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  1. #1
    Ess_Three's Avatar
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    The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    As some of you may know...my S3:



    has gone.
    After 3 1/2 years of continual development which culminated in a sublime car to drive...I decided to sell it on.

    It has gone to a good home however...our very own David R had welcomed it with open arms...and it's good to see David is keeping up the tradition of hounding Evos, Subarus and the like on the racetracks and highways of out fine land:


    (Credits to the photographer for this pic)


    This leads me onto my next dilema; (this should perhaps be in the General Forum..but hell, it starts off S3 related!)

    What to buy next...

    Fortunately, due to the sale of the S3 and a rather healthy redundancy package earlier on in the year, I have a fairly open selection of cars and prices to look at.

    So...what you you buy to replace a seriously well sorted S3?


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  3. #2
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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    [ QUOTE ]
    Ess_Three said:
    So...what you you buy to replace a seriously well sorted S3?


    [/ QUOTE ]

    Another S3 ? [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

  4. #3
    Ess_Three's Avatar
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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    Allow me to offer a few guidelines:

    It can't be a 2 seater...8 year old small thing is too much of a petrol-head to allow that!

    It can't be a soft top - hateful things!...plus you have to be a tanned, slim, good looking kinda lad to pull that off...so that's me out on all counts!

    It should be normally aspirated. I'm sick of the non-linear power delivery of turbocharged engines...I want some throttle adjustability!

    It has to excite!
    I want to feel my palms getting sweaty...the hairs on the back of my neck standing up...I want feedback...all the things the S3 (good as it was) didn't offer.

    I want soul...the engine can't sound like a sodding Dyson..so that's the 1.8T out again!
    I want a proper sounding engine...with a bark!

    I want handling...proper handling...none of this lift off oversteer malarky to get it round corners - a propertly sorted chassis would do fine.
    Needs to have perfect spring / damper / ARB balance...and be useful on the crappy rouds of the north of Scotland.
    Something that makes me smile would be an adantage...

    I'd prefer heritage...some pure bloodline would do nicely...

    I want lightweight wheels...no heavy ass easily bent things for me! Light and strong, please.

    I want proper brakes...no sliding calliper, easily siezed, easily overheated carry on...big brakes with big discs.

    I want a decent gear change! None of this stirring porridge Audi type change...something slick...like a rifle bolt.

    I have to be able to get in and out of it...I'm 6'3" so that's an Elise / Exige / VX220 or similar out for starters. I don't want to be the roadside entertainmemt while I attempt to get in / out of the damn thing.
    I also want waterproof...that's the same suspects out...
    And I don't like tupperware cars...oops...that's the same 3 out once again.

    It's dark and misearble a lot in Scotland...so HID lights would be beneficial...

    I couldn't live with a Caterham / Westfield...just too impractical.

    I would also like something that has a few toys...good seats, decent stereo, possibly Sat Nav etc...
    And lots of cow hide. Preferably black...loads and loads of cow hide...

    The colour is important too...I like vivid colours....what do you follow the best colour Audi have ever used, with?
    Nogaro Blue looks sublime...what next?

    My short list so far consists of the following:






    Exactly. See my point? [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

  5. #4
    Ess_Three's Avatar
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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    [ QUOTE ]
    RichS3 said:
    [ QUOTE ]
    Ess_Three said:
    So...what you you buy to replace a seriously well sorted S3?


    [/ QUOTE ]

    Another S3 ? [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

    [/ QUOTE ]

    No, no, no, no, no...
    For all the reasons listed...and let's be honest, I'm not likely to sell a fully sorted one, to start again, am I? [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

  6. #5
    Ess_Three's Avatar
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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    We must also consider stereotypes here:

    I could never drive an SLK - too hairdresser. Too perma-tan...gold bracelet...yeuck!

    Or a Merc of any description - just too old / fat businessman like for me.

    Or a Ferrari - just too drug dealer! Big gold rope chain...bad 'tache...small penis!

    I'm not even sure I could live with a TVR - too butch, in a sort of "look at me, I'm a big strong man with a hairy chest" sort of way.
    I also want to be able to have it start when *I* want it to, rather than when *IT* wants to!

    Elise / Exige / VX220 are out for the previously mentioned reasons.

    New M3 perhaps?
    Every upmarket Rep's dream car. And for that reason - and the condescending / irritating attitude of thier sales professionals - I just don't think so.

    Evo?
    Subaru?
    I'd rather cut my own left hand off and plunge my head into a vat of boiling oil that drive around in one of those glitzy posing pouches!
    Zero class...zero chance of me ever owning one.

    I'll never own any sort of SUV either, for that matter!

    So, the short list...is still a short list. A very short list. In fact, it's so short, I can't appera to see any choices on it!

  7. #6
    imported_AudiAuto
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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    I think the M3 would be a good choice, but i would say that. New M5 when its out? Porsche of some sort? NSX?

  8. #7
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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    [ QUOTE ]
    pimpmyaudi said:
    I think the M3 would be a good choice, but i would say that.


    [/ QUOTE ]

    It would...but I have friends with those...I'd ideally like something a little individual...especially whan a mate of mine has just bought my ideal spec M3 (Grey with red leather)
    And I still don't like the stigma!


    [ QUOTE ]

    New M5 when its out?


    [/ QUOTE ]

    Cool car.
    Ugly car.
    Fell out the ugly tree hitting every branch on the way down...
    And it's an Auto - another No-No. I should have mentioned that before...NO AUTOS!
    Driver input wanted!!


    [ QUOTE ]

    Porsche of some sort?


    [/ QUOTE ]

    Sigh...I know...I know...


    [ QUOTE ]

    NSX?


    [/ QUOTE ]

    Can't physically get in one!
    Been there, tried that...

  9. #8
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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    I was thinking a Noble M12 of some sort, with it's siblime chassis and performance, unfortunately it only has 2 seats, and the engine is turbocharged.

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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    [ QUOTE ]
    Ess_Three said:

    I want a decent gear change! None of this stirring porridge Audi type change...something slick...like a rifle bolt.


    [/ QUOTE ]

    After owning my S3 for 3 weeks, this would have to be my biggest gripe. Why oh why couldn't Audi come up with something better. I've driven my brothers S2000 quite a bit and the gear change is sublime - so precise and direct. And not even being able to do 60mph in second gear..... pah [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

    Regarding car choice, you dont say your budget, but the Porsche 997 S seems to tick most of your boxes. Or am I shooting way too high price wise? Porsche 996 then [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

  11. #10
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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    [ QUOTE ]
    jojo said:
    I was thinking a Noble M12 of some sort, with it's siblime chassis and performance, unfortunately it only has 2 seats, and the engine is turbocharged.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Great choice!
    I had a good look round one...the local Audi dealer had one in!
    Nice car...but perhaps a little too compromised...I wouldn't fancy an 8 hour journey in one...also, in the NE of Scotland...perhaps a little too trackday orientated.
    It's got the performance, chassis etc...the look is a bit subjective (I'm still undecided on that) and as you say, only 2 seats, no storage, and it's turbo'd. Doh!

  12. #11
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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    Have you looked into the new Supra? The pics I saw were ugly but in person it should look better. The last generation sells for twice book in some cases and they were pretty quick and reliable. Should be out by 07

  13. #12
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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    [ QUOTE ]
    ImS3ola said:

    After owning my S3 for 3 weeks, this would have to be my biggest gripe. Why oh why couldn't Audi come up with something better. I've driven my brothers S2000 quite a bit and the gear change is sublime - so precise and direct.


    [/ QUOTE ]

    The S2000 gearchange feels like my Integra Type-R did...fantastic!
    The best gearchange I've used so far.


    [ QUOTE ]

    And not even being able to do 60mph in second gear..... pah [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]


    [/ QUOTE ]

    That didn't bother me...the 0-60 is meaningless anyway...and it does give you a head start in 3rd!



    [ QUOTE ]

    Regarding car choice, you dont say your budget, but the Porsche 997 S seems to tick most of your boxes. Or am I shooting way too high price wise? Porsche 996 then [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Budget is flexible...

    997...I'm not fully convinced of the new look. The front is OK...the rear, less so.
    It still looks a little 'thin' for my tastes...and with no firm details on / if there will be a wide body version...who knows!

    The new Boxter is a much better development of the previous version compared to the 997 vs 996, in my view.

    A 911 does seem to tick most / all the boxes...
    Perhaps another visit to the OPC is in order.

  14. #13
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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    porsche fits all your requirement a early gt3 are good value,i.e not astronomical.Good luck with your new car,you will be missed.

  15. #14
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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    Glen, you are cruel and provocative in equal measure... [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

    Ryan, A GT3, in the north of Scotland, I think not [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

    Anyhow, the answer to this question is not a hard one for anyone who has been listening to Glen rambling on over the last few months about handling, braking and suchlike.

    The new (and for the timebeing mythical) beast that lurks in a NE garage will, I suspect, soon be revealed.

    Have fun Glen...

  16. #15
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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    I was thinking of a Z3M Coupe.

    Naturally asperated, rear wheel drive blah blah.

    Just found out its only a two seater tho.........so scrap that one.

  17. #16
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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    Holden ? Theyre awesome for the money !

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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    RX-8? Back seats, leather, toys, no turbo, does sound like a dyson on speed though but apparently the handling is good.

  19. #18
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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    [ QUOTE ]
    marctwo said:
    RX-8? Back seats, leather, toys, no turbo, does sound like a dyson on speed though but apparently the handling is good.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Where's the pedigree, brakes and swathes of leather...

    A ferrari 456 has 4 seats doesn't it [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

  20. #19
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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    Has to be a 911 or the new Boxster S. I went to the recent launch of the new 997 - not impressed, ill wait and see what comes later before chopping in the 4S.
    I paid (i mean pleaded and borrowed) 55K last year for a 02 996 4S with 13K miles and its still worth the same today, so if you dont like it you will get out of it easy enough for a couple of K hit. I may have been lucky as the dealer said red was unloved and didnt want on the books, since then red has had a bit of a revival (Guards red is a crap red though). narrow bodied 911 are a bit trickier, all in the spec colour etc. forget a noble they depreciate quite quickly. Incedently the chap selling that turbo2 i love, on pistonheads.com has a noble for sale also!

    I was blown away however with the new boxster! having owned 2 in the past i would say it was the best balanced car i have owned. i think they have done a great job on the new model too but there is just something about the three magic numbers that are 911!

    Why do i feel like im teaching my granny how to suck eggs ? [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] you know the score.

  21. #20
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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    [ QUOTE ]
    nervus said:Why do i fell like im teacing my granny how to suck eggs ? [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] you know the score.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I rather think it's a done deal. There have been some "interesting" motors passsing by my work on the way to the North recently [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img]

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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    Ultima? Forget that, not got 4 doors and a bugger to get in and out of.

    Glen, your asking for an awefull lot, I have had a think about it and there seem to be options available that have some but not all of what your after.

    Here's a random suggestion, Old DB4? Classic.

  23. #22
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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    I can't help thinking TVR really would be the way forward, or how about a griffith 500 for the fun times and a senisble car for the week say an RS4???

    I had a go in a mates griffith, the noise, the sensation the breaks the control when this start going pearshaped (in the dry only of course)

    Just a though, depends how much you want the excitment over the common sense, I've always wanted a 4.5l cerbera but not had chance to drive one yet...

  24. #23
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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    [ QUOTE ]
    pimpmyaudi said:
    NSX?

    [/ QUOTE ]

    [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/1luvu.gif[/img]

    I have always adored the NSX, whenever I see one I fall in love with it again, it's at the top of the "next car" list.

  25. #24
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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    The NSX is a surprisingly good car to drive although the running costs are massive.

    For example. Rear tyres don't last much over 2000 miles if driven spiritedly. The clutch has a life of only 10,000 miles. Those aluminium panels are frighteningly costly if you have a prang, and the insurance is not exactly a bargain.

    However, it perfored well above my expectations for a car with "only" 280bhp. The noise is incredible, it's a real head turner and the handling and brakes are excellent too. My only gripe is that it is, perhaps, a bit too easy to drive, and you can explore its limits fairly quickly - i.e. there isn't much to learn and perfect with it...

    Glen tells me he can't fit in one though. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/lol.gif[/img]

  26. #25
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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    911 993 Turbo4, 40k will get you a nice low miler maybe less! i know u didn't want another turbo, but look at the bloody things - pure class and fast enough to keep with anything! enough soul to haunt you!

  27. #26
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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    Nervus, I'm not a huge fan of the 993TT. It's rather a blunt tool, especially when compared to the C2S or C4S. A freind has one, and I aways think the car feels rather overwhelmed by the monumental power. It's a bit like firing a gun, all or nothing, and the chassis, to be honest, cannot keep up.

    The beauty of the 993 C4S and more so the C2S is the subtlety and adjustability of the engine and chassis. You can lean hard on the suspension and know that you can apply just enough power to get things moving a little out of the corners. Even on track, the turbo has just too much power and when I did some laps of Knockhill I found myself backing off, taking less speed into corners, carrying less through the corners and using the power advantage on the straights - effective, but not fun...

  28. #27
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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    Yes, i see your point and know only too well what you mean. I nearly binned a 996 turbo X51 pack (450ish) and that was similar to what you describe. It went well pre-boost mind but when the thing comes on boost you realise you should have pressed the brake pedal 2 seconds ago - bloody terrifying! It only runs 0.7bar as well so not a huge amount of boost pressure. I've never driven a 993T but i can imagine it being more laggy and running more boost so worse than the 996 T. Worth it for that heart skippy moment though [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] Probably not much fun on the track pushing your pride and joy around in unchartered territory! [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img]

  29. #28
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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    Everyone mentioned Porsche so wont mention them again

    I know you want proper handling cars so Americans are out of the equation eventhough it could be a nice challenge to try and sort out the whole handling setup of a Vette or Mustang? so what do you reckon, they have heritage, massive NA engines? Interior would have to be redone entirely though! Me think you need a new challenge!

    If you're ready to wait why not the new Golf R32 (or R36?). handling should be better than S3 as based on mkV chassis and engine should be NA with proper sound. weght could be a problem.


  30. #29
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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    MK5 golf is a very frustrating machine. I got a Mk5 loner yesterday, 2.0FSI. I thought the engine had about 150bhp? but the weight of the car must have been monumental - it was so slow. It had a totally unnecessary 6 speed gearbox, anoying chimes and wipers that would insist on smearing the screen everytime I stopped them when it was clean. The steering is worse than the old ones, feeling sticky and muddy. I cannot see them making any decent car out of this overweight, overinsulated chassis... Plus it looks like a people carrier... on stilts....

  31. #30
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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]
    Reading back through the tread i quote ess_three:
    Tuperware cars [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh_roll.gif[/img]
    and David_R:
    People carrier....on stilts [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh_roll.gif[/img]

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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    [ QUOTE ]
    god_thats_quick said:
    I can't help thinking TVR really would be the way forward, or how about a griffith 500 for the fun times and a senisble car for the week say an RS4???

    I had a go in a mates griffith, the noise, the sensation the breaks the control when this start going pearshaped (in the dry only of course)

    Just a though, depends how much you want the excitment over the common sense, I've always wanted a 4.5l cerbera but not had chance to drive one yet...

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I'm with you on this one. TVR all the way. The Griffith is awesome but only 2 seats. How about a Typhon? You didn't want turbo but is a supercharger acceptable? 580 BHP? You can chuckle while all the 911 drivers disappear into the distance in your rear view mirror.

    and that sound [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/1luvu.gif[/img]

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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    fom what Glen said (NA and proper sound) engine would have to be preferably V6 or V8 or over (so forget all RS cars and the lot), but light (for handling), so you get enclined to narrow V6 and it has to be a real 4 seater (that rules most sport cars out) non convertible (Glen you could always try esthetic surgery, you know?) the chassis has to be good as a base product.
    if they dont mess up the new golf R32/R36 i think it could feel the bill as it would also have big brakes be quattro (haldex a problem?)

    so, Glen a few questions:
    would consider an old classic car?
    do you require 4WD?
    are Italian, Japanese and French's cars out of the equation?
    do you have any other brand with a "no no!" tag on it like volvo

  34. #33
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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    [ QUOTE ]
    marctwo said:
    [ QUOTE ]
    god_thats_quick said:
    I can't help thinking TVR really would be the way forward, or how about a griffith 500 for the fun times and a senisble car for the week say an RS4???

    I had a go in a mates griffith, the noise, the sensation the breaks the control when this start going pearshaped (in the dry only of course)

    Just a though, depends how much you want the excitment over the common sense, I've always wanted a 4.5l cerbera but not had chance to drive one yet...

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I'm with you on this one. TVR all the way. The Griffith is awesome but only 2 seats. How about a Typhon? You didn't want turbo but is a supercharger acceptable? 580 BHP? You can chuckle while all the 911 drivers disappear into the distance in your rear view mirror.

    and that sound [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/1luvu.gif[/img]

    [/ QUOTE ]
    come on TVR cant go with 4 seater and waterproof!

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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    [ QUOTE ]
    StephV6 said:
    come on TVR cant go with 4 seater and waterproof!


    [/ QUOTE ]

    OK, so it's a 2+2 then. Either way there are seats in the back. As for waterproof, well, how about a Gibbs Aquada then? [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/lol.gif[/img]

  36. #35
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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!


    TVR may start to surprise people with there new russian owner, he's started using words like quality control and we will wait until the product is ready to sell them...

    For emotion I reckon TVR or Ferrari are the only real choice's having driven both... griffith wins on noise, ferrari 348, 355 and 360 are progressively better, and you get the badge and history, and I think if you don't get a red one, you don't look like a complete idiot. or if money really isn't an issue, how about a new lambo gallardo? that's top.

    one last thing, I'm 6'3" and I can fit in a new nsx, really think they might be worth a few hours of consideration...

  37. #36
    Numptie of the highest order

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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    just saw the whole problem with the baby... and after switching brain on, how about an aston or a 456? I've seen 456's in a really nice blue for reasnoble money, and you'd definatly get the noise with an old school vantage?

  38. #37
    StephaneS's Avatar
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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    what about the S4? V8 and 330bhp!
    or is the weight too much?

  39. #38
    StephaneS's Avatar
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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    [ QUOTE ]
    marctwo said:
    [ QUOTE ]
    StephV6 said:
    come on TVR cant go with 4 seater and waterproof!


    [/ QUOTE ]

    OK, so it's a 2+2 then. Either way there are seats in the back. As for waterproof, well, how about a Gibbs Aquada then? [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/lol.gif[/img]

    [/ QUOTE ]
    [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/lol.gif[/img] yep definitely waterproof. should be ok for scotland then [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

  40. #39
    nervus's Avatar
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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    TVR - are you serious? They are rubbish, keep breaking down/falling to bits, gloryfied kit car trash! the quality is appauling.

    Thats why no real dealers will take them off ya and your stuck with another tvr come trade-in time!

  41. #40
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    Re: The S3 is gone...long live the S3!

    Hold out for the new Skyline....whenever it comes?

    V6 3.0 would sound sweet, but it depends on th trim finish I suppose and if you're a badge snob.

    What about the new S4? They say it's handling is better, but have I read the wrong report....or is that something Audi are planning for the future??

    Old or New M5? New isn't the best looking but hey it's not bad.


 

 
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