A great debate. Let the nation decide.

New tyres? Front or rear?

  • Total voters
    53
  • Poll closed .
Forget it....

At least we provided sound evidence... The other team...lololol... could only give wisdom and experience...

By the way just to clear your minds... the world is flat!

Some people have a problem admitting... "OK it might be safer to the unaware driver but I put new ones in the front and it has been OK..."

It's like some football fans... even with video replay they can't see it was a well validated goal.... maybe someone tampered with the video..lololol

Pedro
 
Personally, I couldn't give a flying fig what evidence anyone produces.
In fact, they could make it law that new tyres must go on the back, I would go home and swap them over to the front.
Nice new tyres on the back?
Where they do feck all? (fwd car, not quattro)
Aye, right.:tocktock:
 
just make sure you put the new ones in the rear in your Alpina! Never mind the steering being in the front... make yourself a favour mate...

You can put the tires wherever you want... it is not the point here at all.

But like others I guess you totally missed it... never mind.
:hi:
 
bowfer said:
Personally, I couldn't give a flying fig what evidence anyone produces.
In fact, they could make it law that new tyres must go on the back, I would go home and swap them over to the front.
Nice new tyres on the back?
Where they do feck all? (fwd car, not quattro)
Aye, right.:tocktock:
Click to expand...


yawn
 
marriedblonde said:
Worn tyres on the front of a BMW make for a terrible drive, it tramlines all over the place, much more noticable that worn rears.
Click to expand...

I think you'll find it's the camber settings which have more effect on that

the 'front' brigade are clutching at straws
 
bacardi said:
yawn
Click to expand...

you can keep saying yawn but if the problem is as great as you all seem to think it is surely we would have experienced it?

Over 50% of the people reading this thread put new tyres on the front of thier cars.

The thing is, if driving at 30mph in the wet round a bend in a normal car causes you to spin do you not think that everyone on here would be saying "oh yes that happened to me"
 
believe me... that red car is actually blue!

I have a solution to please all, including tire manufacturers...lolol

4 new tires everytime!!!!

Pedro
 
sleep envy said:
I think you'll find it's the camber settings which have more effect on that

the 'front' brigade are clutching at straws
Click to expand...

I'm talking about a car with factory settings. You obviously get a lot more feel through the front of a BM than an audi for example. But when the fronts are worn it moves around all over the place a hell of a lot more.
 
marriedblonde said:
The thing is, if driving at 30mph in the wet round a bend in a normal car INCREASES THE RISK OF A spin do you not think that everyone on here would be saying "oh yes that happened to me"
Click to expand...

edited for accuracy

HTH
 
marriedblonde said:
The thing is, if driving at 30mph in the wet round a bend in a normal car causes you to spin do you not think that everyone on here would be saying "oh yes that happened to me"
Click to expand...

Well it has actually happened to me when I had a Clio. True. Slippery road... it felt like all of a sudden I had no rear grip and just lost... and going slow I stopped almost facing the other way around... luckly it was at very slow speed and no incoming traffic so everything was fine.

The car had worn tires everywhere but I assume being ligher in the rear axle made a difference..

Believe or not if you want... I really don't "give a fig"....

Pedro
 
marriedblonde said:
I'm talking about a car with factory settings. You obviously get a lot more feel through the front of a BM than an audi for example. But when the fronts are worn it moves around all over the place a hell of a lot more.
Click to expand...

eh?

if you look after your tyres and make sure that the pressures are correct during the life of the tyre (and not use it on a track day) the wear should be even

how is that going to affect the geometry settings which are pretty much fixed (excluding hitting kerbs and going over pot holes)?
 
newbiecrg said:

The car had worn tires everywhere but I assume being ligher in the rear axle made a difference..
Click to expand...

So your example of having new tyres on the front, worn on the rear causing a car to spin is actually with a clio with worn tyres everywhere?

Hmmm not the best example me thinks.

I have spun my wifes Mx5 on a roundabout, new tyres all round, in the dry, basically being a nob. Does that mean new, new tyres on the rear would have saved me from doing that?
 
sleep envy said:
eh?

if you look after your tyres and make sure that the pressures are correct during the life of the tyre (and not use it on a track day) the wear should be even

how is that going to affect the geometry settings which are pretty much fixed (excluding hitting kerbs and going over pot holes)?
Click to expand...

Front tyres do not wear as quickly as the rears on a rear wheel drive car.

You get more feel from a BM than you do an audi. When the front tyres start to get low on the front of a BM it move around a lot more, tramlining if you like. This is not just my current car but a 330 coupe, a 330D touring, a 328i coupe
 
audi upgrades
newbiecrg said:
Well it has actually happened to me when I had a Clio. True. Slippery road... it felt like all of a sudden I had no rear grip and just lost... and going slow I stopped almost facing the other way around... luckly it was at very slow speed and no incoming traffic so everything was fine.
Click to expand...

Where's the evidence that was down to worn tyres?
Could have been some contaminate on the road which caused your slide.
New tyres aren't immune to diesel spillages.
 
sleep envy said:
edited for accuracy

HTH
Click to expand...

But thats not what the video clips are actually showing are they. If it only increased the chances of a sping the test would have involved numberous runs, 10's if not 100's to show the increase.

But they didn;t. Vicki drove round once with new tyres rear/worn front. Didn't spin. Then swapped it round (new on the front, old on rear) and drove round again and it spun.

Conclusion: At 30 mph in the wet, according to her test, you will spin if you put new tyres on the front with wrn on the rear.
 
marriedblonde said:
Front tyres do not wear as quickly as the rears on a rear wheel drive car.

You get more feel from a BM than you do an audi. When the front tyres start to get low on the front of a BM it move around a lot more, tramlining if you like. This is not just my current car but a 330 coupe, a 330D touring, a 328i coupe
Click to expand...

can't say I've noticed it in either of my M3s or my 325i

can't see how a tyre's wear can alter the camber settings
 
marriedblonde said:
But thats not what the video clips are actually showing are they. If it only increased the chances of a sping the test would have involved numberous runs, 10's if not 100's to show the increase.

But they didn;t. Vicki drove round once with new tyres rear/worn front. Didn't spin. Then swapped it round (new on the front, old on rear) and drove round again and it spun.

Conclusion: At 30 mph in the wet, according to her test, you will spin if you put new tyres on the front with wrn on the rear.
Click to expand...

a yes or no answer to this question will surfice;

so you are saying that every tyre manufacturer, tyre development technician and the tyre industry as a whole is fundamentally wrong in this instance?
 
sleep envy said:
a yes or no answer to this question will surfice;

so you are saying that every tyre manufacturer, tyre development technician and the tyre industry as a whole is fundamentally wrong in this instance?
Click to expand...

No, he's quite rightly saying it's a **** test.
 
audi upgrades
marriedblonde said:
Hmmm not the best example me thinks.
Click to expand...

Not the best but the one I had myself... It wasn't a roundabout and I only lost the rear, all of a sudden... The car is a comercial version where does not have back seats. If it was due to worn tires I do not know... what I know is that I lost rear grip. I think if I had better tires in the rear I might have not lost it like that... It wasn't dry, the road was damp.

But other factors like weight distribution come into account off course.

Pedro
 
bowfer said:
Where's the evidence that was down to worn tyres?
Could have been some contaminate on the road which caused your slide.
New tyres aren't immune to diesel spillages.
Click to expand...

I am not saying it was only due to worn tires but I did not lost the front did I?

So obviosly in that car front frip was greater than rear grip that is why I lost it... the rear did not had enough grip.

Pedro
 
sleep envy said:
a yes or no answer to this question will surfice;

so you are saying that every tyre manufacturer, tyre development technician and the tyre industry as a whole is fundamentally wrong in this instance?
Click to expand...


Lololol..... can't help it!

Do you still have doubts on this one? For sure the are not right... maybe, just maybe they are wrong!!

Pedro
 
sleep envy said:
can't say I've noticed it in either of my M3s or my 325i

can't see how a tyre's wear can alter the camber settings
Click to expand...

I didn't say it altered the camber settings did I? Nope I think I said it made the front end move around a lot more, I assume it tramlines more. I would guess this is because the tread blocks have more give when new.

And again notice how I haven't mentioned it altered the camber in this post?
 
sleep envy said:
a yes or no answer to this question will surfice;

so you are saying that every tyre manufacturer, tyre development technician and the tyre industry as a whole is fundamentally wrong in this instance?
Click to expand...

Nope I am saying that the videos you have used as evidence are crap. Using the test as a guide it would mean that over 50% of us who have said we put new tyres on the front would have had a spin when it rained, which lets face it is most of the time in this country is it not?
 
Pedro, if it were case of 'right or wrong', then why isn't it law?
Really, if it's as black and white as you suggest, then surely every tyre fitter in the land would agree?
As it is, they don't.
Even the Costco fitters, who are forced by company policy to fit new tyres on the back, don't agree.
 
NOTE TO MODS: can we get a new horse for this thread please, we've still got loads more flogging to do.
 
bowfer said:
No, he's quite rightly saying it's a **** test.
Click to expand...


on the account that it doesn't fit with your opinion?

Shaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaame
 
newbiecrg said:
I am not saying it was only due to worn tires but I did not lost the front did I?

So obviosly in that car front frip was greater than rear grip that is why I lost it... the rear did not had enough grip.

Pedro
Click to expand...


So your now saying that worn tyres all round will make your car spin? Or are you still using your example for the new tyres on the front will cause your car to spin?

Your example isn't relevant to the discussion of where to put new tyres, front or back.
 
bowfer said:
Pedro, if it were case of 'right or wrong', then why isn't it law?
Really, if it's as black and white as you suggest, then surely every tyre fitter in the land would agree?
As it is, they don't.
Even the Costco fitters, who are forced by company policy to fit new tyres on the back, don't agree.
Click to expand...


Superb!!!

Costo don't agree? Sheeesh, I trust them as much as an audi master technician!
 
bacardi said:
on the account that it doesn't fit with your opinion?

Shaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaame
Click to expand...

On account it doesn't fit with your argument. Like I Said in the video there are 2 runs yes?

One in which the car spins and the other it doesn't? Agree so far?

So therefore we can conclude in the wet at 30mph driving round a bend in a family car with worn rear tyres and new front tyres you will spin?

Is that not what the test showed?
 
marriedblonde said:
you can keep saying yawn but if the problem is as great as you all seem to think it is surely we would have experienced it?

Over 50% of the people reading this thread put new tyres on the front of thier cars.

The thing is, if driving at 30mph in the wet round a bend in a normal car causes you to spin do you not think that everyone on here would be saying "oh yes that happened to me"
Click to expand...


Naah, just tired, been a long day

It has happened to me, fact, also I've had new tyres fitted to the front and NOT lost the car, I've never said that it will happen, I've said for those with little skill it is safer to fit them to the rear.
 
bacardi said:
on the account that it doesn't fit with your opinion?

Shaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaame
Click to expand...

No, I think most right minded people would see it's a **** test.
Complete lack of proper control conditions.

No guarantee her speed was the same for both tests.
No guarantee her throttle position was the same.
No guarantee the grip co-efficient of the tarmac was the same for both tests
No guarantee her sterring wheel forces were the same for both tests.
No guarantee the tarmac temperature was the same for both tests.
No guarantee the tyre pressures were the same for both tests.
Etc.etc.etc.
 
bowfer said:
Pedro, if it were case of 'right or wrong', then why isn't it law?
Really, if it's as black and white as you suggest, then surely every tyre fitter in the land would agree?
As it is, they don't.
Even the Costco fitters, who are forced by company policy to fit new tyres on the back, don't agree.
Click to expand...

Well bowfer I never said it was law... and if you read all my post what I mean is that having the new tires fitted in the rear (in a FWD) it reduces the chance of being caught in an unexpected oversteer, thus being safer in the sense that oversteer is more difficult to control for most drivers. Again I say... reduces the chance of!!!!

Like smoking it is proven that increases the risk of developinf lung cancer and it is not against the law the act of smoking outside public places is it?

So what it being difficult to admit is that the chances of oversteer happening are greater if new tires are in front with worn rear ones... How much it changes the probability towards oversteer I don't know but for certain it is not the same...

Maybe, in normal conditions there is a 10% probability of oversteer happening if you have new front and worn rears the probability rises to 11%... who knows? I don't but I do know it changes the probability of that happening... that all. My point is all that simple...
 
as alot of people are posting in here who seem to know what they are talking about, let me add another question which Id like to know other peoples opinions on....

Tyres, do you wait until they are nearly illegal before changing? Mine are on half tread and I have already noticed a change in the handling... thinking about new rubber all round, if you like driving fast do you change your tyres before they get to minimum tread/illegal?
 
marriedblonde said:
So your now saying that worn tyres all round will make your car spin? Or are you still using your example for the new tyres on the front will cause your car to spin?

Your example isn't relevant to the discussion of where to put new tyres, front or back.
Click to expand...

I know you would say this....lololol!

It is not the perbeft example at all but just helps to illustrate what happens when there is a difference in grip front/rear!

Or are you saying that a worn tire grips the same as a new tire (after running in)?????????
 
newbiecrg said:
Like smoking it is proven that increases the risk of developinf lung cancer and it is not against the law the act of smoking outside public places is it?
Click to expand...

LOL...Thats exactly the same as the worn tire debate!
 
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