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  1. #1
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    APR Cat/Downpipe - Audi S3

    Just looking around Awesome GTI's new site and found a APR Cat/Downpipe Ł995, its says avail Christmas. Nice present [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

    http://www.awesome-gti.co.uk/audi%20a38l1/exhausts.html

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  3. #2
    DavidR's Avatar
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    Re: APR Cat/Downpipe - Audi S3

    And anyhow, I thought we had collectively agreed that the restirction is in the Manifold, not the DP or CATS...

  4. #3
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    Re: APR Cat/Downpipe - Audi S3

    We had... the only restriction really is the manifold and turbo... downpipe/cats/exhaust will only make a real difference (MAYBE!) once other restrictions are removed.

    Rich

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    Re: APR Cat/Downpipe - Audi S3

    I seen this part when i was at Awesome a few weeks back and its HUGE in comparison to the standard one, they also do one for the Leon (not sure if its excatly the same part or not) and it was getting put on Jims car.

    And he was expecting to get over 300bhp from his car when it was next RR, not sure whether this has actually been done and what he actually got though.

    Mark

  6. #5
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    Re: APR Cat/Downpipe - Audi S3

    NWMark - It could be 18feet in diameter, but if the manifold is the most restricitve part (you can barely get your little finger into the exhast ports) then all the DP in the world is not going to help.

    This product has been dyno'd, lost power and is being shipped back to the manufacturer.

  7. #6
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    Re: APR Cat/Downpipe - Audi S3

    For anyone not believing, i will post a pic of my old manifold later...

    Rich

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    Re: APR Cat/Downpipe - Audi S3

    David, i didnt believe the claims of 25-30bhp at the time, seemed way too much for just a DP, maybe 10bhp tops. but if its been tested with no effect then i wont be buying it.

    Mark


  9. #8
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    Re: APR Cat/Downpipe - Audi S3

    It seems to me that all these so called tuners can slap any old fairytale sorry figure onto their products, are they governed by the trading standards i.e. could you take it back if when dynoed on an accurate R/R the figures were way off

  10. #9
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    Re: APR Cat/Downpipe - Audi S3

    [ QUOTE ]
    RichA3Turbo said:
    But Glen, its shiny! Surely that ALONE would add about 20bhp, 30lb.ft? [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh_roll.gif[/img]

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Damn, Rich, I had forgotten that!
    Perhaps a little buff with some Autosol will have that 20BHP up to 25?

    It appears most people buying tuning parts are like Magpies...attracted to shiny things, at which point all sense of reason goes out of the window!

  11. #10
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    Re: APR Cat/Downpipe - Audi S3

    [ QUOTE ]
    David R said:
    And anyhow, I thought we had collectively agreed that the restirction is in the Manifold, not the DP or CATS...

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I believe that is the case...

  12. #11
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    Re: APR Cat/Downpipe - Audi S3

    [ QUOTE ]
    Ess_Three said:
    [ QUOTE ]
    RichA3Turbo said:
    But Glen, its shiny! Surely that ALONE would add about 20bhp, 30lb.ft? [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh_roll.gif[/img]

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Damn, Rich, I had forgotten that!
    Perhaps a little buff with some Autosol will have that 20BHP up to 25?

    It appears most people buying tuning parts are like Magpies...attracted to shiny things, at which point all sense of reason goes out of the window!

    [/ QUOTE ]

    [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh_roll.gif[/img]

    The fact of the matter is, no matter WHAT you do pre or post turbo/manifold, your not going to achieve anything REALLY worthwhile... A S3 in its chipped state running high boost will be near its limit... making everything else more free flowing may produce a couple of extra ponies, but nothing to wrtie home about. We've said it before many times, the only way is to ditch the manifold and turbo. Now, you never know... The K04 on a decnet manifold MIGHT produce some good results... but i doubt anyone will invest the money into having a manifold designed and cast to find out! When the price of turbo upgrades is coming down, it just wouldnt be financially viable.

    Rich

  13. #12
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    Re: APR Cat/Downpipe - Audi S3

    [ QUOTE ]
    Andy bS3 said:
    It seems to me that all these so called tuners can slap any old fairytale sorry figure onto their products, are they governed by the trading standards i.e. could you take it back if when dynoed on an accurate R/R the figures were way off

    [/ QUOTE ]

    This whole situation really hoses me off!
    I think the correct term for it is "Fraud"...and in this country there appears to be no rules governing it where making outlandish power claims are concerned...

    The answer would be something like TUV approval...you don't see too many false / pie-in-the-sky claims from decent German tuners who have TUV approval for their products!

    This would prevent false claims for re-maps, exhausts, cats etc...and put paid to cheap a55, bad quaility products like bendy wheels etc which aren't up to the job.

  14. #13
    dbm
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    Re: APR Cat/Downpipe - Audi S3

    [ QUOTE ]
    Ess_Three said:
    Or 'thier' APR chip at 270+ BHP?


    [/ QUOTE ]

    To be fair, Pure had the APR Optimax chip as his only performance upgrade IIRC, and he registered 270bhp using the VAG-COM airflow equation. Do you have an opinion on how acurate measuring bhp that way is?

    Cheers,
    Dan

  15. #14
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    Re: APR Cat/Downpipe - Audi S3

    [ QUOTE ]
    dbm said:
    [ QUOTE ]
    Ess_Three said:
    Or 'thier' APR chip at 270+ BHP?


    [/ QUOTE ]

    To be fair, Pure had the APR Optimax chip as his only performance upgrade IIRC, and he registered 270bhp using the VAG-COM airflow equation. Do you have an opinion on how acurate measuring bhp that way is?

    Cheers,
    Dan

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Not very.... at all! We did this on an A3 1.8T... measured 150 on teh road and 170 on the dyno.

  16. #15
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    Re: APR Cat/Downpipe - Audi S3

    I would really like to believe this mod is worth the cash, but after MANY long debates and proven evedence, I'm sorry, but I wont be spending over a grand on it !

    Pitty, its nice and shiney!

  17. #16
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    Re: APR Cat/Downpipe - Audi S3

    [ QUOTE ]
    Ess_Three said:

    It appears most people buying tuning parts are like Magpies...attracted to shiny things, at which point all sense of reason goes out of the window!

    [/ QUOTE ]

    [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh_roll.gif[/img]

  18. #17
    dbm
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    Re: APR Cat/Downpipe - Audi S3

    [ QUOTE ]
    RichA3Turbo said:

    Not very.... at all! We did this on an A3 1.8T... measured 150 on teh road and 170 on the dyno.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Sorry to be dense - what was the bhp calculated at using VAG-COM and what was the other measurement used for bhp? How confident are you of the non-VAGCOM method of calculating the bhp?

    Ta,
    Dan

  19. #18
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    Re: APR Cat/Downpipe - Audi S3

    [ QUOTE ]
    dbm said:
    [ QUOTE ]
    RichA3Turbo said:

    Not very.... at all! We did this on an A3 1.8T... measured 150 on teh road and 170 on the dyno.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Sorry to be dense - what was the bhp calculated at using VAG-COM and what was the other measurement used for bhp? How confident are you of the non-VAGCOM method of calculating the bhp?

    Ta,
    Dan

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Sorry... i maent we measured 150 on the road with VAG-COM... I cant exactly remember how we did it mind... its on the ROSS-TECH website somewhere

    Rich

  20. #19
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    Re: APR Cat/Downpipe - Audi S3

    Its called the "Butt-dyno". You have to run the car up in third gear from 1000rpm to redline and then put the clutch in and let the car slow itself down.

    Whilst doing this you log a few variables and then chuck the results into an excel spread sheet.

    You need a long straight flat road to get good values.

    Arguably it gives a very real indication of power and torque.

    See hear http://forums.audiworld.com/vag/msgs/457.phtml

    I got 149BHP out of my standard A3.

  21. #20
    s8n
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    Re: APR Cat/Downpipe - Audi S3

    Yes, this is the australian downpipe that guy harding from QLD worked on. Apparently it produces NO extra power because the MAF and Injectors are just about maxed out with a exhaust/chip/intake anyway.

    It has the potential for gains if you can get it custom mapped. Ive seen the item in the flesh, its very nice but a rip off if it doesnt have a remap included along with new maf/injectors.

    Dont waste your money unless it has that..

  22. #21
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    Re: APR Cat/Downpipe - Audi S3

    ImolaS3 - APR offer a more agressive remap to be used in conjunction with this DP

    Ess Three - Yes its the APR version of the aussie design afaik and yes i'm told Jim@star lost power on his vehicle although i dont know why.. There's some Dynos (on SCN forum somewhere) JBS ran for us on our Leon with the Downpipe/Exhaust and APR map and no other mods and we got the performance we expected from it. Jimbo here also thinks the car is much more driveable with the DP.

    DavidR - Neuspeed have just finished production on an aftermarket manifold for the 1.8T, we havent seen a 225 version yet but it is planned.

    Ess Three - Or 'thier' APR chip at 270+ BHP? - Not sure where this figure is shown, we expect 265BHP with the APR map

  23. #22
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    Re: APR Cat/Downpipe - Audi S3

    ade,

    what is the expected output with the DP and the more agressive APR map?

    Thanks

    Mark

  24. #23
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    Re: APR Cat/Downpipe - Audi S3

    Yes, what is the 'claimed' end result?

    I'd imagine by the time you have pruchased the D/P, fitted it and had the car remapped again (for people who are already chipped) you must be looking at the guts of Ł1800?!

    If you were going from 210/225 to around 290 this would be worth it. BUT will it?

    Stevie

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    Re: APR Cat/Downpipe - Audi S3

    Ade, you can use my car as a test candidate if you like for a discount, get some proper figures and post on here. If the gains are noticable, people will come flocking [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

    I do have to say Ł1000 is a lot of money, your prob looking at half a days labour for the fiting and another remap (so prob closer to Ł1500-Ł1800). For that kind of money, your half way to a bigger turbo and injectors etc.

    I can think of lots of other mods that would make the car more driveable. Brakes / remap / chassis / tyres / suspension etc.

  26. #25
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    Re: APR Cat/Downpipe - Audi S3

    Fitting on it is Ł140+vat, the more agressive remap is free if you already have an APR remap.

    We need to re-run the dyno as we got 5BHP extra but we're sure we can get more out of it, we did get 30ft lb torque extra. See honest figures [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

    Its currently being transferred to our TT and we will re-run the dyno.

    We're not saying it the best power for money mod, we're just saying it is the best downpipe/cat we've come across. If want power cheaper theres a lot of other avenues to take, this product is aimed at those who have everything else already and wants that bit extra.

  27. #26
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    Re: APR Cat/Downpipe - Audi S3

    Let us know how it goes matey.

  28. #27
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    Re: APR Cat/Downpipe - Audi S3

    I like the idea of the free remap to run it. Has certainly swung me. Just need to here some positive feed back now!

    Stevie

  29. #28
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    Re: APR Cat/Downpipe - Audi S3

    check the tt forums as they seem to be fitting it now... Not that I've been looking..

 

 

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