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Thread: Taking one for the team: Revo Stage 1 Case Study on S3 8P3 (MY2012)

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    warren_S5's Avatar
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    Post Taking one for the team: Revo Stage 1 Case Study on S3 8P3 (MY2012)

    Writing a thread about having my car remapped to stage 1 is in the grand scheme of things is a pretty unexceptional thing to be writing about on a forum in 2011.

    However, the reason I'm bothering to write a thread is because as we've seen there have been numerous threads popping up recently where owners of facelift S3's are suffering issues once their cars are modified with code.

    Scope of the test
    Basically at 2,000 miles I'm content the car is running in well and has no identified issues. Its been run in very sympathetically, so I was comfortable that now was the right baseline point to be putting code on the car. The car has been run on either Tesco Momentum 99RON or Shell V-Power since day 1, and has been used predominantly for motorway mileage.

    Other modifications
    The only other engine mod on the car is a Forge DV hose which goes from the DV to the MAF pipe.

    Tuner
    The weapon of choice for this case study is (unsurprisingly!) Revo Stage 1 (V10). I decided to have it installed at the HQ so they could run some basic tests on the car and ensure:
    1. It wasn't already logging misfires
    2. There weren't any error codes
    3. They could take the car out and do some very basic logging to ensure they were content the car left HQ in optimum condition
    1)The service boss man, RevoKev, demonstrating the international symbol for do you want a brew


    The car was taken into the HQ and was tested on VAGCOM for misfires (Channel 015), and there was nothing to note. There were no DTC's either which was encouraging, so Carl & Kev set about getting the code loaded on the car.

    2) Parked up in HQ (JonnyC's TT-RS in the background)


    3) Check out those silver £46 indicator bulbs, worth almost the £3 they cost to produce in China


    4) You think it's black, but it's Panther Crystal ;-)



    The journey home
    I'm pleased to say the journey home was incident free, and my lord what a massive difference stage 1 offers for very reasonable money. It feels so much more urgent than factory spec, and third and fourth gear are just a dream. It feels the car it should have been from factory, and having been at Stage 2+ in my last 8P2 I can confidently say that for me there are 2 optimal routes for your modification path:-

    1) Go for stage 1 and stay there
    2) Go 2+ with all required mods

    Stage 1 delivers exceptional value for money, and maybe add a CAI and you've got a very potent piece of kit. There's no question, the DP, cats, HPFP and Stage 2+ code add a real noticeable difference, but you must leave budget for clutch and I/C to optimise the set up. I aim to get this done in April/May 2012. It gives us 4 months to see if we can replicate any of the faults experienced by other users.

    As I'd run the car in so gently Kev decided to set the Boost setting to 6, the timing to 4, and the fuelling to 9, and whilst this sounds conservative our plan is to see how it runs for a couple of weeks and then dial up the settings as it beds in.

    So what now?
    So now we run the car and see if it starts to misfire, and if so when. I'll be keeping records of mileage / fuel / journey types / observations as we go.

    If we get any issues I'll be heading straight back to Revo HQ who have kindly offered to use the car as a case study to see if there are any identifiable issues that can be pinpointed for the greater good of all, so many thanks to them for extending this offer to us.

    I'll be keeping NGK UK in the loop of spark plug developments to see if they can offer any insight or guidance, which may involve trying alternative plug gaps and running with all the available plug alternatives.

    So now all we can do is sit and wait, but if anyone else finds anything useful in the meantime on this subject I'm more than happy for you to post it in here (symptoms / remedies etc.).

    Fingers crossed!

    To go straight to the 2000 mile review post, click HERE
    Last edited by warren_S5; 14th February 2012 at 16:01.
    FranA3, S., Kelza and 1 others like this.

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    RicoS3's Avatar
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    Superb write up as always Warren and a very commendable effort offering yourself up ;-)

    Hopefully you'll not experience any issues, but if you do, they are resolved quickly and efficiently.

    To hijack slightly, how nice did JC's TT look in the flesh? Did you happen to get a run in the mapped S4? Some tasty figures for stage 1 on that beast.
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    S3Alex's Avatar
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    Excellent write up Warren,and I hope you enjoy the car.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RicoS3 View Post
    To hijack slightly, how nice did JC's TT look in the flesh? Did you happen to get a run in the mapped S4? Some tasty figures for stage 1 on that beast.
    It looked exceptional, and the 5 cylinder lump is just sublime. They've done some exceptional work on this and with the wrap it's just stunning. Words don't do it justice.

    I'm heading back to Revo in late January for a first 'check up' at which point I have plans to get out in the mapped S4, S5, and the mapped RS3. Over 400bhp on the S4 is a great uplift.

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    As others have said Warren, great write-up and I know I wont be the only one watching this closely before going ahead and getting my car mapped, as apart from being the SB version, the model, year and mileage is exactly the same as your own car.

    Keep the updates coming :-)

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    manual or s tronic? having the same dilemna but running s tronic

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    Manual, so clutch is made of dairy lea!

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    Great write up, im so damn excited to get my s3 mapped!
    2006 Audi S3, Phantom Black, Bluetooth/Phone prep, Dvd Satnav, Cruise Control, Auto light and wiper pack, Bose, Addaptive Headlights, Through load in rear seats......... Shark Stage 1 - Pipercross Venom CAI - H&R 25mm Springs - Black Optics Grill.....


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    FranA3's Avatar
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    nicely done warren , that paint
    ​She is back on the road yay!!

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    yeah that paint is saweeet. i m having the same dilemna, want a revo stage 1 but dont want to open a can of works of problems

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    Quote Originally Posted by warren_cox View Post
    4) You think it's black, but it's Panther Crystal ;-)
    That is all.

    Quote Originally Posted by warren_cox View Post
    There's no question, the DP, cats, HPFP and Stage 2+ code add a real noticeable difference, but you must leave budget for clutch and I/C to optimise the set up.
    How far can you take a DSG without having to worry about the clutch?
    Coss

    S3 S-tronic: Panther Black, lots of extras, MTM remap


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    Also, just to note on this thread (may as well keep the posts on the issues in one thread...) that mine went into Audi today and the car logged a misfire. They have no idea what caused the misfire or what cylinder(s) it misfired on, and because the car has been absolutly fine for about a week now, they cant do much else. So I will wait and see if the hesitations come back and when they get more regular, I'll pop down to Kim and see what he can find.

    But yea, kudos for trying to sort out this problem once and for all mate!
    Coss

    S3 S-tronic: Panther Black, lots of extras, MTM remap


  14. #13
    warren_S5's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lil_coz View Post
    That is all.



    How far can you take a DSG without having to worry about the clutch?
    Not 100% sure, but it's a damn site further than on manual! Wonder how launch control would cope with S2+

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    FranA3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by warren_cox View Post
    Wonder how launch control would cope with S2+
    prob wouldn't be as bad as the ESP on the merc black series haha
    ​She is back on the road yay!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by FranA3 View Post
    prob wouldn't be as bad as the ESP on the merc black series haha
    You'd hope not! It's the other reason I stayed with manual as I don't mind a clutch replacement but didn't fancy any bigger issues with a DSG box if Stg2+ took its toll over time. Im sure they are super strong and reliable by now, but tell that to the dealership when you have a £5k bill and no warranty!

    I guess if it works in RS5 then they're pretty much sorted by now, I'm probably more likely to knacker my own gearbox to be fair!

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    BOSSS3's Avatar
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    Warren i thouroughly enjoy reading your posts. Every post you put up are of use and are from a non bias standpoint. thanks mate
    2008 Audi S3
    REVO Stage 1

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    Quote Originally Posted by BOSSS3 View Post
    and are from a non bias standpoint. thanks mate
    Feel it's my duty as a mod, there are no favours, no favouritism, and after 20 years of modding / 10 years on forums I've become pretty tired of cliques, urban myths and over inflated pub talk. The world judges me by my most recent actions, so I offer that same favour in return, but try and make sure I report on these experiences in a way people have a chance to make up their own minds. I'm just a regular bloke with a view to share, and a mission to ensure we all live lives with our eyes wide open.

    Really appreciate the comment mate.
    Last edited by warren_S5; 22nd December 2011 at 08:05.

  19. #18
    Chugger

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    How does this sit with Audi when it comes to remapping a new car? I mean in regards to the warranty
    57 A3 2.0 TDI Sportback (140)

  20. #19
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    As Audi have failed to embrace the future they unfortunately have to be fed on a diet of 'they know what they need to know'.

    If I blow my engine then it's my deal, but I don't trust my local dealership not to try and use a remap as an excuse for trying to bypass a warranty claim on a split washer bottle.

    Case of what they don't know doesn't hurt them for now. Eventually when they embrace tuning like BMW/ Saab/ Vauxhall /Ford.... then we can all be honest an upfront.

  21. #20
    Chugger

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    But they can scan your ecu and see thats it's remapped if it ever did come to warranty work being done?

    I can understand why they don't approve, everything nowadays isn't exactly 'over engineered', so more stress on the certain parts is going to spell trouble.
    57 A3 2.0 TDI Sportback (140)

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    plezz's Avatar
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    Lol, this wins my vote for the most philosophical forum post of the week.

    Quote Originally Posted by warren_cox View Post
    Feel it's my duty as a mod, there are no favours, no favouritism, and after 20 years of modding / 10 years on forums I've become pretty tired of cliques, urban myths and over inflated pub talk. The world judges me by my most recent actions, so I offer that same favour in return, but try and make sure I report on these experiences in a way people have a chance to make up their own minds. I'm just a regular bloke with a view to share, and a mission to ensure we all live lives with our eyes wide open.

    Really appreciate the comment mate.

  23. #22
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    Cheers Plezz

    Let's hope it continues that way as the aim of this thread is to finally put an end to all those remap bashing threads, and make people realise there is seriously limited bandwidth in the OEM hardware. It's little more than Golf GTi spec in some cases.

    What I got sick of was the venom vented towards some of the tuning companies who are just doing their best to give us what we want.

    There is an over-bearing passion to knock Revo particularly, and given the high percentage of Revo cars it would always be their cars that were likely to show up first. However since some MTM cars have shown similar issues the 'haters' have backed off and shut the f@@k up which can only be helpful is stopping the systemic torrent of bull**** and conjecture that was starting to flow all too freely.

    This thread will be warts and all, nothing hidden, plain, upfront and philosophical!
    Last edited by warren_S5; 22nd December 2011 at 11:07.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sportstractor View Post
    But they can scan your ecu and see thats it's remapped if it ever did come to warranty work being done?

    I can understand why they don't approve, everything nowadays isn't exactly 'over engineered', so more stress on the certain parts is going to spell trouble.
    Yes they can, but if issues got that bad there are ways and means. I do agree with what your saying, but if they built an S that went like an S then we'd not be given this predicament. I'm sure code counters can be 'reset'.

  25. #24
    Spin140's Avatar
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    Great initial write up as usual warren and look forward to the honest feedback I know you will give. I too get frustrated with all the Remap bashing that goes on, guess I'm lucky as I have yet to encounter any problems apart for the expected clutch slip when reaching stage 2+ on all the cars I have had mapped.

    I'll be visiting Kev in the next 2 weeks and have to say have never experienced anything but excellent & supportive service.

    Look forward to the updates
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  26. #25
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    I think you've hit it just right Warren.

    There are more cars running Revo software than most others and on a numerical basis it would be surprising if they didn't corner more complaints.

    I have had nothing but good service and sensible free advice from them and also a very fast reliable car into the bargain courtesy of Revo and AMD.

    Nice to see some balance restored.

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    unless they delve into the code itself i see no way they will ever know. Nice work Warren

  28. #27
    paddy's Avatar
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    Well done Warren. Are you starting with the factory Bosch plugs ? Interesting to see Kev has set your timing to 4 to start off, mine was set to 2 which is default stg1 download setting. I now run 5 which improves throttle response no end over 2, fuel air is default at 9 for 99ron and seems to work fine so my settings are 6-5-9 at present and all seems well. i think this is a good example of why the ,map needs to be fine tuned from the download settings from revo. People get the map loaded and think that's it and some are surprised there is not a world of difference but you need to down load the set up guide from revo and use it with their recommended VCDS logging or you will be stuck on timing 2 instead of 5 or 6 for example.
    Looking forward to hearing your final three settings for Boost fuel timing
    cheers
    P
    Ibis white Revo S3 and now matching Vivaro LWB HR 2900 :-)

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  29. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by paddy View Post
    Well done Warren. Are you starting with the factory Bosch plugs ?
    P
    Yep, for the sake of all those who just map and forget I thought I'd start basic.

    If we get issues I may try adding a CAI or re-gapping plugs to see if anything improves. One fix at a time, time to allow car to adapt. If no better try something else. I'm obviously hoping there will be no issues, but given the number of issues experienced this year that's just misplaced optimism!
    S3 Rav likes this.

  30. #29
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    Just a quick note on defaults...

    ...There isn't a default setting for any car to be left in, there is a default setting after the flash completes and a basic setting on the SPS but these are not settings that we recommend any dealers sends cars out in. ALL cars should be logged and set-up prior to being sent out. Timing 2 is not 'the default setting' what it is, is a low 'safe' setting, only put on the switches to be used if you haven't set-up your three performance modes! Hope that makes sense.

    Great to see you yesterday Warren, we'll see you again in the new year when the car's done a few more miles and we can see how it's getting on!

    Merry Christmas everyone!
    Kev

    Revo Technik
    www.revotechnik.com

  31. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by RevoKev View Post
    Just a quick note on defaults...

    ...There isn't a default setting for any car to be left in, there is a default setting after the flash completes and a basic setting on the SPS but these are not settings that we recommend any dealers sends cars out in. ALL cars should be logged and set-up prior to being sent out. Timing 2 is not 'the default setting' what it is, is a low 'safe' setting, only put on the switches to be used if you haven't set-up your three performance modes! Hope that makes sense.

    Great to see you yesterday Warren, we'll see you again in the new year when the car's done a few more miles and we can see how it's getting on!

    Merry Christmas everyone!
    Spot on Kev, just out of curiosity, what fuelling setting was it set to?

    Cheers

    W

  32. #31
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    Kev
    You need to explain that to dealers. I went to the local revo set up and they installed revo. There is no mention of further set up or tuning in fact had i not bought a SPS switch i would have been non the wiser that the std map was even adjustable from its installed setting..It took me and the girl from reception a Saturday morning to work out how the SPS switch even worked as no one had a clue. the whole package cost me £707 and then i find Revo want to charge me £2 extra for a sticker.....
    This is not a complaint, just bringing to your attention a customer experience
    Ibis white Revo S3 and now matching Vivaro LWB HR 2900 :-)

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  33. #32
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    That's really upsetting to read, all of the dealers go through training and receive Revo documentation (dealer manual, product data-sheets, set-up guides) of which all of the emphasis is on vehicle setup. Dealers that do not set up vehicles are in my eyes f****** useless and I would advise our sales team to shut down. Please let me know which dealer you had this poor experience with so I follow up and make sure they a. understand where they've gone wrong, b. are retrained or c. are shut down.

    Warren, fuelling adjustment shouldn't be touched unless the fuel system has been uprated. I.e. the recommended fuel setting on a stage 1 and 2 car is #9. Just for clarification ALL dealers are aware of this as well.

    For any dealer/customer we are here to call ask questions and give advise.
    Kev

    Revo Technik
    www.revotechnik.com

  34. #33
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    Good work mate, I'll be watching this like a hawk!
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  35. #34
    RPB
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    I will be watching this too as ATM will not ramap with the issues I keep reading about. For the money paid here I had a bespoke map on my old car. Road mapped and tested until bang on. It stayed that way for 7 yrs and was superb. I would like, no sorry, I expect nothing less from any other code no matter who does it! So, until that happens, I won't be trusting any Audi remap.
    2011 61 plate S3 SB BE DSG - Shark Stage 1 + DSG

  36. #35
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    i just wish i could join in with all the remap debate they don't even do a remap for the 1.6 TDI :'(

  37. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by plezz View Post
    i just wish i could join in with all the remap debate they don't even do a remap for the 1.6 TDI :'(
    Might be on the cards, have you spoken to any of the tuners about it?

  38. #37
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    Excellent work buddy...watching this like a hawk :-)
    IceHanger
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    Watching with interest. Had read alot of the other threads about remaps on this year's S3 so will be watching this to see how it ends up. TBH at the moment 265hp already feels pretty quick!

    Gandy
    Audi S3 Sportback Black Edition | Open Sky | Comfort Pack | Interior Light Pack | Black paint

  40. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gandy View Post
    Watching with interest. Had read alot of the other threads about remaps on this year's S3 so will be watching this to see how it ends up. TBH at the moment 265hp already feels pretty quick!

    Gandy
    With 300+ the mid range acceleration is superb!

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    What plugs do you have in there atm Warren?

 

 
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