Anyway, when you go up in psi at the fronts you will feel a difference in the handling, especially the steering, which will be a lot lighter but beware wet roundabouts and the like, especially with the 3.0 as its a very heavy front end and prone to quite a lot of understeer at these psi's, in the wet. If its a quattro then it will sort itself out but not before its scared you a bit if you go into a wet corner too fast as it just washes out.

 

[niftyandy]

And dont forget that all these tyre fitting guys just want you to buy tyres more often!
I had the same advise when i got my 19' tyres - "we recommend 30 psi"....yeah right....it just felt like I was running on flats, squirming and sqweeking at every turn. Put in 35-37 as soon as I got home...much better!

 

[nanafagis]

blackpool1974 I know what you mean, i have always gone for the best i can stretch to when I change tyres but at the moment until I know the problem is fully fixed I can't justify the extra £70-80 per corner for a set of Goodyears or vredestein's, hence my choice of the federals which were £100ish and so far i've go nothing but positive feelings about them. When things are back to normal i'll probably go back to something more reputable, but these seem to do the job for now and have out performed the vredesteins by a good 5k miles.

niftyandy, yea I wondered myself about them touting for repeat business but they seem decent enough blokes in the place. They've seen 2 tyres of mine in 3 weeks that have split like that so I would hope they would see the danger in stating lower psi if they were trying to pull a fast one.

I think they are quoting generic guidelines for a 235 35 19 on any car, rather than taking into account the actual kerb weight of individual cars (i hope. otherwise it's just plain dangerous quoting lower psi to get quicker repeat business!) Besides, every tyre place i've been always reccommend low 30's for 19's so they must all have the same guidelines.

As for loss of grip, i generally take junctions, roundabouts and corners like a granny lately as it got to a stage where you could actually feel the tyres skipping and deforming when i had 30psi in. My driving style had to change as I figured that any enthusiastic cornering would see me needing a new set of fronts the next day. If anything they are less grippy on lower psi as you can feel the tyres flexing and scrubbing along. The car just feels more solid now.

Anyway, thanks for the help fellas, i'll keep my eye on things and keep people posted the next time i need new tyres (hopefully it has all just been down to tyre pressure and i won't need to post until mid 2011!)

 

[jdp1962]

If I had lost as many tyres as you have, I think I'd have concluded a long time ago that they were the wrong size for the car.

 

[nanafagis]

i agree, and if any more tyres go i will shop around for some 17's i think. But for it to drive perfectly for 30k miles or more, then all of a sudden start chewing tyres, there's something else not been right. You wouldn't believe the difference it's made to the drive of the car with extra pressure. Also, there's loads of a4's on 19's with no problems at all.

I'll give it a while, keep my eyes on things and i'll know where I stand with it all.