Chris NottMonster Motorsport
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  1. #81
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    Re: Caught doing 98mph :(

    Well that's plainly garbage ScoTTy.
    Obviously they have to take an average when investigating an accident, but to say the margin is narrow is pure b*llox.
    Mini Mk1 with drum brakes all round can stop roughly in the same distance as an RS4?
    I don't think so, you'd be looking at 50% diffrence at least and that's not even taking into account ABS, state of the tyres (crappy old car is far more likely to have sh*te tyres).
    I agree that brand new cars will be closer, but that's not what Eeef was saying.

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  3. #82
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    Re: Caught doing 98mph :(

    To be honest I agree but that's not how it's painted by the Police, the courts or advance driving instructors.

    p.s. I also don't understand how all road cars have the same maximum speed around a bend (subject to them having enough power of course!) but this is also what they use.

  4. #83
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    Re: Caught doing 98mph :(

    [ QUOTE ]
    An ABS fitted car will stop quicker than a non-ABS car, and then we have cars fitted with ABS and EBD!!!! So, no, not all cars are created equal!!!!

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Not true an ABS equip'd car will take longer to stop than a non ABS car BUT with the ABS you will be able to steer, if your a decent driver and can pump the brakes in a non ABS car you can create the same effect of course.

    J.

  5. #84
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    Re: Caught doing 98mph :(

    Sorry but an ABS car will stop quicker, the system allows the wheels to be at maximum retardation, something only a very skilled driver could do and then not in all conditions. I did see something a while back which quoted the percentage reduced stopping distance with ABS, cant remember the numbers, but it was considerable. A skidding wheel is not a braking wheel, also with locked wheels you are unable to steer. But ABS allows the wheel to be at maximum right on the point of locking. It was banned from racing cars as it was considered to take out some skill and render all cars the same.

    Also one of my best friends was a crash investigator for the Bill. He says that the lack of any skid marks to measure on modern ABS cars makes life very difficult.

    Guy at work (in an Impreza) has been pulled for 115mph in a 50 limit in Leicester, case comes up May 14th, think they might throw the book at him....

  6. #85
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    Re: Caught doing 98mph :(


    Hmmmm not entirely true but neither was above statement. abs will improve stopping distances in some circumstnaces but lengthen in others.

    Seems like in day t day driving it will shorten, although I am sure that I watched something a while back on a motoring program that ABS took longer but I think I may be mistaken after doing some research using good old google.

    In slippery (ICE, Mud, Gravel, snow - generally soft conditions) conditions it would appear ABS lengthens the stopping distances but in the dry/wet it shortens!

    Oh well it would appear I'm not right but not wrong either...

    J.

  7. #86
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    Re: Caught doing 98mph :(

    ABS wasn't designed to shorten distances. It was designed to leave you in control so you could take avoiding action.

  8. #87
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    Re: Caught doing 98mph :(

    I saw a top gear thing where they bought old heaps and tested them against each other in various ways. One of which was a braking distance test. Admittedly we are talking about 15 year old cars, but only one of them had ABS and from 50mph (I think it was 50) the ABS Volvo stopped maybe 25% quicker.

    To get back to the point - I agree with whoever said we need revised speed limits. The originals were based on bloody old cars with crappy brakes and crappy handling.

    I would like an 85mph motoway limit, with a 75 limit when raining. Both limits could be enforced as strictly as they like - ie you could get nicked for 1mph over the limit. This would be much fairer and less hypocritical than getting nicked for doing 85mph when everyone else does it anyway.

  9. #88
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    Re: Caught doing 98mph :(

    As said, ABS does actually in theoretical situation shorten the breaking distance. However, currently used ABS systems just don't quite reach that theoretical limit, and so they provide pretty much the same breaking distance as optimum.

    However, there are some interesting results on slippery condition, ice for example. A Finnish magazine (Tekniikan Maailma) did a test with Golf V, with ABS on, off, with winter tyres and with studded winter tyres. Pretty weird results in the end, with ABS on the winter tyre stopped at 400m on ice. At the same time, ABS on with the studded, the distance was 210m. Optimum breaking, and locking didn't affect results with studded tyres a lot, but on non-studded ones they worked better. So something isn't working with non-studded tyres, ice and current ABS systems [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

    - Yak

  10. #89
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    Re: Caught doing 98mph :(

    It obvious that you'll stop quicker with a studded tyre on ice,more grip,after-all thats why we put studs on football boots (not that you play football on ice.)well you might up nooooooooooorth
    Back to the point about ABS,abs will stop a lot quicker and safer than normal braking.It stops you from skidding and keeps you in control.Even in the wet.
    The only way it won't stop you quicker is when you have a build up of material in-front of the tyre, on a loose surface i.e snow or gravel etc it acts as a wedge at the front of the tyre.

  11. #90
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    Re: Caught doing 98mph :(

    [ QUOTE ]
    Sorry but an ABS car will stop quicker,

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Only in panic mode.

    ABS will stop you quicker than simply locking up your wheels. It won't stop you quicker than finding the exact balance point between grip/skid. As MB stated though, it does have the advantage of letting you steer around that woman who just pulled out in front of you...

  12. #91
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    Re: Caught doing 98mph :(

    Some ABS systems can have disastrous effects if you have 2 wheels on a slippery surface (like a grass verge) and the other 2 on the road.

    As already said in the right conditions the quickest way to stop can be a 4 wheel straight line skid.

  13. #92
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    Re: Caught doing 98mph :(

    Except if you have EBD as well! The EBD system will route the most braking force to the wheels that are on the road. The same goes for a good driver "pumping" the brakes, he/she could never simulate the rapid response of an ABS system. The driver won't realise that only one or 2 of his wheels are actually locked, and pumping the breaks will not stop him any quicker. Do you think car manufacturers are spending millions on a system that doesn't make any difference? [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/swear.gif[/img]! Same goes for traction control, even Michael Schumacher uses it!

  14. #93
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    Re: Caught doing 98mph :(


    If traction control's so great them why does everyone turn it off when doing a spirited run, competing in the traffic light grand prix etc? Because it hinders progress, all these driver aids are for drivers of average or less ability!

    Schuey has traction control becuse he has a car that weights 600kg's and has 800bhp [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] (ok so my F1 car stats might be wrong but you get the idea)

    J.

  15. #94
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    Re: Caught doing 98mph :(

    [ QUOTE ]
    all these driver aids are for drivers of average or less ability!


    [/ QUOTE ]

    and to avoid litigation from said-same.

  16. #95
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    Re: Caught doing 98mph :(

    [ QUOTE ]
    If traction control's so great them why does everyone turn it off when doing a spirited run

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Because we all like living on the edge. That's when things get exciting.[img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/burningmad.gif[/img]

    [ QUOTE ]
    all these driver aids are for drivers of average or less ability!

    [/ QUOTE ]

    or for the unexpected (regardless of how good a driver you are). I bet Ayrton Senna wishes he had traction control! [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img]

  17. #96
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    Re: Caught doing 98mph :(


    No just F'ing big bumpers on his car...

  18. #97
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    Re: Caught doing 98mph :(

    [ QUOTE ]
    I bet Ayrton Senna wishes he had traction control! [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img]

    [/ QUOTE ]

    and traction control does what when your car 'bellies out',and your wheels aren't touching the tarmac,exactly ??

  19. #98
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    Re: Caught doing 98mph :(

    [ QUOTE ]
    [ QUOTE ]
    I bet Ayrton Senna wishes he had traction control! [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img]

    [/ QUOTE ]

    and traction control does what when your car 'bellies out',and your wheels aren't touching the tarmac,exactly ??

    [/ QUOTE ]

    produces wings and helps you fly [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/****_you.gif[/img]

  20. #99
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    Re: Caught doing 98mph :(

    [ QUOTE ]
    [ QUOTE ]
    If traction control's so great them why does everyone turn it off when doing a spirited run

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Because we all like living on the edge. That's when things get exciting.[img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/burningmad.gif[/img]


    [/ QUOTE ]

    Nothing to do with the fact we have understeery cars then??

  21. #100
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    Re: Caught doing 98mph :(


    what about BMW's or Merc's traction control systems? They are truly awful and spoil your fun! the 330coupe sport does like a bit of oversteer

    J.

  22. #101
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    Re: Caught doing 98mph :(

    trex, you misunderstood me now. Of course studded tyres stop better, that wasn't my point. What I meant was that some ABS systems (like the one used in Golf V) doesn't function properly on ice with winter tyres, unless there's certain amount of grip, which studded tyres give.

    So this will give interesting results with ABS turned on, your car won't stop [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

    But we're lucky that instead of mk60 used in Golf V, A3 has mk70.

  23. #102
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    Re: Caught doing 98mph :(

    Well, even though this thread has been dead for a while:
    I've been to court this morning, got to say that one of the magistrates was a bit of a w*nker, telling me there is a time and a place?
    However, I've been given 4 penalty points and a 290 fine (includes 40 court costs)
    I'm reasonably happy with the result, it could have been worse :S

  24. #103
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    Re: Caught doing 98mph :(

    reminds me of when i got a bollocking off the CID for clocking a car and selling it to a detective (accidently).

    haha, he got [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/swear.gif[/img].

    ...then i found out 2 years later he was involved in ringing! what goes around comes around.

  25. #104
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    Re: Caught doing 98mph :(

    I'd love to know what the magistrate thinks is the RIGHT "time and place" for 98mph... as it's against the law and he's meant to be upholding it!

  26. #105
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    Re: Caught doing 98mph :(

    on a track?

  27. #106
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    Re: Caught doing 98mph :(

    i got 5 points and 220 fine, didnt go to court as i couldnt c the point. 98.9 mph. nasty.

  28. #107
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    Re: Caught doing 98mph :(

    Whats done is done mate. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beerchug.gif[/img]

 

 
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