Intercoolers ( Not for banter please )

[S3 Paul]

Right,
In "the other FMIC thread" a few questions were raised that did not realy get answered.
Is the forge item the optimum size core?
I was under the impresion that the boost pipe work should be the same as the standard pipe work 61mm or there abouts? if any reduction in size it should only be on the "hot" side of the cooler as air like oil moves easier when hot than when cold?
I understand also that a "good cooler " will need to lower intake temps while giving very little preasure drop ( if any ) ?
Are tapered end tanks ( inlet and outlet in the middle of the end tanks) much better for the s3 than a "normal" design with them at the bottom. ( i asume the air will take the path of least restriction)

 

[MAD_Adamski]

i will try and answer this without causing issue's... right is basically down to what you want? the std items are quite good from what i gather from what i have read on here. NOW some would say that the forge and the AH fabs coolers are OTT for the average user and a ebay jobby will do.... the pipe sizes will no make MAJOR differences and again depends on what your after? do you wanna keep the grill and gogs etc? if so then smaller pipes if your after raw use then do away with them and fit the bigger pipes. as for pressuredrop etc its not just down to the pipes its down to design and flow and the core too its really not a question any of us could really answer without physical eveidence...

IF i was to advise you on my experiences and what alex has taught me over the few yrs its tailor it to YOUR needs! you dnt need buy a big huge one cause its fancy and does 1000hp and again dnt buy a cheap as chips one off ebay cause it'll do the job ok.

Buy the cooler that you think best suits you if you funds are tight and you dont wanna spend much then maybe go for the cheapest option? If you dnt mind doing stuff yourself and wanna save money for a good cooler seup like tufty, maybe the AH fabs? or if you want one thats expensive yet been fitted a few times and comes all in 1 kit then perhaps the forge is for you?

The basis really is there all good in there own mind it just really depends on what you want?

on my cossie i knew i'd wanna go for 400-500hp so i got the upto 700hp cooler so i never have to worry yes it was trid and tested but its fit and forget and not regret later wen its not doing its job. and i have been on both ends of the scale when i should have spent once and spent twice, but on other hand some times gone OTT then gone back lol....

So you really have 3 options, ebay, AH, or forge i personally feel your wallet and what you want out of it is the decider here...

Edit: to say the pipes are better at the top or bottom as long as the end tanks are designed correctly rather than centre.

HTH Ad

 

[Ess_Three]

I too would suggest a core from a reputable maker...

But from there on, I'd not worry too much.
It's a 1.8 engined Hatchback making 270BHP...how fantoosh does the FMIC have to be to drop 40-50 degrees of intake temperature.

I've never seen any proof that there is ANY difference between 51 and 51mm pipework when it's fitted and working.

Is the forge core ideally sized? I don't know.
It's bigger than the one I had and it worked just fine.

In my view, as long as the core is of reasonable quality (design, flow capacity, efficiency) it'll make no difference that anyone will be able to detect when fitted to an S3 making around 270 BHP.

It's not a Championship winning race car where every fraction of a BHP/lb-ft is essential...it's a road car.

Anything is better than nothing...as long as the components are of relative quality, I'm damn sure you, I or the next man will never be able to tell one apart from another.

 

[MintyS3]

Well I received my Forge Intercooler the other day. Im going to fit it end of the month when I have time off. Will try and take pics and give a verdict but I dont have vagcom to take readings just now.

 

[S3 Rav]

looks like a nice piece of kit!

 

[A3Tom]

Nice!

 

[ianysm]

I'm not sure what the standar done looks like. Is the Forge one miles bigger? Does it require losing front fogs etc?

I've seen some that can be seen from the front and protrude out and think it looks terrible. Hope that one doesn't do that?

Is there not a simple replacement that can fit in place of the existing and give decent results due to its better design?

How much?

 

[Forge]

I have to say that there is a world of difference in the quality and performance with regards to the cooling efficiency of the Forge and A&H air cores , both these companies are using some of the best availible in the UK , ( we tested 3 types before sttling on the one in our kit ) The E bay cores simply do not offer the same cooling efficiency or performance ...hope this helps

 

[IIIadidasboy]

looks like a nice piece of kit!

MMMmmmmmmmmmm

 

[S3 Paul]

I have to say that there is a world of difference in the quality and performance with regards to the cooling efficiency of the Forge and A&H air cores , both these companies are using some of the best availible in the UK , ( we tested 3 types before sttling on the one in our kit ) The E bay cores simply do not offer the same cooling efficiency or performance ...hope this helps

Could you please tell me by how much the forge cooler was better at its job than cheaper universal intercoolers ?
I have sold cheaper coolers to a good few of the local tuners around where i live.
All of them have been happy with the results they have had.
In real world terms would any of us notice the diffrence ?
Ive suplied cars such as...
evo 6 now running 600bhp atw
integra type R turbo 320bhp
honda civic turbo 400bhp
Corsa B turbo 400bhp
intergrale 400bhp
Astra gsi 420bhp

Now i know power figures mean nothing, but these cars do go on alot of track days and all have more gauges than a boeing 747 , All report a good Intake temperatures over a track day.

Surely compared to the factory set up on our cars even a "cheap" intercooler fitted with well thought out pipe work would show a massive improvement ??

 

[MAD_Adamski]

I have to say that there is a world of difference in the quality and performance with regards to the cooling efficiency of the Forge and A&H air cores , both these companies are using some of the best availible in the UK , ( we tested 3 types before sttling on the one in our kit ) The E bay cores simply do not offer the same cooling efficiency or performance ...hope this helps

Best from the horses mouth! i've always said the forge stuff is good i've even had some stuff on mine! but the cost is high but you are then supplying the kit. Which some people think is easy but its not for these companies as there day to day so constantly ordering small bits is a hassle... i can see why you at forge charge what you do and AH will never offer a kit as its too much hassle for them....

IMO you can buy the forge or AH one both will give better than std or ebay results just depends if you can use a spanner or not and hw much your looking to spend .

thanks for the input tho FORGE

 

[MAD_Adamski]

Could you please tell me by how much the forge cooler was better at its job than cheaper universal intercoolers ?
I have sold cheaper coolers to a good few of the local tuners around where i live.
All of them have been happy with the results they have had.
In real world terms would any of us notice the diffrence ?
Ive suplied cars such as...
evo 6 now running 600bhp atw
integra type R turbo 320bhp
honda civic turbo 400bhp
Corsa B turbo 400bhp
intergrale 400bhp
Astra gsi 420bhp

Now i know power figures mean nothing, but these cars do go on alot of track days and all have more gauges than a boeing 747 , All report a good Intake temperatures over a track day.

Surely compared to the factory set up on our cars even a "cheap" intercooler fitted with well thought out pipe work would show a massive improvement ??

PAUL i'm no expert and sure alex or the forgee chap can give a more technical reason but i KNOW plenty of customers that have come in with these ''universal'' coolers saying here good but not quite right.

As you listed i shall of a few i know
1:- corsa turbo 30hp increase
2:- fiesta rs turbo 20hp increase
3:- (performace fords) escort turbo much cooler and 20hp increase!
thats just 3 off the top of my head! And i know all this as i put them in contact with AH.

On recieveing there new coolers from AH they then take the car to be retested on the rollers and everytime the cars have made 1. more power (upto 30hp in some cases) 2. been cooler...

Now as said i'm no expert and this isn't my field but what i do know is facts and i'm sure the chap from forge gets the same thing, people asking to have these ''other'' coolers improved... now as said im sure there ok but its pure fact that beter cores WILL work better...

 

[fran-s3]

what does 'AH' stand for?

 

[<tuffty/>]

AH Fabrications.... http://www.ahfabrications.com/

<tuffty/>

 

[fran-s3]

Thanks Tufty, well if anyones thinking of doing a group buy on these AH Intercoolers I'm certainly in. Else I'll be purchasing one next month anyway....

 

[<tuffty/>]

No probs... Not sure a group buy will happen as Alex has already suggested a price of £250 for the FMIC alone which TBH is a ****** good price...

You will still have to mod your own crash bar and source the pipes but do it right and you will get a good cooler whilst saving some money.

For those that are interested, google is your friend....

http://www.gnttype.org/techarea/turbo/intercooler.html

Think its all said there (not read through it properly yet)...

I am still trying to find the time to get a proper write up of my FMIC installation. I might have some time tomorrow if my work VPN is still down...

<tuffty/>

 

[IIIadidasboy]

Sorry to hijack (and to be honest I HAVEN'T done a search YET) - does anyone know of a good guide for fitting a FMIC to a TQS - I now know that it's not quite the same as an S3

 

[S3quatt]

Think it's about time we sorted a group buy from AH...

Anyone?

 

[fran-s3]

No probs... Not sure a group buy will happen as Alex has already suggested a price of £250 for the FMIC alone which TBH is a ****** good price...

You will still have to mod your own crash bar and source the pipes but do it right and you will get a good cooler whilst saving some money.

For those that are interested, google is your friend....

http://www.gnttype.org/techarea/turbo/intercooler.html

Think its all said there (not read through it properly yet)...

I am still trying to find the time to get a proper write up of my FMIC installation. I might have some time tomorrow if my work VPN is still down...

<tuffty/>

Yeah it is a good price I don't mind paying that at all... yours still running well mate?

Great stuff cheers mate look forward to the guide.

 

[MAD_Adamski]

I did try to arrange a grp buy while back to help everyone out with no benefit to myself i dont even own a S3! BUT to many people messed and caused hassle *james* *cough* and few were worried it would not be as good as the others for some reason....

Alex has read all this, he read the last 7page one too, and was very tempted to post after some of the rubbish that people were puting, but in the end he said as usual the product will do the talking.

As tufty has said alex wont mind doing a grp buy but as far as i'm aware the price wont change!? As that price is a V good price as it is trust me....

Its a simple if you want one put your money where your mouth is and the phone number is listed below as tufty pointed out....

you wont be dissapointed :icon_thumright:

 

[S3quatt]

Speaking of Tufty....

Where's this write up??

Looking forward to it like

 

[<tuffty/>]

soz guys, they fixed my vpn so had to work today

I have a load of other viable excuses too but I will endeavour to get it sorted this weekend (family willing)

<tuffty/>

 

[FazS3]

If there is a group buy I would be very interested in a FMIC for my r32.

Give us a shout if you get anything sorted im not on here alot these days!

 

[Forge]

I can vouch for the quality of the A&H stuff , it is excellant stuff , you wont go wrong .... IF you need an alternative to the same sizes or specs as the A&H I would be happy to help

 

[Dani_B19]

Mines going to have to wait now due to been laid off

 

[<tuffty/>]

Mines going to have to wait now due to been laid off

Rubbish mate

<tuffty/>

 

[Dani_B19]

Rubbish mate

<tuffty/>

Yup big time, just gald i ordered my upper boost hose and dv relocation kit beofre it happened, least i can fit them and my tip while im off haha

 

[S3 Rav]

bad luck mate

 

[Broken Byzan]

Adam, TBH there is no need to try and organise the group buy as the price Alex is knocking these out for is very good anyway, and he himself said there is very little movement on the price anyway. Anyone interseted can contact Alex on the details posted above.

When Minty fits his forge, if he is willing to do a write up, i will stick his and Tufftys in the same post and stick it for all to see. Then when we get some one do a full Ebay fit i will stick that with them too

 

[Dani_B19]

Gazzaone has got an ebay joby, ask im if hell do a write up to compare all three.

 

[IIIadidasboy]

Mines going to have to wait now due to been laid off

Sorry to hear that mate

Hope you get something else sorted quickly.

 

[s3_kev]

Gazzaone has got an ebay joby, ask im if hell do a write up to compare all three.

yeah i done it for him after he saw my post about me doing mine, ill add mine onto the sticky now then shall i

 

[Broken Byzan]

Go for it, i want one of each option in there. Will maybe lock it, or not depending

 

[Dani_B19]

yeah i done it for him after he saw my post about me doing mine, ill add mine onto the sticky now then shall i

Yeah, be a good way to gauge what people can afford and also to determine what route they want togo down.

 

[MAD_Adamski]

I can vouch for the quality of the A&H stuff , it is excellant stuff , you wont go wrong .... IF you need an alternative to the same sizes or specs as the A&H I would be happy to help

thanks Forge not often these days companies are willing to speak kindly of others :icon_thumright: