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  1. #1
    Schlaag's Avatar
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    Traction control problem after a hit and run! *added pics*

    Hi guys, Happy New Year!

    Just before xmas, someone hit our S3 on the back passenger side. Took the rear bumper out and hit the passenger rear wheel / panel.

    they scarpered! left us stranded!

    Ive just replaced the bumper/light today and drove for the first time since the accident. There are a couple of issues.

    Tracking is out... centre of steering wheel has to be at 10 o'clock for the car to drive straight! is this something bent on the rear pass side at back? would this affect the steering direction? impact was no where near the front wheels

    and next.. taking off in 1st gear always sends traction control loopy! abs flashes and all power is cut! this only happens in 1st gear. It does clear after about 10 seconds..

    can anyone help with the cause of these issues? I hope so, we are gutted they hit us and ran! need a bit of help/luck!

    Cheers
    Dave
    Last edited by Schlaag; 23rd January 2013 at 17:37.

    2001 AMK Dolphin Grey S3

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  3. #2
    Prawn's Avatar
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    the bent wheel will be causing it mate.

    Often when you change components on the suspension like track rod ends and the like, if you set the tracking too far out, the scrubbing of the wheel alters the wheel speed on a given corner to such an extent that the traction control sees it as wheel slip and interferes.

    If something on the rear end is bent to a similar degree from the impact I have no doubt the ESP would do exactly the same thing.

    I'd imagine if the passengers rear wheel was hit, it'd be toe out to require the steering wheel to have some left lock to go straight, as the whole car will be crabbing.

    Get an alignment check and it'll almost certainly show up as rear left toe being miles out.

    Not sure how toe is controlled on the back of an S3, but I'm sure of our 4wd friends can advise
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  4. #3
    Schlaag's Avatar
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    Thanks Prawn.. i'll get an alignment booked up asap. If say something was bent.. what would be the most common component?

    hoping its just knocked the tracking way out, but best to be prepared to replace whats needed! Ive hd a look under but cant see anything untoward.

    2001 AMK Dolphin Grey S3

  5. #4
    s3dave's Avatar
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    My bet will be on the flimsy tie arms... there are 2 attached to each hub, take the wheel off and you can see by eye if any have bent, it may be hard to see just looking under..
    Whats the damage on the rear panal? could it have gone into the suspension turret?
    ohh and pics...??

  6. #5
    RobinJI's Avatar
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    Yep, from what I've seen of S3 rear suspension I'd definitely be looking at the tie bars first. As Prawn says, it'll probably be towing out loads because of the impact.
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    for the tracking to be out something would of bent, as said above check the visual components for obvious damage. i9 guess the car crabs a little and that's why your steering wheel is out.

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  8. #7
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    Tie bars, stub axle, suspension arm... any of that could be the issue ... ESP and ABS will be playing up due to the steering wheel being off centre... the steering position sensor expects the wheel to be dead straight when driving straight... it knows this because the abs sensors are reporting the same speed... if you turn the wheel the ABS/ESP expects to see a speed difference between the sensors now due to the steering angle... with the wheel out of whack its out of its calibration range and silly things happen as it thinks the wheels are spinning when they are not... this triggers the ESP...

    Get the bent stuff unbent and the wheel back inline then all will be good in the world

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  9. #8
    Schlaag's Avatar
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    Just been out and taken the wheel off (its COLD!)

    i took a load of pics... and had a good look around.

    I couldnt see anything bent. Perhaps you guys can?

    (I fitted a brand new bumper and tail light hence why damage doesnt look too bad. Wing dented and wheel scuffed where the other car hit me)

    Wing damage








    wheel off .. its a but grubby under there! but all looks straight...




















    Last edited by Schlaag; 23rd January 2013 at 17:31.

    2001 AMK Dolphin Grey S3

  10. #9
    <tuffty/>'s Avatar
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    Could be the perspective but the bottom tie bar looks bent up a tad... that will throw camber and toe out a bit... might look like a an old Mini crabbing down the road from behind..

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  11. #10
    Schlaag's Avatar
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    Is anything adjustable on the rear suspension that could have been 'knocked out'?

    I really thought the front had been affected.. I didn't realise that a knock on the rear wheel would affect the steering position so much!?

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  12. #11
    <tuffty/>'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Schlaag View Post
    Is anything adjustable on the rear suspension that could have been 'knocked out'?

    I really thought the front had been affected.. I didn't realise that a knock on the rear wheel would affect the steering position so much!?
    Not in std form no... if the rear is out of alignment then something is bent... or worn... but normally bent...

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  13. #12
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    Is it just me or does the wheel look as cambered as a lowered A3 / S3 without adjustable tie arms?

    http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/h...B48599464B.jpg

    Looking at the coil springs you have fitted, I would guess your car isn't lowered and the camber certaintly makes me suspicious something ain't right.

  14. #13
    Schlaag's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackcupraa View Post
    Is it just me or does the wheel look as cambered as a lowered A3 / S3 without adjustable tie arms?

    http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/h...B48599464B.jpg

    Looking at the coil springs you have fitted, I would guess your car isn't lowered and the camber certaintly makes me suspicious something ain't right.
    Suspension is all standard

    The top of the wheel deffo seems to tuck in more than it does on the other (non impacted) side

    So basically no point in getting an alignment done until I locate what is bent!

    Basically something is definitely bent and nothing can be adjusted because nothing could have been knocked out of its setting, its all unadjustable

    2001 AMK Dolphin Grey S3

  15. #14
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    Sorry to hear about the accident mate It does look like your wheel has lots of camber on it very similar to mine after I had my new lower suspension fitted. I took my car to a proper wheel alignment specialist and he managed to adjust the rear camber on my car so its almost right now on my standard tie bars. So there is defo some adjustment that can be done to both the toe and the camber on the rear wheels which of course in the impact may well of been knocked out of place.
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  16. #15
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    Plus they would be able to tell you when doing the alignment if something is bent or not too. The guy I got my alignment done with was really good as I took my subframe off the car about 2 weeks after getting the alignment done and he only charged me £20 to redo the front for me.
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  17. #16
    Schlaag's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vrbob View Post
    Sorry to hear about the accident mate It does look like your wheel has lots of camber on it very similar to mine after I had my new lower suspension fitted. I took my car to a proper wheel alignment specialist and he managed to adjust the rear camber on my car so its almost right now on my standard tie bars. So there is defo some adjustment that can be done to both the toe and the camber on the rear wheels which of course in the impact may well of been knocked out of place.
    Hi matey. Ah ok, that sounds promising... forget my last post then. Ill get it to a proper laser alignment outfit!

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  18. #17
    vrbob's Avatar
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    Cost me £60 for the full alignment and of course got a nice printout telling me the difference between before and after. Defo worth a shot before you start buying bits
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  19. #18
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    As per VRbob's post, i'd take it to a monkey garage who charge a tenner for tracking and see what they say, if it's out, spend the big money on a hunter alignment etc.

  20. #19
    Schlaag's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JudderMan View Post
    Yeah there's a **** load of camber on it. The pic with the wheel off from behind the car looking at the suspension if you look at the angle of the damper it's cantered in loads and whatever that's called that it's connected to is bent.

    Tufty...the old Mini rotten subframe crabbing

    (edit, must type faster)
    This pic mate? are you referring to where the lower part of the shock mounts


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  21. #20
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    Yep, that's the pic. Maybe it's my eyes but it looks bent or twisted even. If you look at the lower end of the shock it's twisted in a little - I don't mean the other thin bar that is cantered inwards to the right of the shock.

    This is what I mean Traction control problem after a hit and run! *added pics* | Awesome Screenshot
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  22. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by JudderMan View Post
    Yep, that's the pic. Maybe it's my eyes but it looks bent or twisted even. If you look at the lower end of the shock it's twisted in a little - I don't mean the other thin bar that is cantered inwards to the right of the shock.

    This is what I mean Traction control problem after a hit and run! *added pics* | Awesome Screenshot
    Gotcha! (nice screen shot tool!)

    I'll jack the rear up on the diff and take both rears off... see what doesnt match up to the OK side!

    Nice spot mate

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  23. #22
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    I actually deleted the original post as I doubted myself but after putting it in the screenshot (Google Chrome addon) it looks like it. Interested to see what the other side looks like now
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  24. #23
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    Those are typically at a slight angle anyway... they are not straight on as std...

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  25. #24
    Schlaag's Avatar
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    bugger!

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  26. #25
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    The bottom arm does look look like it has a bit of an arch to it, The trailing arm is slotted too and could have been forced too one end?
    Going by the pics i cannot understand how the steering has gone like it has? is there a chance in the shunt, the front wheel was forced into the curb?

  27. #26
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    I think at this point you should be taking it for an alignment check mate tbh...

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  28. #27
    Schlaag's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by s3dave View Post
    The bottom arm does look look like it has a bit of an arch to it, The trailing arm is slotted too and could have been forced too one end?
    Going by the pics i cannot understand how the steering has gone like it has? is there a chance in the shunt, the front wheel was forced into the curb?
    Not really Dave... As I turned in to a lane on my right side... the other guy came steaming round a bend, slammed his brakes on and as i pulled in to my right turning.. his nose smacked in to my pass wheel, bumper end (took bumper off) .. oh then he did one!

    I wasnt spun.. luck he just caught my tail end really rather than a full on shunt in to my side!

    Nothing hit my front. I agree, its strange my steering is so off!

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  29. #28
    Schlaag's Avatar
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    riiight... Had a hnter alignment and car no longer crabs.. and drives straight.

    Toe adjustment is maxed on the suspect side and is still out. So looks like stub or whole arm is bent slighty. Without spending untold on replacing parts, we will never track the problem down... I can live with the slightly increased tyre wear that side... Its 99% better

    Still the EBS issue though.. but I can press esp and turn it off if annoying.

    Just need to get it through its MOT now.. reckon it will fail on headlight level...

    2001 AMK Dolphin Grey S3

  30. #29
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    Looks to me like the hubs bent where the shock mounts to it. Also the ESP issue could be a damaged ring/sensor from the same shunt. If the aligner has just adjusted out the crabbing, has not a good enough fix imo. They should have found the root of the problem.
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  31. #30
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    As above something has been bent and subjected to stress that it wasnt designed for, adjusting things to almost right is potentially risky as the bent or damaged component could fail with catastrophic results, if it was my car I'd want to be finding the root of the problem and replacing any bent or damaged components with either new or good second had parts. Some things are just not worth compromising on with IMHO.
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