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  1. #1
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    Thumbs down 23C4 - AUDI is stealing power from our cars

    In Spain official audi dealers are instructed to carry out the "23C4 campaign" to any 2.0 140cv or 170cv engines (Seat and VW also) during regular servicing.
    Basically this modifies the engine mapping system in order to reduce contamination and emissions. Results is that engines do not have all their torque between 1800-2200 rpm. Cars become lazy and a lot of users have reported sluggish and slow performance... including myself.

    Does anyone know anything related to this?

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  3. #2
    Matt's Avatar
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    I think I have heard rumours of it on here previously a month or 2 ago.

    If they do it and it affects the performance that much then I dont think I would want my car anymore. I like the way my car drives and performs and if they change that its not the same car I paid for!
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  4. #3
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    Is that not also going to balls-up any remap you may already have on the car?

    How is it even lawful to alter features on your car without consulting you?
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    surely it would (should) also have some effect on the road tax banding if it was done in this country ?

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    Quote Originally Posted by PNH80 View Post
    Is that not also going to balls-up any remap you may already have on the car?

    How is it even lawful to alter features on your car without consulting you?
    Absolutely, that would be very dodgy if it was done in the UK as they've changed the product you've bought
    My understanding of this is - you can offer improvements for free (bug fixes, extra features etc) but you can't take away functionality

    I guess it would depend on how they classed this, they could in theory say its an improvement to C02 emissions but it would be very suspect

  7. #6
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    Don't get me wrong, if Audi fitted new improved parts free of charge to improve the cars emissions without altering performance i'd be more than happy.... But to remap the engine?! Dodgy to say the very least!
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  8. #7
    Amchlolor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CHARLIE-DONT-SURF View Post
    surely it would (should) also have some effect on the road tax banding if it was done in this country ?
    Not sure if you could change the roadtax banding, even if you retrospectively make improvements to the Co2.
    I think that info is 'fixed' on the V5.
    I'd be interested to find out though.

    If it is possible to retrospectively improve a car's Co2, and therefore it's roadtax banding, then that could be quite an exciting development for companies like superchips.
    They could have people re-chipping to improve their roadtax, rather than looking for more power.
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  9. #8
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    You are all completely right. And this is exactly what people are feeling in spain. Some don't want their car any more, some say its not what they paid for, some say its not legal... but yet audi is still doing it.

    Any of you guys that speeks or understands spanish do a search in google for "23C4" and you will be surprised.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bowfer View Post
    Not sure if you could change the roadtax banding, even if you retrospectively make improvements to the Co2.
    I think that info is 'fixed' on the V5.
    I'd be interested to find out though.

    If it is possible to retrospectively improve a car's Co2, and therefore it's roadtax banding, then that could be quite an exciting development for companies like superchips.
    They could have people re-chipping to improve their roadtax, rather than looking for more power.
    as you , i would to be interested !
    I appreciate there is the whole 'improve CO2' retrospectively discussion but as it is 'from factory' , therefore one could expect Audi to declare figures to EEC etc , therefore affecting banding.
    Does anyone know if it is an available 'modification' in this country ?

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    Amchlolor's Avatar
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    Do you gain from it in any way?
    Does the Spanish government charge less tax after the change?
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  12. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by bowfer View Post
    Do you gain from it in any way?
    Does the Spanish government charge less tax after the change?

    Not at all. In spain, road taxes are paid according to your vehicles specific power, an indirect calculation (strange equation) that only takes into account the cubic centimeters of your engine (regardless of what the real power is).

    There are also rumors that the torque output of the engine is reduced in 1st and 2nd gear (and progressively less in the rest of gears) due to reported reliabilty issues. Dual mass flywheels, turbos etc failing constantly.

  13. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by amgad View Post
    Not at all. In spain, road taxes are paid according to your vehicles specific power, an indirect calculation (strange equation) that only takes into account the cubic centimeters of your engine (regardless of what the real power is).
    So it's a lose/lose situation.
    I was looking for a silver lining to your cloud, but there doesn't appear to be one.
    You're right to be angry.
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