To big brake or not to big brake

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Jimgrim77

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I've uprated, downrated and am now thinking again having decided to keep the car.

What's everyone's thoughts on standard with uprated pads/discs against big brakes?

Currently running standard s3 calipers with 256 drilled Zimmerman discs and Bosch pads.
 
personally I think the standard breaks are fine,if your mapped then uptated disks, ds2500 pads and motul brake fluid will make a difference over standard. I think bug brakes are more ideal for big turbo setup but obviously I'd you come across a set from cheap then go for it
 
I've tested a few setups over the last 3 years at the Nurburgring. (just like proper car manufacturers do lol)

1st year I took my S3 I had completely standard brakes and they were appalling at speed. Constantly fighting to get the cars speed down for each bend, it was actually very scary :sadlike:

A year later I returned with Bremo Max grooved discs, Ferrodo DS2500 pads and some Motul RBF 600. What a difference this made! So much more braking confidence and the brakes were sharp, corner after corner.

Last year, I returned again. Same disc, pad, and fluid setup but this time I had a set of Porsche Boxster 4 pot callipers. These things make a big difference over the year before. Now not only can I brake in confidence but I can brake later and still get the cars speed where I want it before turning in for a bend.

So basically what I'm saying is, standard OEM setup is a big NO. I know people will say "i won't be racing or going to the ring" but for anyone who's been, can testify that the Ring is just like a 10 min drive through some epic country roads.

Ideally uprate your pads, discs, and fluid over OEM stuff.
 
Westy said:
I've tested a few setups over the last 3 years at the Nurburgring. (just like proper car manufacturers do lol)

1st year I took my S3 I had completely standard brakes and they were appalling at speed. Constantly fighting to get the cars speed down for each bend, it was actually very scary :sadlike:

A year later I returned with Bremo Max grooved discs, Ferrodo DS2500 pads and some Motul RBF 600. What a difference this made! So much more braking confidence and the brakes were sharp, corner after corner.

Last year, I returned again. Same disc, pad, and fluid setup but this time I had a set of Porsche Boxster 4 pot callipers. These things make a big difference over the year before. Now not only can I brake in confidence but I can brake later and still get the cars speed where I want it before turning in for a bend.

So basically what I'm saying is, standard OEM setup is a big NO. I know people will say "i won't be racing or going to the ring" but for anyone who's been, can testify that the Ring is just like a 10 min drive through some epic country roads.

Ideally uprate your pads, discs, and fluid over OEM stuff.
Click to expand...


After reading this i think i need to do another disc/pad/fluid upgrade. I "upgraded" or so i thought to EBC Ultimax slotted discs / EBC Greenstuff and OEM fluid..........and if i am honest i didnt notice much difference.

Hopefully this isnt seen as a hijack but a permutation of the poster's question.... :

Westy (or anyone else for that matter): Can you confirm my own suspicions that EBC isn't really much better than OEM compared to the likes of Brembo max/Ferrodo etc?

.....think i may try the Brembo Max disc/DS2500/Motul combination when the EBCs wear out......not wanting to go as far as changing calipers.

From your post, I presume you would recommend that change if caliper upgrade isnt being considered?
 
chazza55 said:
After reading this i think i need to do another disc/pad/fluid upgrade. I "upgraded" or so i thought to EBC Ultimax slotted discs / EBC Greenstuff and OEM fluid..........and if i am honest i didnt notice much difference.

Hopefully this isnt seen as a hijack but a permutation of the poster's question.... :

Westy (or anyone else for that matter): Can you confirm my own suspicions that EBC isn't really much better than OEM compared to the likes of Brembo max/Ferrodo etc?

.....think i may try the Brembo Max disc/DS2500/Motul combination when the EBCs wear out......not wanting to go as far as changing calipers.

From your post, I presume you would recommend that change if caliper upgrade isnt being considered?
Click to expand...


My personal opinion is that unless you want to do track days then Ferrodo DS2500s and Motul fluid are a must. This thread is very helpful:

http://www.audi-sport.net/vb/a3-s3-forum-8l-chassis/96917-definitive-brake-thread-8l-a3-s3-owners-other-golf4-platform-cars.html

Disc aren't as important as you might think, the main components are the pads and fluid. You can pick up some pretty cheap plain discs that will probably be an improvement over your current setup if used with a decent pad and fluid.

From my personal experience with EBC stuff I found their pads to be either like cheese or like brick but never really did what I wanted them to do.

I'm currently running with a set of discs from Euro Car Parts that only cost me £100 (think they are pagid)

ecabdabe.jpg


29aeec7c.jpg
 
ATE discs im pretty sure you said in your build thread :p
 
Paradox1 said:
personally I think the standard breaks are fine,if your mapped then uptated disks, ds2500 pads and motul brake fluid will make a difference over standard. I think bug brakes are more ideal for big turbo setup but obviously I'd you come across a set from cheap then go for it
Click to expand...

Thanks. I've uprated the discs and pads but should probably look at ds2500 pads at the very least. I'm running ATE Super Blue fluid.

Been trying to hit 300bhp on the K04 before hitting a snag last week, and subsequent power loss, from leaking oil from the upper gasket into the spark plugs. I'm uprating/replacing this all at the weekend at the weekend before testing on the dyno again next week. Essentially, if that doesn't sort the power loss...it could be a crack in the turbo and inevitably a hybrid will be next stop.

So...big turbo = big brakes and i'm sussing out the best way forward. Appreciate your thoughts.
 
Westy said:
I've tested a few setups over the last 3 years at the Nurburgring. (just like proper car manufacturers do lol)

1st year I took my S3 I had completely standard brakes and they were appalling at speed. Constantly fighting to get the cars speed down for each bend, it was actually very scary :sadlike:

A year later I returned with Bremo Max grooved discs, Ferrodo DS2500 pads and some Motul RBF 600. What a difference this made! So much more braking confidence and the brakes were sharp, corner after corner.

Last year, I returned again. Same disc, pad, and fluid setup but this time I had a set of Porsche Boxster 4 pot callipers. These things make a big difference over the year before. Now not only can I brake in confidence but I can brake later and still get the cars speed where I want it before turning in for a bend.

So basically what I'm saying is, standard OEM setup is a big NO. I know people will say "i won't be racing or going to the ring" but for anyone who's been, can testify that the Ring is just like a 10 min drive through some epic country roads.

Ideally uprate your pads, discs, and fluid over OEM stuff.
Click to expand...

Great post, thanks.

Don't anyone worry about changing the tone/context of the post. I've read the definitive brake thread and really wanted to draw on everyones experiences.

Essentially, from what I am reading and like anything, the brake set up should reflect the application. I've upgraded and downgraded but am thinking of upgrading again. I live in north somerset where the country lanes, whilst not a track, are a great environment for the S3.

The fact that I'm pushing almost 300bhp with a possible hybrid waiting in the wings just strikes me as a little too much go fast and too little slow down on standard calipers when driving enthisiastic over 30 mile distances. On this basis, i think that i'll stick and decide on the hybrid but will investigate the big brake set up. However, it's a must with more power.
 
Big brakes arent just for big bhp builds IMO. Whether you had 30bhp or 300bhp bigger or better quality(ie better pads, discs, fluid) brakes are going to be worth while for all applications. Standard brakes are never "enough" as you`ll always find the limits even on the roads.
 
Jason.s said:
Big brakes arent just for big bhp builds IMO. Whether you had 30bhp or 300bhp bigger or better quality(ie better pads, discs, fluid) brakes are going to be worth while for all applications. Standard brakes are never "enough" as you`ll always find the limits even on the roads.
Click to expand...

That is a very good point mate.

It also depends on how you want to drive the car. I've got the track day bug and they are a must for that. Some people just like to blast it down the road in a straight line and wont need to brake so hard and fast.
 
Although one hard braking session from say over the 70mph speed limit down to 0 would probably be the limits for a basic standard set up, do it again in quick succession and you find yourself struggling to stop in time. Anyone that lives in or around MK will know this all too well lol.

Unless you have my friends Fabia VRS which seems to never fade on basically an S3 setup but standard discs, pads, fluid even at Combe :s
 
Jason.s:1468456 said:
Although one hard braking session from say over the 70mph speed limit down to 0 would probably be the limits for a basic standard set up, do it again in quick succession and you find yourself struggling to stop in time. Anyone that lives in or around MK will know this all too well lol.

Unless you have my friends Fabia VRS which seems to never fade on basically an S3 setup but standard discs, pads, fluid even at Combe :s
Click to expand...

lool I don't live in mk but I know exactly what your talking about,straight dual carridgeways then a roundabout:eek:
 
Do it, the improved feel of a decent set of four pots alone, over standard 312s is worth it. Ive got LCR brembos on my S3 and they are worth every penny. And ive only got pagid pads in at the minute. Cant wait to get some decent pads for when ill be needing the brakes... Hehe

Nuff said.
 
no problem mate,I think ill stick with my 312 setup for the time being. when I change my rear disks, I'll change the pads all round and the fluid all together. then hit 140 on the motorway and try a few emergency stops lol
 
Appreciate everyones feedback and after todays brief debate, i Just had some used LCR brembo 4 pots delivered with 312mm discs and pads.

Quite a bit of wear on the pads/discs and imagine 12k of miles left. I'm thinking of getting new ones prior to install.

What discs and pads would be best combo and where should i purchase from?
 
Alex C said:
how did you manage to source them so quickly?
Click to expand...

Ebay is a wonderful thing. Saw the LCR Brembo kit yesterday online with bids ongoing for an online sale from a breaker in Birmingham. I contacted direct and made an offer for the kit. He accepted and he got it delivered last night to Bristol for me. POW!

I have to say, they do look in very good nick, although i've probably got no more than 12k in mileage left on them, hence thoughts on new disc pad combo for them.

links/thoughts on that would still be good. Pads most important but want the best set up possible really.
 
Jimgrim77 said:
Ebay is a wonderful thing. Saw the LCR Brembo kit yesterday online with bids ongoing for an online sale from a breaker in Birmingham. I contacted direct and made an offer for the kit. He accepted and he got it delivered last night to Bristol for me. POW!

I have to say, they do look in very good nick, although i've probably got no more than 12k in mileage left on them, hence thoughts on new disc pad combo for them.

links/thoughts on that would still be good. Pads most important but want the best set up possible really.
Click to expand...

323mm discs can get quite pricey. The pads are the most important part, followed by the fluid so a set of plain discs will be fine.

Pads wise I can only recommend DS2500s because they are the only fast road/racing pad i've tried. They've been so good for me I've not looked back.
 
Westy said:
323mm discs can get quite pricey. The pads are the most important part, followed by the fluid so a set of plain discs will be fine.

Pads wise I can only recommend DS2500s because they are the only fast road/racing pad i've tried. They've been so good for me I've not looked back.
Click to expand...

Thanks Neil

That's what i was thinking. I have ATE Racing Blue fluid already and was going to go with the DS2500s for certain.

Have read that you bought 323mm plain discs...were they ATE Racing too? Any idea of what online shops are best for price/stock for these parts?
 
Jimgrim77 said:
Have read that you bought 323mm plain discs...were they ATE Racing too? Any idea of what online shops are best for price/stock for these parts?
Click to expand...

Mine Were ATE from Euro Car Parts but they are grooved but we're quite cheap as ECP had a 25% off sale last year. I also only got 312mm discs. I have Porsche Boxster callipers and the reason i went for them was because they use 312s and they work out cheaper ;)
 
Westy said:
323mm discs can get quite pricey. The pads are the most important part, followed by the fluid so a set of plain discs will be fine.

Pads wise I can only recommend DS2500s because they are the only fast road/racing pad i've tried. They've been so good for me I've not looked back.
Click to expand...

lol trust me 323mm discs arent that expensive :)
 
audi upgrades
i'm sat here trying to source 323mm discs for the S3...anyone have any idea?
 
Another update...I ended up ordered 323mm pagid vented ones from Eurcaroparts for £197 delivered.

Existing Brembo pads have plenty of wear left so i thought i'd stick with them for the while.

Discs, pads, xs power mani and stage 3 hybrid are all going on next week.

Fingers crossed it all goes without a hitch!
 
Just wanted to update on this too....the lcr 4 pot brembo are seriously good for anyone looking for an upgrade over standard or uprated standard set ups. I cannot believe the difference over uprated pads/discs and especially when giving it some welly over prolonged periods.

My only problem is that I've nearly lost my wife through the front windscreen a couple of times when she's not been paying attention.

Here's a pic in situ:-

4447-img-1404-large.jpg
 
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