Vehicle rejection advice

[Granny]

Hi
Been a while since i've been on here! Picked up my brand new A3 at the end of last year and since buying have had 2 major faults with the car. I'm in the process of trying to reject the vehicle and either get a replacement, or my money back...

The car has done under 1800 miles and in that time i've had the Turbo and catalytic assembly replaced. I now discover that the whole engine needs to be replaced... Whilst I'm satisfied that Audi has fixed the initial problem with the turbo, I'm not happy with having to have a replacement engine. My concern with this is that i am now exposed to the depreciation of having an engine in the car that doesn't match the V5...

I wrote to the Stealer and they spouted some rubbish about having to have "3 strikes" before a vehicle can be rejected - i.e. I needed to experience 3 major faults before they'd consider rejecting the vehicle! I'm maybe not the sharpest tool, but even I smelt a considerable hint of cow dung in that response!

I've since spoken and written to audi customer service. I now await their response!!

If any of you have experienced anything similar and have some advice, or even if you'd just like to add your tuppence worth, I'd really appreciate it!

 

[jamiekip]

Perhaps go to consumer advice website, or RAc, Aa websites might have useful info.
My view, if you stmap your feet hard enough and for long enough they will probably replace the vehicle with something of equivalent value.
Alternatively, suggest the delaer or Audi buy it back off you at Market price and you can go and find a car with no problems!!!

Oh, an email to watchdog usually helps in these situations too!!!

 

[Trev241]

I had a 1.8 T Sport Quattro some years ago, upon my return from Austria it developed a flat spot which became dangerous when overtaking.

They had the car for 11 weeks and in that time replaced everything you can think of with the exeption of the engine block, time to call a halt me thinks so called in the area manager for Audi.

My argument was that the car would never be the same again with so much being replaced and they still had no idea what was wrong, after four hours of very tough discussions they finally agreed to give me a new car of the same model at a cost to me of £1,500 instead of the £7,000 or so I would have had to put towards the part ex at that time (think the car was between one and two years old).

This was the bottom line so decided on the deal rather than have the old car back if and when it was fixed.

I guess you just have to stick it out and give them a really hard time, don't give up and good luck.

 

[jamiekip]

PS - Good luck!!!!

 

[steve184]

yeh just don't give up - keep phoning and keep on their backs. I had an issue with my wipers on my last car (ok not major mechanical like engine) but they had 5 attempts at fixing and still weren't right. I tried to reject the car but because the 5 attempts had been over the space of two years and the car was now two years old - so they wouldn't consider a replacement on this basis alone even though i explained this was their fault! Anyway in the end i got a £1650 payment towards a new car from audi, a 13% discount from the dealer involved and i sold my old car private (with still problematic wipers!) - was a lot of hassle but in the end i have ended up financially better off with a better car and not having to only borrow a small sum of money over two years.

Oh and ps if they replace engine the issue wont be with the V5 as the engine number can be changed on this so they match - the issue is with the workmanship - swapping an engine is a collosal job which they will never be able to do to a factory standard, ie things not fixed in where they should be, paint damaged/scraped, marks - bonnet will have to be removed so the paint will be disturbed on on the fixing bolts - this then gives future potential buyers reason to ask why? accident? etc all this tedious kind of stuff

 

[HeliChris]

Hi Granny

I have had a number of cars exchanged, and my personal best was a Golf, exchanged within a week of the dealer principal telling we there was no way the car would be exchanged.

I have found the following very useful

- Keep a log of all letter, calls (including a transcript) and visits.
- Never threaten Audi UK or the dealer with “Watchdog” etc, it only has a negative effect.
- Never lose your temper in any conversation/letter.
- Complain via letter not phone calls, and keep them brief and to the point (you can include your log for additional detail)
- Sending letters to directors works, but make sure you send them to all the directors you can find, some will have letters trapped and routed to Customer Services, but others won’t. Director letters should not be specific about your case but ask difficult questions which require a written response. Example Do you feel an engine replacement after 1800miles is representative of the Audi brand quality? Also try to focus the letter to the director, i.e. the marketing director should be asked about marketing issues around Audi quality. Directors talk to each other, and this will be your route to the Customer Services Director.
-Be persistent

My Golf took 3 letters to get exchanged, and it was far more minor than an engine change.

Chris…

 

[cdb2]

Talk to your local Trading Standards, they are very helpful.

I'm not sure of the 3 strikes, but you do have to give them the opportunity to remedy it.

 

[dbm]

Hi,
I am a Which? subscriber and so read about things like this from time to time. From memory the law is that you can only reject an item if you haven't allowed them to attempt a fix; once you allow them to try then you are basically admitting that the problem can be fixed. There is also a time factor involved. If the problem manifests in the first 6/12 months (sorry, can't remember exactly of the top of my head) then it is assumed to have been there at the time of purchase, unless the vendor can prove otherwise. After that time it is up to you to prove the fault was there all along.
My advice would be to join Which? Legal Services at £50 for the year. They will tell you exactly where you stand.
Dan

 

[Amchlolor]

The consumer editor of WHAT CAR is really good.
She helped a girl in our office reject a Fiesta.
All she asked was that the girl have her photo taken for the mag.
The girl bottled it and said no.
HOWEVER,when the dealer was sent the e-mail from WHAT CAR saying they were willing to take the case on,they relented and gave her a refund.
They must have shat themselves at the thought of their name appearing in the mag.
They used to have her address on their website,but they've changed it.
A bit more vague now.
She was maybe being inundated !
Go out and buy the mag and it'll be in there.

 

[steve184]

dbm that is rubbish! - you HAVE to by law give them an opportunity to fix it. If you refuse this then you have no legs to stand on - take them to court and they will just laugh at you - (we offered to fix the problem but the customer didn't allow us).

Its a shame we dont have a lemon law in this country like they do in the US - we would soon see better servicing standards if they did cos it would cost them a fortune in new cars! from my experience a fault is never remedied first time and this would change for sure if they knew there would be sever financial consequences to themselves if they didn't. But, alas we don't so it is no skin of their nose to repeatedly make 'attempts' at repairing cars, taking their time, so by the time it becomes obvious it isn't repairable your car is too old/too many mils to get replaced.

 

[dbm]

I've double checked and the 'no fix' clause only applied up until 1994, so is indeed not in effect any more. However, you do not have to accept an attempt at fixing a problem. Obviously, the nature of the problem is a factor in whether or not you can reasonably reject a car because of it; no rejects for faulty wiper blades!

It is important not to keep using a car (or any item) which you intend to reject. If you tell the dealer you intend to reject the car and then keep using it, you have in effect accepted it.

Final note, as the buyer your contract is with the seller, not Audi directly. You need to pursue re-course with the dealer should things get legal. Obviously, Audi may choose to do somethings as a demonstration of good will, but they aren't required to by law.

As I said before, £50 to join Which? Legal Services will tell you exactly what to do. And for small additional fees they will have Solicitor's letters written for you.

Cheers
Dan

 

[Plank]

Two experiences :

Honda Civic (parents car) - 1 year old, dash clocks failed and had to be replaced with new instrument cluster (in the days of analogue odometers so read 00000 miles as they claimed they couldn't adjust the new set to match the true mileage). I went to the dealer and insisted this would negatively affect the value. They agreed and offered to replace the car for a new one at zero cost (way above expectations!)

Volvo S40, Spent 8 weeks at the dealers in it's first 3 months! Recurring mechanical fault. Very little interest from dealers, ditto customer services and Volvo UK. Eventually rejected the car through the legal route (solicitors etc).

With a 6 month old Audi, you'll be very lucky to get a zero-cost rejection, but as per others advice, you need to keep on at them 'till you're blue in the face.

 

[RobB]

Got mine replaced after 6 months and 6k miles.

3 strikes or whatever could be accepted as reasonable if it does not affect the value of your car or inconvenience you too much with some kind of compensation thrown in for goodwill. However, a new engine is unacceptable.

To kick off, you must return the car and leave it at the dealers with formal notice of rejection and what you expect to happen. If you keep driving it, you are not rejecting it. Keep a log (date, time, who etc) of all communication and what was said. Do not lose your rag and do all you can to be polite and and constructive. It really does help.

Whilst your contract is with your dealer, it was Audi CS who eventually provided me with the new car although delivered through the dealer. I also had a complimentary A3 to match my own from Audi UK whilst I waited for mine to be replaced. There are certainly worse manufacturers out there and I was very happy with the outcome in the end, but it took some hard work on my part.

I'll pull some more details together for you if it would help. Let me know.

 

[steve184]

well i had an obviously unrepairable fault with mine and i moaned and moaned and moaned and the refused and refused and refused to replace it after 2 years of nothing but going back and forth - they just wouldn't accept they couldn't fix it - just ended up witha sizable iscount on a new one but i had to do the legwork, ie, sell my old car private etc

DBM - so you are saying a repalcement engine is worthy of a repalcement car but a faulty wiper system that i gave 5 attempts at fixing isn't? It should be! Any fault on a product under guarantee should be fixed or the item replaced simple as. That goes for a mobile phone, a tv, or a car or whatever.

 

[Granny]

Hi All
Thanks for all your help and advice. I've been on holiday for a couple of weeks and am picking up the 'Audi Baton' again today! I'll post any resolution or updates that i receive.

 

[dbm]

I said wiper blades, not wiper systems

Dan

 

[Granny]

Development... but not necessarily a good one.
Audi have told me that they are in the process of considering my vehicle rejection. The car has now had the engine replaced and is 'road worthy' as they put it. They have refused to give me a hire car now that the car is road worthy, but i'm concerned that if i start using my car i will lose any standing i have to reject it. Audi Customer Service have apparently posted me a letter saying that by using my car now it won't affect the outcome of the rejection request... I'm not so sure! but for the current moment I'm car-less!!!

Any advice?