Lag

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No,the moral of this is that DSG has faults.

Some are willing to accept,overlook, or adapt to them,some are not.

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Wrong, my DSG does not have faults, no warning lights on the dash so far and the garage never reported to me that it had any faults showing when it went in for it's service.

However, there are a couple of design features that I don't agree with, such as the automatic upshifting but it's nothing that I wasn't aware of when I bought the car, and I've adapted my driving style to suit.

I understand that you feel the car doesn't do what you want it to, but that's your shortcoming, not the cars.

/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/soap.gif

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Abso f&*(%ng lutely, mine doesn't have any "faults" either, it works as designed, period

Bowfer - its NOT faulty!!!!!!
 
I'm with Eeef on this one my DSG box doesn't have any faults either that I am aware off. Personally I do not mind the auto upshifts, most of the time it doesn't happen, occasionally when pulling out of a junction and I hoof it down the road it's quite useful for it to change from first to second for me.

I knew after testing driving a S-line 2.0Tdi DSG what the short falls of the gearbox where, like David I drove my comute to make sure that I would be happy with the car.

Some of us like the quirks of the DSG and others don't.

J.
 
[ QUOTE ]
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No,the moral of this is that DSG has faults.

Some are willing to accept,overlook, or adapt to them,some are not.

[/ QUOTE ]

Wrong, my DSG does not have faults, no warning lights on the dash so far and the garage never reported to me that it had any faults showing when it went in for it's service.

However, there are a couple of design features that I don't agree with, such as the automatic upshifting but it's nothing that I wasn't aware of when I bought the car, and I've adapted my driving style to suit.

I understand that you feel the car doesn't do what you want it to, but that's your shortcoming, not the cars.
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/soap.gif

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Eeef is absolutely, 100% correct. DSG does what it says and there is absolutely <font color="brown"> nothing </font> wrong with it.

I have said this many times now, it is an automatic transmission pure and simple.

Some misguided individuals have bought the notion that the DSG is some kind of F1 racing transmission type incarnated as a manual gearbox in disguise. If you fall into this category you have my sympathy - Audi's marketing machine did hype the whole idea out of sight.

Let's face the facts - you have P, R, N, D, and S on the selector gate don't you? The paddles (also fitted to most automatic transmission equipped cars these days) allude to some sort of manual overide when in reality it will only shift as and when the transmission's electronics believe it safe (mechanically) to do so.

I smile sadly when I read posts that "I shift manually around town", oh really? We really do share this planet with some gifted people don't we?

Stick the thing in D and let it get on with it - the DSG is better at deciding when to shift than you will ever be - period.

Rant over, /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif
 
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Stick the thing in D and let it get on with it - the DSG is better at deciding when to shift than you will ever be - period.

Rant over, /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif

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Not so, which was the whole point behind this post. 'D' is not very slick at the changes when your pulling away, unless you want to wait for massive gaps in traffic and I assure you that's not often possible at some of the roundabouts up here.

Put it in 'manual' and its no bother at all.
 
[ QUOTE ]

Stick the thing in D and let it get on with it - the DSG is better at deciding when to shift than you will ever be - period.

Rant over, /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif

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Ridiculous.

THis is an ok approach for middle lane morons who drive the same speed, same style, regardless of conditions, circumstances or other road users..

However, in the real world, those of us who do take notice of these things, even in an auto will need to trigger a gearchange at times the gearbox wouldnt.

If youre behind a 'dawdler' and spot a nice big gap in the oncoming traffic, what do you do? In a manual you drop a gear in anticipation, ready to floor it and enjoy the response.. why? to avoid having to waste time doing so once the gap appears, and spend more time completing your manouvre. No different in the auto, (while totally accepting its an auto), knock it into tiptronic, down a gear, and exactly the same applies. and thats just ONE circumstance.
 
Personally I prefer to drive my DSG equipped A3 in manual mode nearly all the time. I get all the benefits of engine braking when I change down and being in the right gear for exiting a corner etc and with me choosing when to change up to suit the road conditions. The D or S are very useful for not having to keep putting the clutch pedal down every few seconds when in a traffic queue but the 'manual' mode is much more enjoyable to me most of the time. It's almost just clutchless gear-changing.
 
I'm smiling again, more of the truly gifted are speaking.......
 
Theres no Lag on my DSG from the start off ?
What are you guys on about, is this a problem with the Oil Burners only ?

Must be Turbo Lag and not the DSG.

Its Instant on the 3.2 /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif which is what i wanted, this is why i went for the DSG
 
[ QUOTE ]


Must be Turbo Lag and not the DSG.



[/ QUOTE ]

That's the whole point,it is turbo lag,but the DSG exagerrates it,or at least doesn't allow you to get around by getting the revs up and slipping the clutch,as you would in a manual.

I've never tried DSG in a NA car,but I would imagine it's a lot better.

The only thing I could see bugging me about DSG then would be the auto change-up at top revs.
 

Bowfer, did you ever take Japper up on his offer and hook up with him to have a go in his car to see if your car behaves differently to his?

I can get over the lag to a certain degree by hitting the brake pedal and accel at the same time but from what you have said thats a no no in your car. Might give you some more weight with Audi...

J.
 
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Bowfer, did you ever take Japper up on his offer and hook up with him to have a go in his car to see if your car behaves differently to his?

I can get over the lag to a certain degree by hitting the brake pedal and accel at the same time but from what you have said thats a no no in your car. Might give you some more weight with Audi...

J.

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Not yet.

Mind you,I can barely find my car in the drive just now.
It's been abandoned,under about 3 feet of snow.

There's no point even trying to make it to a main road in it,it is utterly utterly useless in the snow.

I can't even see quattro making a difference on this occasion,due to the sheer depth of snow.

This was my drive to work this morning,in the wife's HRV;

untitled.jpg


Just me and the bloke in the Shogun.
 
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Bowfer, did you ever take Japper up on his offer and hook up with him to have a go in his car to see if your car behaves differently to his?

I can get over the lag to a certain degree by hitting the brake pedal and accel at the same time but from what you have said thats a no no in your car. Might give you some more weight with Audi...

J.

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Not yet.

Mind you,I can barely find my car in the drive just now.
It's been abandoned,under about 3 feet of snow.

There's no point even trying to make it to a main road in it,it is utterly utterly useless in the snow.

I can't even see quattro making a difference on this occasion,due to the sheer depth of snow.

This was my drive to work this morning,in the wife's HRV;

untitled.jpg


Just me and the bloke in the Shogun.

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Shame you're not in the A3 today, as i'm venturing over to dyce this afternoon.
 
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bowfer, is that road Westhills way ?

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It's the road from Skene to the tyrebagger hill Japper,so it's close(ish) to Westhill.

Well spotted !
 
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No,the moral of this is that DSG has faults.

Some are willing to accept,overlook, or adapt to them,some are not.

[/ QUOTE ]

Then a RWD car has faults because if you put the power down to hard in a bend, you put your *** in a ditch... Bowfer, if you're not prepared to adapt your driving style to get the most from the box , then that's your call, it's not the fault of the technology.

Why do so many expect miracles from DSG? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif
 
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No,the moral of this is that DSG has faults.

Some are willing to accept,overlook, or adapt to them,some are not.

[/ QUOTE ]

Then a RWD car has faults because if you put the power down to hard in a bend, you put your *** in a ditch... Bowfer, if you're not prepared to adapt your driving style to get the most from the box , then that's your call, it's not the fault of the technology.

Why do so many expect miracles from DSG? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

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Fine,you can't understand why I'm not willing to adapt my driving to suit the gearbox,and I can't accept why you are.

I don't think I expect "miracles".
I do expect manual mode to be manual mode,and I do expect it to accelerate when I boot the throttle,not just sit there going through it's millions of calculations and waiting for the turbo to spool up.

If that's expecting miracles,then I'm guilty as charged. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/noidea.gif

If I were the only one experiencing problems,I'd have to walk away and accept it's me.

I'm clearly not,so there are issues with it.
 
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Not yet.

Mind you,I can barely find my car in the drive just now.
It's been abandoned,under about 3 feet of snow.

There's no point even trying to make it to a main road in it,it is utterly utterly useless in the snow.

I can't even see quattro making a difference on this occasion,due to the sheer depth of snow.

This was my drive to work this morning,in the wife's HRV;

untitled.jpg


Just me and the bloke in the Shogun.

[/ QUOTE ]

And I am basking in glorious sunshine /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif high 20's sunnies and a t-shirt...
 
I'm also basking in glorious sunshine /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif temperature is registering a cool zero on the celsius scale tho! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif
 
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Fine,you can't understand why I'm not willing to adapt my driving to suit the gearbox,and I can't accept why you are.

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As a matter of interest, did you adapt your driving style to suit a diesel when you bought one.

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and waiting for the turbo to spool up.

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and that would happen in a manaul anyway would it not? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif
 
I think you have hit the nail on the head LeMan. If you are not prepared to adapt to something different, then stick to what you know. Don't buy a DSG (especially without test driving one first) and expect it to behave the same as a manual gearbox, even in what some people refer to as manual mode - In the User's Guide Audi refer to it as the tiptronic mode). It is not a manual gearbox and was not designed to be a manual gearbox.
 
Well picking up my lagging DSG version tomrrow so will post my views as and when. Am just glad I didn't pick it up today
 
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Fine,you can't understand why I'm not willing to adapt my driving to suit the gearbox,and I can't accept why you are.

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As a matter of interest, did you adapt your driving style to suit a diesel when you bought one.

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and waiting for the turbo to spool up.

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and that would happen in a manaul anyway would it not? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

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Have you only read parts of this thread ?...sheesh...

As has been said before here,one is able to avoid lag in a manual by getting the revs up and slipping the clutch.

DSG does not allow that so,when you sit at a junction and press the throttle,the car is expected to accelerate from tickover,which it struggles to do until the turbo,eventually,kicks in.

We're not talking ages here,which is why some may not notice,but even a slight delay can be annoying,or dangerous,when you're joining flowing traffic.
 
[ QUOTE ]
As has been said before here,one is able to avoid lag in a manual by getting the revs up and slipping the clutch.

DSG does not allow that so,when you sit at a junction and press the throttle,the car is expected to accelerate from tickover,which it struggles to do until the turbo,eventually,kicks in.

We're not talking ages here,which is why some may not notice,but even a slight delay can be annoying,or dangerous,when you're joining flowing traffic.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's a fault of the engine, not the gearbox.
VW should tune it so the turbo delivers more low down grunt. My 2.0T doesn't suffer that fate, nor does a 3.2 DSG.

However, i'm not convinced that DSG is suited to the 2.0TDI, the one that i drove did feel laggy... agreed. Diesel engines, although strong performers, do behave very differently to performance petrol engines. And as such may not be 100% suited to a quick shifting gearbox.
 

I disagree, I think the DSG is better suited to the Tdi engine due to the narrow power band. I find myself changing gear a lot more in my Tdi then I ever did in any of my previous petrol engined cars.

J.
 
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I disagree, I think the DSG is better suited to the Tdi engine due to the narrow power band. I find myself changing gear a lot more in my Tdi then I ever did in any of my previous petrol engined cars.

J.

[/ QUOTE ]

So expense and cost saving aside... you'd rather have DSG in a 2.0TDI than a 2.0T or 3.2
 
Let me think.....

50-55mpg, 0-60 less in less than 8sec (not that I use it much), in gear acceleration that leaves most other cars floundering.........

Yup diesel does it for me every time!

I tried the 2.0T and 3.2, nice cars, couldn't live with the consumption or the need to change down when I wanted to accelerate on motorways.
 
[ QUOTE ]

So expense and cost saving aside... you'd rather have DSG in a 2.0TDI than a 2.0T or 3.2

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Like I said the DSG gearbox, IMHO of course, suits the diesel engine extremely well due to the narrow power band.
 
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DSG does not allow that so,when you sit at a junction and press the throttle,the car is expected to accelerate from tickover,which it struggles to do until the turbo,eventually,kicks in.


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I'm not convinced thats exactly what's happening. I think it shifts up too quickly (i.e. almost immediately) then when you floor to try and get the damn thing to pull away it kicks down into first again and whooof!

I was trying it again in D last night and found that if you're really gentle with your right foot it does pull away reasonably well.
 
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[ QUOTE ]


DSG does not allow that so,when you sit at a junction and press the throttle,the car is expected to accelerate from tickover,which it struggles to do until the turbo,eventually,kicks in.


[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not convinced thats exactly what's happening. I think it shifts up too quickly (i.e. almost immediately) then when you floor to try and get the damn thing to pull away it kicks down into first again and whooof!

I was trying it again in D last night and found that if you're really gentle with your right foot it does pull away reasonably well.

[/ QUOTE ]

beaker, I think you're right. Sometimes in D, if you boot it reasonably hard from a standstill, especially if turning it changes to 2nd, then decides it wants 1st, giving you the 'kangaroo' effect. But then D mode is for lazy gits, so don't get the problem in S or manual /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
I agree, I don't think I would enjoy driving a 2.0TDI without a DSG. I did test drive a manual version before make my final choice but there was just too much gear changing compaired with my previous 1.8T Sports. I also tried the 2.0FSI and whilst there was less gear changing there was very little go at all at low revs when compared to the TDI.

I certainly could not afford the fuel consumption of the 2.0T or 3.2 and personally I prefer the SE to the Sport and you can only get the 2.0T and 3.2 in Sport mode.

So the 2.0TDI DSG SE is currently the best A3 for me.
 
[ QUOTE ]
I agree, I don't think I would enjoy driving a 2.0TDI without a DSG. I did test drive a manual version before make my final choice but there was just too much gear changing compaired with my previous 1.8T Sports.


[/ QUOTE ]

There is more gearchanging involved when switching from a manual petrol to a manual diesel,but that's not comparing apples with apples.

If you were to drive a manual tdi now,after being used to the engine in a DSG,you may be surprised.

It's honestly like a different engine,as someone else on here also noted when they got a shot of a manual.

It seems far more flexible,simply because you are able to use the whole rev range without the gearbox changing for you (up or down).

I think the gearing is higher in a manual as well,meaning you can hold onto a gear longer.

For example,I found myself being able to use third gear for ages,where the DSG would have been constantly flitting between second,third and fourth.

In my opinion,manual makes the engine seem flexible,whereas DSG makes the engine 'fussy',for want of better word.
 
I've been following this thread for a while, and have found the differing opinions fascinating. Having never driven a DSG-equipped car, I can't offer a direct opinion on the driving experience.

However, I have a question about the technical aspects of the DSG, and how it differs from the Tiptronic box that I have.

Am I right in thinking that like my Tiptronic auto, the DSG is an automatic gearbox with a facility for manual control (subject to certain pre-programmed overrides), but instead of a torque converter, it has electronically-actuated friction clutches?
 
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I agree, I don't think I would enjoy driving a 2.0TDI without a DSG. I did test drive a manual version before make my final choice but there was just too much gear changing compaired with my previous 1.8T Sports.


[/ QUOTE ]

There is more gearchanging involved when switching from a manual petrol to a manual diesel,but that's not comparing apples with apples.

If you were to drive a manual tdi now,after being used to the engine in a DSG,you may be surprised.

It's honestly like a different engine,as someone else on here also noted when they got a shot of a manual.

It seems far more flexible,simply because you are able to use the whole rev range without the gearbox changing for you (up or down).

I think the gearing is higher in a manual as well,meaning you can hold onto a gear longer.

For example,I found myself being able to use third gear for ages,where the DSG would have been constantly flitting between second,third and fourth.

In my opinion,manual makes the engine seem flexible,whereas DSG makes the engine 'fussy',for want of better word.

[/ QUOTE ]

It's only 'fussy' if you drive around in D. How can it be fussy in manual mode. You get just as big a rev range as in the manual, except that 200rpm in the red that no one else uses.
 
[ QUOTE ]
It's only 'fussy' if you drive around in D. How can it be fussy in manual mode. You get just as big a rev range as in the manual, except that 200rpm in the red that no one else uses.

[/ QUOTE ]

Exactly, and it only changes up on it's own at times where the car would either a/ stall or b/ hit the limiter.

I've had DSG in my GTI well in the red before and it never changed up of it's own accord
 
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I agree, I don't think I would enjoy driving a 2.0TDI without a DSG. I did test drive a manual version before make my final choice but there was just too much gear changing compaired with my previous 1.8T Sports.


[/ QUOTE ]

There is more gearchanging involved when switching from a manual petrol to a manual diesel,but that's not comparing apples with apples.

If you were to drive a manual tdi now,after being used to the engine in a DSG,you may be surprised.

It's honestly like a different engine,as someone else on here also noted when they got a shot of a manual.

It seems far more flexible,simply because you are able to use the whole rev range without the gearbox changing for you (up or down).

I think the gearing is higher in a manual as well,meaning you can hold onto a gear longer.

For example,I found myself being able to use third gear for ages,where the DSG would have been constantly flitting between second,third and fourth.

In my opinion,manual makes the engine seem flexible,whereas DSG makes the engine 'fussy',for want of better word.

[/ QUOTE ]

It's only 'fussy' if you drive around in D. How can it be fussy in manual mode. You get just as big a rev range as in the manual, except that 200rpm in the red that no one else uses.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't agree Japper.

Of all the modes,I find 'S' the fussiest,with the thing changing up and down like some chavved up Corsa boy trying to make out he's going faster than he is.


I found third gear,for example,(in the manual) could go down to lower speeds and up to higher speeds than third in the DSG,so you're staying in the one gear where the DSG would have changed down and up (even in manual mode).

So it made the engine seem far more flexible,to me.

I also preferred the instant throttle response of the manual,compared with the delays one can encounter with DSG.

No DSG owner can convince me they haven't,at some point,been a victim of DSG where pressing the throttle (in any mode) leads to a downchange,or upchange,that you didn't ask for,sometimes at very inopportune moments.



 
[ QUOTE ]
I've been following this thread for a while, and have found the differing opinions fascinating. Having never driven a DSG-equipped car, I can't offer a direct opinion on the driving experience.

However, I have a question about the technical aspects of the DSG, and how it differs from the Tiptronic box that I have.

Am I right in thinking that like my Tiptronic auto, the DSG is an automatic gearbox with a facility for manual control (subject to certain pre-programmed overrides), but instead of a torque converter, it has electronically-actuated friction clutches?

[/ QUOTE ]

Bump.
 
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I agree, I don't think I would enjoy driving a 2.0TDI without a DSG. I did test drive a manual version before make my final choice but there was just too much gear changing compaired with my previous 1.8T Sports.


[/ QUOTE ]

There is more gearchanging involved when switching from a manual petrol to a manual diesel,but that's not comparing apples with apples.

If you were to drive a manual tdi now,after being used to the engine in a DSG,you may be surprised.

It's honestly like a different engine,as someone else on here also noted when they got a shot of a manual.

It seems far more flexible,simply because you are able to use the whole rev range without the gearbox changing for you (up or down).

I think the gearing is higher in a manual as well,meaning you can hold onto a gear longer.

For example,I found myself being able to use third gear for ages,where the DSG would have been constantly flitting between second,third and fourth.

In my opinion,manual makes the engine seem flexible,whereas DSG makes the engine 'fussy',for want of better word.

[/ QUOTE ]

It's only 'fussy' if you drive around in D. How can it be fussy in manual mode. You get just as big a rev range as in the manual, except that 200rpm in the red that no one else uses.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't agree Japper.

Of all the modes,I find 'S' the fussiest,with the thing changing up and down like some chavved up Corsa boy trying to make out he's going faster than he is.


I found third gear,for example,(in the manual) could go down to lower speeds and up to higher speeds than third in the DSG,so you're staying in the one gear where the DSG would have changed down and up (even in manual mode).

So it made the engine seem far more flexible,to me.

I also preferred the instant throttle response of the manual,compared with the delays one can encounter with DSG.

No DSG owner can convince me they haven't,at some point,been a victim of DSG where pressing the throttle (in any mode) leads to a downchange,or upchange,that you didn't ask for,sometimes at very inopportune moments.





[/ QUOTE ]

Pressing the throttle in D and S and yes the computer decides what gear it wants. DSG in manual mode WILL NOT change gear on throttle openings unless you hit the kickdown switch, or if it's going to stall or hit the rev limiter.......FACT.
 
I know what you mean Japper,but I still sometimes find manual lacks response as well.

It's hard to put into words but I'll try;

If you approach a roundabout/junction in second,with the revs low(ish),you only seem to have a choice of accelerating quite slowly in second,or forcing a change down to first which results in such a jerk that your face practically smacks off the wheel,and it makes you look like a right eejit.

In that scenario,in a manual,one would just briefly slip the clutch in second and you're off.

Know what I mean ?
 
I've never slipped a clutch on the move in the said gear, seems like a real plonky way to drive to me!
 
[ QUOTE ]
I've never slipped a clutch on the move in the said gear, seems like a real plonky way to drive to me!

[/ QUOTE ]

Oh hardly...

Slightly slipping ( or 'dipping') the clutch is a perfectly acceptable way of getting the revs up in a manual car,rather than changing down to a lower gear.

It's especially useful in cars that need to be at certain revs to get going properly.

For example,my Alfa 156 was gutless below 4000 revs,but flew above it,so I would often slip the clutch a wee bit to get it going.

Just because you haven't heard of it doesn't mean it's "plonky".

Give it a go next time you're driving a manual car and need to accelerate that wee bit quicket,you might like it !
 
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