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  1. #1
    Chester999's Avatar
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    Is this power pulley kit worth getting anyone ???

    Been looking at this power pulley kit for the 1.8t engines they are quite pricey so just wanted to know if anyone has used these before and are they worth the money any info would be great cheers.

    Awesome - Neuspeed Power Pulley Kit 1.8T

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  3. #2
    <tuffty/>'s Avatar
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    No... the crank pulley is not damped and will essentially shake the engine to bits... avoid like the plague

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  4. #3
    Chester999's Avatar
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    ok cheers tuffty will scrap that idea then lol

  5. #4
    Chester999's Avatar
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    another quick question mate what about an uprated fuel rail will be putting 440cc green top injectors in soon when i go for the map just wanted to know if this would help at all ???

    AUDI A3 1.8T 20V TURBO HIGH FLOW RACE ALLOY FUEL RAIL | eBay

  6. #5
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    Both Welly and I run big turbos on a std fuel rail thats more than enough for your 440's...

    Save your money

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  7. #6
    Andrew@A.L.D's Avatar
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    Standard rail on mine also

    Its something i looked into and found it to be fine right up to some very high power levels
    Was 531bhp 8L S3 thats going to break the 600+ bhp Club then break something else. Lets see what this OD HTAGT3582r can do
    My S3 Twists Drive shafts for fun.

    FOR SALE
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    Adjustable FPR from 1-5 bar, 2 sets of Unused ARP 3/8 2000 rod bolts
    , relentless 200 cell cat pipe, Std AGU Crankshaft. Ported & Reconditioned Cylinder head service.

  8. #7
    www.badger5.co.uk

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chester999 View Post
    Been looking at this power pulley kit for the 1.8t engines they are quite pricey so just wanted to know if anyone has used these before and are they worth the money any info would be great cheers.

    Awesome - Neuspeed Power Pulley Kit 1.8T
    absolutely NOT
    see below what can happen when you fit Neuspeed *cough* power pulley... power my arse.
    Crank Pulley is damped as std, helps deal with resonance.

    Friends engine after fitting Neuspeed Power Pulleys


    and the offending power pulley



    Want a different pulley Fluid Damper one.
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  9. #8
    [Dave B]'s Avatar
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    Feck me!!!
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    holy moly!

  11. #10
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    WOW !
    seen plenty of engines with holes in the block but nothing like that before..thats a good one

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    Pushing the limits..

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    WOOOOWW im lost for words... thanks for the heads up bill

  13. #12
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    Re: Is this power pulley kit worth getting anyone ???

    Is it just the neuspeed one, I got an ecs one I was planning on installing after seeing that probably a bad idea

  14. #13
    <tuffty/>'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neru View Post
    Is it just the neuspeed one, I got an ecs one I was planning on installing after seeing that probably a bad idea
    Any pulley thats not damped in some way is bad... IE do billet ones too... same issue applies...

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  16. #15
    <tuffty/>'s Avatar
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    yarp... same sorta thing...

    This..
    Fluidampr Crank Pulley for Late 1.8T Engines

    ...or stick to the std one...

    ...and balance the bottom end

    <tuffty/>
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  17. #16
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    damn, oh well I just ill sell of my set which came with my timing belt kit

    how hard is it to balance bottom end

  18. #17
    <tuffty/>'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neru View Post
    damn, oh well I just ill sell of my set which came with my timing belt kit

    how hard is it to balance bottom end
    Easy enough for an engineering shop... needs specialist gear to do

    <tuffty/>
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  19. #18
    Andrew@A.L.D's Avatar
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    I have the fluid damper pulley and wouldn't fit anything else

    If you want a upgrade buy this and this only

    Fluidampr Crank Pulley for Late 1.8T Engines
    Was 531bhp 8L S3 thats going to break the 600+ bhp Club then break something else. Lets see what this OD HTAGT3582r can do
    My S3 Twists Drive shafts for fun.

    FOR SALE
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    Adjustable FPR from 1-5 bar, 2 sets of Unused ARP 3/8 2000 rod bolts
    , relentless 200 cell cat pipe, Std AGU Crankshaft. Ported & Reconditioned Cylinder head service.

  20. #19
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    Has anyone had Thier motor fully balanced , crank rods etc? Just wondered if it was worth it while it was apart?

    I was going to use Andrews Precision • What We Do • Crankshaft Balancing

    These guys are local to me.

    But would rather know from those who have already developed the 1.8t if I am wasting my £££

    Cheers
    SP.

  21. #20
    Andrew@A.L.D's Avatar
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    I have
    Was 531bhp 8L S3 thats going to break the 600+ bhp Club then break something else. Lets see what this OD HTAGT3582r can do
    My S3 Twists Drive shafts for fun.

    FOR SALE
    Sparco Torino 2 sport seats
    Adjustable FPR from 1-5 bar, 2 sets of Unused ARP 3/8 2000 rod bolts
    , relentless 200 cell cat pipe, Std AGU Crankshaft. Ported & Reconditioned Cylinder head service.

  22. #21
    Pushing the limits..

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    how about this timming belt any good ? changing all belts next week :D

    Gates Racing 06A 1.8T Timing Belt

  23. #22
    Andrew@A.L.D's Avatar
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    yes but you can get a Kents cams cam belt for a lot less
    Was 531bhp 8L S3 thats going to break the 600+ bhp Club then break something else. Lets see what this OD HTAGT3582r can do
    My S3 Twists Drive shafts for fun.

    FOR SALE
    Sparco Torino 2 sport seats
    Adjustable FPR from 1-5 bar, 2 sets of Unused ARP 3/8 2000 rod bolts
    , relentless 200 cell cat pipe, Std AGU Crankshaft. Ported & Reconditioned Cylinder head service.

  24. #23
    www.badger5.co.uk

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    Quote Originally Posted by Neru View Post
    Is it just the neuspeed one, I got an ecs one I was planning on installing after seeing that probably a bad idea
    The factory pulley is damped.. any billet only offering will be the same as neuspeeds, so avoid
    pointless mod.

    if you want something better than oe, and this is generally for BT cars with more revs and power, Fluid Damper is what you should use.
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  25. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sneekyparrot View Post
    Has anyone had Thier motor fully balanced , crank rods etc? Just wondered if it was worth it while it was apart?

    I was going to use Andrews Precision • What We Do • Crankshaft Balancing

    These guys are local to me.

    But would rather know from those who have already developed the 1.8t if I am wasting my £££

    Cheers
    SP.
    yes yes yes yes yes yes yes

    If you can, get it done.
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  26. #25
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    Hello guys and girls,

    I passed this information onto Neuspeed.
    I have the exact reply as quoted:

    "We have been selling under-drive pulleys worldwide for well over 15 years and have never had one customer complaint of engine damage or shortened life. From the pics that engine is not even stock internally, how could he blame the pulley when there are so many other modifications."

    I hope that helps

    Thanks
    Hassan

  27. #26
    www.badger5.co.uk

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    Explain why removing a mass damped crank pulley for a billet non damped one wont effect resonant damping of the crank then please Hassan/Neuspeed

    Harmonics and resonant frequencies on the crank is whats occuring without a damped pulley


    some light reading for you... Engine Vibration - Why A Damper Is Absolutely Essential



    Engine was modified yes.. and unfortunately for the owner after it has been built he thought a "billet pulley set" would help.... then the crank snapped on next test day. No coincidence the crank failed (not the rods or pistons<< read the above link as to likely cause)
    Last edited by badger5; 22nd August 2012 at 16:24.
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  28. #27
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    Humm... so crankshaft harmonics disappear when using a non damped pulley? I would think not... if anything fitting this pulley to a fairly std engine would be worse than fitting one to a blueprinted and fully balanced engine (such as the one in the pics)....

    Seems odd that VAG deem it a requirement for a damped pulley to be fitted to help eliminate this issue as std... not like them to do something for the hell of it..

    <tuffty/>
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  29. #28
    "Stick a V8 in it!"

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    Harmonic damper - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    That explains how the damper differs to balancing an engine.

    Its about damping out harmonic and resonant vibrations, these will still be present in even the most perfectly balanced engine.

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  30. #29
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    Bill, I am not getting in to the ins and outs of harmonic and resonant vibrations mainly because I know very little about them,

    You have deliberately attacked a product that we sell a lot of and off the back of what you have mentioned I have been on to Neuspeed to find out if what you have said is really an issue with the product they offer. They say it is a product they have offered for 15 years and are unaware of it causing engine failures.

    You know more than most that there is an argument to be had for and against almost every modified part that is offered for any car.

    Just because a highly tuned motor failed the day after fitting them this does not mean they were categorically the cause of the engine failure, it just seem like a coincidence. I bet you've seen a few of these in your days. I am sure you could real off a long list of other issues that could have caused that failure. It would be very hard to specifically identify the failure on that motor as it's by far the worst failure I have ever seen and will have damaged so many unrelated parts when it exploded,

    All in all I do respect your opinion and would never dismiss it and they may not be best for a motor that is very highly strung but I do believe all standard motors with stage 1 or 2 maps on them would not have an issue with the power pulleys,

  31. #30
    <tuffty/>'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AwesomeHassan View Post
    ...You have deliberately attacked a product that we sell a lot of...
    Actually in context no he hasn't... the fact that the Awesome is mentioned in the original link is irrelevant (and coincidental)... this is about the product (and products like it) regardless of who sells it... where does it say that its not recommended for non std engines? surely if a product is believed to be a problem on tuned engines then this should be made obvious to mitigate against the potential for a product to be discussed like this when its actually not suitable for certain applications...

    <tuffty/>
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  32. #31
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    ...further more... how can you say (and I quote)...

    Quote Originally Posted by AwesomeHassan View Post
    ...they may not be best for a motor that is very highly strung but I do believe all standard motors with stage 1 or 2 maps on them would not have an issue with the power pulleys,
    when you have said...
    Quote Originally Posted by AwesomeHassan View Post
    ...I am not getting in to the ins and outs of harmonic and resonant vibrations mainly because I know very little about them...
    <tuffty/>
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  33. #32
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    "avoid like the plague" and "power my arse" I took as attacking the product.

    We are just trying to offer our opinion on one of the products we sell, we are just joining in the conversation with everyone else and offering a different opinion. It is up to anyone reading the post to do with what they want with the information and I appreciate nothing has been aimed at Awesome,

    " surely if a product is believed to be a problem on tuned engines then this should be made obvious to mitigate against the potential for a product to be discussed like this when its actually not suitable for certain applications.."

    I haven't said that. I said it might not be the best option, that is only my opinion not the company's or manufactures and I have said that due to the nature of the post and the mention of harmonics etc and I expected someone to come up with something to do with the harmonics and a tuned engine. That was my fault making an assumption as I am unaware weather they would cause an issue on a tuned motor or not.

    I would have thought removing the vibration damper from the front of the engine would be a lot less likely to cause a failure than fitting a single mass fly wheel especially since the front toothed crank pulley is under tension and damped by the toothed belt and the hydraulic damper.

    Is this right or wrong?

  34. #33
    <tuffty/>'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AwesomeHassan View Post
    "avoid like the plague" and "power my arse" I took as attacking the product.
    Sounds more like advising to me and the way you worded your reply made it sound like you thought he was having a go at Awesome... like I said... its the product (irrespective of who makes it as there are a few out there and irrespective of the supplier...) thats in question...

    Quote Originally Posted by AwesomeHassan View Post
    " surely if a product is believed to be a problem on tuned engines then this should be made obvious to mitigate against the potential for a product to be discussed like this when its actually not suitable for certain applications.."

    I haven't said that. I said it might not be the best option, that is only my opinion not the company's or manufactures and I have said that due to the nature of the post and the mention of harmonics etc and I expected someone to come up with something to do with the harmonics and a tuned engine. That was my fault making an assumption as I am unaware weather they would cause an issue on a tuned motor or not.
    Point is you are currently representing Awesome and people will take what you say as " Awesome said....." its a fine line we all have to be aware of

    Quote Originally Posted by AwesomeHassan View Post
    I would have thought removing the vibration damper from the front of the engine would be a lot less likely to cause a failure than fitting a single mass fly wheel especially since the front toothed crank pulley is under tension and damped by the toothed belt and the hydraulic damper.

    Is this right or wrong?
    fitting a single mass flywheel has nothing to do with crankshaft harmonics in this context... a flywheel would be a balanced component much like a DMF... it would be no different... I suspect you have this mixed up with the inherent chatter that you get from the gearbox after fitting an SMF...

    Crankshaft harmonics is the result of torsional stresses imposed on the crank from the combustion process not rotational vibrations from unbalanced components..

    <tuffty/>
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  35. #34
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    in my eyes, its common sense as to why not to use one, and why a damped one is so essential

  36. #35
    www.badger5.co.uk

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    Quote Originally Posted by AwesomeHassan View Post
    Bill, I am not getting in to the ins and outs of harmonic and resonant vibrations mainly because I know very little about them,

    You have deliberately attacked a product that we sell a lot of and off the back of what you have mentioned I have been on to Neuspeed to find out if what you have said is really an issue with the product they offer. They say it is a product they have offered for 15 years and are unaware of it causing engine failures.

    You know more than most that there is an argument to be had for and against almost every modified part that is offered for any car.

    Just because a highly tuned motor failed the day after fitting them this does not mean they were categorically the cause of the engine failure, it just seem like a coincidence. I bet you've seen a few of these in your days. I am sure you could real off a long list of other issues that could have caused that failure. It would be very hard to specifically identify the failure on that motor as it's by far the worst failure I have ever seen and will have damaged so many unrelated parts when it exploded,

    All in all I do respect your opinion and would never dismiss it and they may not be best for a motor that is very highly strung but I do believe all standard motors with stage 1 or 2 maps on them would not have an issue with the power pulleys,
    Please read my post 23 - I am not digging at Neuspeed/Awesome - but the product is not a good idea for the reasons I have stated.
    Billet crank pulley wheels, (anyones), non-harmonic balancer type are not a good idea.


    Non damped crank pulley is just a bad idea. There is no performance reason to fit a different crank pulley (other than high performing engines, and I dont mean stage 1/2 remapped) - Fluid Damper for high end motors is the only available option I am aware of (and use personally)

    Power Pulley? power? Is this a name or a description of what they proport it to do?


    Could you ask Neuspeed engineers why a non balanced crank pulley on an engine designed for one, is deemed ok... and the answer ....
    " They say it is a product they have offered for 15 years and are unaware of it causing engine failures."
    does'nt cut it with me. Why is a non resonant damped pulley ok?

    They should take note of the picture posted of their pulley on the broken crank engine. They can look for many others excuses or reasons of other potential causes, but to ignore harmoncs and crank resonance, knowing their crank pulley is'nt, is to stick their head in the sand whilst whistling la la la.. This might be the first they have seen, but I find it hard to believe its the only one which has occurred.

    Bill
    Last edited by badger5; 22nd August 2012 at 19:09.
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  37. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by badger5 View Post
    yes yes yes yes yes yes yes

    If you can, get it done.
    Oki doki I will add it to the ever growing list :-))

    Thx
    paul

  38. #37
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    Holy crap! Thanks for posting this, I was thinking of buying the IE equivalents but will think twice about it now.

    Why would folks still continue to sell these kits then? I mean, IE are pretty clued up engineering wise, so I would think they would take this into consideration?

    JB

  39. #38
    www.badger5.co.uk

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    Quote Originally Posted by ZAS View Post
    Holy crap! Thanks for posting this, I was thinking of buying the IE equivalents but will think twice about it now.

    Why would folks still continue to sell these kits then? I mean, IE are pretty clued up engineering wise, so I would think they would take this into consideration?

    JB
    A very good question.

    Remember companies who make these are making them to keep up with their competitors and a demand for a product, and they are in business to sell you stuff.
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  40. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZAS View Post
    Holy crap! Thanks for posting this, I was thinking of buying the IE equivalents but will think twice about it now.

    Why would folks still continue to sell these kits then? I mean, IE are pretty clued up engineering wise, so I would think they would take this into consideration?

    JB

    maybe i understood you wrong but the IE fuildampr one you can buy as it does dampen unlike the rest i.e. billet....

  41. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sevv View Post
    maybe i understood you wrong but the IE fuildampr one you can buy as it does dampen unlike the rest i.e. billet....
    Yup, that is only one of their offerings though, they do also sell plain billet ones.

 

 
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