EM TuningChris Nott
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  1. #1
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    Std S3 on the Prosports rollers!

    Here's the plot!



    As you can see , my S3 is making a good whack over book figures , but the torque is very nice!

    I had two other runs , but the computer glich'd before he printed them off and they were lost

    They were

    281bhp 300lbft and 283bhp 301lbft so i will take a average of 280bhp x 300lbft.

    I'm very pleased with the figures as it's a hot-ish day

    Roll on the RR day , great set up and decent blokes.

    I /we should get roughly the same figures.

    I think i will get a remap after the first service!

    Thanks

    p
    Last edited by phantom; 10th May 2008 at 11:45.

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  3. #2
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    Just for referance!



    Thanks

    p

  4. #3
    I cant spell !

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    Good figures !

    Richard
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    Ask to see their calibration certificate. Without it the measured performance is meaningless.......
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  6. #5
    gr1zly's Avatar
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    My S3 after Re-map

    2005 A3 2.0TDI S-line quattro
    2007 S3 silver 300Hp
    2008 S3 sportback SprintBlue: Bucket seats, magnetic ride, RNSE, BOSE, Bluetooth, Carbonspeed CAI, Forge BOV... SOLD
    2009 A4 3.0TDI Ibis white with some goodies
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  7. #6
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    Turn it in , ive got TWO rolling road plots from TWO different sets of rollers on TWO different days showing that my car is making well above book figures!

    Both plots are in the same ball park!

    Mitch78 also got the same figures as me from Awesome.

    Prosports rollers are ONE of three sets in the country that Prodrive ( the offical Subaru tuner ) test there car on!

    People are either don't want to eccept the truth of there jealous......FACT!

    leon

    AKA Phantom

  8. #7
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    I'm not jealous! Why would I be? If I wanted an S3 I'd buy one..... Measurements are meaningless unless the equipment doing the measuring has been calibrated. If you don't wish to accept this then you are deluding yourself.
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    I know peter at prosport, and its unlikely that his rollers will be giving high readings. Hes a straight up guy, not interested in boosting egos by provided high power readings. Theres no reason to think those figures from prosport arent reasonably accurate.

  10. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Twizzler View Post
    I'm not jealous! Why would I be? If I wanted an S3 I'd buy one..... Measurements are meaningless unless the equipment doing the measuring has been calibrated. If you don't wish to accept this then you are deluding yourself.
    Were not talking back st here were talking respected tuners and Vag specialists!

    If there was fuding going on they would fudge Std cars down and remapped cars up!!!!!!!!!!

    Not just you pal , there's a lot of people on here with or without S3's that seem to think S3's only put out 261bhp SOME DO , but not all.... thats where the jealousy comes in because SOME DON'T not just mine and Mitch78's car , but countless others too! ( search the threads ) all the rollers can't be out or is that just the ones where cars run more than 261bhp!

    Well i'll have a very educated guess that Prodrives rollers are spot on!

    Awesomes rollers i would say were decent to , or at least consistant with the readings of Std cars and remapped cars!

    p

  11. #10
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    LOL I'll give up. I can see I'm wasting my time.
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  12. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Twizzler View Post
    LOL I'll give up. I can see I'm wasting my time.
    LOL you are mate , because the proof is there!

    p

  13. #12
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    Twizzler I cant really see your argument in regards to calibration certificate - if this was a one only rolling road test then ok - but Leon (phantom) has had his car on TWO independent (from Audi) rolling roads and has come back with pretty consistent figures. He has not had any mods done by either Awesome or Prosport so it not in their interest to give bulls**t figures.

    Peter @ Prosport has a very good reputation in the Subaru tuning world for been very straight forward and having a very accurate rolling road which does get regularly calibrated!

    It is known for cars to come out with more than the stated figures, Ford with their latest diesels are coming out with more than the factory stated figures as do the BMW Mini Coopers.

    Richard
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  14. #13
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    I was hoping this plot would go some way to ending the Awesome rolling road day argument about the power output on the Std S3 or at least my Std S3.

    The figures are as close as what 2 plots on 2 different sets of rollin roads on 2 different days can be, there is a continuity and consistency within my plots/figures!

    I really don't think i have a "special" S3 i think they can all achieve this power with a strong/hard run in and good fuel ( Tesco 99 RON ) lets be happy our cars are putting out more than what we paid for!

    Anyway get your names down for the RR day Std or remapped i can vouch for the rollers to give a accurate reading! hehehe

    Thanks

    leon

    AKA Phantom
    Last edited by phantom; 10th May 2008 at 20:46.

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    Kris's Avatar
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    Ok, back to the figures. If i'm reading the two graphs correct (phantom's and grizly), the stock cars bhp starts tailing off at around 6000rpm where the mapped car carries on producing power. The mapped car also makes the stock cars max bhp at 5000rpm as opposed to stock at 6000rpm. More interstingly the torque plumets shortly after 3000rpm on the stock car but remains pretty constant on the mapped car and only starts significantly tailing off at around 4,800rpm.

    So, i'll leave you guys to argue fact or fiction but using the two cars/graphs as a comparison i'd conclude the mapped car makes bhp sooner and more torque over a longer/broarder band. As said before, it's not necessarily the max bhp acheived (although figures look good) but how the engine made the power. If for example two cars made identical 260bhp but one made it say 2000rpm sooner with a longer torque curve would they both be equally fast because of peak figures?? ........... i know which one i would choose.
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    I have to take mine to the rollers...

    I think it can't be a bad unit mine.... is actually getting a bit faster lately...

    Close to home there is a motorway straight, up hill and in the botton is a ticket machine were you have to stop... and in the end there is a bridge crossing over the motorway so I can always compare the speed at that point. Always it made 210... Yesterday it did 215 with a full tank...

    Curious a bit about figures.... Also I can see you guys all remapping... I have been thinking about it...

    Pedro
    FOR SALE: S3 Phantom Black, left hand drive, Xenons, FBMFSW, bucket seats, BOSE, rear parking sensors, armrest, interior light package, Symphony II+. Full Audi service history and 4 new Michelin Pilot Sport 2. 18500 miles PM for details! I want to give it away have a good family reason. For a quick sale around 19.5k PM only if interest is genuine! Thanks

  17. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kris View Post
    Ok, back to the figures. If i'm reading the two graphs correct (phantom's and grizly), the stock cars bhp starts tailing off at around 6000rpm where the mapped car carries on producing power. The mapped car also makes the stock cars max bhp at 5000rpm as opposed to stock at 6000rpm. More interstingly the torque plumets shortly after 3000rpm on the stock car but remains pretty constant on the mapped car and only starts significantly tailing off at around 4,800rpm.

    So, i'll leave you guys to argue fact or fiction but using the two cars/graphs as a comparison i'd conclude the mapped car makes bhp sooner and more torque over a longer/broarder band. As said before, it's not necessarily the max bhp acheived (although figures look good) but how the engine made the power. If for example two cars made identical 260bhp but one made it say 2000rpm sooner with a longer torque curve would they both be equally fast because of peak figures?? ........... i know which one i would choose.
    I agree with you 100% Kris!

    A remap will come for me sooner rather than later , it just means i can bide my time a bit more as i'm still not 100% convinced there are no issues with the maps!

    p

    p

  18. #17
    Spin140's Avatar
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    Glad you are pleased with the results Leon (phantom).

    The evidence is certainly stacking up that the S3 is producing more than claimed with 280bhp certainly a figure to be pleased with, I for one am well pleased for you all.

    I still conclude that a remap is highly recommended as regardless of peak power claims the mapped car drives and goes better in every aspect.

    Its good to see Prosport providing Flywheel/clutch figures because although not truly indicative of power at the wheels it allows a true comparison with manufacturers and Tuners claims.

    On the subject of Awesomes Dyno day my biggest issue was with their estimated transmission losses rather than outright power, had these of been more in line with expectation it would have removed much of the doubt on the day.


    Thanks for taking the time to post up the results, at least you and the other Guys now have a 'base' figure to work with.

    Look forward to June 28th
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  19. #18
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    I'll book the 28th June for us in the morning , so get your names down you don't have to have a S3!

    They are also a Revo dealer if you want your car remapping.

    I think they charge 90 for oil and filter ( with genuine Audi parts ) change if you have one due!

    Andy who strapped my car down used to work at Macc Audi.

    Peter is a great fella there were Three people all wanting to see him who hadn't booked in , so on with the overalls to do there jobs......as i was leaving somebody else turned up with a problem.

    I counted 15 good subarus there ( STI minimum ) all having work done and 5 forrester/wagons!

    Thanks

    p

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    He is a good bloke, he's rebuilt the gearbox on my caterham, done work on my s2000, and my wifes civic type R, put a new engine in my Fiat coupe turbo, and loads of other stuff over the years

  21. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spin140 View Post
    Glad you are pleased with the results Leon (phantom).
    How many Leons do we have here?? We have Phantom, L6on and my name is Leon also! Mine is pronounced Layon though. Cheers dad.
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    Quote Originally Posted by julians View Post
    He is a good bloke, he's rebuilt the gearbox on my caterham, done work on my s2000, and my wifes civic type R, put a new engine in my Fiat coupe turbo, and loads of other stuff over the years
    Where do you live mate? are you local or do you just travel to Prosport?

    p

  23. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by staz1000 View Post
    How many Leons do we have here?? We have Phantom, L6on and my name is Leon also! Mine is pronounced Layon though. Cheers dad.
    My old headmaster used to call me Lay-on

    p

  24. #23
    L60N
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    My old teacher did too

    Im sure he did it on purpose! Lay-on. Grrrrrrr

    Anyway, im a definate for the rollers mate. If it makes less than 280 i'll be pissed!!! LoL

  25. #24
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    I'm local, in stockport.

  26. #25
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    All booked and sorted for the 28th June 9.00 am kick off .

    They'll lay on a buffet for us!

    35 each , plus they would like us to donate 5 each to a charity of our choice , so if anybody has some ideas post in the thread in the meets section!

    Thanks

    leon

    PS Theres still time to get your name down!
    Last edited by phantom; 12th May 2008 at 12:49.

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    Mr cynical again, my 5 donation will be in the form of a cheque made payable to the charity LOL
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  28. #27
    L60N
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    My cheque will be dated 3008 :P

    Seriously though, after recent events, mine will be going to Burma.

  29. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by phantom View Post
    35 each , plus they would like us to donate 5 each to a charity of our choice , so if anybody has some ideas post in the thread in the meets section!
    Just what I need, a day out with cars, strangers, and boost. Still not too sure I want to see my baby on the rollers though.
    Charity wise, how about the "Foundation for Heart Broken S3 Drivers"?
    Damn birds


    I might have a friend interested to bring his 3.2 dsg, can non-members participate?
    World's Fastest S3 Driver - racing old people in toyota camries since 1997 with a 97.6% winning rate.

  30. #29
    L60N
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    Whats wrong with putting it on rollers?

    Please inform the uninformed

  31. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by boggysv View Post
    Just what I need, a day out with cars, strangers, and boost. Still not too sure I want to see my baby on the rollers though.
    Charity wise, how about the "Foundation for Heart Broken S3 Drivers"?
    Damn birds


    I might have a friend interested to bring his 3.2 dsg, can non-members participate?
    Yeah non members can come.

    They'll be no heart broken S3 drivers on the day , happy happy happy

    p

  32. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by L60N View Post
    Whats wrong with putting it on rollers?

    Please inform the uninformed
    In case his car doesn't make what he wants!

    And the fact your car will be going 155-160mph whithout moving

    EDIT Ive read post about speedos , my speedo is spot on , so if your going over a speed trap it maybe worth it to drop it too 28-29mph!

    p
    Last edited by phantom; 12th May 2008 at 13:18.

  33. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by L60N View Post
    Whats wrong with putting it on rollers?

    Please inform the uninformed
    It's just me. Very likely the car would be fine, but I'm just paranoid after seeing a few mishaps in the past.

    I'm in no way implying or suggesting anything against PROSPORT or AWESOME, as incidents I've seen happened out of this country.
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  34. #33
    windsurfer

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    Quote Originally Posted by phantom View Post
    In case his car doesn't make what he wants!

    And the fact your car will be going 155-160mph whithout moving

    p
    Mine did that on the road...
    But good thing is at least won't get bugs all over bonnet.... haha

    Pedro
    FOR SALE: S3 Phantom Black, left hand drive, Xenons, FBMFSW, bucket seats, BOSE, rear parking sensors, armrest, interior light package, Symphony II+. Full Audi service history and 4 new Michelin Pilot Sport 2. 18500 miles PM for details! I want to give it away have a good family reason. For a quick sale around 19.5k PM only if interest is genuine! Thanks

  35. #34
    S3IZZO
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    Good results! - i'm looking forward to the RR day, last one was a laugh...hopefully i'll be able to stick around for the whole day this time.

    Leon, can you check to see if it'll be possible to load Revo to the other S3 we're bringing on the day?....be even better to see if they're willing to load it whilst it's on the rollers to give a true gain figure.

  36. #35
    L60N
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    Ah, he means it coming off the rollers and heading down the street at 160mph.. sheeet, that would be bad!!

  37. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by S3IZZO View Post
    Good results! - i'm looking forward to the RR day, last one was a laugh...hopefully i'll be able to stick around for the whole day this time.

    Leon, can you check to see if it'll be possible to load Revo to the other S3 we're bringing on the day?....be even better to see if they're willing to load it whilst it's on the rollers to give a true gain figure.
    Yep , i'll sort it next time i speak with them about that.

    They will be able to do it, in fact i'll ring them now!

    I also want to sort this charity lark out!

    leon

  38. #37
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    Good thread (other than the bunfight!)...
    Phantom, How did you go about running your car in?, the figures do seem excellent and we of course have seen on older S3's higher than stated output.
    I have always been careful running in using gradual increase in revs over the miles, long runs and drop the oil at 1500 miles. This may have no bearing but I have seen great figures and zero oil use on my (many!) cars.

    Looking forward to getting mine now; roll on June!...
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  39. #38
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    Yes they can do Revo on the day.

    This charity thing , we can either keep the 5's and we send them or give them the 5 and they can send them to the charity of our choice!

    Right ive just been informed theres gonna be a LOT of work for me to do on the day , i'll be collecting your 35 and getting you to sign the concent foarm , then settle up with Claire ( Peters wife ) So could you please all bring CASH MONEY!

    Thanks

    leon

  40. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by The911SC View Post
    Good thread (other than the bunfight!)...
    Phantom, How did you go about running your car in?, the figures do seem excellent and we of course have seen on older S3's higher than stated output.
    I have always been careful running in using gradual increase in revs over the miles, long runs and drop the oil at 1500 miles. This may have no bearing but I have seen great figures and zero oil use on my (many!) cars.

    Looking forward to getting mine now; roll on June!...
    TBH i bought it used ( from Audi ) it was a Audi reps car and had done 1100miles a month , so you would imagine it's been run in hard!

    Ever since ive had the car ( Jan ) ive ran it on V-power , but settled on Tesco 99 RON since FEB .

    I bought my last car ( Mk 2 Leon Cupra ) brand new and i ran it hard from day one to give a tight piston ring seal , and then i drove normaly after that.

    I never go over 3-4k revs when cold , but when it's warm and the roads/conditions allow i give it death other wise you may as well drive a TDI ( no offence TDI owners )

    p

 

 

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