New 18" RS4s

[trekbiker]

Now i have my S3(well, its on its way!!), i'm after the wheels that it needs, rather than replacing the booots on it which have about 3mm.

I know that rochford do good deals, but i have come across another place on Ebay that does wheels and Avon ZZ3s for £695 & post.

My question is this- is the Rochford deal iwth the economy tyres at £625 good- ie what are the tyres like?anyone bought from there? I phoned them yesterday, they told me for an S3 i would need to upgrade from 225 to 245 width to ensure the speedo was accurate. True /not true?? The package price here was £800, somewhat more than the initial £625 i was expecting.

Advice please 'fellow S3ers'
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif

 

[trekbiker]

Just read what DickyS3 said about Avon, so please don't bombard with post about them. I AM now aware that they are crap /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/fuck_you.gif

 

[ajmackie]

the speedo just measures the angular velocity of the wheel so can't see how width would affect it. although wouldn't doubt rochford tyres from the good press i've heard on here!

someone mentioned audisport and got a free upgrade to avon zz3s and free delivery.

 

[AndyMac]

245's are slightly closer to the original rolling radius of the stock wheels, but you'll need to go to 245/35/18's rather than 225/40/18's these will mess up the handling, and also will be far more expensive. Goodyear 225/40/18's are about £114 per corner balanced & fitted (Micheldever tyres), 35's will be at least £50 more as they are not a popular size. 245/35's will give you an error of 0.5% too fast (at 100mph on the speedo you will actually be doing 100.5mph), whereas 225/40's will give a 0.8% too fast. Bearing in mind all speedo's are calibrated to show a faster speed than actual, a bigger rolling radius on the wheel actually makes the speedo more accurate. I have 225/40/18's and my speedo is still about 2mph slow at 100mph (compared to GPS speed on my road angel).

 

[trekbiker]

found a place offering 18" replicas with Avon ZZR's for £595. I know these tyres aren't rated, but surely thats a great deal ??

 

[trekbiker]

So what are so bad about the Avons anyone??

 

[17AUG2002]

well i had them on a one click amd gttdi 185 golf and they only lasted me 9000 miles on drive wheels. but there fantastic in wet and dry they drive the same wet or dry

 

[trekbiker]

so good then ,apart from life expectancy. how long would good years etc expect to last?

 

[17AUG2002]

some people i have spoken to say pilot sports are good "sorry miches"

 

[dickys3]

I think I have ZZ1's and they are awful! I have no confidence in them and have put me in scary situations since owning them! I had Bridgestones before and they were excellent.

I think the ZZ3's are supposed to be better but I'm not risking it! As soon as these things wear out I'm going for F1's!

Do a search on Avon tyres on this forum and you'l see that I'm not on my own with my comments! Ask Glen (Ess_Three) what he thinks of them!

Rich.

 

[trekbiker]

thanks Dicky! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

 

[trekbiker]

Just been getting some prices this afternoon, as follows:

replica RS4 with budget (Maxxis)tyres from LTS tryes(stourbridge) £599, with good year F1 £750

Auto Alloys(in NI) with Dunlop sp9000 £690

Rochford has promised to match that price, and seeing as they tend to get quite a bit of business from this site, i will probably go for it from them!

 

[trekbiker]

Can anyone who has upgraded clarify whether the drive/handling in an S3 is affected much by switching from 17s to 18s??

 

[monty77]

Had ZZ1s on my current car, complete [censored]! Changed for T1Rs which are miles better... F1s or Toyo T1Rs in my book...

Adam

 

[trekbiker]

Just found somewhere that is only 70 miles away from me, willing to do a set of 4 with Toyo T1S for £650. That sounds like a good deal eh?? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/goofy.gif

 

[trekbiker]

Does anyone have any comments on about how ride/handling is affected by upgrading form 17 to 18??

 

[jojo]

Better handling, similar ride IMO. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

[Ess_Three]

[ QUOTE ]
DickyS3 said:
I think I have ZZ1's and they are awful! I have no confidence in them and have put me in scary situations since owning them! I had Bridgestones before and they were excellent.

Do a search on Avon tyres on this forum and you'l see that I'm not on my own with my comments! Ask Glen (Ess_Three) what he thinks of them!



[/ QUOTE ]

They are ****** awful!
Not grip, no feel, bad wet weather preformance...avoid at all costs.

They are cheap, sure. But, don't forget the only thing between you and the tree on the outside of that corner, are your tyres...do yourself a favour, avoid the Avons.

 

[Ess_Three]

[ QUOTE ]
monty77 said:
Had ZZ1s on my current car, complete [censored]! Changed for T1Rs which are miles better... F1s or Toyo T1Rs in my book...


[/ QUOTE ]

That's the two that most people seem most happy with...

I'd run either Toyo T1-S or T1-Rs...both are great...but do handle differently.

 

[Ess_Three]

[ QUOTE ]
trekbiker said:
Does anyone have any comments on about how ride/handling is affected by upgrading form 17 to 18??

[/ QUOTE ]

Handling is a compromise...of many things:
Grip, feel, comfort, sharpness of turn in, etc...

Going from 17s to 18s will improve your turn in as the sidewall moves less...it will improve the feel for similar reasons...

It will also give higher lateral grip berore the grip breaks away - but when it breaks away, will do so more aggressively. For most people this point is unlikely to be reached...but, if you are likely to push to the nth degree, you need to fit the best rubber you can afford!

Comfort is reduced on 18" wheels...but not by a lot. A good compromise.

Stick to 225 wide tyres - the S3 is already over tyred for it's chassis...any more and it'll tramline more, torque steer more and be generally less responsive.

Now, the subject of wheel weights:
If you fit cheap wheels - which, unfortunately replicas are - you will add unsprung weight...this in turn WILL make the car less responsive...and possiblt harm the handling.

It's up to you...but regardless what some clowns tell you, the BEST compromise for HANDLING is a set of 8" (or perhaps at a push 8.5") x 18 lightweight wheels (they need to be lighter than the standard 17s!) and run on 225/40/18 tyres - preferably the best tyres you can afford.


On the prickly subject of 19" wheels..
You will get a handling advantage over 17s...
But, compared to 18s they TEND to weigh more - especially these cheap *** replicas - and they are wider than ideal...meaning more unsprung weight and worse handling - worse even than the standard 17s at times!

Also with 19s you struggle to keep the tyre width moderate...go to a 235/35/19 and you get more harshness for no advantage in feel, more tramlining and less throttle adjustibility.


So, it's my view - and that of many others who actually know about handling and the finer nuances of chassis dynamics - that the 'perfect' size wheels for the enthusiastic driver is 8.0" (*) x 18" with 225/40/18 quality tryes.

(*) You can get away with 8.5" wide if they are light...but from a purely practical point of view, you are less likely to kerb an 8" rim!
8.5" offer no advantage...in fact in my view, can add to tramlining etc...but the differences are slight.


Basically, for driving, fit 18s...for posing down the local Wine Bar and impressing all the Hoorah Henrys / Julians / Max Power kids...go for 19s.

 

[trekbiker]

Wow ess three,

thats a fairly comprehensive answer! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beerchug.gif

Basically, if money were no object, i think that i should go for the genuine 18s due to being lighter. However, having only just bought my car, i am, so it looks like i'm best off going for the above deal, 18" replicas with Toyos for £650.
This way my outlay isn't massive,yet i get the desired look, whilst maintaining the handling characteristics. as for the weight, i will just make sure my car is free of extra passengers, clutter etc all the time! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif

 

[DavidR]

ZZ-1s: Overheat in the dry leading to lots of understeer. The side wall is too flexible also. They don't work in the wet at all, especially bad on damp, greasy roads when the temp is 5 degrees and below.

Awful tyres.

The ZZ-3 are much better, a friend has them on his STI-8. I personally will not be risking them, and havesome T1-Rs on order.

 

[DavidR]

[ QUOTE ]
trekbiker said:
This way my outlay isn't massive,yet i get the desired look, whilst maintaining the handling characteristics. as for the weight, i will just make sure my car is free of extra passengers, clutter etc all the time! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Don't confuse the unsprung weight with sprung weight. Unless you attach you passengers and clutter to the wheel hubs, you'll make no difference to the unsprung weight.

Unsprung weight is what is downwind of the spring dampers - so wheels, hubs, brake discs, calipers etc. If you imagine that as the suspension works, the components that move most are those that are unsprung, whereas the rest of the car remains relatively static. By reducing the unsprung weight, you allow the suspension to move relatively quicker under the effect of less inertia, so improving the suspension and its responsiveness. If you attach huge, heavy wheels then the suspension is subject to more intertia, loosing resposnsiveness. Given that the car remains, relatively, static, adding the same weight to the car has much less of an effect than adding to the unsprung weight... Hence the role for light wheels, brakes, hubs etc.