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  1. #1
    ~RS~'s Avatar
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    3.2 Quattro sportback questions

    Hi,

    Thinking about the possibility of getting a 3.2 SB, mainly as the 2.0T doesn't come in with a DSG box unless it 09' facelift model. Not looking to spend that much as (they are the same price as austerity spec S3 SB's!! Plus will be looking for a new car in 2012 to hang onto for a couple of years, and have the 'old shape syndrome', so that rules out the 09' 2.0T AWD.

    On the other hand the 3.2 is Quattro, DSG and if it sounds anything like the R32 Mk5 it's got a pepperami streak to it I understand that the tuning options are compromised due to the lack of aspiration, but also thinking that a 3.2V6 lump must be pretty quick all the same...

    I've read that it tends to understeer more due to the the iron lump the V6 has, not sure what to make of it until I test drive one as some moan about it while others seem to think it's fine round corners/ twists n bends as it has the quattro.

    Looking for some opinions on what it will be like to get shot of in 18 months time, anything I should be looking for problem wise (have had a good read through the software update thread, damn there was a shed load of work done by a few on that thread!) So I am aware of the fluttery idle around 2K due to software. Also seen a couple vids and posts on chain lengthening, apart from those 2 probs is that it? Or have a missed a few?

    Will be looking at a 40 - 50k s line, most I looked at have xenons, PDC phone prep, cruise and generally a good spec, lotta car for the money, if I do get it I have a few mods planned to keep me busy!

    Any advice if they take an age to get rid of and general things to watch out for appreciated
    Last edited by ~RS~; 9th December 2010 at 14:57.

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  3. #2
    audicruiser's Avatar
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    You could get the 2.0T with DSG before the facelift cars, but it was an option where as now it's standard.

    3.2's are cheap now due to running costs and high tax (post Mar 06 cars) so selling in 18 months time and with the new model out around then too, you may be hard pushed to sell it on, certainly for a good price anyway. 3.2's are generally well specced from new so are appealing from that respect.
    Scott

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  4. #3
    ~RS~'s Avatar
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    Cheers mate, wasn't aware of the cheaper tax on pre 06' cars. Couldn't find a DSG 2.0T quattro on the used car searches at all so I figured it didn't exist! Plus I don't recall anybody saying they had one... Is yours a 2.0T quattro DSG? (Bloody hell that's a mouthful!)

    I figured the same thing about getting rid in 18 or so months time, as everything is geared toward small engine big power (superchargers, turbo etc) now days. Ah well, guess it's back to looking for the needle in a haystack.
    Last edited by ~RS~; 9th December 2010 at 21:33.

  5. #4
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    Dont bother changing mate, 18 months with present car equals more saved up to get a nicer one then, given fuel costs & the 3.2 will drink it for sure & potentially cost allot to fix, stay with tdi for now as in 2 years you'd have saved a fair whack towards a new car you'd think, with almost double the mileage per tank than a 3.2 aswell.

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  6. #5
    audicruiser's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ~RS~ View Post
    Cheers mate, wasn't aware of the cheaper tax on pre 06' cars. Couldn't find a DSG 2.0T quattro on the used car searches at all so I figured it didn't exist! Plus I don't recall anybody saying they had one... Is yours a 2.0T quattro DSG? (Bloody hell that's a mouthful!)

    I figured the same thing about getting rid in 18 or so months time, as everything is geared toward small engine big power (superchargers, turbo etc) now days. Ah well, guess it's back to looking for the needle in a haystack.
    No mine a 6 speed manual. We have a DSG TDi 170 in the family, got it in April new. DSG is good, but I think I like the best of both worlds.
    Scott

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  7. #6
    paddy's Avatar
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    A few points that might help.

    The understeerr is a myth on the road. the 3.2 lump is one of the smallest dimension and compact V6's ever built. Push It to the edge on a track and you might find it but then the car is not set up for the track and those that are will be crap on the road anyway.
    It puts out near enough the same power as a S3 and is within .5 seconds to 60mph
    It is a far smoother engine than a Turbo and bottom end response is a lot better.
    It sounds great
    You will not have any trouble selling it. You might not get a lot for it but then your not going to pay a lot either.
    Pre 06 is cheaper tax but its only 150 which is 2 tanks of petrol. If that bothers you its not the car for you.
    It will do 32 mph on a run, more at constant speeds on a motorway but expect that figure to drop a lot if you hit a jam !!! I ave about 27mph running about.

    Ultimately Nige is right, why not just keep what you have for 18 months ..
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    I've just joined here any was about to start a thread almost exactly the same as this! Like you I think a used 3.2 represents astonishing value for money but am a bit unsure about real world running costs. I really want a Sportback with quattro and DSG. The reason I started looking at the 3.2 is because lots of them have DSG and QT is std - seems pretty rare to find these on a 2.0T.

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    Hi Paddy, what are servicing costs like vs the 2.0T?

  10. #9
    paddy's Avatar
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    Not a lot in it really, its the same thing plus 2 extra spark plugs and a etxra ltr of oil. always pays to go to an indipendant after the first 3 years but audi often do a fix price service. 40k miles is the big one with gearbox oil as well + long life service .
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    Any nasty cam belt etc major services to be aware of? Seems like fuel economy ("economy" isnt really the right word is it?!) between the 3.2 and 2T is about the same.

  12. #11
    paddy's Avatar
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    No cam belt on a 3.2, its a chain and should last the life of the engine. That said some early pre 06 engines had issues with stretching chains, common on the R32 as well. Like any car of this type its going to cost an arm and a leg if it goes wrong and Audi's do go wrong by their very nature of being a lot more complicated than your average ford or Nissan.
    the bottom line is with these cars is they are not cheap to run. If the thought of a timing chain bill for 3-4k worries you then Audi's are not for you...unless you feel lucky. Don't equate exclusivity, performance and quality with reliability...If that was the case then Porsche Ferrari Bentley and Aston martin would be good reliable cars but they are not
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  13. #12
    TQS
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    Unless you feel lucky paddy? I don't consider myself to be a particularly lucky guy - I ha similar concerns too but then thought about the number of cars sold and the proportion that have to have 3-4k spent on a rebuild after 4 years and I estimated that in percentage terms, it must be less than 1% (more of a guestimate really).. And as I don't consider myself to be particularly unlucky I sought out the best example I could find, and in the end probably paid slightly more than equivalently aged models and now have a sublime practical car as a daily driver.

    The op is right - the 3.2s are very good value for money, especially when compared to an equivalent S3 and the turbo lag/potential turbo issues/boy racer profile and if you find a good one, then go for it

  14. #13
    PaulAr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TQS View Post
    - the 3.2s are very good value for money, especially when compared to an equivalent S3 and the turbo lag/potential turbo issues/boy racer profile and if you find a good one, then go for it
    3,2s are superb vfm, but I dont understand the "equivalent S3" statement??

    The S3 and 3.2 were only around at the same time for few months. The S3 effectively superceded the 3.2 as the 8P flagship (much to Paddys frustration).

    As for the boy racer image? really? He he , new one on me that mate.

    Turbo problems? eerrrr, Ive done some forum nerding over the years and Ive yet to read a thread about inherent S3 turbo problems.

    Turbo lag? agree that its not as responsive as a 3.2 off boost, but in relative terms its not particularly laggy as turbo cars go.

    Like I said, the 3,2 is a fantastic car for the money but as far as useful advice for the OP goes , the S3 comments are not at all accurate.

    cheers
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  15. #14
    TQS
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    Sorry, my post was a bit unclear and written on a phone - to clarify, "equivalent S3" referred to equivalent age/mileage/condition - a 5 year old 30k miles S3 is significantly more expensive than the 3.2 so they aren't a like-for-like choice in that respect.

    The S3 is the boy racer, souped up version of the A3 - for me it does have conjure up image of a younger person tearing around the streets with chrome wing mirrors and a loud exhaust.

    Inherent turbo problems? Not sure i mentioned that the turbo problems were inherent but i think your forum nerding (nice phrase, hope you don't mind me cribbing it!) may have clouded your view.

    The point i was trying to make was don't believe everything you read on t'internet. Well, believe it but put it into proportion. I don't dispute that there are maybe 100 individuals who have posted mechatronic issues over the years but i'm guessing (and i must stress that it is only a guess so don't take my word for it) that this is a tiny percentage of DSG car sales over a similar time-frame.

    I admit that i nearly overlooked buying a car with DSG due to maybe having to spend 3-4k on getting it repaired should the worst happen but let's face it, if a significant proportion of the public who had bought these cars had these problems i think you'll find the second hand DSG car market would be on it's bottom.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TQS View Post
    Unless you feel lucky paddy? I don't consider myself to be a particularly lucky guy - I ha similar concerns too but then thought about the number of cars sold and the proportion that have to have 3-4k spent on a rebuild after 4 years and I estimated that in percentage terms, it must be less than 1% (more of a guestimate really).. And as I don't consider myself to be particularly unlucky I sought out the best example I could find, and in the end probably paid slightly more than equivalently aged models and now have a sublime practical car as a daily driver.
    Pretty much what I was thinking, I understand that some 3.2 engines have had issues which sees them branded as unreliable by Audi standards - but we're not exactly talking about a TVR Speed Six hand grenade here are we?

  17. #16
    paddy's Avatar
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    I didn't say the chain WILL go, i was simply saying if you are the sort of person that would find a bill of 3-4k a killer then Audi's are not for you....unless you feel lucky. Its not chains in particular its anything that puts the car in a Audi dealership for more than a few days. At 150 an hour thats in excess of 1000 a day...as i found out. Lets be honest here, the running costs will be higher than your basic cooking models ! A replacement DSG box will cost you more fitted than a new Citroen C1.
    As for the S3 ? well the 3.2 is a cheap alternative but it is not an S3,it just depends what floats your boat. Your chances of a big bill are greatly reduced with a manual S3 than a DSG 3.2
    Here is an example from another thread today..
    ---------------------
    Just been to my local dealer for replacement front pads and was charged 227.66

    115 for labour, 75.45 for pads and 3.30 for some plastilube + vat
    ---------------------------

    PS...If you don't consider yourself lucky...then what does that make me ? ...shut up Paul
    Last edited by paddy; 11th December 2010 at 15:08.
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    I know exactly what you mean. My other car is an S2 Elise, everyone with one of those lives in fear of the head gasket letting go. It does happen but won't happen to everyone. I suppose it's the same sort of thing, if you can only just afford the car - then you can't afford the car!

    Several years of Lotus ownership has taught me that it's wise to have a few K ferreted away just in case!

  19. #18
    ~RS~'s Avatar
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    Thanks guys, useful replies indeed.

    Paddy I thought the chain lengthening problem was easy to diagnose, does it cost 3-4K to have the chain replaced? (sorry mechanical dummy- work with me ) I can afford the running costs. As long as it's not a deep dent resale wise I don't mind, as I am sure the fun will outweigh the cost as it usually does! In general the costs - running are something I've looked into somewhat, and they seem bearable as long as the DSG box and chain don't go @ once lol

    Considering the age I'm looking at there will be no warranty and I'll be stuffed if I'm paying Audi's high labour charges, there are more than a few competent VAG specialists in London whom I haven't heard any bad reports about, plus there many R32's in London so I'm sure most will be familiar with the engine. Thanks for your insight mate, I've been reading a few of yours posts on the car and have had a good chuckle along the way. My engine went due to a faulty alternator tensioner wheel, belt snapped and shagged the timing, long story short extended warranty forked out 6K so I'm very aware of the A3's ability to shag you when your not looking! Lovely motor all the same...

    TQS thanks for the posts, although I gotta say I'll probably be putting my OEM S3 mirrors onto it if I do get one lmao... I see your point about the DSG box though, plus I currently have one in the TDi. Can't recall anybody with a DSG box having issues with the box itself. Must be a rarity (as I perform my superstitious rituals, touch wood etc etc) hopefully I won't be back in a few months time using the crying smiley ranting DSG failure!! I see your also in London, which is my main reason for wanting another DSG, was your TQS manual? How did you find the manual in town? I Haven't had a manual car in donkeys! Another reason is that I have the itching urge to get a few more BHP out of the TDi I have (currently stage 1 chippedUK maps circa 180BHP) As it is the car will torque steer, I think it's refereed to as- so the car pull in left or right if your heavy with the right foot (not that there's much chance of that in London!) I read that the quattro eliminates this also.

    Jon208, I was looking at the Subaru WRX STi but the engine failure horro stories @ less than 10k on some turned me right off of that!

  20. #19
    3.2 Ju's Avatar
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    I'm on my second 3.2 dsg , I did defect to a 330cd for a while but a blown turbo and the draw of the V6 was too much for me. A lot of my mates couldn't understand why I would go back to what was effectively the same car, it was even the same age, but to get into a dsg'd sportback S3 with the same spec, you were looking at over twice the price and near 30k, I paid 13k. I did consider a 2.0T, but until recently you could't get Quattro AND dsg and looking at the fuel figures for both, the difference is surprisingly small.
    For me the 3.2 SB makes absolute common sense. It has plenty of power, an abundance of grip, drives a peach, sounds fantastic and has 4 doors.
    My advice is to buy wisely and enjoy one before they fade away!
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  21. #20
    paddy's Avatar
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    RS..
    The chain will cost you about 4k if it goes simply because if you replace the chain then you would be daft not to do the sprockets, tensioners, VVT units , solenoids and anything else related while you have the engine apart. a good indicator is try holding the revs at spot on 2k in park. If the revs jump about...beware !! If it has ever even hinted at a fault code saying "camshaft set point not reached" run away!!. I know of 3 engines that have shot chains which is not a lot. All were 2004 and under 40k miles. If its going to go i expect it to go under 50k but its just a guess.
    I had bad luck..many have had no problem so you takes your chances. The real test here is i still own the car. I have done 50k miles in it over 6 years and it is the nicest thing to drive i have ever had.despite all its problems i still keep going with it but a 3ltr A5 is on the horizon one day.
    Last edited by paddy; 11th December 2010 at 16:34.
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    Just been having a look on YouTube at a few clips. The Mrs could hear the engine note on the clips from the next room - says it sounds awesome! Ah nuts to it. You only live once and it's only money. V6 it is then.......

  23. #22
    paddy's Avatar
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    Get a Remus back box as well :-)
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    Many people are alive because its illegal to shoot them.

  24. #23
    ~RS~'s Avatar
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    Jon I think that may well make 2 of us mate, good luck finding yours... Just looking into a few things before taking the plunge. Let me know how you get on. Got to agree it sound mint! Been listening to em on youtube for a couple days now... sad ain't I

    Paddy would the chain and any resulting damage be covered by a warranty?

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    Maybe Paddy, need this one to be quiet when behaving but a bit of noise when pushing on would be good. The decat and Larini box on the Elise is very loud, able to set off every Golf car alarm in a multistory without even trying and when it was my daily driver had to roll down to the end of my road in neutral in the morning to avoid waking the whole street. Pops and bangs on lift off make it worth it though ;-)
    Last edited by jon208; 11th December 2010 at 18:27.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ~RS~ View Post
    Jon I think that may well make 2 of us mate, good luck finding yours... Just looking into a few things before taking the plunge. Let me know how you get on. Got to agree it sound mint! Been listening to em on youtube for a couple days now... sad ain't I
    No sadder than me by the sounds of it!

  27. #26
    3.2 Ju's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jon208 View Post
    Just been having a look on YouTube at a few clips. The Mrs could hear the engine note on the clips from the next room - says it sounds awesome! Ah nuts to it. You only live once and it's only money. V6 it is then.......
    My old one on the rollers at Awesome

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  28. #27
    paddy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jon208 View Post
    Maybe Paddy, need this one to be quiet when behaving but a bit of noise when pushing on would be good. ;-)
    That is exactly what a Remus does. :-)
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  29. #28
    paddy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ~RS~ View Post
    Paddy would the chain and any resulting damage be covered by a warranty?
    I would think so ! Mine was done as a good will by Audi because it should never have gone. Unfortunately i still had to pay the 4.5k diagnostic charge as it took them 3 weeks to find the fault...Audi paid 5k towards the finished job....
    Ibis white Revo S3 and now matching Vivaro LWB HR 2900 :-)

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  30. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by TQS View Post
    Sorry, my post was a bit unclear and written on a phone - to clarify, "equivalent S3" referred to equivalent age/mileage/condition - a 5 year old 30k miles S3 is significantly more expensive than the 3.2 so they aren't a like-for-like choice in that respect.

    The S3 is the boy racer, souped up version of the A3 - for me it does have conjure up image of a younger person tearing around the streets with chrome wing mirrors and a loud exhaust.

    Inherent turbo problems? Not sure i mentioned that the turbo problems were inherent but i think your forum nerding (nice phrase, hope you don't mind me cribbing it!) may have clouded your view.

    The point i was trying to make was don't believe everything you read on t'internet. Well, believe it but put it into proportion. I don't dispute that there are maybe 100 individuals who have posted mechatronic issues over the years but i'm guessing (and i must stress that it is only a guess so don't take my word for it) that this is a tiny percentage of DSG car sales over a similar time-frame.
    .
    Ok, but there is no such thing as a 5yr old S3, the very first ones didnt hit or roads unil Dec 2006?
    So I still dont understand?

    Loud exhausts? Have you every been in or heard an S3?
    Noisy it aint mate.

    In fact none of the 8Ps are noisy in stock tune, quite the opposite, and why people such as Paddy and many other `mature` owners change them for quality aftermarket items to liberate more noise.

    Dont know what jobs your local boy racers have but where I live the boy racers fly around in Clios and Corsas, not 30K AUDIs.

    Dont believe everything on t`internet??

    Maybe not, but forming an educated view based on reliable information and sharing experiences with fellow enthisiasts is something else. Its kind of the whole point of motoring forums.
    My views are indeed NOT clouded my friend. Im pretty grown up these days and its a while since I picked up a copy of Max Power.....

    If some one can show me evidence that S3 have specific Turbo issues then I will hold my hands up and stand corrected.


    Cheers
    Paul
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  31. #30
    paddy's Avatar
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    My pigeons are faster than yours so is my whippet. so there.
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  32. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by paddy View Post
    4.5k diagnostic charge
    2006 Phantom Black A3 2.0T S-Line.
    DSG | 18" BBS Pescaras | Rear Parking Sensors | MFSW | Symphony II | BOSE | Auto lights/wipers | Half leather
    MODS : '09 tail lights | TT vents | Weitec Hicon GTs | RNS-E 2010 | Controls Pack (Red Stitching)
    PLANS: Dumbos | 8P3 S-Line Rear Bumper | OEM Parking Sensors


    GONE BUT NOT FORGOTTEN:
    2005 Ebony Black A3 1.6 Sport tiptronic. You will be missed!
    1997 BMW 316i Coupe M-Sport. You won't be missed quite so much!

  33. #32
    Neutral

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    Damn it! Broke my wrist about 20 minutes after my last post and spent the whole night in A&E. Definately going to need a DSG now!

  34. #33
    paddy's Avatar
    Audi=No fault code, no idea

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    dont tell me you were looking at 3.2's on youtube at the time

    Sorry to hear that mate..bet that hurt !!
    Ibis white Revo S3 and now matching Vivaro LWB HR 2900 :-)

    Many people are alive because its illegal to shoot them.

  35. #34
    paddy's Avatar
    Audi=No fault code, no idea

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    Quote Originally Posted by sub39h View Post
    If you dont have a fault code and you dont know what the problem is then at 1k+ a day it soon mounts up. I just had a misfire on startup, could have been a 100 things, took 7 weeks in all to find and fix.
    Ibis white Revo S3 and now matching Vivaro LWB HR 2900 :-)

    Many people are alive because its illegal to shoot them.

  36. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by paddy View Post
    dont tell me you were looking at 3.2's on youtube at the time

    Sorry to hear that mate..bet that hurt !!
    Don't worry wasn't a V6 related one handed surfing injury!

    Smarts a bit for sure. Going in for an aftermarket titanium add on tomorrow.

    Jon

  37. #36
    PaulAr's Avatar
    S3 (8P)

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    Quote Originally Posted by paddy View Post
    My pigeons are faster than yours so is my whippet. so there.
    My whippet can drink more pints than yours.

    My pigeons taste better than your pigeons.
    So there
    Now:
    -MK2 Golf Gti 16V/VR6, Oak Green, Shrick, Intake, Decat, Kish Retrim, Lenso BSX..
    -BMW 335d Xdrive, Estoril Blue, fully loaded.

    Before:
    S3 (8P), Ibis, DSG, Milltek, SHARK

    BMW 320d M Sport
    S3 (8P), Sprint, REVO, H&R Springs, BBS CHs,

    Golf MK5 GTi 20TFSI - REVO Stage1, Red.
    Golf MK5 GTi 20TFSI - Std, Shadow Blue
    Civic Type `R`
    Golf MK4 GTi 18T - 200bhp, MTM ECU, Forge DV
    Golf MK3 VR6 - Cat Back
    Corrado VR6 - JAMEX
    Corrado G60 - JAMEX, BRM Charger rebuild
    etc....

  38. #37
    ~RS~'s Avatar
    5th Gear

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    Bloody eck lads... I tell ya... This car malarky...

    Was all intent on keeping the 2.0TDi when I get a call today from a dealer I'd viewed a 3.2 SB at, with a rather tasty offer. Seems the previous salesman was a little scrooge like on his val of my current car either that or they wanna get shot of the 3.2 :D lol, anyway cut a long story short a nice deal was cut and failing there being anything wrong (has agreed to VAG check and look over by Audi) I maybe going for it. They also want me to put my car back to standard which is a bonus as I'm sure previous salesman had valued with sat nav BT MFSW etc.

    They offer a standard 3 month warranty but will extend that to 18 months for a small sum (I've checked online and it's way cheaper than warranty co sell for). My question is if they are willing to let Audi have a look over it and VAG.COM checks to be done all is well and I take it, will the warranty in the eventuality that the chain has issues, cover it? Mileage is over 65K so I think I'd have to contribute towards labour (30% or something) but parts would be 100% paid for. Or is there some sneaky wear & tear small print that may allow them to wiggle out of paying up.

    Plus is there any warranty co's that are recommended over others, or more likely to pay up in the event something does go wrong, more to the point!

  39. #38
    paddy's Avatar
    Audi=No fault code, no idea

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    What year is it ?
    Ibis white Revo S3 and now matching Vivaro LWB HR 2900 :-)

    Many people are alive because its illegal to shoot them.

  40. #39
    Sarah's A3's Avatar
    MODERATOR V6 S3 Hybrid

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    Depending on year, Audi may only offer an exgratia payment or offer payment to parts only. Chain can be checked via vagcom. I'd also check service history and make sure the haldex oil has been changed. Also gear box if its DSG.


    Mauritus Blue 3.2 V6 S Line Quattro DSG Xenons Sunroof Leather Sat Nav/Changer/TV/Text W8 & Int Light Pack Dark H/Lining Tints PDC S3 Kit '11 Rears Sachs/Eibachs & more... Build Thread

  41. #40
    6th Gear

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    Quote Originally Posted by jon208 View Post
    Don't worry wasn't a V6 related one handed surfing injury!
    L

    M

    F

    A

    O

    hope you're alright mate!
    2006 Phantom Black A3 2.0T S-Line.
    DSG | 18" BBS Pescaras | Rear Parking Sensors | MFSW | Symphony II | BOSE | Auto lights/wipers | Half leather
    MODS : '09 tail lights | TT vents | Weitec Hicon GTs | RNS-E 2010 | Controls Pack (Red Stitching)
    PLANS: Dumbos | 8P3 S-Line Rear Bumper | OEM Parking Sensors


    GONE BUT NOT FORGOTTEN:
    2005 Ebony Black A3 1.6 Sport tiptronic. You will be missed!
    1997 BMW 316i Coupe M-Sport. You won't be missed quite so much!

 

 
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