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Thread: AUM & APY heads, mix and match

  1. #1
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    AUM & APY heads, mix and match

    I've managed to bend a few valves on my AUM head, was gonna send it away for a rebuild but I've since been offered a low miles APY head for next to nothing. Only things is it doesn't have any lifters and obviously APY doesn't have VVT.

    My question really is am I ok just to swap the AUM cams (including VVT unit) and lifters across to the APY head?

    Thanks
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  3. #2
    <tuffty/>'s Avatar
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    Yarp... transfer your followers, cams and VVT over dude...

    Don't mix cam caps up whatever you do and keep everything in order as you remove stuff...

    <tuffty/>
    Silver 2001 AMK S3. Silver alcantara interior... now with added powarrrrrrrr, torques. VAGCOM + KII-USB. >> My build thread...

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    Nice one, cheers tuffty... Some how had a feeling you'd be the one to reply to this! lol

    new name = "Trusty Tuffty"

    Just to clarify are you saying I should use the APY cam caps with the AUM cams? . .
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    <tuffty/>'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by VAG-Slag View Post
    Nice one, cheers tuffty... Some how had a feeling you'd be the one to reply to this! lol

    new name = "Trusty Tuffty"

    Just to clarify are you saying I should use the APY cam caps with the AUM cams? . .
    You need to keep the cam caps paired to the head they came on as they are line bored to the head...

    So yeah, sorry to add a degree of confusion but it can end up messy if you in advertantly use caps from one head on another so felt I needed to mention it..

    Basically... remove cams, VVT, followers and cam chain from the AUM head and assemble in the APY head...

    Use new VVT gasket set, and ideally new cam seals too... you will need to replace the cam pulley bolt if you do change the seals as its a stretch bolt

    Take note of the cam cap positions as while they are numbered they are not in the order you think, cap 5 goes cyl 1 end...



    <tuffty/>
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    Silver 2001 AMK S3. Silver alcantara interior... now with added powarrrrrrrr, torques. VAGCOM + KII-USB. >> My build thread...

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    Nice, thanks for such detailed advice tuffty...

    Looks like this will be my job for the weekend then!


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    <tuffty/>'s Avatar
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    A few links that may help also
    VWVortex.com - FAQ : Cylinder Head & Camshaft Removal + Re-Installation

    How-to: 1.8T Cam Chain Tensioner Gasket replacement

    You will need a cam chain tensioner tool to compress the tensioner, when removing the cam caps remove caps 3 and 5 from inlet/exhaust, double cap up front by belt and the two caps by the chain... then undo the tensioner bolts...

    Once you have done that, release caps 2 and 4 by alternating diagonally... this is so it loosens/lifts the cams evenly out of the head and doesn't damage the bearing faces of the head...

    Make sure you don't over tighten the cap bolts when re-fitting else you will pull the threads easily... they actually only need 10nm torque...

    <tuffty/>
    Silver 2001 AMK S3. Silver alcantara interior... now with added powarrrrrrrr, torques. VAGCOM + KII-USB. >> My build thread...

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    Pick up this head in the week and have started taking it apart. Bit of confusion but it turns out it does have lifters but is missing a couple of valves. No problem tho, I can get a couple valves put in.

    My question tho, is it ok to use the lifters from the APY head with the cams from the AUM head or should they all be matched? . . I only ask as I did occasionally have a noisy lifter on start up with the AUM head and I know the APY head has covered a lot less miles so could be good to use those lifters.

    Thanks


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    <tuffty/>'s Avatar
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    Watch using just any old valves as there are differences on some... only noticed it on an AEB head before now but there are two different collet groove heights (installed height remains the same)... lower height I would imagine is to add a bit more preload on the springs..

    The other thing to be aware of is the APY head has a shim under the exhaust valve springs... if some of the missing valves are exhaust ones and the shims are missing them I would personally use stuff as complete sets..

    I swapped out my inlet hydros today as one fell apart (for no apparent reason) when I rebuilt it... they have prob done less than 15k miles and were brand new INA (OE supplier) ones..



    I am normally of a mind to swap stuff thats known to be working... almost worth treating the APY head as bare and swapping your stuff to it... the noisy lifter noise could well be the VVT... its a 'brrrrratttt' noise thats lasts a few seconds... lifters stick occasionally and this would be a ticking noise that takes a few mins to go away..

    I would think your noise is the VVT not the lifter

    <tuffty/>
    Silver 2001 AMK S3. Silver alcantara interior... now with added powarrrrrrrr, torques. VAGCOM + KII-USB. >> My build thread...

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    future's Avatar
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    sorry to hijack the thread but in what way are the aeb heads different for the valves? i have an aeb head to rebuild and put on an pay engined S3, which valves should i use? (both are in perfect working order)

    cheers
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    <tuffty/>'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by future View Post
    sorry to hijack the thread but in what way are the aeb heads different for the valves? i have an aeb head to rebuild and put on an pay engined S3, which valves should i use? (both are in perfect working order)

    cheers
    Not all I have seen are but in this particular case the triple grooves for the collets were lower/higher than the valves from a n other head (found out as Bill/Mark was swapping out a damaged valve or something)

    Identical valve height but the difference in collet grooves will affect the lift and spring rate if mixed

    Personally I would use the valve train from the S3 in this case... obviously its more work but the subtle differences in spec are there for a reason but the base castings of the heads are all the same in context

    <tuffty/>
    Silver 2001 AMK S3. Silver alcantara interior... now with added powarrrrrrrr, torques. VAGCOM + KII-USB. >> My build thread...

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    Quote Originally Posted by future View Post
    sorry to hijack the thread but in what way are the aeb heads different for the valves? i have an aeb head to rebuild and put on an pay engined S3, which valves should i use? (both are in perfect working order)

    cheers
    I'm my case they were the same as my AMK set. I only took notice because of tufftys early warning.
    juts check and be precautious.

  13. #12
    future's Avatar
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    thanks for the help tufty i had always planned to swap the stuff over from my s3 because i know it has been looked after, but just wanted to make sure that was ok
    Audi S3

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    Think it was a sticky lifter as the noise lasted a minute or so from start up but only if I'd been giving it a bit of a pasting on the previous drive... I'd guessed this was because the oil had gotten a bit hotter/thinner and drained from the lifters but having recently learned something about the oil I was using not being so good at higher temps it could well have been that.

    As for the valves I have decided I'm going to plonk all the AUM exhaust valves into the APY head rather than new valves/spings etc on just the one cylinder...

    Thanks again for your help mate, will let you know how I get on.


 

 

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