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  1. #1
    Spin140's Avatar
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    Turbo back Milltek Mini-Review

    Just had the full Turbo back system fitted to the S3 at the weekend, fantastic service again at Statller in Sheffield and I was surprised at what the job entails with removal of the rear propshaft etc.

    The boys did a great job and the Miltek was fitted with no rattles or knocks apparent, a little improvisation was required to maintain sufficient clearance of the rear ARB and this is a common occurence exagerated by my thicker H&R items, the Guys basically fitted a larger rubber hanging/fixing so the centre section is suspended a few mm lower.

    The Milltek is well constructed and feels a little lighter than the OEM item, mine is resonated so the car has all the performance benefits but little increase in the way of noise, the car certainly sounds a little gruffer and meatier under hard load but you would be hard pressed to tell the difference from stock during normal driving. On tick-over it has a bassier sound but certainly not obtrusive, I am surprised to admit that initially I wished it was louder, but this is testament to Millteks promise of increased performance without the undesireable sound.

    From a performance perpective it definetly makes a difference and is a good and worthwhile modification.

    The turbo feels more eager to spool up and the higher end of the rev range feels far more substantial, initially it does make you drive a lot quicker as the increased bhp is apparent but now I've settled down a little and with normal daily use the car behaves just like stock with no unwanted attention induced by a noisy Corsa style exhaust.

    For me the car needs to remain very oem looking as I prefer a stealthy approach to the more aggressive styling of others, the upgrade to Milltek helps to achieve this offering enhanced performance but with similar to OEM sound and appearance.

    I would highly recommend this modification but ensure its fitted by experienced individuals like the Guys at Statller as it certainly is not as straight forward as Milltek would have you believe especially if a Quattro equipped vehicle.


    Spin

    http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b2.../Milltek19.jpg

    http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b2...s/SDC10018.jpg
    Last edited by Spin140; 5th May 2009 at 15:11.
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  3. #2
    Staz's Avatar
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    Nice one Spin, cheers!

    I'm in the process of deciding which CAI to get (new thread to follow) then later down the line I'll be getting a Milltek TBE fitted.

    A quick off topic question....does the H&R ARB make a big difference? I've been pushing my car a lot harder recently (now the roads are dry) and have found that I think there's just a touch too much roll for my liking. How much too?
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    Jamiekip's Avatar
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    Spin - Good review - what exhaust tips did you go for if you don't mind me asking?

    Staz - ARB's are a well worthy mod. Think they are about 350, and a royal pain in the @ss to fit the front one, as the fornt subframe needs to eb dropped. BUT.. the benefits are reduced role, ability to hold a tighter line and carry better speed through corners. Understeer is all but eliminated unless provoked.
    If you're doing the ARB's it's worth doing the lower H&R springs at the same time IMHO.


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    10blazin's Avatar
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    like the sound of a miltek myself is there any other makes of exausts that are abit louder in terms of grunt ..... cant you choose muffled and un mufled milteks ???

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    Staz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jamiekip View Post
    Staz - ARB's are a well worthy mod. Think they are about 350, and a royal pain in the @ss to fit the front one, as the fornt subframe needs to eb dropped. BUT.. the benefits are reduced role, ability to hold a tighter line and carry better speed through corners. Understeer is all but eliminated unless provoked.
    If you're doing the ARB's it's worth doing the lower H&R springs at the same time IMHO.

    Cheers Jamie! How much lower are the H&R springs? And how much are they (fitted)?

    I think I need a drive of someones car with ARBs and springs before shelling out.
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  7. #6
    Jamiekip's Avatar
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    The springs drop it by 25mm and are about 160-170 I think. The wheels sit nice in the arches too - not to low though.
    I live in London and have had no issues with speed humps etc.
    The ride is deffo firmer at speed (in a good way IMHO), but compliance isn't particularly suffering at town speeds etc.
    I had the springs and ARB's fitted at Regal for about 240 in labour I think.

    Like I said, I'm based in the South East - if you're near by PM me and you are welcome to have a run out in mine to see what you think.

    J
    Last edited by Jamiekip; 5th May 2009 at 11:40.


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    10blazin's Avatar
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    i think the springs are around 230 now jamie well thats what they cost from dpm ....

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    Jamiekip's Avatar
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    Damn exchange rates
    No doubt means the ARBs have gone up in price too!


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    Spin140's Avatar
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    H&R ARB's will cost you about 475 fitted, the springs if done at the same time an extra 250. Very worthwhile with understeer eradicated with little or no loss to ride comfort.

    I went for twin jet syle and will post some pics later this evening.

    The zorst would be louder if selecting non-resonating as this negates one of the rear silencers, the benefits of choosing Milltek over alterante brands is the fact that the brand is well known so you can pretty much get 50% of your money back if you resell come PX time.
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    il be going for non res.. i dont want it to sound standard then again i dont want a subaru just a nice grunt to it to drown out the engine noise as they do sound lightly tappy these 2.0tfsi

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    Iggu's Avatar
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    Good review Spin - these cars desperately need after-market intakes and exhaust systems to release the potential of the engine.
    After my Forge Intake (do it Staz !) and Milltek I got an immediate 20bhp gain on the same rollers (AmD) on the same day.
    Personally speaking (others may disagree) the quality on the Milltek has been outstanding. After nearly a full year mine looks like new - no rusting, no rattles, no shakes or burps.
    A must for any S3 owner in my opinion.
    Phantom Black S3, RNS-E with SDS Hack , BOSE, Sunroof, iPod, ITG CAI, Forge DV, Milltek TBE, Revo Stage 2+, Autotech HPFP, Sachs clutch, Lamin-X, BBS Pescaras, H&R springs, H&R ARBs, NGK Iridium Plugs, Vagcom.

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    Jamiekip's Avatar
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    Interesting you've had no issues with your Milltek Iggu.
    I've read across several forums now that the Milltek systems aren't quite what they used to be, with some owners even saying that Milltek have acknowleged the issue with their suppliers. I guess its all 'Hear Say' though, some may be fine, some cearly not so. I guess the reassuring part is that Milltek have top quality customer service should anyone be unlucky enough to have issues.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Spin140 View Post
    H&R ARB's will cost you about 475 fitted, the springs if done at the same time an extra 250. Very worthwhile with understeer eradicated with little or no loss to ride comfort.

    I went for twin jet syle and will post some pics later this evening.

    The zorst would be louder if selecting non-resonating as this negates one of the rear silencers, the benefits of choosing Milltek over alterante brands is the fact that the brand is well known so you can pretty much get 50% of your money back if you resell come PX time.
    Would be great to see the pics mate as I am about to order a system myself but not sure which tailpipes to go for! Can I be cheeky and ask how much the exhaust cost you?

    Cheers John

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    Staz's Avatar
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    Well as the subject has moved on a bit I hope no one minds if I post my question here instead of starting a new thread...

    S3-N has sent me some useful links for ordering a CAI. I was looking at getting Evoms initially as I didn't really want the Forge due to the pipe going right down in the engine bay. I know you can get the sock thingy to stop water ingress but I just prefered not to have it down there anyway.

    I'm now a bit stuck. Here're the links:

    http://www.vag-tuner.com/acatalog/2.0TFSI.html

    http://www.jkm.org.uk/performance/tfsiinduction.htm

    So now I'm trying to choose between the Forge 252.29, Evoms 340/370 (plus 25 for the heat shield) or the Dbilas 365.

    Does anyone know much about the Dbilas? I have to admit I've not heard of them.

    There's a huge difference in the prices there, which I'm surprised about. I can't imagine there're many improvements that come with the money so does anyone have any thoughts?
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    Quote Originally Posted by staz1000 View Post
    There's a huge difference in the prices there, which I'm surprised about. I can't imagine there're many improvements that come with the money so does anyone have any thoughts?
    EVOMs stuff generally is over-priced I think. They do a DV which is over 100 more than the Forge DV unit. For no greater gains.

    Don't forget WHY the Forge sits where it does - it sucks in cold air from outside the engine bay. The EVOMs unit sucks air from within the hot engine bay - I know the cone is "protected" by a plastic heat shield but you can guess for yourself how effective that will be.

    The Forge and EVOMs are both great bits of kit - both giving the same gains. The difference in price is a shocker though.
    Phantom Black S3, RNS-E with SDS Hack , BOSE, Sunroof, iPod, ITG CAI, Forge DV, Milltek TBE, Revo Stage 2+, Autotech HPFP, Sachs clutch, Lamin-X, BBS Pescaras, H&R springs, H&R ARBs, NGK Iridium Plugs, Vagcom.

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    Staz - just sent you a PM realting to the Evoms - it may be of interest.

    With regards your questions.
    Several people have the Forge and are happy - it's delivered the goods.
    The Evoms in my opinion is the better product for the best performance - from what i've read and heard (I'm sure that will 'cause debate!). However, a few people have said it is quite loud.
    The Dbilis is similar to the Evoms, but the filter is enclosed so it's quieter. I only know of one or two S3's with it on and they seem happy, but I'd question what retrictions there are in getting the volume of air required. That's just a gut feeling though.
    Last edited by Jamiekip; 5th May 2009 at 12:50.


  18. #17
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    Nice review Spin, have any pics or video of how it sounds now?

    Has anyone got any videos of there exhaust? I here Milltek do a decent one that makes the TDI sound less like a tank!?
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  19. #18
    Fast,not furious's Avatar
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    Nice review Spin,i never hear of any complaints with Statller!

    Staz1000 - firstly,congrats for spelling Dbilas correctly!!!

    I use the Forge intake for 2 reasons,primarily because it sucks air from outside the engine bay - nice and low down so it should be cool,and secondly,it's not black - which absorbs heat!

    I think the Evoms appears to be slightly more popular,with the Dbilas one following along similar lines designwise (black,and air filter mounted where the stock intake was)

    I've never had any problems with the Forge sucking in water(although after six months i did add a Hydroshield belt and braces approach! - with the benefit of keeping the filter clean!!) It's cheaper too...


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    Quote Originally Posted by Jamiekip View Post
    Interesting you've had no issues with your Milltek Iggu.
    I've read across several forums now that the Milltek systems aren't quite what they used to be, with some owners even saying that Milltek have acknowleged the issue with their suppliers.
    At least one very vocal "owner" we both know is actually a business customer though aren't they - and I see more going on there than a simple case of quality issues. I sense a business grievance which will be of minimal concern/interest to most individual buyers on here.
    Hooe that doesn't come across the wrong way - you know I mean it well JK.
    Phantom Black S3, RNS-E with SDS Hack , BOSE, Sunroof, iPod, ITG CAI, Forge DV, Milltek TBE, Revo Stage 2+, Autotech HPFP, Sachs clutch, Lamin-X, BBS Pescaras, H&R springs, H&R ARBs, NGK Iridium Plugs, Vagcom.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jamiekip View Post
    Staz - just sent you a PM realting to the Evoms - it may be of interest.
    To others as well maybe ?
    Phantom Black S3, RNS-E with SDS Hack , BOSE, Sunroof, iPod, ITG CAI, Forge DV, Milltek TBE, Revo Stage 2+, Autotech HPFP, Sachs clutch, Lamin-X, BBS Pescaras, H&R springs, H&R ARBs, NGK Iridium Plugs, Vagcom.

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    Staz's Avatar
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    So Forge is looking the likely candidate then! Thanks guys.

    I'm planning to get the CAI first then the exhaust a bit later down the line with Revo. Obviously I have Bluefin ATM and I know from past threads that initially after installing Bluefin the car learns the best settings from the way the car is driven. It's made me think that I should fit the CAI, then reinstall Bluefin so it can make use of the extra air input.

    Is that the best approach in lieu of Revo for now? Or am I talking complete crap? lol
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    Jamiekip's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iggu View Post
    At least one very vocal "owner" we both know is actually a business customer though aren't they - and I see more going on there than a simple case of quality issues. I sense a business grievance which will be of minimal concern/interest to most individual buyers on here.
    Hooe that doesn't come across the wrong way - you know I mean it well JK.
    Completely understand Iggu mate.
    My point is, since then, more people have come out of the wood work - a colleague I work with has even heard it from the horses mouth. Anyway, they are sorting it from what I hear, so fingers crossed it's just been an unfortunate blip.

    Incidentally - I love the Milltek downpipe and sports cat on my car with OEM back box.... it's working really well


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    Quote Originally Posted by Iggu View Post
    To others as well maybe ?
    I'll let Staz as a mod share the link if he wants, but it was simply the location of another forum with a discounted price on the Evoms


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    Quote Originally Posted by staz1000 View Post
    So Forge is looking the likely candidate then! Thanks guys.

    I'm planning to get the CAI first then the exhaust a bit later down the line with Revo. Obviously I have Bluefin ATM and I know from past threads that initially after installing Bluefin the car learns the best settings from the way the car is driven. It's made me think that I should fit the CAI, then reinstall Bluefin so it can make use of the extra air input.

    Is that the best approach in lieu of Revo for now? Or am I talking complete crap? lol
    You're right the ECU does adapt, but it's adapting all the time. I reflash my GIAC regularly now, and every time I do so, the car feels far more urgent. If you didn't reflash the bluefin and added the CAI, the car would adpat to the imporved airflow anyway.
    I think the ECU adpats to your driving style etc over time. So re-flashing it means you benefit from the specific characeristics of the re-map I think.


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    If people wanted to share a link to a discounted product that would be grate, sharing is caring lol!
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    Spin140's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lee_Malone View Post
    Nice review Spin, have any pics or video of how it sounds now?

    Has anyone got any videos of there exhaust? I here Milltek do a decent one that makes the TDI sound less like a tank!?
    I've not taken any sound clips as you really would be hard pushed to tell the difference from stock, on the S3 and 2.0T there is a valve on the exhaust that opens at mid to high revs and the miltek sound is pretty much smack on for that one but without the valve so consistently, a nice gruff encouraging sound.

    If you want to add bass and resonance to the sound emmitted from your D, go for the Non-resonated option, slightly more expensive but from my own past experience an enhancement from the stock tractor soundtrack.

    I'm happy to say I have have had nothing but positive experiences with Milltek and with various applications including petrol and Diesel, I do think the product needs to be fitted correctly by experienced technicians for the product to deliver.
    Last edited by Spin140; 5th May 2009 at 15:53. Reason: Correction
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spin140 View Post
    I've not taken any sound clips as you really would be hard pushed to tell the difference from stock, on the S3 and 2.0T there is a valve on the exhaust that opens at mid to high revs and the miltek sound is pretty much smack on for that one but without the valve so consistently, a nice gruff encouraging sound.

    If you want to add bass and resonance to the sound emmitted from your D, go for the resonated option, slightly more expensive but from my own past experience an enhancement from the stock tractor soundtrack.

    I'm happy to say I have have had nothing but positive experiences with Milltek and with various applications including petrol and Diesel, I do think the product needs to be fitted correctly by experienced technicians for the product to deliver.
    im confused i thought the non res was louder can you correct me so the resonated one will give more grunt ???

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    Spin140's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 10blazin View Post
    im confused i thought the non res was louder can you correct me so the resonated one will give more grunt ???
    my mistake , Non-resonated = louder, resonated equals additional silencer.
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    10 S3 SB, Phantom, Buckets,Int light Pack, Privacy. (Sold)
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    cheers mate i dont understand exaust to much the down pipes seem expensive im not sure what they do
    http://www.awesome-gti.co.uk/product...10719&xSec=394

    would just getting the backbox bit be fine or do you need the full system ???

    http://www.awesome-gti.co.uk/product...=5621&xSec=394

    help please the people who know about this....

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    What do you want out of it Blazin?
    Noise?
    Performnce?

    If you want noise go for the BackBox - you may see a slight improvement to performance, but the bottle neck in the system will still remain - the downpipe and cat on the OEM system is the weakest link.

    If you want the performance, get the downpipe and sport cat (it's the cat that is expensive!). With this you'll see inproved performnce (about 70% of a full system!) adn you will get a slight improvement to noise too.

    I don't have the full system on my car, as I want it to look totally OEM, I only have the DP. It's working fine, no issues and proven performnce gains.... over 25lb/ft more torque at the bottom end

    Milltek say the donwpipe on the OEM backbox is an un-tested variable... consider me the guinea pig and I'm happy!


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    I looked into doing this for the same reason but was advised against it due to increased temperature and their affect on the OEM parts.

    I would assume all will be fine for normal fast road use be interested to hear how you get on long term.

    TBH the pipes don't protrude that much so to the untrained eye the car still looks pretty OEM and in keeping with a performance Audi.

    No excuse not to add the uprated Autotech fuel pump as this is just internals utilising the original pump housing, would be a good mod on your motor LOL !!
    Wife - 12 BMW 320D 181 bhp, 8 Speed Auto, Melbourne Red, Heated Leather, privacy.
    10 S3 SB, Phantom, Buckets,Int light Pack, Privacy. (Sold)
    Golf GTi MK6 - Revo stage 2, ITG, Milltek Race TBE, AP Racing 4 pot BBK - Sold.
    10 S3 SB, Phantom, Buckets,Int light Pack, Privacy,Nav, Park sensors, 6 disc, Revo Stage 1, ITG Enclosed Intake - Sold
    BMW M135i F20 - Bloody good straight from the box !

    "Fast Cars are Safer...."

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    Quote Originally Posted by Spin140 View Post
    I looked into doing this for the same reason but was advised against it due to increased temperature and their affect on the OEM parts.

    I would assume all will be fine for normal fast road use be interested to hear how you get on long term.

    TBH the pipes don't protrude that much so to the untrained eye the car still looks pretty OEM and in keeping with a performance Audi.

    No excuse not to add the uprated Autotech fuel pump as this is just internals utilising the original pump housing, would be a good mod on your motor LOL !!
    Ha - is that what Milltek have said? Increased temps???
    I was told it was un-tested!!!! I don't know what to beliveve tbh... the sceptic says "of course they'll say that, as you they want you to fork out for the FULL system!"

    TBH with you spin - I'm finished modding this car - I've run it with the DP fitted for about 5000 miles now and it's not missed a beat. Getting it detailed this month so it looks all pretty () for summer, but then that is it until I hear if the RS3 is confirmed.
    If it is, and its due in 2010 i'll hang on to the S3 until it comes, if it isn't confirmed, then I'll be referring to my shortlist of future options!


  34. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jamiekip View Post
    What do you want out of it Blazin?
    Noise?
    Performnce?

    If you want noise go for the BackBox - you may see a slight improvement to performance, but the bottle neck in the system will still remain - the downpipe and cat on the OEM system is the weakest link.

    If you want the performance, get the downpipe and sport cat (it's the cat that is expensive!). With this you'll see inproved performnce (about 70% of a full system!) adn you will get a slight improvement to noise too.

    I don't have the full system on my car, as I want it to look totally OEM, I only have the DP. It's working fine, no issues and proven performnce gains.... over 25lb/ft more torque at the bottom end

    Milltek say the donwpipe on the OEM backbox is an un-tested variable... consider me the guinea pig and I'm happy!
    right i get you i would like both to be improved tbh so it might be a full exaust but that straightens me out on the down pipe and i know what you mean ive seen milltecks on and you can see the backbox pertruding under the spoiler i dont like that at all so if mine is gona do that i may just go for downpipe thanks for the info

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    Good review spin again, the last one you did cost me the GIAC hammer map from Statller ! I am off there tommorrow to see about the Hpfp specific map for my car.

    Have also looked into the APR Exhaust but does not look like it is avaliable in UK yet, it is on APR Austriala site, the link is for the tfsi not s3 or quattro.

    Also can confirm Steve at Statller has excellent service , knowledge etc top guy
    Last edited by Whiteatom; 5th May 2009 at 20:02.

  36. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spin140 View Post
    I looked into doing this for the same reason but was advised against it due to increased temperature and their affect on the OEM parts.
    Spin - I've consulted someone who has a way better understanding of all things mechanical than me about the risk you were told about just running the DP and Cat.

    Here's what he has to say:

    "Freeing up the back pressure in the downpipe by increasing the flow, going to 3" from 2.5" and from a restrictive 400+ cel cat to a HJS 200 cel race cat will lower velocity and decrease restriction and therefore temperature in the exhaust (Exhaust Gas Temperatures EGT's)

    So, less velocity and less heat will be better for the cat back section of the exhaust.. Thats my take on it anyways? Unless they mean that cooler exhaust gas flowing more slowly will have an adverse affect on things?? lol.. "


    No doubt a full system is going to be better... but the above statement kind of makes sense to me!
    Who told you it would cause temp issues if you don't ind me asking?

    J


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    I have to say that makes sense to me (and I can guess from the style who wrote that !)
    The only other way to see it (and I'm not mechanical or technical either so this is a novice's viewpoint) is that the downpipe frees things up but the OEM back box just can't deal with all that gas coming through so you get a bottleneck where the downpiep meets the cat - which would increase temps.

    Dunno though. Can see a logical argument to both viewpoints.
    Phantom Black S3, RNS-E with SDS Hack , BOSE, Sunroof, iPod, ITG CAI, Forge DV, Milltek TBE, Revo Stage 2+, Autotech HPFP, Sachs clutch, Lamin-X, BBS Pescaras, H&R springs, H&R ARBs, NGK Iridium Plugs, Vagcom.

  38. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iggu View Post
    I have to say that makes sense to me (and I can guess from the style who wrote that !)
    The only other way to see it (and I'm not mechanical or technical either so this is a novice's viewpoint) is that the downpipe frees things up but the OEM back box just can't deal with all that gas coming through so you get a bottleneck where the downpiep meets the cat - which would increase temps.

    Dunno though. Can see a logical argument to both viewpoints.
    Hahaha, you DO NOT win a prize for guessing who wrote that Iggu

    I hear what your saying, which is why I asked him to clarify. Have you compared the OEM back box to the Milltek? The OEM system is pretty free flowing TBH, even Regal commented on it when they were fitting the DP to mine. I'm not saying it's AS free flowing as the Milltek kit, but it's not the restrictive part of the OEM system. The person who offered the earlier techincal insight was the one who suggested I do this anyway, knowing about my desire to keep things looking as OEM as possible - he had it on his car for a while before going the custom exhaust route.
    I trust what he has to say, and he's never given me duff a piece of advice
    Last edited by Jamiekip; 7th May 2009 at 09:37.


  39. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jamiekip View Post
    I trust what he has to say, and he's never given me duff a piece of advice
    Absolutely !
    Makes total sense to me - the restrictive part is the downpipe then ?
    Useful info for anyone considering a cat-back system (i.e. don't !!).
    Phantom Black S3, RNS-E with SDS Hack , BOSE, Sunroof, iPod, ITG CAI, Forge DV, Milltek TBE, Revo Stage 2+, Autotech HPFP, Sachs clutch, Lamin-X, BBS Pescaras, H&R springs, H&R ARBs, NGK Iridium Plugs, Vagcom.

  40. #39
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    Pics!?

  41. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by hufcforpromotion View Post
    Pics!?
    Of what ?
    Phantom Black S3, RNS-E with SDS Hack , BOSE, Sunroof, iPod, ITG CAI, Forge DV, Milltek TBE, Revo Stage 2+, Autotech HPFP, Sachs clutch, Lamin-X, BBS Pescaras, H&R springs, H&R ARBs, NGK Iridium Plugs, Vagcom.

 

 
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