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  1. #41
    RichA3Turbo's Avatar
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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    [ QUOTE ]
    garethj said:
    [ QUOTE ]
    RichA3Turbo said:
    [ QUOTE ]
    Yak said:
    the handling,

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Bad arguement! [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] old a3 handles better! [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/groovy.gif[/img]

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Rich have I missed this discussion? Why exactly does the old A3 handle better than the new one ?

    [/ QUOTE ]

    No, I just started a new one. Im not talking about modified, im talking standard. The old A3 T Sport handles really well for a standard car and also you get A LOT more feeling through the chassis. The new A3 is completely dead! You may aswell be driving a computer game! Theres a route that the salesman at Audi took me on where we tested out the car (was an ex copper who liked to feed a bit of speed to the ride [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]) and would encourage you to drive the car to its limits, so i felt obliged! I could take corners quicker in my A3 than i could in the new A3. This is PROBABLY due to the new one being such a lardass!

    My arguement is valid, and im not the only one who thinks so

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  3. #42
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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    Bye the way, im talking about pre-facelift A3! The facelifted A3 doesnt handle as well as the prefacelift, and is also a fair bit higher (like 20mm!)

    Rich

  4. #43
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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    It's making my head hurt reading this [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif[/img]

    You know, life is all compromises. Even the lovely S3 is a compromise. But then, a 911 might be a compromise (oooh, Carrera GT).

    We take our choices and sometimes get a little mis-led. There was a time when a 2.0 mid size car would have pretty much always been considered quick(ish) at least. Now it's not true.

    Recently I've been thinking of giving up the S3 for financial reasons. Then, well, I thought, why? Just use it a little less and use our other car more. Enjoy it when I can [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/1luvu.gif[/img]

    I'm not saying either of your are right or wrong... oh no.

    Still, it's nice to see a bit of heated discussion on here, been a wee while. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/groovy.gif[/img]

  5. #44
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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    [ QUOTE ]
    RichA3Turbo said:
    [ QUOTE ]
    garethj said:
    [ QUOTE ]
    RichA3Turbo said:
    [ QUOTE ]
    Yak said:
    the handling,

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I could take corners quicker in my A3 than i could in the new A3. This is PROBABLY due to the new one being such a lardass!

    My arguement is valid, and im not the only one who thinks so


    [/ QUOTE ]

  6. #45
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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    [ QUOTE ]
    RichA3Turbo said:

    I could take corners quicker in my A3 than i could in the new A3. This is PROBABLY due to the new one being such a lardass!

    My arguement is valid, and im not the only one who thinks so


    [/ QUOTE ]

    Rich you are entitled to your opinion. In reality there is no right or wrong here.

    You are very familiar with your own car, the new A3 is a very different car. You will be more confident in a car you know and therefore should be quicker.

    I disagree that the new A3 handles worse than the old A3, I believe it is a massive improvement. Having spent 16,000 miles in a new A3 I know its not perfect but a few tweaks will sort most of those niggles out. The electric steering takes some geting used to and that is perhaps part of the problem you have with the car. I would also say that you would need to compare like for like to get a more objective view (i.e. test the new 2.0TFSI against your 1.8T).

    I appreciate that the handling may not be to your taste but I think you'll find the majority of reviews of the new A3 point towards the massive improvement in handling. No doubt it will be further improved with each model year / version.

    BTW the new A3 model for model is not significantly heavier than the old one. The figures that were first posted on this forum were completely wrong.

  7. #46
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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    An Audi that handles [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh_roll.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh_roll.gif[/img]

    I'll take my Compact thanks. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beerchug.gif[/img]

    And by the above I mean that I find the factory set-up on Audi's pretty poor in comparison to say BMW...or Pug/Citroen (Not the same class though!).

    My A3T only became 'acceptable' to me once I changed the springs and the wheels/tyres, before that it was just plain bad in my eyes.

  8. #47
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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    [ QUOTE ]
    Gambba said:
    An Audi that handles [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh_roll.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh_roll.gif[/img]

    I'll take my Compact thanks. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beerchug.gif[/img]

    And by the above I mean that I find the factory set-up on Audi's pretty poor in comparison to say BMW...or Pug/Citroen (Not the same class though!).

    My A3T only became 'acceptable' to me once I changed the springs and the wheels/tyres, before that it was just plain bad in my eyes.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Oh yeah sure, im not saying either are good! Just that the older one, in my eyes, handles better.

    Mine is much better since adding the H&R's and will shortly be fitting Koni adjustable shocks and eibach anti roll bars back and front. THEN it will handle 'well'!

    Rich

  9. #48
    yak
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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    Gambba, nah seriously. Compact is horrible car when there's snow, how can you handle it when it won't go anywhere [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]. And still, I prefer the new A3 over Compact when driving (though 325Ti would be nice [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]).

    - Yak

  10. #49
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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    I do love the BMW vs Audi arguement when it comes to handling. BMW's brainwashing marketing has really persuaded a lot of people that their cars are wonderful.

    Last winter I hit a roundabout covered in black ice, my A3 slid slightly, easily corrected, the BMW following me did the most wonderful 540 degree piroutte and ended up facing the oncoming traffic.

    BMWs may be set-up for great dry weather handling but add some water or ice and they can become a bit of a handful. Audis seem to be set-up better for all weather driving, even if they are a little spongy (nothing a new set of springs can't sort out).

  11. #50
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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    There's a ditch called "3 series ditch" in Southampton (coming of the M27 at Airport Parkway) where there's a slight corner on the dual carriageway which can be taken flat out as you come off the roundabout. Great fun in the right car. Not fun in a BMW after a light drizzle.
    Pathetic.

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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    [ QUOTE ]
    Ess_Three said:
    Perhaps it's the additional weight, helping to keep the car down through the corners?

    Or maybe the cupholders?

    Would it be the TTesque air vents?

    The more comfort orientated springs and dampers?

    No, no...wait...it's the electric power steering thingy, that is assured of robbing each and everly last feeble morsel of feedback the poor A3 could muster, surely that's it?


    [/ QUOTE ]

    Ess and your S3 was so perfect that you didn't need to change any components to get it set up right [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/angel.gif[/img]

  13. #52
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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    [ QUOTE ]
    garethj said:

    Ess and your S3 was so perfect that you didn't need to change any components to get it set up right [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/angel.gif[/img]

    [/ QUOTE ]

    No...that's the point, smart ar*e.

    My S3 was awful...but it was better than anything else in the range.
    It took a complete re-design of the suspension geometry, change of anti-roll bars, springs and dampers to get it to be a great drivers car - which, to my mind, it now is.
    At least I now have some feel and feedback through the steering...not as much as on the best out there...but streets ahead of any other Audi I've ever driven.

    The new A3 is worse, as far as I'm concerned...and that's worse than my S3 was standard...so what does that say about it in the 'big' picture?

    Not a lot really...


  14. #53
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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    [ QUOTE ]
    garethj said:
    The kinematic configuration of the front axle, in conjunction with the design and configuration of the rubber mounts, helps to give the new A3 its neutral handling and driving behaviour, with slight understeer easy to anticipate not arising until the car reaches its extreme limit.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    No that doesn't help at all. It tells me how Audi have tried to make it handle - but gives no insight in to the dynamic changes people feel.

    This is just marketing hype and frankly contradictory - how a car can be neutral and understeer in the same sentence would suggest that the prose was purpled up by marketing wizards rather than people who actually know what they are talking about.

    Subaru made a huge play on the fact that the dampers on the new STI were installed upside down "just like the rally cars" - didn't make it handle better than the p1 though...

    No, what I was wondering was what the *drivers* thought had been improved, as I'm still at a loss to see how a car that has less steering feel, less throttle adjustability, a more reticent turn in and arguably at least similar levels of understeer characteristics could possibly be described as better. The new A3 chassis is very compliant and comfortable, probbably aided by its inert and isolating ride, but I cannot see how this is "better handling".

    Maybe I'm missing something - I look forward to being enlightened.

  15. #54
    yak
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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    [ QUOTE ]
    garethj said:
    From a personal point of view I believe the new A3 has a much better chassis, is better balanced. Once the over soft springs and dampers are replaced it will be a decent car. I disagree that the electric steering robs all feeling it is just a different feel, it takes some getting used to.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Agreed, chassis feels better, more balanced, firmer (there's probably a correct word also for this, but I only know Finnish one). Saying "it has electric steering" doesn't make it automatically worse. There are cars with awful steering, like for example older Audis. They're overpowered, too light, not enough response. In my opinion new A3's gives great feedback at what position the tyres are at, it's just different than what older models have (or what BMW for example has). Find some nice gravel road and give it a go. Gravel roads are my favourite ones, they're really fun to drive, when they're in good condition (no sand which takes away grip). Especially at winters, when there's snow on it, it's a lot better to drive than tarmac with snow (not as slippery).

    - Yak

  16. #55
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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    [ QUOTE ]
    Yak said:
    Agreed, chassis feels better, more balanced, firmer

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I find that it has similar levels of understeer to the old A3, therefore IMO no better balance. I think the ride feels taughter on the newer car (probably due to the stiffer bodyshell) but this does nothing to improve the fundamentals : i.e. poor turn in, under damped, understeer bias balance, floaty and disconnected.

    [ QUOTE ]
    Yak said:
    Saying "it has electric steering" doesn't make it automatically worse. There are cars with awful steering, like for example older Audis. They're overpowered, too light, not enough response. In my opinion new A3's gives great feedback at what position the tyres are at,


    [/ QUOTE ]

    Saying it doesn't make it bad, true. But the steering feedback is lost alltogether on the new model and the irratic and inconsistent amount of effort required at the helm serves to further distract the driver and gives confusing messages.

    Personally, I don't care at what position my wheels are at, given that I have a bloody huge steering wheel in front of me telling me the same, I would be much more interested in where the tyres are in relation to the limits of adhesion, and there is almost no indication of what the road conditions and traction limits are in the new model.

    [ QUOTE ]
    Yak said:
    it's just different than what older models have (or what BMW for example has).


    [/ QUOTE ]

    A very sage comment. It is different, but I wouldn't use the rather inert helm of the new BMWs as my point of reference. The new M3 lacks steering feel almost as much as some of the S line audis, but the A3 is in a different class.

    I think is has no feel, and most reviews agree...


  17. #56
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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    [ QUOTE ]
    garethj said:
    I do love the BMW vs Audi arguement when it comes to handling. BMW's brainwashing marketing has really persuaded a lot of people that their cars are wonderful.


    [/ QUOTE ]

    Nothing to do with brainwashing....go drive one then you'll know. I buy a car to DRIVE, which I'll do on dry roads, so that's what ill buy a car for thankyou. In comparison to Audi the standard setup for handling is miles ahead IMO, than the understeering Audi range.

    Drive a BMW and an Audi for any period of time and you'll understand the difference between good and bad handling....oh and just plain ugly (That will be a Merc then)

  18. #57
    imported_alxs3
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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    I believe the blue clothes red clothes is an anology as for the new A3's handling I didn't think it was great with feedback but the chassis did fell quite well balanced. Audi therefore has a good starting point to develop the S3/RS3.

  19. #58
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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    [ QUOTE ]
    garethj said:
    Sure the new A3 understeers, just like most cars these days as manufacturers see it as safer and easier for the average driver to cope with. The understeer can be dialled out through suspension tweaks.


    [/ QUOTE ]

    But here's the thing: why should you have to spend nearly 20K on a new vehicle, and then spend a further 1500-2000 making it handle properly.
    Insane, surely?
    What ever happened to making a 'sporty' car and giving the driver what he wants: a drivers car?

    I agree that in mose cases understeer can be dialed out...but why sould it take an enthusiast spending thousands tyring parts and working in his garage to fix the problem the multi-million pound developmemt costs failed to address?


    [ QUOTE ]

    The old A6 was a steaming pile of dog doo, yet Audi managed to use it to build the RS6 which is a bloody good car.


    [/ QUOTE ]

    A good car?...yes. A great car?...perhaps..to some.
    But a great drivers car? No...the RS6 just isn't that great a drivers car...just ask Barry who dumped his and reverted to an RS4!


    [ QUOTE ]

    Given that the new A3 is a much better starting point I believe that the S3/RS3 will be a stunning car which will reverse peoples current opinions.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Well, considering the S3 was a noticable improvement over the A3 (in most cases) then I follow your logic...but the S3 isn't great...good, perhaps...but not great. In fact, with hindsight...is's barely adequate...never mind goog.

    So, why the hell do you believe that starting with the new A3, they will evolve into a 'stunning car'
    Maybe the new S3 will be faster...maybe better apointed...but stunning? I seruously doubt it.

    If current Audi thinking is followed, the new S3 / RS3 will be beautifully well built, well appointed and quick...but will still be a dismal drivers car...it's understeer all over the place - despite 4WD - it's have no meaningfull feedback and the brakes will lack feel.
    But it'll have good seats...and lots of toys. Great. Oh, and it'll be reasonably quick.

    How about Audi actually making something that's exciting to drive?

    As for the S3 / RS3 reversing peoples opinions...I really do doubt it. More likely to cememt the feeling that Audi have lost the way and condemn the S line especially to mediocre handling, badge engineered, sloppy, uninspiring also-rans.

    Will the RS3 be any better should it appear? I doubt it...but it'll be faster. And you'll be able to fit more 'stuff' in it. Wow. I'll leave a deposit immediately.

  20. #59
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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    [ QUOTE ]
    garethj said:

    BTW as you know it rains quite a bit here so wet handling is important to me.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    And?
    Audis understeer in the dry...and in the wet.

    Proper quattros (torsen) tend to understeer less in the wet compared to Haldex quattros...as standard the chassis of Haldex quattro cars understeer MORE in the wet than in the dry!
    It's all down the the chassis set-up...after all, you can't defeat the laws of ophysice...not even quattro can do that.

    Are you sure you're not confusing 'handling' with 'traction' because the two are distinctly different functions.

    quattro traction is superb...but this does not follow that the handling is also so.

  21. #60
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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    Sorry Ess can we clear the air here please and try to lighten up on the insults.

  22. #61
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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    I have to say that the average Audi driver (not anyone on this forum) does not want a real drivers car. Audi as a brand is associated with understatement & class, so hacking round on 3 wheels is not a market they are targetting their cars at. Why would you pay such a premium for an Audi if handling & performance is your main criteria?
    The average Audi driver likes the association with the RS4 & RS6, but would only buy one because it was top of the range rather than any longing to take it on track days.
    I think this market prefers the association with the safety that Quattro & an S or RS engine gives them rather than any desire to take on every Saxo on a winding country road.
    It's a bit more grown up than it's Seat & VW cousins. Those buyers that want it to handle as well, will tweak it anyhow, no matter how well set up it was originally. I believe BMW drivers have similar aspirations, but don't realise they actually need the driving skills to go with their "ultimate driving machine", otherwise they end up in the ditch at 3 series corner (mentioned above).
    Audi drivers realise their limitations but still want to (on occasion) burn off a BM through the twisty bits in the wet, without the associated costs of rally school.

  23. #62
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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    Hey Ess, good to see you're playing devils advocate AGAIN!

  24. #63
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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    Whilst being patronising and personally insulting, good example for a moderator to give to others eh !

  25. #64
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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    I agree with Glen here. 'S' Cars are SUPPOSED to be 'sports' cars. or am i wrong? If thats the case, they should be setup FROM FACTORY as a sports car, and not a luxury business persons transport! It would be a lot better for them to be setup more'neutral' rather than understeer as then its safe, yet still a good drivers car!

    For the rest of the range, sure! Safe and predictable is the right way, but for the S cars, then they should be setup for the main reason we have them!

    Rich

  26. #65
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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    No problem with the debate its fun. I'm trying to argue in defence of the new A3 because everyone else seems to want to slag it off.

    I do have a problem with Glen's attitude and tone there is no need to be patronising or personally offensive.

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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    Supposed to be a Sports car yes, but for a buying public that aren't performance drivers, otherwise you end up with 911 syndrome.

  28. #67
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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    Rich

    But would you have a business if the cars were set-up as you want them ?

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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    Damn Andy you beat me to the 100th reply.

  30. #69
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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    [ QUOTE ]
    garethj said:
    Rich

    But would you have a business if the cars were set-up as you want them ?

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Yes...Can still make them go faster, and handle better yet! [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

    Im not saying make them absolutely perfect! Thats why you buy a Porsche or similar, and thats why you pay that much! I just think they should make it a bit more inclined towards a drivers car!

    Rich

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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    [ QUOTE ]
    garethj said:
    No problem with the debate its fun. I'm trying to argue in defence of the new A3 because everyone else seems to want to slag it off.

    I do have a problem with Glen's attitude and tone there is no need to be patronising or personally offensive.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Gareth, in 500 posts I thought you would of learnt that the comments on here are generally not personal, because generally we don't know that much about each other! Hypocrite springs to mind with you, you don't like other peoples opinions in general if they don't conform to what you believe....just my opinion of course!

    On the BMW vs Audi debate, there's a great video of an S4 and M3 going round a track, and although it's a close race you can see how much better the M3 line is all the way round.....and the drivers seemed pretty well matched. BMW can produce a car which is comfortable, well balenced and handles well, why can't Audi?

    Rich, I'd like to take it a step further than just the S and above range of cars, if you offer a sports package then make it handle that much better than the standard, but you're bang on in general about the S and RS's, they should of been made as great drivers cars.

  32. #71
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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    Gamba, understand where you are coming from, sorry for being a bit forceful with my point of view. Think it's quite funny that you have defended the comments as not being personal and then called me a hypocrite in the next sentence.

    I was just trying to defend the new A3 as everyone else seems to slag it off. When I get in a groove I stick to it its not that I don't like other peoples opinions I'm just trying to explain my point of view not force mine on others. If I get carried away sometimes then I apologise.


  33. #72
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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    Most of us on here drive the high (ish) performance versions of the old A3, ie 1.8TS / S3 etc. The new A3 doesn't have a performance version. ( and I don't count the V6 :P). I personally don't like the way the new A3 handles or accerlerates ( and no I haven't driven the TDi). I look forward to driving the 2.0T but I didn't particularly enjoy the engine chararistcis (sp) in the new Golf, so I can't see it being that good in the A3.. only time will tell tho.

  34. #73
    yak
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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    So in other words cybrey, you've tested the new A3 with the comfort-base? This is at least what most of the dealers have, basic version or the Ambiente, not the sport-one, which should have a bit different dampers/springs.

    - Yak

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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    When my service centre first screwed up it was the sales team fault so they gave me a 2.0Fsi 'sport', next time they screwed up it was the service team so I got a 1.6SE, the time after that was the 1.6Se again .. time after that was the A2 1.4 TDI ( which in my opinion was the worst engine I've ever driven), couple of times after that I went back to the 1.6SE and the most recent time I got the new Vectra. ( Was Audi Roadside assist providing it).

    Personally, from a handling pov, I couldn't tell a lot of difference between the sport and the SE.I found both of them rolled in and out of corners and never gave you a great deal of information about what was happening. Mind you I think that about my car as well ( 1.8TS). Had an MX-3 before this and found the lower centre of gravity made the car turn in a lot better.. I'm still getting used to the TS, maybe it'll grow on me [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

  36. #75
    Ess_Three's Avatar
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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    [ QUOTE ]
    garethj said:
    Whilst being patronising and personally insulting, good example for a moderator to give to others eh !

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Oh dry your eyes Gareth.

    You have a real hang up with someone taking a different line to you...to the point where you feel the need to send me PMs whining...
    If I wanted to make a personal atteck on you...you'd know about it.

    A lively debate on one thing...but some of your comments are ill-informed and if I may be frank, pig headed.

    I appreciate you like your A3...but you must realise that it is still an average shopping car...all people have against that is that Audi don't want to try and make a decent driving version...which is up to them, and there's nothing we can do about it.
    Maybe you should stop taking things so personally...the new A3 is not a great car to drive, in my view. Maybe to you, it is...
    But you have to accept that everyone has different standards and what you may find acceptable, others may not.


    As for your complaints about my tone in my replies:
    I have been here for years with the same tone and I'll not change it now just to mollycoddle one user. There was nothing deeply insulting about my replies...maybe some home truths?
    I will continue to use sarcam in my replies as well as patronising where I feel it's justified.

    Nobody has complained up to this point about my conduct, or my manner...so maybe you're just a sensitive soul...aww.... Bless.
    I didn't reaise taking on the role of Moderator meant I wasn't allowed to speak my mind.


    You know, maybe if you listened instead of whining about people calling you names, you'd learn something. Or do you know it all?

  37. #76
    Ess_Three's Avatar
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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    What was the original topic?

    I know...let's start a new one.

    How about:
    How many people has Glen insulted today?
    How many people has Glen insulted last week?
    How many people has Glen insulted in the last year?
    Maybe an easier one would be, who hasn't Glen argued with / fallen out with / insulted?
    Or who is a little sensitive today?
    Or who should Glen beg, bow, scrape and generally grovel for forgivness for being sarcastic / condasending to, in the last 2 years? That should be fun.

    Or...I know:
    Who thinks the new A3 is bland, boring and uninspiring in equal measure?

    No, no...wait...let's just have an open topic:
    Please throw abuse at Glen as he's a really sensitive soul who'll have a nervous breakdown and take his own life just because somebody on an internat forum doesn't like his general demeanour...that's a belter!


    Jeez people...web forums are supposed to be fun!

  38. #77
    5th Gear

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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    [ QUOTE ]
    Drill said:
    And always modest, eh? [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh_roll.gif[/img]


    [/ QUOTE ]

    As you know!

    And don't take this the wrong way guys, but it's hard being right all the time [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/****_you.gif[/img]

  39. #78
    imported_mustwin1
    Guest

    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    fight....fight.....fight [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/froggie_red.gif[/img]

  40. #79
    2nd Gear

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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    [ QUOTE ]
    Ess_Three said:
    What was the original topic?

    I know...let's start a new one.

    How about:
    How many people has Glen insulted today?


    [/ QUOTE ]
    Who's Glen ??






    [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

  41. #80
    RichA3Turbo's Avatar
    ...Watching you!

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    Re: Taking and A3 and making it go faster!!!!!

    Ah this post is fun aint it ! [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh_roll.gif[/img]

 

 
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