Badger5Chris Nott
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  1. #1
    SamiG's Avatar
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    Poor results after Remap - May need new turbo - Advice Please!

    Right, so a couple of long stories short, i've been having a fair few problems with my S3 in the time i've owned it, it's never been running particularly well and never been hitting requested boost figures.

    So the car went in at Regal Autosport 3 weeks ago to try to diagnose the boosting fault, 2 days later and a 350 hole in my pocket i had the car pack, was making 195bhp and 183lb/ft before, then they changed a split IC pipe, FPR and fitted an N75J along with adjusting the slack actuator and subsequently it made a healthy 215bhp and 198lb/ft after.

    So the car seemed to perform a fair bit better and having had the problems "fixed" i finally booked in the car for a stage 1 map also at Regal Autosport.

    Again a couple of long stories short again the car went in on Monday and came out only producing 240bhp & 226lb/ft. Now i'm not one to really take dyno figures as gospel and i honestly didn't care but when i drove it, it just felt naff. I had forked out another big sum for the map and a 4Bar FPR and the car was now under boosting by up to half what it was requesting.

    You stick your foot down in first and second and it pins you in your seat when it hits boost, but this quickly dies off . the rest of the gears feel pretty poor too.

    So anyway after checking out the dyno graphs and chatting to the technicians at Regal they have come to the conclusion my Turbo is nackered. Apparently it's not actually showing any tell tale signs but as every other component that contributes to the car making healthy boost has either been changed or proven to be working fully, apparently this is the last thing on the list.

    So if anyone has any of thier own opinions on this judgement then feel free to input.
    Also if anyone can also advise on the best options of going about changing the turbo as Regal have quoted me 1,066.00 including a refurbed turbo and labour to do the job.

    I won't attempt the job myself but any advice as to who to speak to and wheather this is a likely ball park price i'll be looking at paying would be appreciated muchly
    Last edited by SamiG; 2nd March 2011 at 22:55.

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  3. #2
    [Dave B]'s Avatar
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    Personally I'd get a second opinion before changing the turbo. I don't know anything about Regal Autosport but if it's not showing any other tell tail signs of having a knackered turbo I wouldn't change it yet. My other thoughts would be:

    - What are the other parts you've changed? i.e. know are good.
    - Lose the N75J and go back to standard 'E' or 'F'. J causes problems on its own.
    - Do you have any vagcom logs you can share?

    Dave.
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  4. #3
    s3dave's Avatar
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    what psi are you getting on boost? and what map?

    AMK dont like j valves, and you should not need a 4bar reg

  5. #4
    [Dave B]'s Avatar
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    ^^^^True, did regal recommend the J valve and the 4 bar FPR?
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  6. #5
    SamiG's Avatar
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    Regal fitted the 'J' valve as they said the origional was ****ed. No idea why they put this one on mind...

    And they also recommended upgrading the FPR to 4Bar, again i don't know why but i just went with thier advice.

    Parts changed so far are FPR, N75, MAP sensor IC pipe, Map sensor itself, MAF sensor along with having the actuator adjusted twice.

    The car is on a Regal custom map.

    They spend about 2-3 hours on the dyno and with VCDS logging a few things, checking all other components for faults before pretty much diagnosing the fault as being a weak turbo not being able to product the boost pressures requested.

    The dyno graph looks to show a peak boost of nearly 1.0 bar at 2,250rpm which quickly declines down to just below 0.6Bar at 4,750rpm
    The boost isn;t progressive and it pulsates on full throttle where it should be holding a constant steady amount of boost its just up and down beetween 0.5Bar and 0.7Bar.

  7. #6
    cecilthesausage's Avatar
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    Dont want to ask a stupid question but I am going to.... is the J valve fitted the right way round.... because I have experienced the same problem and it felt as if my turbo was f@@ked...... but I agree with Dave

  8. #7
    [Dave B]'s Avatar
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    Could you post up the dyno graph and the requested vs. actual boost graphs if you have them?
    > S3 225 (03) - OEM+
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  9. #8
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    Why would anyone who new there stuff put a J Valve on an AMK engine and tell you need a 4Bar FPR..... Limp mode is imminent

  10. #9
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    It sounds like a weak actuator to me...was it a 4 wheel drive dyno?

  11. #10
    SamiG's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Funky_Junky View Post
    Could you post up the dyno graph and the requested vs. actual boost graphs if you have them?
    I have the dyno graphs but i'd have to try and get a decent picture as i don't have a scanner unfortunately, and no they didnt print out any logs.

    Quote Originally Posted by cecilthesausage View Post
    Dont want to ask a stupid question but I am going to.... is the J valve fitted the right way round.... because I have experienced the same problem and it felt as if my turbo was f@@ked...... but I agree with Dave
    I have no idea what way round it should be to be honest with you mate and i haven't even checked it out...

  12. #11
    SamiG's Avatar
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    It is, but the disconnected the Haldex and ran it FWD mate. I had an inclin the actuator was ****ed considering they have now had to adjust it 2-3 times...

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    Did Regal use there own software or Giac...??

    Also who's been doing the work Chris..??
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  14. #13
    SamiG's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by S3BAM View Post
    Did Regal use there own software or Giac...??

    Also who's been doing the work Chris..??
    There own software dude.

    Chris mapped the ECU but another couple of the technicians have been doing the rest.

  15. #14
    cecilthesausage's Avatar
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    Did they check for fault codes before the remap ?

  16. #15
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    Yep, no fault codes at all. Still isn't and never has been...

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    I would pull the pipe of the n75 that goes to the actuator and carefully go for a spin to boost but dont go mad (dont redline) and see if it is any better...

  18. #17
    [Dave B]'s Avatar
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    If you can post pics of the graph up it would help. Also if you can get a pic of the N75 in situ then it could help confirm if it's fitted correctly.

    It's too early to say really but TBH I'd be concerned that about leaving it with Regal (given the number of parts that have been changed in pursuit of the problem and the questionable nature of the parts they have been replaced with).

    It might be worth checking the VCDS users map on here for people in your area who can lend a hand with some logging/graphing/recovering of fault codes etc...
    > S3 225 (03) - OEM+
    > 205 GTI (90) - Limited Edition Miami Blue with full leather - 1 of only 300 made
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  19. #18
    SamiG's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by s3dave View Post
    I would pull the pipe of the n75 that goes to the actuator and carefully go for a spin to boost but dont go mad (dont redline) and see if it is any better...
    What would this achieve Dave? Or more to the point what am i looking for to happen by doing this?

  20. #19
    S3BAM's Avatar
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    Personally i would of paid the bit extra and went for the Giac... Excellant software(One of the biggest U.s Vag Tuners)

    But still doesnt resolve youre issue's...

    Have u any idea what its hitting then dropping off too..??

    if u decide on Actuator which i would prob point towards give us a shout il see what i can get u a Forge one for

    Sometimes i think certain companies should stick at what there reasonably good at i.e Regal/Vauxhall but they have got to cater around this day and age..
    Last edited by S3BAM; 2nd March 2011 at 23:50.
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  21. #20
    SamiG's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Funky_Junky View Post
    If you can post pics of the graph up it would help. Also if you can get a pic of the N75 in situ then it could help confirm if it's fitted correctly.

    It's too early to say really but TBH I'd be concerned that about leaving it with Regal (given the number of parts that have been changed in pursuit of the problem and the questionable nature of the parts they have been replaced with).

    It might be worth checking the VCDS users map on here for people in your area who can lend a hand with some logging/graphing/recovering of fault codes etc...
    I'll see if i can scan a copy of the dyno graphs tomorrow at work mate and get a quick pic of the N75 too and post them up.

  22. #21
    SamiG's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by S3BAM View Post
    Personally i would of paid the bit extra and went for the Giac... Excellant software(One of the biggest U.s Vag Tuners)

    But still doesnt resolve youre issue's...

    Have u any idea what its hitting then dropping off too..??

    if u decide on Actuator which i would prob point towards give us a shout il see what i can get u a Forge one for

    It seems they aren't offering GIAC software anymore dude that's why..

    It's hitting just under 1.0Bar boost at about 2,250rpm and almost immidiately drops down and fluctuated up and down rapidly between 0.5bar and 0.8Bar all the way through the rev range in every gear.

    Yeah grab us a price on the Forge actuator if you can supply them mate it's worth a shot...

  23. #22
    s3dave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SamiG View Post
    What would this achieve Dave? Or more to the point what am i looking for to happen by doing this?
    well it would be purley mechanical boost with no interference from anything, thats why i advised against flooring it... just run it up to boost and steadily press forward and if it seems to be holding boost it certainly would suggest that your turbo is ok...

  24. #23
    S3BAM's Avatar
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    uhmm...

    Il let u no tommorow on Act I may speak nicely to Faction see if i can put a g.b up...
    Noggy Blue 02 plate Bam S3 281Bhp SOLD....

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  25. #24
    SamiG's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by s3dave View Post
    well it would be purley mechanical boost with no interference from anything, thats why i advised against flooring it... just run it up to boost and steadily press forward and if it seems to be holding boost it certainly would suggest that your turbo is ok...
    Thanks, i'll give that a try then mate. So i guess if it feel's no different, it would sort of suggest the turbo is on it's way out, if not and it feels a lot stronger and progressive on boost it therefor means the turbos doing it's job...

    How about if ther turbo's fine but the actuator is ****ed, would disconnecting the N75 change anything then?

  26. #25
    s3dave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SamiG View Post
    How about if ther turbo's fine but the actuator is ****ed, would disconnecting the N75 change anything then?
    Not really but worth a try i think..see how it goes and report back

  27. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by s3dave View Post
    Not really but worth a try i think..see how it goes and report back
    Mission Accepted

  28. #27
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    I have a AMK and my N75j works very well on my car, better than the F. Loss the 4 bar FPR, probably straining your fuel pump.

    They have really been playing around with your car, I would advise you only change/adjust one thing at a time when trying to diagnose a fault. Unplugging the N75 will just let you run actuator pressure, so about 5/6 psi at WOT.

    You have changed the sensors which help control/adjust boost so it could be a mechanical fault. I would look at your N75 and check the fitment is correct then look at how they have adjusted your actuator. Have you got vagcom
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  29. #28
    [Dave B]'s Avatar
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    I recently had issues with N75's and boost so there's quite a bit of info in this thread that might be worth reading: Badger5 TIP & JC Filter on Friday :)

    Mine turned out to be a dodgy N75 valve (which may not be your problem) but the investigations taught me a bit about how the system works
    > S3 225 (03) - OEM+
    > 205 GTI (90) - Limited Edition Miami Blue with full leather - 1 of only 300 made
    > Clio v6 255 (05) - Lethal Weapon

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